Louise/Sofia: Tough Women Don't Try, They Do! Part 2

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lol. I try.

I think that there's a difference, though, between being a one-note character, which I don't feel anyone else on the main cast is, and simply being an incomplete character, which I do feel Sofia is. I never get a sense of her motivations. I'm not asking that she be the same every single week or month or year. Every one of the CSIs has changed since Season 1. I don't feel any logical, natural progression in the way that she's changed.
 
Wow sarahvma, do you like Sofia AT ALL? You’re very persistent, which gives me the feeling that instead of just expressing an opinion you just really don’t like her and you want to have us understand and/or agree with your well thought-out argument on why she’s not a good character. I mean, I’d love to go into the Nick thread and with some fantastic reasoning have them all agree with me that “yeah, he does suck” but that’s just not going to happen (I’m not trying to bash, I’m just making a point). If this is an argument on whether or not she’s a good, purposeful, interesting, unique or well thought out character, then, in this thread you’re just not going to win it. Everybody in here already likes her, that’s why there here. All your going to get is all the people in here (what, there’s like 4 or 5 regulars ;)) trying to explain to you why she doesn’t suck.


sarahvma said:

• I don't think she should've been on this show in the first place
• answer me this: what unique character trait does she possess that makes her different from any other character currently on the show? What makes Sofia unique in Season 7?
• I see no consistency in her character whatsoever.
• I don't feel that Sofia currently, for better or worse, brings anything unique.
• she's basically there for no reason
• I don't feel she gets any personal screen time
• What does Sofia have or do that is in any way special or different
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You know I did actually have a very long response typed out in reply to your last post (especially the above points), but then I read the one you posted in response to atfm and I came up with something better then just rebutting everything you’ve said.

The thing is, at the end of the day, all this just comes down to personal opinion. A character one person (you) may see as see as a mess of qualities that has no purpose, another person (everyone in here) sees as a multifaceted and unique character, doing the job exactly as they’re suppose to be doing it (being a detective). So I’m not going to spend the next thousand or so words explaining why I like her or why I think she has a purpose as you asked me to (although believe me, I want to) because I imaging your response would be something like mine lisening to someone explain why Nick (or god forbid, GSR, or every single non femslash paring, really) is so great when no amount of explaining is going to make me change my mind because that's just the way I feel.

So I’m not going to patronise you by trying to change yours.

Besides if we keep going like this, we (or me at least, because I have gotten in trouble over this before) are just descend into an argument; and I imagine that if Destiny intervened it would be to say that everybody has different opinions and we should just agree to disagree and respect each others views.
 
Well said, Birdie (hey, I christened you). We could go on endlessley with this and nobody would budge. I wouldn't even get into an argument because I don't fight over something like this with people. I respect other people's opinions as long as they respect mine. So, like you said, let's just agree to disagree. :)
 
Thank you, thank you very much (that was my Elvis impersonation :D). I just realised I spent like two hours writing that, I got to get a life.
 
Birdie has left the building. LOL, don't you have essays to write or something? ;)

Okay, that's not on topic, so...I'll say I think I'll watch Hidalgo this weekend. I need to treat myself to some Louise. Or perhaps I'll cap Esther. Ooh, yeah, I'll do that. ;)
 
I do like Sofia around.. For the simple reason there are so many different guys on the show that I just like having another good looking woman around.
And still I see her with Grissom, or whatever they had going on in the beginning, but she's also a great match for Sara so I guess for me she does keep things interesting on the path of CSI love :D
 
I'm not a fan of Grissom, so I'd rather see her with Sara. Femslash all the way! *coughs* Yes, I know that doesn't belong in here.

88Blackbirds said:
Cap Esther, pleeeease, you know we’ll all love you for it :D.
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The things I do to make people love me. ;) Good luck with the last essay.
 
Birdie - I think it's perfect :) Much easier to type out than the full name...

oooh Esther caps - YES PLEASE!

*dances* Hot Louise, hot Louise...
 
Wow sarahvma, do you like Sofia AT ALL? You’re very persistent, which gives me the feeling that instead of just expressing an opinion you just really don’t like her and you want to have us understand and/or agree with your well thought-out argument on why she’s not a good character.
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No, I don't like the character. I wish she hadn't been brought in. But I do like Louise - I've seen her in interviews and she seems sweet, smart, and motivated. She casually joked about the accent everyone mocks which really endeared me to her. I'm happy to see her get her own show, because I think she's been wasted here. This is also a Louise thread.

I do dislike Sofia. But I more dislike her because they kept making her jump through all of these pointless character development loops to end up... nowhere. She could've been a fun addition to the cast, and instead they sort of used her as a tool for other characters, and then made her into a plain detective, and I wish I sensed some kind of middle ground is all.

The thing is, at the end of the day, all this just comes down to personal opinion. A character one person (you) may see as see as a mess of qualities that has no purpose, another person (everyone in here) sees as a multifaceted and unique character, doing the job exactly as they’re suppose to be doing it (being a detective). So I’m not going to spend the next thousand or so words explaining why I like her or why I think she has a purpose as you asked me to (although believe me, I want to) because I imaging your response would be something like mine lisening to someone explain why Nick (or god forbid, GSR, or every single non femslash paring, really) is so great when no amount of explaining is going to make me change my mind because that's just the way I feel.
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All I was asking was a curiosity on my part as to why you liked her. I do apologize if it came off as argumentative. That said, this is not a "for Sofia fans only" thread. It's a discussion board. I mean, if you didn't like "Lab Rats", would you think it unfair for someone to say you didn't have a right to speak your mind about it?
 
Of course it's not a "Sofia fans only" thread, everyone is welcome here as long as they don't bash the character, which you didn't, you just made your point and that's totally fine. All she was saying was that in this thread, there ARE mostly Sofia fans, so you're not going to convince anyone in here. But of course you're entitled to your opinion, as is everyone else.

I guess I'm not one of those people who get worked up over character development or lack thereof. I don't base my sympathies on that. I either like a character or I don't. Obviously I don't want them to be pointless, either, and would prefer if their presence played an actual role. But sometimes, I'm just happy if they're there, even if there are character inconsistencies. Yes, I'm that shallow. It's TV, it's fun, there are more important things in life, that's the way I see it, and of course, that's only my opinion. :)

Drumchik said:
Birdie - I think it's perfect :) Much easier to type out than the full name...
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That's what I was thinking. ;)
 
Drumchik said:
Birdie - I think it's perfect :) Much easier to type out than the full name
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Ahh, *slaps forehead* that’s what atfm was talking about, Jesus Christ I’m an idiot sometimes, I didn’t realise what she (well, you if your reading this) was saying until now. I think it’s the dyslexia, sometimes I just don’t read words properly...yes you can call me that, I like it :D.

sarahvma said:
All I was asking was a curiosity on my part as to why you liked her. I do apologize if it came off as argumentative. That said, this is not a "for Sofia fans only" thread. It's a discussion board. I mean, if you didn't like "Lab Rats", would you think it unfair for someone to say you didn't have a right to speak your mind about it?
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Damn, atfm, you just made everything I’m about to say pretty much irrelevant. And you did it sounding nice too, while my post just makes me sound like a b****, oh well ;).

Now sarahvma, can I just ask you where in my post it said that this was a “Sofia fans only" thread where you can’t express your opinion. I was just trying to say that if you wanted us to agree with you’re argument on the pointlessness of Sofia (and I do think you made some rather good points to support your argument; yes, arguing is exactly what you’re doing when you present evidence to support an opinion) then that probably wouldn’t happen in here, since everyone in this thread (by virtue of regularly posting in here) are fans who rather enjoy her presence on the show.
 
88Blackbirds said:

Ahh, *slaps forehead* that’s what atfm was talking about, Jesus Christ I’m an idiot sometimes, I didn’t realise what she (well, you if your reading this) was saying until now. I think it’s the dyslexia, sometimes I just don’t read words properly...yes you can call me that, I like it :D.
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Duh. Slow on the uptake, are we? *chuckles* ;)

Damn, atfm, you just made everything I’m about to say pretty much irrelevant. And you did it sounding nice too, while my post just makes me sound like a b****, oh well ;).
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LOL, um, sorry? I'm just really not into fighting over things that are simply a matter of opinion. I appreciate a good argument if it's conducted calmly but I'm so over the whole message board war thing. ;) I respect other people's opinions if they are based on facts and well-argued and don't consist in running in here, yelling, "Sofia sucks and so does Louise!" and then leaving.
 
Okay we preferre debating to arguing, that just sounds so negative and negative not good. :p -- Also glad to see the mantra about opinions have been driven in and recognized. Also for those who do not know what atfm is saying about the yelling is the rule: Show Criticism - It's fine to say a certain aspect of CSI is bad, as long as you don't insult the people who think otherwise, and as long as you actually back up what you say. Jumping in and shouting "Curtis sucks!" is not an acceptable form of constructive criticism." (name changed to reflect the thread).

Yes its true everyone is welcome here, its not strictly one demensional thread, but a multi demensional thread. While one might say "I love the actress she is great! but the character seems out of place" thats okay, but others might say "I love the character! but the actress seems a touch wrong for the role." It's all dependant upon how we see it.

Yet everyone in my opinion seems to agree with one thing while the actress is good and growing with each role. That being said the material they are given they do the best they can with, and there will be some who think its the best they have seen and some who will say they have seen better. Everyone actress needs growth in the industry, Sofia is just part of that stepping stone for that actresses growth.

There are times lets face it that Louise is under played, you can see it in the character, and there is a time when you see the scene (such as ABRTI) in which you say wow that was a depth reached. Granted Intro's are also an important part first impression and some will say, refreshing and some will say could have been better. That part on any show is no different then real life, be it reality interferring with fiction or vice versa.

I don't think anyone in this thread is trying to change someones mind, but rather purposing (from both sides) that you all expand just further on the actress/character and your thoughts on them. Though please remember that some people are so set on their opinion that it could be hard if not impossible to make them see, or make them uncomfortable, other times you finally come together and say hmm there is a point I can agree with. Its a challenge for everyone and one that I am sure that you all will come to at some time, until then listen to all opinions, you might see theirs or you might see something totally different. That is what the clean positive debating is for widing the horizan if you would. ;)
 
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