Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Anyway

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Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

heh heh heh..Because I have a filthy mind the first time I read this I thought it said "how far S and G had gotten WITH each other." and I was like "Well I'd say pretty damn far, y'all! Mwaha. *eyebrow wiggle, suggestive leer*
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You mean like... hand holding?

Not following.. are we talking about Formalities or Unbearable or whatever episode that was? I'm SO BAD with episode names and orders and stuff. Must be my impending old age.
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UnBearable - obviously the scene where Sara comes down the hallway was more her interpretation, however the end of the episode is what I'm referring to.

I completely agree. No healthy romantic relationship can be built without a good, sturdy platonic base. If you're not friends first and foremost, the relationship is not anywhere near as likely to succeed. I think it's really great that they (apparently) recaptured their friendship before just leaping forward into romance. I always prefer the fanfics where they start going for coffee and talking rather than just falling into bed together. Of course, I prefer above all else the ones where they go for coffee and talk and THEN fall into bed, but maybe that's just me
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It is. Pervert.

No, I mean - obviously it's my guess, but I don't think that Sara was really in the mood to get it on after having a knife shoved to her throat. And technically, even their friendship has this base of flirtation to it, seeing as he immediately started making winking comments to her ("baby" in the next scene).

However I didn't get the sense from Trigger that these were two people who had already gone somewhere. And really, if Committed wasn't going to spark them off immediately, there really wasn't too much to explain. Especially when Grissom makes the comment about not going out that much in Weeping Willows. That doesn't sound like someone who's been courting his 'lady' all over town, or even dating.

And that is why i LOVE that scene so much. It really gets back their earlier level of closeness/friendship but it also has this added level of intimacy. Not romantic intimacy, but in the sense that Grissom is actually sharing personal information with her. Okay, its cute childhood non-life changing stuff, but its an indication of him opening up. Letting her in. What a huge difference compared with Sound of Silence (waaaaaaay back in season 1) where she's all "Grissom goes out?"
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Right. And there's kind of a nice foreshadowing about his fears regarding a relationship, harkening back to Butterflied. He tells her about it, she thinks it's cute and laughs a little, and he is sort of embarassed, but just kind of asks for the frame back and closes off again. Not a lot, but just a little.

Like I said, I don't think Grissom is talking about his job in Butterflied. I think that he means that "Grissom", or at least the main part that everyone associates with him, is kind of a sham. He gets accused of being a robot all the time. The end scene of Way to Go was very unguarded, which may be why people thought it was OOC, but technically it may be one of the most in character moments we've ever seen.
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

Darn I wish I hadn't missed Butterflied...I think CBS might've skipped it because they seemed to go right past it to whatever the next ep is. Grrr.
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

The end scene of Way to Go was very unguarded, which may be why people thought it was OOC, but technically it may be one of the most in character moments we've ever seen.
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oh, i like that one sarah :D

it was very unusual to see him being open like that. but still very in character. you know, talking about how would you like to die is not something you would chat about with whoever. and still to see Grissom saying this could mean (before we saw sara coming from the bathroom) that he either talked to himself practicing Sofia's investigating technique, OR talking to someone very special. and most of the people know that Grissom is not THAT crazy to go for the first option (i mean off the clock, in bed, cause we know he tried it at work) so in this moment of uncertainity people knew that the latter option is the only one that would make sense. just then, they saw the legs. who's that? Sofia? Lady Heather? Catherine? Sara? The new unknown character? and then BOOM. Sara. of course! who else? everything started to make a clear picture. they're together, finally.
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

Right. And I thought that it was really cool of them not just to announce the relationship via a make-out session or the two of them already in bed, or walking home or just... like... "Boom. Here it is. See you next season".

Instead they did wrap it into the case, and they frequently had scenes where Grissom got to say a few words, like in Burden of Proof when he had Catherine over for dinner and then tried to keep Sara at the lab.

So in truth, the format of having a post-case wrap-up wasn't OOC or unusual.

The concept was unusual, but not OOC.

And I think I got a little too philosophical there, but thank you Adzix - however it's my feeling that if we see it on screen, it's canon. And if it's canon, then it's in character.

And that's good enough for me.

You can read endless press releases for and against GSR (and right now apparently the people backing CSI have said that they really feel the ending went over well with the majority of the audience, (which means that they probably aren't just relying on poll results and letters, but probably real conversations and ratings - because right now CSI is kicking ass) and so I don't see them suddenly going, "um... dream sequence?"
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

You can read endless press releases for and against GSR (and right now apparently the people backing CSI have said that they really feel the ending went over well with the majority of the audience, (which means that they probably aren't just relying on poll results and letters, but probably real conversations and ratings - because right now CSI is kicking ass) and so I don't see them suddenly going, "um... dream sequence?"
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*squeek* oh, that made my day *runs around in euphoria, btw killing some bees, flies, ants and Grissom knows what, with overreacting hand movements*
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

Whew, I go away for the weekend and I need like an hour to catch up on all the posts!

I have to say I agree that Sara's problems and "downward spiral" in seasons 4-5 are not all related to Grissom. I think what appeared the most painful, however, was watching her struggle (with the cases, getting too attached, Hank, the explosion, etc) and then going to Grissom for support and being rejected. Of course, the problem was that she approached him in a personal way instead of in a professional way, and he sort of freaked out. I think Sara always had a blurred vision of their relationship (that the personal was intertwined with the professional), and Grissom had clear cut lines of what their professional and personal lives should be. I think that when she asked him to dinner he couldn't see past the fact that she was asking him on a date. He didn't really consider that she may need someone to talk to. Grissom's fear of the personal prevented him from doing his job professionally, which ironically is what he was trying to avoid in the first place. If he had been a little more in tune to Sara's struggles as an employee, he could have said "I don't think we should pursue a relationship right now, but let's talk. We haven't talked in a while." Or something along those lines.

And of course afterwards it gets worse because he decides that avoiding her is the best policy ( "I haven't seen you in a while, have i?" "You see me every day." Love that scene.) Sooooooooo I guess I just feel that most of the things that caused Sara's problems weren't Grissom related, but were execerbated ten-fold by the way he handled the situation. He is the supervisor, but instead of dealing with a problem he avoids it hoping it will get better.
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

A new quote from CM says that she thinks that Sara and Grissom had been intimate in San Francisco. What are your thoughts?
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

If he had been a little more in tune to Sara's struggles as an employee, he could have said "I don't think we should pursue a relationship right now, but let's talk. We haven't talked in a while." Or something along those lines.
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true. but we all know that he is not the "people person" and saying something like that would be more difficult for him than anything he does in his job. and i was thinking why is that? first - he doesn't KNOW what to say (while he can elaborate about pupa stage 3 for hours) and second - even if he knew for some reason, he won't say it b/c it's to hard for him to open to someone. okey i'm correcting that last sentence and putting past tense there.

about the poll, jesus where did you get that sarah?? oh, boy. i'm gonna freak out in a second. OMG, what if it's true???!! oh, boy. oh, boy. oh, boy. i voted the third option b/c i'm too shocked. :eek:
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

On YTDAW Mike Ausiello from TV Guide reported that the entire cast without Billy, who is apparently attending his mother's service (condolances again), were interviewed by a panel of critics, and CM said that she felt that they had been intimate in San Francisco, however she didn't think that when she arrived in Las Vegas they resumed this... at least not initially.

Now while it's great that CM is suddenly very pro-GSR, it doesn't feel like she's been watching the show. There is NO.WAY. that anything happened between Sara and Grissom prior to Committed.

Their personalities and the circumstances don't allow it, and yet she's making it sound like something was happening right from Season 2.

Having said that, I think the majority of writers probably don't believe this, because she said from day one there had been heated arguments about whether GSR should even happen or not, and there are many theories, but if some reviewing is necessary I can't see them coming to any other conclusion, between Teri Miller, Lady Heather, Hank, Sofia and others, and their own comments and times in their lives, anything prior to the aforementioned episode would really really not make sense.

As for myself, I voted for the second option because I think they probably took things a little further than intended (not physically) and then Grissom had to leave back for Las Vegas, but certainly there was a sense that they were continuing on an attraction when she arrived.
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

I voted the second option, basically because I feel that way. I don't think that they got VERY far in SF, but I don't think they did NOTHING.

I don't thing they did anything because then we would have seen MORE awkwardness. :devil: :p
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

thank you sarah. oh, thank you. i'm calmer now. besides, i always had an impression that sara didn't know IF grissom was at least attracted to her. that might have changed sometime during seasons but i'm pretty sure that there was a time that she didn't know that. on the other hand, it was her who did most of the steps that we saw. so maybe she knew, and that gave her enough courage to ask him out, say she chose him though he wasn't emotionally available etc. so i'm kinda thorn but i'll stick with that she didn't know. besides the Snakes scene convinces me in it.

also after the shock, i'm staying with my third answer. i don't think anything happened in SF beyond flirting.
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

in the poll i voted Absolutely - you could see it on his face the moment she arrived .always i think so and more watching the last scene gsr i think that is very comfortable on both sides and the first moment they have chemistery and well the conversations about sex .
1. Unfriendly Skies
2.Turn Of The Screws
3.Nesting Dolls
4.Spark of Life
5.Bite Me
6.Time Of Your Death

and well i want to belive this because give to couple sex-appeal the relathion teacher-student .
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

Regarding the poll, i was actually torn between option 2 and 3, and i briefly explain why:
All discussions (or pretend to be discussions, more exchange of glaces, and uncompleted sentences...) between Sara and Grissom, never missed the opportunity to emphasize the complexity of their relationship, phrases like "what we had or didn't have", or "it's complex" or whatever (i'm not sure the quotes are absolutely word-for-word, but you get the meaning) only point to the direction that they have left something in the middle back in SF.

However, on the other hand the way the seasons unfold and Grissom's effort to keep the relationship mainly to a professional level (and i'm saying 'mainly', because there are more than a few instances were he deliberately (?) or not -e.g. Butterflied, Invisble Evidence- lets himself express his true feelings), and that points to the direction of option 3. Anyway, i voted for 3, as at the time i clicked it made more sense...now that i reread what i wrote option 2 makes sense as well...

I was watching "Big Middle" the other day, and there was a line by Grissom, which apparently i had overlooked when i had first seen the epie: When asked by Greg "What do you like? What gets your juices flowing? "Grissom answers: "Someone who doesn't judge me."
At first i thought, wow, how weird, Grissom a man so accomplished (not to mention sexxy ;)) is so insecure! But, then i realized he's just a guy, a regular guy with his insecurities and his fears of commitment and of opening up. Maybe, that was the reason they didn't make the alleged leap forward with Sara, maybe she was (or he thought she was) too judgemental...
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

thank you sarah. oh, thank you. i'm calmer now. besides, i always had an impression that sara didn't know IF grissom was at least attracted to her. that might have changed sometime during seasons but i'm pretty sure that there was a time that she didn't know that. on the other hand, it was her who did most of the steps that we saw. so maybe she knew, and that gave her enough courage to ask him out, say she chose him though he wasn't emotionally available etc. so i'm kinda thorn but i'll stick with that she didn't know. besides the Snakes scene convinces me in it.

also after the shock, i'm staying with my third answer. i don't think anything happened in SF beyond flirting.
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Oh, I absolutely agree. And if he was dating her, why would he say he "couldn't do it" in Butterflied? Also, why did Sara say "what didn't happen between us" in Invisible Evidence? I think they were both referring to her having asked him out and him not agreeing.

Either way - Carol M has her own show next year (or should) and Richard Lewis is supposed to be taking over. I think CM was simply responding to the last season, which had been under her control.

Now while I'm happy that they seem to find all of the attention comforting, which it is - I do have to say that comments count for nothing. Ratings count for everything. And until new episodes start up, there is no indaction what the majority of people want to see.

And I am REALLY looking forward to what Richard Lewis's season 7 looks like. Already he seems more open to taking risks and being creative. I felt like CM really added a lot of unncessary glitz to CSI and it distracted from just solving cases.
 
Re: Grissom&Sara #20 - Who Cares? The Shirt's Coming Off Any

Sidlreiana_15 said:
in the poll i voted Absolutely - you could see it on his face the moment she arrived .always i think so and more watching the last scene gsr i think that is very comfortable on both sides and the first moment they have chemistery and well the conversations about sex .
1. Unfriendly Skies
2.Turn Of The Screws
3.Nesting Dolls
4.Spark of Life
5.Bite Me
6.Time Of Your Death

and well i want to belive this because give to couple sex-appeal the relathion teacher-student .
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I totally agree with you on that one. When Grissom and Sara talk about sex around each other, they are always so calm and comfortable. They never change the subject stright away and listen to what each other is saying.

I think something did happen in SF. The reason, the gigantic smile on Grissom and Sara's face when they saw each other again. Although it never continued 'cause the whole supervisor/subordinate thing. Grissom, at that point, didn't want to risk his or her career by continuing where they left off. It would have been too suspicious and Catherine and the rest of the team may have rejected her.
 
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