Marg/Catherine: The Sexier, the Better! #3.0

[margburger]

Sorry Erica,
I wasn't saying you specifically but referring to the recent thread. These are from within the past few hours and there are more further back.
Here's coolcatz, answering willowswannabe:

uh, ok. cath is a former coke addict.

Here's Bev:

I don't see how anyone can deny the evidence that Cath at one time had a problem.

This is what I object to. There isn't any real evidence.
margburger

Oh, and this just in -
Bev wants to make it personal:

Obviously, I could say yours are made out of naive, wishful thinking.

You could, I guess, but so what.

 

[Bev]

See, but there is. Eddie's choice of words. Plus the fact that she knew what the white powder was that Nick was processing. Then when he asked her how she knew, she told him, "Never you mind."

When you combine the two plus her history there is evidence.

 

[coolcatz]

eddie was not lying. the both of them had issues with drugs. cath found a way to stop (with eddie's money which was probably hers but that's another subject). eddie didn't. we know this from harvest (what do you expect linds, he was high!).

 

[Bev]

Bev wants to make it personal:

Obviously, I could say yours are made out of naive, wishful thinking.

You could, I guess, but so what.

Actually, you started it by telling me my theory was made of sand. But that's a whole 'nother story.

Yes, I do believe Cath's character had a cocaine problem. I also believe she kicked it and has gone on to become a productive citizen of CBS-land. Many people in real life have drug issues and have the ability to overcome them and make theirselves productive.

Its sad if people think "Once and addict, always an addict." Its so not true.

 

[coolcatz]

actually i disagree with your last point. i think it is true because it is so easy to go back to old habits. one has to make a concious choice to stay clean. but cath seems to be one to make that choice and keep making it.

 

[Bev]

coolcatz said:
actually i disagree with your last point. i think it is true because it is so easy to go back to old habits. one has to make a concious choice to stay clean. but cath seems to be one to make that choice and keep making it.

You're right. I was inferring more the people who have that attitude than the actual addicts themselves. Yeah, when you've had an addiction its going to be there for life. Its just the attitudes that other people have about it that get me irritated.

You're right. Cath deals with it admirably.

 

[coolcatz]

she does. and i think this is a choice by marg in how she plays cath. she doesn't play her as someone to feel sorry for. you want to cheer her on, you want to see her happy.

 

[Destiny]

*Walks in waves*

Hey all, noticed a little tension going on in here, so I thought I would do that little reminder for everyone, which is that you all have the right to your opinions, and to disagree with the opinions, but not to attack each other for having the opinions thats not tolerated.

Now lets play nice and move back on point and remember the reason you all are in this thread, your devotion for the actress and her character. Now you all have a nice day/night (depending where you are).

*Walks back out humming*

 

[margburger]

coolcatz said:
eddie was not lying. the both of them had issues with drugs. cath found a way to stop (with eddie's money which was probably hers but that's another subject). eddie didn't. we know this from harvest (what do you expect linds, he was high!).

Yeah, Eddie was lying. All you need to do is watch that scene and it is undeniable that he is throwing around angry, vicious slander, trying to undermine Cath in front of her coworkers and her boss. She caught him stealing from her and Lindsey and he's fighting like a cornered rat.
So, the mainstay of the "Cath was an addict" argument is a series of lies by an angry cheater, claiming to have done something impossible. Cath had supported him for years and kept his business afloat.
Now, I'm confused by a couple of recent posts. One string says that "close up a nose" refers to a surgical procedure that closes up a perforation caused by prolonged and intense cocaine abuse and another string says that it means going through rehab for addiction. Both of these are very expensive, requiring payment up front if there is no insurance. Eddie had no money and no insurance, certainly. Saying he took Cath's money to do this makes no sense.
Basically, the core of the addiction claim is worthless, the lies of an angry druggie (in Harvest, Lindsey referred to Eddie being high, not Cath).
Saying that because Cath could recognize cocaine after fifteen or more years as a criminal investigator means she had a cocaine problem is nuts. The other part, "Never you mind", is just a flirty, woman-of-the-world thing. She loves to tease the guys, Greg, Nick and Gil, because they are so naive she gets away with it. Notice that she never plays that game with Warrick. Remember the scene when Warrick identifies a substance as certain kind of heroin and Brass snidely asks him how he knows that. Warrick answers that it is his job to know. Same with Catherine. If she plays the boys for fools, that doesn't prove addiction. More likely, it proves that she never was, because she can treat it so casually. A real recovering addict would be too tensed up so close to the drug.
margburger

 

[AngelEyez]

Gee. Nice way of letting go, kid.

Anyway. If we want to assume that Eddie was lying, then we have to assume that he lied in everything else. Which would also indicate that he was a horrible father. But the thing is... his attitude to Lindsey was totally different. And I find it oh so stranger, that instead of telling him off when he brought up the 'close up' issue, she suddenly became so irritated, that she wanted to slap him. TO ME it says quite a lot... as if he hit a very sore spot.

And if we want to assume that Catherine is so smart that she never had a drug problem -just because she can treat it so casually now- will give you a false illusion. Because that smart and thoughtful woman MARRIED a drug addict. She knew it all along that Eddie was one.

With saying that she just teases the guys, you take away Catherine's credibility. They all make sense, you should just look at the bigger picture. The addiction story would fit her past lifestyle, you can't say that she doesn't do stupid things now either. She even used the lab (and asked for Greg's help) in a personal matter. It's one thing that she most probably came to her senses and now that she's in law enforcement, she has a totally different view on life and the world -as she should- but some of her recent stuff indicates that her having -even if not a heavy- drug problem is quite possible.

I personally wouldn't base too much on the official bio... if it weren't for the hints in the show.

And by the way, even Warrick had an addiction. He was a gambling addict. Addiction is addiction, even if they have certain differences. I guess you would deny Warrick's addiction too if it weren't for the -not so subtle- evidence of it.

 

[coolcatz]

as for harvest, cath is the first one to bring up eddie's drug use. it is after her saying that "it was because he was high" that linds comes back with she'd "rather had (Eddie) high over her anyday."

and again, cath still had the problem when she started working at the crime lab according to the bio. and so far nothing has changed in that part of her story (although she was born in two different places but that's well, that's just laziness on the part of the new writers).

 

[ren28]

All that can be said in this debate, I think, has been said. Just a little word here. Intelligence is no buffer against addiction. And AngelEyez is right: whatever one may be addicted to, the root problem is the same. The frightening thing is how prevalent the problem really is in any population. To some extent, shipping is an addiction for some of us! :lol:

So is it so hard to imagine that Catherine might, in her younger and harder days, turning in the circles she was turning, and coming from the relatively chaotic family background that seems to have been hers, that Catherine might have got hooked on drugs? No.

That she has managed to lick it is all to her credit though.

 

[coolcatz]

i think a lot of people want to see these characters as faultless when they are human beings with flaws. if they weren't then we, the viewers, would not be interested in them.

 

[EricaSJ]

coolcatz said:
i think a lot of people want to see these characters as faultless when they are human beings with flaws. if they weren't then we, the viewers, would not be interested in them.

Interesting. Because what drew me to Catherine was the fact that she isn't flawless. She's no saint. She used to be a stripper. She (might) have had drug problems. She made wrong choices (Eddie and Chris for example). She made mistakes (using the lab to test her own blood). She came from a complicated family. She also overcame her problems and worked her way to what she is now. To me, it's the imperfection of Catherine that makes her real and had me fall in love with this character.

 

[coolcatz]

oh the blood test. see i don't see that as catherine trying to find out who here father was. i see it as it was an opportunity to find out but it was also a way to find out if sam had killed a man. she was basically killing two birds with one stone. only when she confronted sam her emotions got the better of her and she brought up the father issue (a reason for her wanting gil to go with her maybe and since he wasn't there no one to keep her emotions in check?).