That idea would hold water if he'd been a suspect at the time, but he wasn't. He wasn't even on the map. If he had been, I could've bought the idea that he sliced himself to throw them off the trail, but as it is, it smacks of the writers needing a cheap road out of the time-constraint corner they'd painted themselves into.
"Empty Eyes" Discussion *SPOILERS*
- Thread starter Destiny
- Start date
That idea would hold water if he'd been a suspect at the time, but he wasn't. He wasn't even on the map. If he had been, I could've bought the idea that he sliced himself to throw them off the trail, but as it is, it smacks of the writers needing a cheap road out of the time-constraint corner they'd painted themselves into.
xfcanadian
Pathologist
Its in every episode, the GSR storyline has gotten more scenes than the greg storyline! Every 30 sec scene just makes me lose more and more interest in the show.
Plus they have taken out a lot of the character interaction with Grissom and Sara with the other characters. Its like they have segregated themselves away from everyone. tptb took out all the character interactions that favoured the other pairings to push this relationship. Also Grissom sucks now. His character is completely turned from the quirky scientist, to an unenthusiastic boss who doesn't seem to care about any of the other CSI's. The storylines, the science, and the writing have all got worse, I guess as long as their are GSR scenes in the episodes, no one even notices the rest, so why bother?
allmaple
Judge
wow, a 15 year age difference is worthy of a grandfather/grand daughter like relationship?
anyway, i like the observation that maybe the guy (i dont remember his name, im useless with details) wanted to see what it felt like. we know he is sick, no remorse and felt like it was no big deal, so maybe hes crazy enough to try it on himself to try and figure out what all the fuss was for since he couldnt understand it himself. like someone said, it was a shallow cut and in a public place, not likely a suicide attempt. lots of people cut themselves without hoping to take their own life. and if he didnt go out that night intending to kill 6 women, then he probably didnt intend to get caught if he cut himself, he just wanted to do it.
i dont necessarily think there were plot holes, i just think they didnt leave themselves enough time to deal with it in another way. ie a clue that leads them to someone who leads them somewhere else etc. they wanted the time to focus on the cast, not the victims, which worked for me but obviously not for a lot.
anyway, i like the observation that maybe the guy (i dont remember his name, im useless with details) wanted to see what it felt like. we know he is sick, no remorse and felt like it was no big deal, so maybe hes crazy enough to try it on himself to try and figure out what all the fuss was for since he couldnt understand it himself. like someone said, it was a shallow cut and in a public place, not likely a suicide attempt. lots of people cut themselves without hoping to take their own life. and if he didnt go out that night intending to kill 6 women, then he probably didnt intend to get caught if he cut himself, he just wanted to do it.
i dont necessarily think there were plot holes, i just think they didnt leave themselves enough time to deal with it in another way. ie a clue that leads them to someone who leads them somewhere else etc. they wanted the time to focus on the cast, not the victims, which worked for me but obviously not for a lot.
xfcanadian
Pathologist
It isn't about their actual age difference, its how their character dynamics. Also, in the earlier season, Sara always acted way younger than she was. To me, they have always had the father/daughter dynamic, and now its just creeping me out. Plus those two are as exciting as watching paint dry when they are together...lol.
quoth_the_raven
Corpse
What about when he specifically went to the hospital to see Greg after he got attacked, or held Catherine after Keppler died? I don't think that's not caring
And if you think about it, his new attitude fits. He's in a relationship now and he doesn't know how to act. He's never been in one before.And I really don't think GSR has dominated the show. If you count all the GSR moments this season, it wouldn't add up to more than a few minutes. This season has been more Catherine-centric, than GSR centric. I love Catherine, and she's had tons of episodes this season.
How did Sara act younger than she is? She's never been in a real relationship either. She doesn't know how to act.
I've always thought Grissom and Catherine had a best friend dynamic but I don't say they creep me out or make me sick when they're on screen together
vegaslights
Brute
It's NOT just the age difference. Look at the early seasons. It's the chemistry and beyond. Or lack thereof.
xfcanadian
Pathologist
quoth_the_raven said:
What about when he specifically went to the hospital to see Greg after he got attacked, or held Catherine after Keppler died? I don't think that's not caring
And I really don't think GSR has dominated the show. If you count all the GSR moments this season, it wouldn't add up to more than a few minutes. This season has been more Catherine-centric, than GSR centric. I love Catherine, and she's had tons of episodes this season.
The storyline is one of the dominant storylines this season. Just because there are only 30 seconds here and there doesn't mean its not affecting the rest of the show. Like those stupid looks they give each other, or Grissom's character being ruined. He isn't a scientist anymore, he is just blah now. Boring, and they keep wasting the scenes that he is in with GSR stuff.
He didn't even care about Greg in EE, and we had a 2 second flat scene with catherine. And what happened to him not playing politics?
quoth_the_raven
Corpse
Greg has had tons of airtime this season, as Catherine has had as well. Sara, Warrick and Nick have had barely any screentime.
How are the looks they give eachother stupid? There was tons of chemistry and there still is. Sexual tension is the only way to describe it. There was never that with Catherine and Grissom, it was always best friends teasing eachother. It IS chemistry but not sexually. They're comfortable around eachother because they've known eachother for years.
You're a G/C shipper obviously and I'm a GSR shipper, but I'm also a multi-shipper. I don't have a thing against G/C. Why can't we all just get along?
How are the looks they give eachother stupid? There was tons of chemistry and there still is. Sexual tension is the only way to describe it. There was never that with Catherine and Grissom, it was always best friends teasing eachother. It IS chemistry but not sexually. They're comfortable around eachother because they've known eachother for years.
You're a G/C shipper obviously and I'm a GSR shipper, but I'm also a multi-shipper. I don't have a thing against G/C. Why can't we all just get along?
S_Bright
Police Officer
It's not character development, this is regression. These are seasoned CSIs and they do not even seem to know they are breaking the law half of the time. Ambulance rides with a suspect with out medical personnel overseeing? The city is looking to get sued. You do not ride along in an ambulance unless the patient is a minor under your supervision. And then you always have to have medical personnel present.
This was all written for one dramatic OOC Sara = Bad writing.
The acting is totally OOC and furthermore not even age-relevant. These are not immature teens, they're adult professionals. At least they should know the legislation.
I don't understand why you think the romance dominates the show, S_Bright
It doesn't dominate it, it ridicules it.
The man obviously tried to kill himself so he wouldn't have to do time in jail and/or to direct blame on someone else. He didn't have remorse or guilt, he didn't want to get caught
If a tv-show that calls itself scientific makes its viewers believe that about a "classic psychopaht" then the science is long gone. If you use clear medically diagnosis and rewrites them to fit into your drama = bad writing.
The man wasnät even close to get caught. He had no reason to do what he did, escpecially not being a classical psychopath – which per se is scientifically wrong. There's no such thing as a “classical” psychopath. See link I provided earlier.
xfcanadian
Pathologist
quoth_the_raven said:
Greg has had tons of airtime this season, as Catherine has had as well. Sara, Warrick and Nick have had barely any screentime.
How are the looks they give eachother stupid? There was tons of chemistry and there still is. Sexual tension is the only way to describe it. There was never that with Catherine and Grissom, it was always best friends teasing eachother. It IS chemistry but not sexually. They're comfortable around eachother because they've known eachother for years.
You're a G/C shipper obviously and I'm a GSR shipper, but I'm also a multi-shipper. I don't have a thing against G/C. Why can't we all just get along?
Because I am angry at tptb for sucking up to one of the fanbases, and ignoring the rest. This used to be my favorite show, now I just get mad every thursday night.
Just because you think G/S have chemisty doesn't mean everyone sees that. It isn't fact, its an opinion. They are cheesy, and fake, and it makes the show rediculous...why one earth would Grissom do that?? Ah!
Adzix
CSI Level Three
quoth, you're awesome. i wanted to say the same thing. you know it's so funny to me that when Grissom and Sara weren't canon, they "didn't have chemistry" but now "they give each other stupid looks". hilarous, lol.
i'm not going to argue anymore about the same thing again, cuz it always ends like this, pro-GSR vs anti-GSR. you don't like it, you don't have to, it's your opinion. i like it, and as Erica said, good for me
ETA:
maaan, S_Bright, seriously, you seem to hate this show. you know you can always watch something else if everything bothers you. i'm sure there are plenty of shows that you would like out there.
quoth_the_raven
Corpse
How do you know? It's a 45 minute show, they can only show so much. They would've gotten him eventually, he left behind tons of evidence.
How do you know what a psychopath was going to do? It doesn't have to make sense, they're mentally insane. Nothing they do makes sense. It's not the show's fault or the writer's fault.
Sara was blaming herself for Cammie's death, it was obvious, and if the same guy had stabbed the man in the ambulance she wanted to try and save him like she couldn't save Cammie. And there were EMTs in there.
Then why not stop watching it?
It's not just a fanbase, they've been cooking GSR up from season one. Jorja Fox said in an interview that she specifically came into the show as a love interest for Grissom. They've been planning this since day one. Not everyone's going to agree with it, and not everyone's going to like it. But the producers and writers have said that it makes more sense for Grissom and Sara to be together.But that's also just your opinion
And thanks Adzix
I just don't understand why GSR is such a big deal, we all love the same show, it makes me sad Another opinion.
I've been reading this debate from a distance, as I have been doing with most of the "discussions" on this board. I rarely get involved, because then I'll just get attaacked, as does everyone else who does not agree with a certain viewpoint.
And in this case, I see value in many of things that all of you have said. First of all, QTR is correct, in that if you added up the GSR scenes, they would not take up all that much time. You can't say that those scenes dominate the entire season, because they are not the focus of the show. Even if we keep the relationship in mind, so what? There is more to CSI than Grissom and Sara (and for the record, who the heck cares who Grissom dates. They are both adults, they are both consensual, and really, ten years isn't that big of a deal. I know people who married someone 20 years older/younger than them, and who cares? Also, although they may have had a friendship dynamic, Sara has consistently asked Grissom out throughout the years. That takes away the father/daughter dynamic).
Moving on. The science. Despite what definition you use for psychopath, psychopaths are unpredictable. I am in the mental health field, and I have worked with real psychopaths, and with people who have conduct disorder. We can go off of a working definition for various disabilities, but you know what? People don't always do what we expect of them. Ask any therapist, or any mental health professional, or even anyone who works with individuals who have disabilities. The moment that we start classifying (in the stereotyping sense) people, the moment we stop seeing what might really be going on.
Procedural science. Medical personnel were on the ambulance. Of course they were. Who drove it? Who sat in the back with the person? Medical personnel.
Regardless, I still love this season. I think the characters ARE developing, and are learning new things about not only themselves, but everything/everyone around them. I don't get not watching a show that you love, just because... well, I don't know. To each his own, I suppose.
S_Bright
Police Officer
Iknow because I watched the show. they happened uppon him by chance. badm bad bad writing about a presumed spychopath.
Why would a professional CSI blameserself for a victim's death? That sounds emotiionally unstable, On the job, youäre professional, you don't blame, you don't assume you keep your own emotions back. Always. There's no discussing that. ask any professional in the field.
And I don't know how many times I have to repeat that a subordinate/underling relationship in the policeforse would carry severe repercussions if found out. One of them needs to move to days and they can keep this up. Otherwise is far too soapy and no, I will not watch this soap anymore.
I hope it lives it's long soapy life, I just hope the good actors get out of their contracts asap. I pity them fot the shit they have to work with this season.
It's like this board, suddenly itäs become the second YTDAW? bleeh.
And please, do never pull the occupancy card sine most of you have no idea what your fellow forumist does for a living. that's just cheap shots to somehow save a sinking ship. Let the passive-agressiva attack on those who do not agree with you slide. That's not prefessional either. *sighs*
Why would a professional CSI blameserself for a victim's death? That sounds emotiionally unstable, On the job, youäre professional, you don't blame, you don't assume you keep your own emotions back. Always. There's no discussing that. ask any professional in the field.
And I don't know how many times I have to repeat that a subordinate/underling relationship in the policeforse would carry severe repercussions if found out. One of them needs to move to days and they can keep this up. Otherwise is far too soapy and no, I will not watch this soap anymore.
I hope it lives it's long soapy life, I just hope the good actors get out of their contracts asap. I pity them fot the shit they have to work with this season.
It's like this board, suddenly itäs become the second YTDAW? bleeh.
And please, do never pull the occupancy card sine most of you have no idea what your fellow forumist does for a living. that's just cheap shots to somehow save a sinking ship. Let the passive-agressiva attack on those who do not agree with you slide. That's not prefessional either. *sighs*
Adzix
CSI Level Three
i totally agree with you Zan and quoth. i just can't see how some people won't take those arguments into account but simply state the same over and over. but whatever, i don't care. all i care about is that i'm extremely happy and nobody is going to ruin it. be jealous! lol
ETA:
ETA:
lmao. *Adz died*