Why Lindsay Must Go (Part 3)

[Top41]

And I think that comes down to the fact that Lindsay doesn't really bring anything to the show. If you talk with any of the other actors, they can go on and on about their characters' roles or their thoughts and views on things, or what they add to the show. In his last interview here, Hill was talking about how Hawkes gets all the complicated science stuff. Carmine talked about Danny being the "go-to fuck-up" and how that still comes up for his character. I could go on but I think that illustrates it--all of the actors have put a lot of thought into their characters, a lot of passion and complexity, and she just hasn't. It's still the same stuff they were talking about back in season two, which we should be long over. You don't hear Carmine talking about Danny being the "hothead" much anymore, or Gary discussing Mac losing his wife in 9/11. Those were things the characters were introduced with, but have grown from since. They're still part of their bio/background, but four years down the road, not still the first thing you think of when the characters are brought up in their current incarnations.

With Lindsay, it always comes down to falling back on the same old, same old: "country girl in the big city," "breath of fresh air," a foil for the New Yorkers. Nothing new or interesting to say about her since the season she was introduced--three seasons ago--other than, of course, that she banged Danny.

 

[Poppet]

Top41 - have you ever interviewed Anna?

Just wondering if when she talks about her character there is an enthusiasm in her tone of voice that doesn't come across when the interview is written down. In the written word she really doesn't come across as being that interested in Lindsay at all.

 

[jolein]

I don`t think Anna was intentionally arrogant but the wording came off that way.
Now offcourse the written word is always hard to judge cause you can`t capture the tone of someone`s voice.
That said,I wonder if Anna doesn`t get the change to read the interview before it is printed.

[With Lindsay, it always comes down to falling back on the same old, same old: "country girl in the big city," "breath of fresh air," a foil for the New Yorkers. Nothing new or interesting to say about her since the season she was introduced--three seasons ago--other than, of course, that she banged Danny. /QUOTE]

And that is what is starting to get annoying.
Not even her so called secret was intersting enough.
It was something which could have been much more then it was now

 

[vegaslights]

Top41 - have you ever interviewed Anna?

Just wondering if when she talks about her character there is an enthusiasm in her tone of voice that doesn't come across when the interview is written down. In the written word she really doesn't come across as being that interested in Lindsay at all.

Top41 indeed interviewed Anna. You can view the interview here

 

[Kimmychu]

Ironically, it's privatename's post that helped me to pinpoint exactly what it was that made that answer come off as arrogant to me. :lol: I agree that it's subjective whether not it was actually said in arrogance but it could really have been worded better or answered in a much better way.

privatename said:
What I also thought was interesting is that she didn't really answer the question. Now maybe it was the way the interviewer wrote up the interview, but Anna was asked what she contributes to the show and all she could think of to talk about is what she doesn't bring to the show instead. Seems like an odd choice in an interview when you are presumable trying to sell your character and the show you are on as something you want people to watch and be interested in.

In other words, she dodged the question by answering it with a non-answer that had nothing to do with the question. Seeing as she was asked what she contributed to the show, her answer is odd no matter how you spin it. It implies that she considers the other characters on the cast as 'super-glamorous' ... but they're not. None of them are. So, even her answer of contributing 'non-super-glamorousness' to the show isn't even a logical one.

There's also the implication that she won't do certain things even if TPTB wanted her to. 'If they want something else they won't get it'? An actress' job is, first and foremost, to portray whatever character the script demands. Moreover, TPTB is the one who calls the shots on what her character is going to be like, all the way.

I give her kudos for self-confidence or whatever, but who she is as a person has nothing to do with whatever character she's portraying. She =/= Her character. So the question is ... what is she going to do if TPTB one day says, "Yeah, we'd like to see Lindsay go the super-glamorous route."? Is she going to tell them 'it's not who she is' and that 'they're not going to get it' even though TPTB is her boss and signs her pay checks?

This reminds me of the times various people have mentioned it seemed that the writers had to change Lindsay's character multiple times throughout the show, as if the actress couldn't pull off a personality the writers had in mind for Lindsay and therefore had to rewrite her character to suit the actress. Think her answer may have some bearing on this?

I read in other threads and I think someone has probably said it in this thread that Lindsay/Anna is warm and brings a softness to the show, but I really don't see it. I think Melina/Stella brings much more warmth and compassion and a softness when it is called for than Lindsay/Anna ever has.

I agree. I've empathized with Stella far more and many more times than I've ever empathized with Lindsay. The warmth and genuine care reaches Stella's eyes and expression, but not in Lindsay's case. Even when she says she cares/is worried, it doesn't reach her eyes or expression. Most times it doesn't even reach her voice.

 

[sidlewannabee]

Hey, why don't you guys like lindsay? I think she is awesome. I am not trying to invade your thread. I am just literally curious. I have not seen many episodes of CSI NY but from what I have seen, I love Lindsay. Please, don't be offended by my asking this question.

 

[Top41]

Top41 - have you ever interviewed Anna?

Just wondering if when she talks about her character there is an enthusiasm in her tone of voice that doesn't come across when the interview is written down. In the written word she really doesn't come across as being that interested in Lindsay at all.

Yes, I interviewed her back in the second season. She wasn't unenthusiastic--she didn't, say, have the kind of depth to her answers that Carmine or Eddie have, but I didn't get the "I'm bored, this is just a paycheck, whatever" sense from her. I haven't reread the interview in a while, but it was the same kind of stuff she's saying now--which was a lot more understandable then, given that her character was fresh out of the box.

In other words, she dodged the question by answering it with a non-answer that had nothing to do with the question. Seeing as she was asked what she contributed to the show, her answer is odd no matter how you spin it. It implies that she considers the other characters on the cast as 'super-glamorous' ... but they're not. None of them are. So, even her answer of contributing 'non-super-glamorousness' to the show isn't even a logical one.

There's also the implication that she won't do certain things even if TPTB wanted her to. 'If they want something else they won't get it'? An actress' job is, first and foremost, to portray whatever character the script demands. Moreover, TPTB is the one who calls the shots on what her character is going to be like, all the way.

I give her kudos for self-confidence or whatever, but who she is as a person has nothing to do with whatever character she's portraying. She =/= Her character. So the question is ... what is she going to do if TPTB one day says, "Yeah, we'd like to see Lindsay go the super-glamorous route."? Is she going to tell them 'it's not who she is' and that 'they're not going to get it' even though TPTB is her boss and signs her pay checks?

I do think it's more self-deprecating than that--she's saying she's not the super glamorous type. And let's face it, she's right about that--the attempt this season to give her a trendier wardrobe and haircut has only made her look older and frumpy. The 'girl-next-door' clothes and look at least worked better on her. I don't see it as so much an arrogant refusal as an honest assessment of what she is and isn't. If they were looking for glamorous, they picked the wrong actress--and they clearly weren't looking for that.

And I think it's fair to say Stella and Aiden are/were glamorous in their own ways. We all joke about seeing Stella's "ladies" in the trendy tops she wears, and she always looks great (if not uber-professional). And Aiden was exotically gorgeous. Lindsay's very plain compared to them.

That being said, just getting a plain girl who looks the part wasn't enough. The girl-next-door charm is exactly what Lindsay should have...and is lacking completely.

Hey, why don't you guys like lindsay? I think she is awesome. I am not trying to invade your thread. I am just literally curious. I have not seen many episodes of CSI NY but from what I have seen, I love Lindsay. Please, don't be offended by my asking this question.

Honestly, read the thread. If you're really curious, the answers are in the numerous posts made in this thread.

 

[Kimmychu]

Top41 said:
I do think it's more self-deprecating than that--she's saying she's not the super glamorous type. And let's face it, she's right about that--the attempt this season to give her a trendier wardrobe and haircut has only made her look older and frumpy. The 'girl-next-door' clothes and look at least worked better on her. I don't see it as so much an arrogant refusal as an honest assessment of what she is and isn't. If they were looking for glamorous, they picked the wrong actress--and they clearly weren't looking for that.

:lol: Ah, I see what you mean. That's the meaning I would have gotten if it wasn't for the second line of her answer. The whole 'that is who I am' kinda changed the context of her answer, to me. Her hairstyle in season two was alright. That definitely made her look more towards Lindsay's supposed age. (Still wouldn't have bought her being 28 even then though.)

And wait, if TPTB decided to give her a trendier wardrobe and haircut, does that mean TPTB does want her to become more glamorous? :lol:

And I think it's fair to say Stella and Aiden are/were glamorous in their own ways. We all joke about seeing Stella's "ladies" in the trendy tops she wears, and she always looks great (if not uber-professional). And Aiden was exotically gorgeous. Lindsay's very plain compared to them.

Ah, we have different definitions of glamorous, that's why we're interpreting the answer differently. When I read the word glamorous, I think of someone bearing major blingbling like that of the filthy rich or overly gaudy fashion. :lol: So for me, the word has always had a negative connotation. Like ya mentioned, Stella wears trendy tops and looks good in them so I never associated 'trendy' with 'glamorous' since 'glamorous' = 'overly gaudy'. But glamorous being attractive. fascinating, charming, etc., yes, definitely, Stella and Aiden had all that in spades!

Poor Lindsay. It is not a good thing when the slightest attempt to be glamorized ends up backfiring in a bad way. The opposite of glamor = dullness, drabness, unexciting, etc. I guess Belknap was right about TPTB never, ever getting glamor from her/Lindsay.

That being said, just getting a plain girl who looks the part wasn't enough. The girl-next-door charm is exactly what Lindsay should have...and is lacking completely.

What piques my curiosity is why TPTB felt it was so important to get a plain girl who looked the part. Did they think that girls from outside of big cities are all plain and boring or something? If that's the case, it's damn narrow-minded. I don't see how an attractive-looking woman would be unable to play the part of a country girl well. If they went only with looks as a requirement for a character, what would happen if TPTB felt it was time for a change and any sort of change compromised the look that was the sole reason the actress was chosen for? Then what other reason would be left for that actress to stick around, especially if TPTB can find another actress who looks and acts better for the role?

It's not the looks that make a character, it's the acting.

 

[Shytownmofo]

I think the problem I have is that it doesn't seem as though Anna knows who her character is. As was posted above by Top41 I don't think Anna knows her character. I don't think that's all because the writers have made changes/been inconsistent with her. They haven't been all that inconsistent with her, IMO. Yeah, there have been some half hearted, dropped storylines, but that's been with all the characters in the show. However, the other actors know who their characters are, no matter what's been done with storylines and bios. (I'm thinking Danny, is he from Staten Island or The Bronx; Stella, who was supposed to have lived at St. Basil's Orphanage since she was an infant/toddler, but then she all of a sudden has a foster mother, and Flack, who was asking a whole bunch of questions about the Catholic Church in "Three Generations are Enough, but then went to Catholic Middle School)

It just bears out my assertion that Anna is not a very good actress. Good actors know their characters and their motivations. It doesn't seem like Anna does.

Her comment about "If you want glamourous, you're not gonna get it 'cause what you see is what you get." may have been more Self-deprecating, but it did come across as arrogant. I know it's words on paper, but, youch!

I know CSI:NY has put a lot of the actors into the characters, Danny having played baseball and been a musician just like Carmine Giovanazzo, Mac playing Bass like Gary Sinise, etc, but still...I'm not sure that's what Anna meant.

She ISN'T Lindsay Monroe, so she'll have to do what TPTB tell her. However, perhaps she can't, so she's just there.

I can understand they want her to be warm and approachable, but she comes across as cold and aloof. I think I'd actually have more respect for her character if they intentionally played her that way. Then, perhaps I would feel something for her other than indifference.

 

[privatename]

I think the problem I have is that it doesn't seem as though Anna knows who her character is.

I would tend to agree with this and I think it is a huge problem in terms of her ability to interest me at all in her character.

I can understand they want her to be warm and approachable, but she comes across as cold and aloof. I think I'd actually have more respect for her character if they intentionally played her that way. Then, perhaps I would feel something for her other than indifference.

If they were going for warm and approachable and I think that was and is the intention, they fell far short of the mark with their casting choice. Now perhaps Anna is warm and approachable in person, I don't know. Her interviews come off as fairly aloof as if she doesn't really put much energy into them, but as I don't know Anna at all and I haven't seen any interviews but only read them, I realize that I have no real sense of Anna as a person. That said, Lindsay does not come across as warm or approachable in any way to me. She comes across as condescending and has been rude on many occasions.

And she is right, she is not glamorous in the least. However, I don't need every woman on my t.v. screen to be glamorous, but if she is supposed to be a likeable character then she should have something likeable about her. To me, there really is nothing. Even the scenes where she is trying to portray light and cute come across as forced moments of Anna trying (and not really suceeding) to act light and cute rather than the character of Lindsay having a light and cute moment that is a natural part of her overall personality and it takes me right out of the scene.

 

[Top41]

The only time she succeeded with the light and cute stuff was in "Stuck on You" and even then, there was an undercurrent of edge because her whole motivation was to compete with Danny and show him up.

 

[cSiNyFrEaK30]

The only time she succeeded with the light and cute stuff was in "Stuck on You" and even then, there was an undercurrent of edge because her whole motivation was to compete with Danny and show him up.

The episode where she ate the bugs wasn't too bad for me, but i haven't seen it in a while, so I'm not sure how it compares now.

I think people have been making some very good points on Anna's view of Lindsay. While every other actor or actress on the show seems to become their character, she really doesn't. The "warmth" and "breath of fresh air" she was supposed to bring never materialized-Anna Belknap might be a sweet and warm person (and I haven't heard anything that disputes that from other cast members so I'm gonna guess she's at least a nice person) but she doesn't bring that to her character whatsoever. In her mind I think she has a clear seperation between who she is, and the character she is supposed to be portraying. Carmine and Melina can immerse themselves in their roles and become that character, but Anna always seems like she is Anna acting as Lindsay. If her character is supposed to be this warm and caring person like fans of her are claiming she is, it shouldn't be this hard to get that message from her acting. Even if her story lines can suck and her character is kind of ambiguous from the writing, she should be able to pull something out of it and show it on screen, even if its just an attitude or emotion. Flack, Sid, and Adam are all characters that don't get nearly the same amount of screen time as Lindsay does, but their acting skills and personalities are still more real and convincing. I never see Eddie or AJ or Robert acting, but always Flack, Sid and Adam on screen. I'm never confused as to what they are thinking or feeling or trying to emote, and they are given less exposure than Lindsay. If they can do the excellent job they do with what they are given, Anna should be able to do the same with her screen time-but she doesn't.

 

[IrinaAthena]

My main problem with Lindsay is the inconsistency in her personality. She gets clingy, then acts stubborn when Danny tries to make up? It doesn't really make much sense when I think about it. On their own, the different characteristics are okay, but together, it can make an unlikable character, like said before. Even if she was established as competitive and self-absorbed, and just that, at least the character would have had a personality. But with all the different versions of Lindsay, it makes her unlikable and flat to me.

 

[ladyhunter]

Although I haven't read every single post in the thread, I get the gist, Lindsay must go.

I watched Manhattan Manhunt the other night on SPIKE.

The part where Mac sent Lindsay back to the lab spoke volumes of what Mac thought she could handle. A telling tale right from the beginning of her character.
Then she got pissy at Danny about it and told her NOT to call her Montana. But in latter episodes she missed being called Montana.

I think the problem is what to do with her character. They already have tough-as-nails Stella. So is Lindsay supposed to be the 'girl-next-door'? They try to make her tough but somehow it's not coming through, they try to make her caring and fragile, but again, I don't see it. There is no depth to her character. No layers of feelings or anything.

Her character is supposed to have gone through this horrible tramatic experience, but she can't pull it off. I felt nothing for her when she left to go back to Montana for the trial. She could tell Stella but not Danny?? Whom she claimed she loves.

Bottom line, TPTB created something in Lindsay and they don't know what to do with it. If she does leave, I hope she's replace by someone with a little bit more depth.

 

[Kimmychu]

Top41 said:
The only time she succeeded with the light and cute stuff was in "Stuck on You" and even then, there was an undercurrent of edge because her whole motivation was to compete with Danny and show him up.

:lol: So, in other words, she can't do light and cute stuff, only fake cute stuff with the ulterior motive of showing off her 'awesomesauce-ness'.

cSINyFrEaK30 said:
Carmine and Melina can immerse themselves in their roles and become that character, but Anna always seems like she is Anna acting as Lindsay.

Bingo. According to Kim Coates (who played Detective Vicaro in season one), acting is 'becoming the character'. So like ya said, Carmine, Melina, Gary, the other actors on the cast have never had problems being their characters except for Anna.

Something's not right somewhere when people can tell an actress is trying to act like a character, ya know?

Welcome to the thread, IrinaAthena and hhunter!

IrinaAthena said:
My main problem with Lindsay is the inconsistency in her personality. She gets clingy, then acts stubborn when Danny tries to make up? It doesn't really make much sense when I think about it.

Yours and mine and that of most posters in this thread. And you have a point, it doesn't make sense at all ... unless ya consider the possibility she has emotional and maybe even psychological issues. It's almost a given that Danny's a messed up guy (Carmine even said it in his interview) but even he doesn't treat people like crap, much less people he loves, like she's treated him.

On their own, the different characteristics are okay, but together, it can make an unlikable character, like said before. Even if she was established as competitive and self-absorbed, and just that, at least the character would have had a personality. But with all the different versions of Lindsay, it makes her unlikable and flat to me.

Agreed. That's why I hope TPTB will finally stop using Danny as a prop for her character by season five. And about her having many different personalities, heh, that could possibly point to some underlying psychological problem too, if we're gonna go for a logical explanation here.

hhunter said:
The part where Mac sent Lindsay back to the lab spoke volumes of what Mac thought she could handle. A telling tale right from the beginning of her character.

Yes, that scene stood out to me too. Even more so when Lindsay griped about not being able to stay to process the scene ... and then later in the season, freak out at the mere sight of one dead body and then claim PTSD over her Big, Dark Secret. Whut?

Her character is supposed to have gone through this horrible tramatic experience, but she can't pull it off. I felt nothing for her when she left to go back to Montana for the trial. She could tell Stella but not Danny?? Whom she claimed she loves.

:guffaw: Yep, the signs were there for a long time; I don't think Lindsay gives a damn about Danny at all unless it benefits her in any way.

There's discussion in the Locker Room thread at the moment about Lindsay possibly seeing Danny as nothing more than a sex object/someone only worthwhile for sex. Do you agree? What do you guys think of this?