Not everyone has to agree. I am not GSR, but I'm not 100% against it, I'm just not crazy about it. I don't see it taking over the show.
I say Gris should date whoever he wants.
And those who don't want to watch the show, JUST DON'T! The fact that some don't like it anymore doesn't mean that no one else can. Why is someone here if they are sick of the show? Just to badmouth?
I have no intention to be disrespectful, i just don't like the direction where this is going....
I'll shut up now
The initial flirtation between Grissom and Sara is cute, but enough not to be too weird considering where they are. It stopped after they each got one line out. Then, it was back to work. Their focus was on the case, and what they have to do.
I think Catherine's comment about the familiarity of the faces drifting away is interesting, and how Warrick didn't view that as a necessarily good thing. That's sorta what this episode was about, to me. These CSIs are used to dealing with death every day. They have to inform families of what happened every day. My mind keeps floating back to "Invisible Evience" where Warrick and Nick were fighting about how much to tell the family members, about how much to give away and how sensitive was too sensitive, etc.
In this episode, we saw Sara affected by a victim. Yes, that's happened before, but this new experience gave her and Nick a new kinship, in that they'd been there with the person who was barely hanging on. In Nick's case, the little girl lived. But, in Sara's, the young woman did not. I think this was probably especially hard for Sara considering how her father was murdered. Her mother stabbed her father to death. Now, here Sara was, holding the hand of a dying woman, talking out of a slit in her throat. She was dying, and all Sara could do was hold her hand.
Hodges and Warrick had their turns to show their more sensitive sides, but I'll get to them.
The symbolism of the cut on Sara's face is really apparent on the second viewing. The victim didn't just touch Sara, she got under her skin. This wasn't a case that Sara could shake. Yes, she stayed professional as much as she could throughout, but she was affected the whole time. She was holding back tears, and trying to do the right thing.
I like Nick's immediate concern for Sara over what happened. They're good at keeping an eye on one another in the field. Sara did it for him in "Gum Drops" and here, he's trying to keep an eye out for her. They always watch out for each other. Yet, they don't have to say much, but they know it's a shared experience. When they're talking during their first interaction of the episode, you can see on Nick's face that he's remembering the little girl from "Gum Drops", that he's remembering that desire and will to save her as she clung to life. And, he has a sadness for Sara, because this time, it didn't work out...
I must say, Doc Robbins telling Sara about the six girls seemed like a planned scene to try to further personalize the story for Sara, but it was unnecessary and really out of place. Sara came in on her day off. She was not the primary on the case. Therefore, someone else probably should have been getting that briefing. I mean, Sara's my fav character, and I'll all for increased screentime for her, but this moment seemed forced and out of place. I realized that the first time I watched it, and upon second viewing, it was even more obvious.
However, I do like how Ms. Fox played the moment when Doc Robbins showed her to look at the stabbing wounds from the one blond who was raped... Did you see how much it affected her? She was remembering the last time she saw that kind of stabbing, just a pre-teen in her house, with the police swarming and her mom being taken away as her dad's corpse laid there, covered with stab wounds and blood. It made the case even more personal for Sara. She can try to be a prfoessional CSI as much as she wants, but that's something she has that is unique to her among the CSI's, first-hand experience of constant physical abuse mixed with a violent death right before her eyes. Like Grissom seeing the girl who reminded him of Sara in "Butterflied", Sara has found her obsession point with the stab wounds.
One thing that bothers me: How many times have we had knife tips break off on this show? I know it probably happens often in real life, but it feels like we've just had many killers who had the knife tip break off, and it's a little... feels like a little bit of a copout since there's so little science in this episode. Yes, it's character driven, but there had to be something more creative to link the killer than the fact that the knife tip broke off AGAIN.
As for the humanization of Hodges, I'm not sure what to think about it. I like the character, and it was an interesting moment, but I feel like we're suddenly humanizing everyone. As others said, Catherine's an ex-stripper. She knows what it's like to stand up there dancing half-naked, and I could have seen her and Sara having a talk about their different aspects of connection on this case. Don't get me wrong, Mr. Langham acted the HECK out of that scene... But, I would have liked to see a little more Cath this episode.
I loved Warrick going back to his old neighborhood. I absolutely loved it. Warrick is my fiance's favourite character, so we often get into discussions about him, and I have to say that I loved getting to see a little more of Warrick and the type of life he had that shaped him into the man he is. Up until this point, we've met Nick's parents. We learned about Sara's parents. We knew Cath's parents and daughter. We know Grissom's Dad died when he was 10, and his mom was deaf. We know about Greg's grandparents and that his mom didn't know he was in the field. Finally, we know more about Warrick than, "His grandmother raised him." We get to see a neighborhood, quiet and serene. The colors aren't bright and flashy. They're calming and cool, reminiscent of Warrick himself, often a calming element for others. When Grissom left in LLV, he called Warrick "the rock of the team." Until this moment, seeing his old neighborhood, seeing a woman he grew up next to, I forgot why.
I love the way it's shot when the woman first sees him. He's standing there, and he looks so small, like a little boy, almost, probably reflective of the vision she's had of him until this moment. He took the trash for her, he talked with her. He tried to do it as gently as possible, and she ended up crumbling in his arms. He was her rock. He held her up in that moment when gravity was going to pull her down. This is the Warrick Brown I love, not the man constantly complaining about his marriage, yet putting work ahead of it. This man RIGHT HERE, who puts an effort into human beings is the Warrick I love. This is the Warrick who can playfully get a little boy to give his DNA by showing him how wiping the inside of your mouth can be a game. This is Warrick Brown, flawed, but beautiful.
The Greg continuity in this episode? It's just like the G/S scene in "Snakes." It was completely out of place within the context of the episode, but a complete set-up for next week.
When Sara wants to go with the vic/killer, Nick knows it's not a good idea, but lets her make her own decision. He lets her go, knowing she's freakin' stubborn. She just wants to help. She let it get personal. She feels like this is another person who was taken advantage of, another person who was attacked who was completely innocent, and she wants to give him that comfort. She wants him to make it. It's tragic, really, that her vision is so clouded.
Someone over at YTDAW noticed the correlation of the hand scenes at the end of each act... really great catch! I was so annoyed by the hand scenes the first two times, that I missed it the third. I don't remember who noticed it, but it's great camera work, right there.
As for why the guy slit it own throat, I personally thought he was suffering from paranoia. He kept listening to the radio to hear reports. He was watching the television. He might have felt like the walls were closing in on him. At least, that's how I read it the first time around. Trying to kill himself was completely irrational, but I figured his paranoia and whatever else was wrong with him (psychotic, alcoholic, etc) pushed him over the edge and he just went for it. Rather than letting them catch him, he was going to take matters into his own hands. It's not unusual for CSI killers to do that. No, he's not a serial killer like the Blue Paint Killer or Paul Milander, but both of them would rather take their own life than let the system decide a path for them... Control.
The look on Sara's face when she realized the "victim" was the killer was intense. Once she figures out, she's going a mile a minute. She can't stop, and I love Grissom trying to balance her out, because it reminds me of me and my fiance. I'm the bubbly, over-excited one at times, especially when I'm passionate about something. Grissom's telling her to take it one step at a time, and the voice he's using isn't the voice of a supervisor when he says, "One step at a time." Before, he was trying to be a boss, but now, he's concerned about her.
As for the gun, it does look quite real at first glance. To someone who doesn't see guns often, that's enough to frighten them into doing whatever they were told. So many people have a fear of death, of pain, of dying. The girls had no way of knowing that the gun in their faces was nothing more than a toy. This is why paint ball guns have to have an identifying orange tip, why so many guns are tipped, because this kind of thing can happen. It's a terrible reality that crimes can be committed with a toy brandished as a weapon.
The end scene: It's Sara and Grissom. They're standing by each other, and he's already completely invading her personal space. She has her arms pulled around her, her jacket over her arms. It's a defensive stance, and the last time we saw it, she was protecting herself from Grissom as he said goodbye to her in the locker room. Tonight, he standing by her side, right there, helping her fend off the monsters as much as he can. She watches the images on the screen. After functioning on pure adrenaline for so long, pushing herself so hard to find the answers, she finally lets it come down.
The tears fall down her face, and she admits to him that she held the hand of the killer. She looks to him as a million emotions wash over his face. There's a bit of shock. There's the temptation to scold her, to tell her she shouldn't have done that. There's also compassion. As she turns away from him, compassion for his lady love takes over as the primary emotion. In the past, he would have given her a lecture, would have told her that she was chasing rabbits, would have cautioned her on getting too close to the victim and spending all her time in hospital rooms... He would have talked to her about winning and losing, and given her a riddle to ponder. Tonight, he has no words. There's nothing he can say.
Her telling him outright meant she wanted him to know. She wasn't trying to hide anything and keep him out of the loop. She was telling him in that moment why she had been so terribly affected by the whole thing, why she was standing there crying. She told him without him having to ask. She opened herself up to his opinion, to his ridicule, to whatever she thought he might offer. But, he only offered comfort. He reached up, wiping her tear away awkwardly with his left hand while his right arm wound around her back, letting her know he was there. She looks at him, her eyes searching his, reaching out. He looks down, the squints at her, realizing this isn't the best place to give her the comfort she needs. With a glance towards the door, he tells her they should go. She nods, following his lead, but his arm never moves from around her.
It's consistent for Grissom to have an arm around her. It really is. If you go back to Strip Strangler, as they walked away from the decoy operation, he has his arm around her, protectively. If you listen, you can actually hear the sound of his hand touching her back as he leads her away. In Blood Drops, he walks arm in arm with her across the busy street. Then, puts an arm around her to steer her clear of the sprinkler they pass so she won't get wet. It's instictual for him to put an arm around her when he's worried, concerned, and not paying attention to his own fears about doing so. When they walk out, he wants her to know he's there for her. As the camera smashes to black, she turns towards him. She feels the love that he's offering her, and it's incredibly sweet.
As for the person cleaning the floor? I definitely think there's something MCSK-related there. See, the shot was set up so we saw the cleaner in the background as soon as we saw Gil and Sara. That was intentional. These people see things no one else does. So often, sadly, people think of janitorial staff as invisible. They see more than we ever realize. And, this could be the key to figuring out who the MCSK is.... We'll see, I guess.
Overall, I liked the episode, but I still didn't LOVE it. I agree with others who say there were some WONDERFUL pieces there that just didn't make a complete whole. I love all the symbolism involved in the episode, all the consistencies with character and past reactions to various events. But, the flow of the script wasn't there. It was a little disjointed and a little rushed to make it to the conclusion. I figure they were using the flashbacks to try to introduce the girls to us as human beings and not just dead-bodies-of-the-week. But, the time it took to do that took away from case time. So, there was a compromise, and I think it just knocked the episode down a little in overall effect.
I know I've written a novel, and this is really late. But, there you go.
And please, do never pull the occupancy card sine most of you have no idea what your fellow forumist does for a living. that's just cheap shots to somehow save a sinking ship. Let the passive-agressiva attack on those who do not agree with you slide. That's not prefessional either. *sighs*
I didn't pull the occupation card. I said that this is what I do for a living, and this is what I know about what I do for a living. Just like I would respect opinions from other people, who have experience with what they do. And you need to remember that what happens in NYS (where I am) might not happen in Las Vegas, or the Netherlands, or France, or whereever. Isn't the purpose of a debate to learn? I'm not attacking. I'm pointing out what I know, in a polite manner.
quoth, you're awesome. i wanted to say the same thing. you know it's so funny to me that when Grissom and Sara weren't canon, they "didn't have chemistry" but now "they give each other stupid looks". hilarous, lol.
I have always thought they have never had chemistry, and always cringed at their attempt at 'flirting'. I am NOT TELLING YOU GUYS YOUR OPINION IS WRONG!! I don't care if you guys like GSR, but I don't. SO STOP LAUGHING AT MY OPINION AND SAYING IT IS STUPID!
no duh! does anyone actually read my posts? I never said you guys are wrong for liking GSR, I am just trying to point out how its affecting the show for non-GSR fans.
Then why not stop watching it? It's not just a fanbase, they've been cooking GSR up from season one. Jorja Fox said in an interview that she specifically came into the show as a love interest for Grissom. They've been planning this since day one. Not everyone's going to agree with it, and not everyone's going to like it. But the producers and writers have said that it makes more sense for Grissom and Sara to be together.
Just because the writers and the actors think its a good idea, doesn't mean it is. For a show like CSI, a relationship is a disaster.
And in this case, I see value in many of things that all of you have said. First of all, QTR is correct, in that if you added up the GSR scenes, they would not take up all that much time. You can't say that those scenes dominate the entire season, because they are not the focus of the show. Even if we keep the relationship in mind, so what?
Another poster who apparently missed my explanation of the scenes themself are not taking up that much time, but the fact the rest of the show has changed, which makes it dominate. Also the fact that its one of the biggest storylines for this season.
There is more to CSI than Grissom and Sara (and for the record, who the heck cares who Grissom dates. They are both adults, they are both consensual, and really, ten years isn't that big of a deal. I know people who married someone 20 years older/younger than them, and who cares? Also, although they may have had a friendship dynamic, Sara has consistently asked Grissom out throughout the years. That takes away the father/daughter dynamic).
Asking someone out on a date, doesn't change their dynamic for me. And I am pretty sure the county will care if they are dating, since Grissom is Sara's supervisor. Did everyone forget about the episode 'the Accused is Entitled'?? Rewatch it...
And I guess Grissom shouldn't have given all those lectures about lab ethics to the other CSI's. He didn't even want to take the money from catherine to save Nick in 'Grave Danger' because it would make the lab look bad.
I have always thought they have never had chemistry, and always cringed at their attempt at 'flirting'. I am NOT TELLING YOU GUYS YOUR OPINION IS WRONG!! I don't care if you guys like GSR, but I don't. SO STOP LAUGHING AT MY OPINION AND SAYING IT IS STUPID!
I wasn't saying your opinion was stupid, nor was I laughing at it. I respect everyone's opinions. I just don't like the fact that everyone's saying GSR is gross or disgusting I just want everyone to get along and like the same show we've been watching for seven years now. Ships shouldn't make a difference...
Ships will always make a difference, just like favourite characters will make a difference. We're all different. We're rehashing old arguments, here.
We respectfully disagree, at least I hope we do, on a billion and one things in this world. We all like CSI, though, right? I'm all for civil discussion, but this thread is becoming consumed not by discussion of the individual episode, but by the constant banter between those who don't like GSR and those who do...
I think this episode was a good episode in terms of balance of characters (with the exception of Catherine). And, I'm not the biggest Cath fan in the world, but I do like her and the flavor she adds to the show. So, if you could have rewritten this episode, how would you have incorporated Cath in more? I'm just curious.
Personally, I would have loved a scene between Cath and Sara, the girls. I love their scenes and connections, and there was something for both of them in these brutal murders. That would have made the episode a little more complete for me. What about you guys?
I have always thought they have never had chemistry, and always cringed at their attempt at 'flirting'. I am NOT TELLING YOU GUYS YOUR OPINION IS WRONG!! I don't care if you guys like GSR, but I don't. SO STOP LAUGHING AT MY OPINION AND SAYING IT IS STUPID!
geee, chill out. get some distance, it's only a TV show. there is no Grissom nor Sara nor Catherine in a real world so you don't have to worry that the world's gone bad.
and i've never said your opinion is stupid. i laughed cuz you made me laugh. if you can say something made you want to vomit, i can say i laughed, right?
can Erica come back here please? lol
Al i love your interpretation of the episode. seriously, you rock. i just gotta say that i loved the episode though, it was purely awesome, and i, being completely unspoiled, was very surprised and excited. it was great, and i'm gonna watch it the third time now
If people bitch about GSR so much that they want to give up watching CSI all together, then they are watching the show for the wrong reasons. GSR centric stuff takes up at most 30 seconds of a 45 minutes episode, that is like 1%-2%, get a grip.
Alyssa great interpretation of the whole scenerio/episode .. big applause
you got to the depth and the meaning of this episode.. you should write for CSI.. I agree with everything you said and on age difference.. guess my boyfreind and I should be shot at dawn, 15 yr. age gap.. age has nothing what-so-ever to do with anything.. when two people are "in tune" and have everything in common.. that's the key!!!
mrb105 said:
If people bitch about GSR so much that they want to give up watching CSI all together, then they are watching the show for the wrong reasons. GSR centric stuff takes up at most 30 seconds of a 45 minutes episode, that is like 1%-2%, get a grip.
Unfortunately I can't say I was unspoiled :lol: When I saw that it was a Sara centric episode I couldn't help myself. But I just downloaded the episode from iTunes last night and watched it before bed The Warrick scene still makes me cry!
Unfortunately I can't say I was unspoiled :lol: When I saw that it was a Sara centric episode I couldn't help myself. But I just downloaded the episode from iTunes last night and watched it before bed The Warrick scene still makes me cry!
Why would a professional CSI blameserself for a victim's death? That sounds emotiionally unstable, On the job, youäre professional, you don't blame, you don't assume you keep your own emotions back.
You do know that feelings can be quite irrational ?
One of my neighbours works with the police as some kind of religious counseller (maybe someone here knows the right word). He goes with the police to notify the family , things like that but he also does the counselling for the police and the firefighters. It affects them even if it's there job .
That's true, but I think they've all cried..while on their watch..& and at other harrowing times.. Nick..Cath..Sofia.. Brass.. Grissom.. Greg..their not robots.. and have deep feelings, when push comes to shove. and it gets to you.. an killer jumping at you.. how would anyone react.. holding his hand prior someone dies on you.. lots of swirling emotions there
