myfuturecsi
Corpse
Now what came after Daddy's Little Girl, Kiss Kiss Bye Bye..Nick lite..I think
The Nick Stokes Timeline: Part 2
- Thread starter Destiny
- Start date
- Status
Agreed. I don't think the people on the show had anything to do with it. I think it was mostly Les "I Hate Star Trek" Moonves.
That said, it could have been that the people on the show were dependant on Moonves for their jobs so they may not have been willing to go againist him. Moreover, I think the people at show were willing to let it go and at least in the later half of the season gave Nick some pretty good stuff to do.
I really think that the only thing that sticks out in my mind for this episode is what didn't happen in it...namely there was a scene where the entire gang are eating and talking about the case(Greg lamenting his lack of shrimp salad) but no Nick....I just sat up at that moment and went..mmm, this isn't like Nick. Maybe I am overanalyzing or I guess it's because I am still catching up on earlier seasons and am used to seeing Nick as always laughing with the guys and outgoing, but it seems he has taken a 360 degree turn since GD, Gum Drops and DLG especially. It's as if he is isolating himself from the group and shutting down emotionally if you will. Ironically, I think in the next episode(I think) Warick calls him Grissom, and that is what essentially he is becoming. Prefering to be on his own and away from people in general.I thought back to the episode where Grissom prefered to skip breakfast with the guys and instead shared it with one of his insects. To be honest, I can't think of one real conversation Nick has had with anyone since Gum Drops....So I don't know if this is a conscience choice on GE part, or just coincidence and my overthinking everything,but it seems to me that something is definitely not all right with Nick these days and I hope GE and TPTB are going somewhere with this.
Sorry -- third attempt to post comments on Daddy's Little Girl.... I keep getting time outs.
I wrote a comment late late last night, only to have this site time-out. Probably just as well. Now that I've had a chance to read everyone else's comments, my perspective has changed a bit and I will go back and watch DLG again.
I will add these thoughts, some of which I did draft last night.
I took the looking over the shoulder as he found Kelly's name in another way. The moment Nick saw her name, his involvement in the case should have been terminated for conflict of interest. But he wanted to pursue it, so he was checking to see if Grissom, Ecklie or anyone else who'd pull him off the case was looking over his shoulder. I just got a sense of him trying to keep it secret that he'd stumbled onto a connection to his own case.
I now do see the coldness Nick develops on hearing the audio file. It's easy to miss on first viewing which is something that concerns me.
It seems like the best bits of continuation on the Grave Danger story are coming from George and his way of playing Nick; not from the writers. But to get real closure we, the audience, need the writers to put something in the script. It's fantastic that George has decided how to play Nick, but to see the true state of mind Nick is in, we need to see one of the other CSI characters interact with him and that means the writers have to write something to address it. I'm glad Warrick finally said something in Pirates of The Third Reich. That gives me a little hope.
You know, there were hundreds of ways fans would rather have seen this episode scripted that what we got. Certainly making the Nick/Kelly story the B story was a bad choice, particularly when the A story was not great. I think it also took away from the story to have Catherine and Sophia be Nick's partners on the case instead of Warrick or Grissom and Brass. Why? Because the guys were far more emotional during parts of the Grave Danger story and their feelings about the whole thing could have been carried forward into DLG. Instead they gave us cold Sophia who wasn't around for Grave Danger (due to Louise Lombard's maternity leave) and Catherine who wasn't party to Grissom having the audio tape.
Getting back to Nick's character, I do feel this episode and Kelly's surprise visit to him in Still Life turned Nick cold far more than what happened in Gum Drops. Kelly freaked him out turning up like that. It exposed Grissom for keeping information from Nick so he can't trust him or look for apporoval from Grissom any more. And it made Nick's jail visit to Kelly at the end of Grave Danger useless. Despite him advising her "not to take it with her", she did. He can't even trust his own judgment on how to handle people. He's gone cold, he's all-business, and he's isolating himself from the team he used to pal around with.
I wrote a comment late late last night, only to have this site time-out. Probably just as well. Now that I've had a chance to read everyone else's comments, my perspective has changed a bit and I will go back and watch DLG again.
I will add these thoughts, some of which I did draft last night.
I took the looking over the shoulder as he found Kelly's name in another way. The moment Nick saw her name, his involvement in the case should have been terminated for conflict of interest. But he wanted to pursue it, so he was checking to see if Grissom, Ecklie or anyone else who'd pull him off the case was looking over his shoulder. I just got a sense of him trying to keep it secret that he'd stumbled onto a connection to his own case.
I now do see the coldness Nick develops on hearing the audio file. It's easy to miss on first viewing which is something that concerns me.
It seems like the best bits of continuation on the Grave Danger story are coming from George and his way of playing Nick; not from the writers. But to get real closure we, the audience, need the writers to put something in the script. It's fantastic that George has decided how to play Nick, but to see the true state of mind Nick is in, we need to see one of the other CSI characters interact with him and that means the writers have to write something to address it. I'm glad Warrick finally said something in Pirates of The Third Reich. That gives me a little hope.
You know, there were hundreds of ways fans would rather have seen this episode scripted that what we got. Certainly making the Nick/Kelly story the B story was a bad choice, particularly when the A story was not great. I think it also took away from the story to have Catherine and Sophia be Nick's partners on the case instead of Warrick or Grissom and Brass. Why? Because the guys were far more emotional during parts of the Grave Danger story and their feelings about the whole thing could have been carried forward into DLG. Instead they gave us cold Sophia who wasn't around for Grave Danger (due to Louise Lombard's maternity leave) and Catherine who wasn't party to Grissom having the audio tape.
Getting back to Nick's character, I do feel this episode and Kelly's surprise visit to him in Still Life turned Nick cold far more than what happened in Gum Drops. Kelly freaked him out turning up like that. It exposed Grissom for keeping information from Nick so he can't trust him or look for apporoval from Grissom any more. And it made Nick's jail visit to Kelly at the end of Grave Danger useless. Despite him advising her "not to take it with her", she did. He can't even trust his own judgment on how to handle people. He's gone cold, he's all-business, and he's isolating himself from the team he used to pal around with.
You're not imagining it. I commented on the same thing in a few episode discussion threads when KKBB aired. In fact, I think Warrick, Greg and Sara were sitting in the same positions as the breakfast scene in Gum Drops. Certainly the empty chair was the one on the left, closest to the camera -- exactly where Nick was sitting in the Gum Drops scene.
He was also missing in the group discussion among Grissom, Catherine, Sara and Warrick in Killer. He should have been there -- echoing back to the group discussions in the early seasons.
The problem with having the character absent in these scenes is that no other character's commenting on it. Let's hope someone does comment the next time Nick's clearly absent from a group discussion.
And a new thought on Kiss Kiss Bang Bang... it was interesting to have Nick and Archie in a scene in this epi following right on the heels of the Nick/Archie scene in Daddy's Little Girl. Nick was professional but certainly not friendly to Archie and he was far from the easy going guy who reviewed tapes with Archie in Bite Me. Cold is a good description.
I have to agree there wasn't much of Nick in KKBB, but what there was good.
1. When we first saw him with the father from last season was good. I liked how he walked over to him and mentioned that he worked the man's daughter's case. It was a good way to tie the two together and to remind the viewers who the guy was...
2. We saw him later with Archie. And I agree that he wasn't as nearly as friendly with the tech as he was in Bite Me a few monthes ago. But then, he is pretty much that way with Warrick in a later scene...so I don't think it was that he was mad at Archie in particular. Nick is withdrawing himself form everyone.
3. That point became clear in the breakroom scene. I don't know if it is because I am looking for it, and reading something that is not there, but I do think there was a reason that Nick was not there, laughing and chatting with the others. I still have some faith in the writers, so I do have hopes this is all part of the plan...just how long they are going to deal with this is what I don't know...
4. The lack of Nick in the rest of the episode is bit surprising, given that his main contribution comes via Grissom. That makes me wonder if there was something going with GE during that episodes filming where he was unaviable for filming for a few days...
Anyone else have any other thoughts ??
1. When we first saw him with the father from last season was good. I liked how he walked over to him and mentioned that he worked the man's daughter's case. It was a good way to tie the two together and to remind the viewers who the guy was...
2. We saw him later with Archie. And I agree that he wasn't as nearly as friendly with the tech as he was in Bite Me a few monthes ago. But then, he is pretty much that way with Warrick in a later scene...so I don't think it was that he was mad at Archie in particular. Nick is withdrawing himself form everyone.
3. That point became clear in the breakroom scene. I don't know if it is because I am looking for it, and reading something that is not there, but I do think there was a reason that Nick was not there, laughing and chatting with the others. I still have some faith in the writers, so I do have hopes this is all part of the plan...just how long they are going to deal with this is what I don't know...
4. The lack of Nick in the rest of the episode is bit surprising, given that his main contribution comes via Grissom. That makes me wonder if there was something going with GE during that episodes filming where he was unaviable for filming for a few days...
Anyone else have any other thoughts ??
ford_prefect
CSI Level Two
I don't have anything to add, just wanted to say I'm digging what you all are saying. 
I think this is my favorite thread. Everyone is so insightful.
I think this is my favorite thread. Everyone is so insightful. canshetype
Victim
Hey guys. I was out of town over the weekend, so I'm behind on the discussion. Just wanted to add a word about the scene in DLG where Nick hears the Walter Gordon tape... This is one of those situations where you wonder if what GE did was scripted or not. When he plays the tape the second time, he mouths the word "perfect," along with the evil murdering chick on the tape. At the time, he was probably convinced that it was Kelly, given her "perfect" response in Still Life. Oh and while I'm at it... the final scene in Kelly's suicide room of death... after Kelly dies, Nick moves backward and has to use the dresser for support. Another subtle move by GE. Did I mention that he's hot?
ford_prefect
CSI Level Two
I noticed that too and thought it was a nice touch. I wouldn't be surprised if that was something George just decided to do.
That I did not notice, him using the dresser for support that is, not that he's hot, 'cause well duh.
Now I'll have to watch the scene again. Oh drat.
G
Guest
Guest
I thought this was particulary poignant because, as Skylar has mentioned, weren't the others all sat in the same formation as the breakfast scene in Gum Drops? The now empty seat right in the foreground where Nick should be. It was so obvious. It just begged the question 'Where is Nick?'. I think it is too similar to Gum Drops to just be a co-incidence, I think it is a little titbit for the more observant watchers such as ourselves.
Ah damn. I was hoping to be up to date before tomorrow night's episode... sigh.
Oh well. You guys have been doing an awesome job nevertheless, and that's all that matters!
Oh well. You guys have been doing an awesome job nevertheless, and that's all that matters!
G
Guest
Guest
Shall we move on to Killer?
I need to watch the episode again but from memory Nick doesn't turn up until about half way through the episode. Although he does looks stunning at the bus stop when he makes his first appearance - cool angle!!
Nick is straight down to business. I love the way he points at the riders to move away - he's the boss. I did notice the quick glance over his shoulder.
Whilst Greg is lamenting about the woes of throwing away porn, Nick has already followed the tracks and found the evidence and almost solved the case. It's no-nonsense Nick.
Nick is once again blatantly absent from the group discussion a bit later on in the episode - further evidence of him withdrawing from his colleagues?
This episode also sticks in my mind because Nick says 'tire' in his most gorgeous accent several times - sorry I know this should be on the syndrome page but I just had to comment here.
With his tire info Nick cracks the case and Grissom acknowleges this fact!! How does Nick react? He doesn't!!! All those times in the past where Nick has been craving Grissom's praise and now he has it and nothing. Nick is unmoved. He does not break his stride. He is emotionally drained.
I also thought Nick looked different in the corridor scene - vulnerable - could be the change of clothing style but it seemed more than that to me. Can't really put my finger on it.
There was the bit at the end with Brass but I will have to watch this again.
I need to watch the episode again but from memory Nick doesn't turn up until about half way through the episode. Although he does looks stunning at the bus stop when he makes his first appearance - cool angle!!
Nick is straight down to business. I love the way he points at the riders to move away - he's the boss. I did notice the quick glance over his shoulder.
Whilst Greg is lamenting about the woes of throwing away porn, Nick has already followed the tracks and found the evidence and almost solved the case. It's no-nonsense Nick.
Nick is once again blatantly absent from the group discussion a bit later on in the episode - further evidence of him withdrawing from his colleagues?
This episode also sticks in my mind because Nick says 'tire' in his most gorgeous accent several times - sorry I know this should be on the syndrome page but I just had to comment here.
With his tire info Nick cracks the case and Grissom acknowleges this fact!! How does Nick react? He doesn't!!! All those times in the past where Nick has been craving Grissom's praise and now he has it and nothing. Nick is unmoved. He does not break his stride. He is emotionally drained.
I also thought Nick looked different in the corridor scene - vulnerable - could be the change of clothing style but it seemed more than that to me. Can't really put my finger on it.
There was the bit at the end with Brass but I will have to watch this again.
Amy777
Rookie
I agree with everything Easter said.
I think that what was "off" about the corridor scene was more the actor than the character. I think he was sick. If you notice at the end GE bumps into MH and jumps to the side. I think that he was weaving down the hall most of the way like he was dizzy or something. Also some people commented on his "husky" voice during this episode, I think he lost his voice. He tends to do this fairly regularly.
As for as the desert scene, I loved it, Nick was all focused on the case (referring the porno as "trash") and not loosing that focus during the whole time.
I also have noticed that Nick looks over his shoulder a lot more than he used to. Maybe this is part of the "fall out" form the kidnapping. For some reason the other characters either do not notice him doing this or they ignore it.
I think that what was "off" about the corridor scene was more the actor than the character. I think he was sick. If you notice at the end GE bumps into MH and jumps to the side. I think that he was weaving down the hall most of the way like he was dizzy or something. Also some people commented on his "husky" voice during this episode, I think he lost his voice. He tends to do this fairly regularly.
As for as the desert scene, I loved it, Nick was all focused on the case (referring the porno as "trash") and not loosing that focus during the whole time.
I also have noticed that Nick looks over his shoulder a lot more than he used to. Maybe this is part of the "fall out" form the kidnapping. For some reason the other characters either do not notice him doing this or they ignore it.
nickstokesfan
Coroner
I've noticed that, too!
Poor Nicky. *sends him virtual hugs*
Yeah, I think a few of us have been commenting on the frquent "over the shoulder" looks too. The dude is definitely on edge by times.
OK, I'm gonna do a quick catch-me-up:
Kiss Kiss Bang Bang-
Not a whole lot in this to read into, but I did like the comment from that guy Nick was talking to,( the one whose daughter was killed in season 5) about cigarettes: "Filthy habit. Tryin' to quit." I'm thinking that was for George's benefit since apparently he's been trying to kick the habit.
I also liked how he said the word "foyer". I don't know if that's how all Americans pronounce it, but he said "Foy- Yur". In Canada, we say "Foy-yay". It's a french word, after all. Anyway, it made me smile.
I liked the little bit where he and Warrick stumbled over the name "McGonigle". That was obviously some inside joke with the writers and actors or something. Probably somebody's friend. Always makes me think of a guy I knew in high school though with the same name.
Overall, I didn't see much new in the episode. Nick was just very business-like for most of the episode. I also didn't see anything amiss with the Archie scene like a lot of people did- again, they were just doing the job. Seemed normal to me, especially since there were no hot chicks for them to be drooling over like they usually do together! :lol:
I did miss him at that table scene though. However, keep in mind these guys don't always work every shift together. He might have had the night off, yeah?
Killer
Not much to comment on in this episode other than again, he's just doing the job... and finding the evidence that makes the case, as Grissom pointed out.
I did notice that he was walking a bit funny in the scene where he's walking down the hallway with Grissom and Catherine... a bit like he's got a pickle up his butt near the end there! :lol:
Alrighty then. I've already got comments ready for Pirates of the Third Reich but I don't want to jump the gun, in case anyone has stuff to add to KKBB or Killer. I'll come back tomorrow night and see where we're at.
OK, I'm gonna do a quick catch-me-up:
Kiss Kiss Bang Bang-
Not a whole lot in this to read into, but I did like the comment from that guy Nick was talking to,( the one whose daughter was killed in season 5) about cigarettes: "Filthy habit. Tryin' to quit." I'm thinking that was for George's benefit since apparently he's been trying to kick the habit.
I also liked how he said the word "foyer". I don't know if that's how all Americans pronounce it, but he said "Foy- Yur". In Canada, we say "Foy-yay". It's a french word, after all.
Anyway, it made me smile. I liked the little bit where he and Warrick stumbled over the name "McGonigle". That was obviously some inside joke with the writers and actors or something. Probably somebody's friend. Always makes me think of a guy I knew in high school though with the same name.
Overall, I didn't see much new in the episode. Nick was just very business-like for most of the episode. I also didn't see anything amiss with the Archie scene like a lot of people did- again, they were just doing the job. Seemed normal to me, especially since there were no hot chicks for them to be drooling over like they usually do together! :lol:
I did miss him at that table scene though. However, keep in mind these guys don't always work every shift together. He might have had the night off, yeah?
Killer
Not much to comment on in this episode other than again, he's just doing the job... and finding the evidence that makes the case, as Grissom pointed out.
I did notice that he was walking a bit funny in the scene where he's walking down the hallway with Grissom and Catherine... a bit like he's got a pickle up his butt near the end there! :lol:
Alrighty then. I've already got comments ready for Pirates of the Third Reich but I don't want to jump the gun, in case anyone has stuff to add to KKBB or Killer. I'll come back tomorrow night and see where we're at.
- Status