Why Lindsay REALLY Must Go (Pt. 2)

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Ain't gonna comment on cast and crew opinions of her.

However, it's interesting most of us agree that Lindsay = Mary Sue. Guess it's not just a few of us who think that. ;) Which brings me to the question of: Why in hades would TPTB write a character as such a blatant Mary Sue? Heck, even fanfiction writers (the good ones, anyway) avoid writing Mary Sues and Gary Stus like the freakin' plague because they know characters like that always bring teh lolz, ridicule and next to no respect with the audience. (As proven by the Why Lindsay Must Go threads.)

Hmmm, maybe it's TPTB trying way too hard to make viewers like Lindsay that's really grating. The whole she-fits-in-so-hunky-dory thing like you guys have mentioned. It's not realistic, and this is a crime show that relies greatly on realism to be sold. Sure, people might say, "It's the science that has to be realistic!" But who can take things seriously if only a portion of the show is believable, while the rest of it is laugh-worthy? Not me. I like to see things done well all-around, not half-arsed like it's a joke.

Oh, and I'd love to see Flack have a problem with the relationship on the show. It seems logical that he'd be the one to. He's Danny's close friend so obviously he knows the guy pretty well. ;) And, also as you guys have said, he hasn't been friendly with Lindsay since the moment she joined. It is possible that the writers decided to transfer the hostility that had been Danny's to Flack instead when they realized Anna couldn't handle a plot like that. Notice how it's usually Flack making subtle jabs whenever he talks to Lindsay? Yeah, Eddie does all the work.
 
Oh, and I'd love to see Flack have a problem with the relationship on the show. It seems logical that he'd be the one to. He's Danny's close friend so obviously he knows the guy pretty well. And, also as you guys have said, he hasn't been friendly with Lindsay since the moment she joined. It is possible that the writers decided to transfer the hostility that had been Danny's to Flack instead when they realized Anna couldn't handle a plot like that. Notice how it's usually Flack making subtle jabs whenever he talks to Lindsay? Yeah, Eddie does all the work.
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I realized that from the get-go. That Flack is sort of hostile towards Lindsey. TPTB had not written many scenes with them together. And in those scenes, usually Don's a bit snappy (the flower from Fiji scene with Sheldon) and matter-of-factly (such as in the water tank thing). Or he's kinda avoiding a conversation altogether (the block party).

If the spoilers are true (TPTB tends to forget they said something because they're too engrossed with the D/L "development"), I can see a repeat of "On the Job" -- Danny going to Flack to get things off his shoulders.

If not, it'll be Flack who'll notice that something's in Danny's head and will offer a friendly ear.
 
I think part of Lindsay's Mary Sue-ness is because she was supposed to be a stereotype from the get-go. She was the "country girl" who was supposed to come in and shake things up. And of course, they went with every stereotype imaginable--she was plain (as opposed to the blonde, blue-eyed beautiful type they originally wanted for the role), she grew up on a ranch, she wrangled cows? horses? I can't remember, she loves wheat fields, football, etc. They might as well have tacked "I'M A HICK" on her forehead. :lol:

So the role wasn't great to begin with, but I think a better actress could have done a lot more with it--especially by now. We still pretty much know nothing about Lindsay, even two years later. Most of the discussion I see about her is about her hair. :rolleyes: That's because Anna's brought no depth to the role with her performance, and the writers haven't bothered to flesh out the character (perhaps because of Anna's performance).
 
Top41 said:
Most of the discussion I see about her is about her hair. :rolleyes: That's because Anna's brought no depth to the role with her performance, and the writers haven't bothered to flesh out the character (perhaps because of Anna's performance).
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:lol: Yeah i occasionally venture to the Pro-Lindsay thread, trying to find some reason to like her...and all i keep seeing is discussion on her hair or clothes. There is even a point in the thread where there are a few posts (myself included) of constructive criticism for the character, like how the lighter storylines are better for her and how she needs to flesh out more as a character....and then the next four posts are all about her hair in the promo and her dress and how shes not wearing shoes.

There really seems to be nothing to really talk about in regards to her character, besides her physical appearance, apparently. :rolleyes:
 
LOL, the only things that changed about her are her weight (well, the baby) and her hair. Oh yeah, and her montage on the opening theme.

Yeah i occasionally venture to the Pro-Lindsay thread, trying to find some reason to like her...and all i keep seeing is discussion on her hair or clothes. There is even a point in the thread where there are a few posts (myself included) of constructive criticism for the character, like how the lighter storylines are better for her and how she needs to flesh out more as a character....and then the next four posts are all about her hair in the promo and her dress and how shes not wearing shoes.
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It's like Paula Abdul in American Idol. You can't say anything good about the performance so you comment positively on the appearance. Let Randy and Simon do the bashing for you.

I guess the best they could say is positive reinforcement when it comes to Lindsey. Absolutely nothing positive can be said about her character, portrayal, personality (or lack thereof), development, and individual storyline.

I think part of Lindsay's Mary Sue-ness is because she was supposed to be a stereotype from the get-go. She was the "country girl" who was supposed to come in and shake things up.
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Even that didn't last long. They kept on pressing that she's a countrygirl, she's from Montana, she's from Midwest... blahblahblah. But somewhere in season2, that disappeared. Anna didn't show a countrygirl-esque portrayal of Lindsey actually. She was... well, a countrygirl because they kept on saying she was but you can't see it in her. (LOL, I'm not making sense, I know. I'm high on flu meds... haha)
 
^Yeah, Anna never really brought that believability to Lindsay either. I never felt a love of the country the way you feel a love of NYC from Danny or Flack. Again, with that as with everything else, she's just flat.
 
Top41 said:
^Yeah, Anna never really brought that believability to Lindsay either. I never felt a love of the country the way you feel a love of NYC from Danny or Flack. Again, with that as with everything else, she's just flat.
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Danny and Flack (and Aiden) are authentic. Lindsey wasn't even half-convincing that she's a country girl. Not even a measly fake accent to further embody a cliche 'country girl' (since they've gone Mary-Sue on everything else). Psh.
 
I agree as the country gal Lindsay never ever pulled it off and partially here the writers are to blame for this in that first episode Zoo York we were inundated with the never ending country references to Lindsay's character. We get Danny starting with his Montana references so we all can never ever forget where she comes from, she makes comments about the amount of meat people keeps in their basements, Mac asks her what they feed her in Montana when she tackels a suspect with gusto. And by the end of it you want to scream at your TV screen okay I get it she's from Montana! Shut up already :devil:
I digress so in one episode we had so much small town girl shoved down our throat but we never actually got to see any evidence of it in her character's behaviour. Maybe it would have been nice to hear her complaining about not being able to find her way around the city or not fitting in or getting lost on the subway or missing her family or her friends or god anything remotely involved with the huge change the character had taken on from moving from her home to New York. But no that never happened she might as well have shown up on her first day wearing a MONTANA sweater.
 
^Yeah, they laid it on thick in that episode--a classic case of what good writing doesn't do. One of the first rules of writing is "show don't tell" and there was a lot of telling going on there, probably because Anna wasn't conveying with her acting what needed to be shown.
 
All right, seriously, two seasons of the Lindsay Monroe travesty is enough.

And as a Midwesterner, I wince when I hear she's supposedly from my region of the US. Even just small things make me incredulous...I seem to remember her talking about apartment hunting and this supposedly very practical, down-to-earth, non-materialistic farm girl refuses to live in Queens or other boroughs, because "This girl has her heart set on Manhattan". Good luck on making the rent on your 110 sq foot studio apartment, chickypoo, the amount of which would make any Midwesterner want to be sick.

I wouldn't mind her as much if she was a bit player, but she's proven time and again her inability to carry a major role as part of the NY team. She doesn't generate any kind of friendship warmth with the others. I feel bad for Danny being constantly forced to be with her and engage in the totally awful Candy-Land saccharine "Danny Linsday thing", since it just drags him down.

It sticks out like a sore thumb when you look at the rest of the team. They're knit together tight as an aran sweater. "Pop" Mac Taylor? His emotions may generally be jacketed in as stiff as his old Marine tunic, but he'd go balls to the wall for any of his team--and has. "Mom" Stella Bonasera? Professional, sometimes also emotionally distant, but fierce about her friends and co-workers. Flack, Danny, Hawkes: all three would probably take a bullet for their buddies in the lab.

And then you throw Lindsay into a scene and the sense of camaraderie comes to a screeching halt. If she was wrongly accused and arrested like Hawkes was last season, the idea that the CSIs would work frantically to clear her would work as a professional obligation, but I totally wouldn't buy that they're doing it out of a deep sense of friendship and caring.

And if after two seasons I can't buy that when she's playing one of the top tier of characters in importance, it's time for TPTB to stop embarrassing themselves by trying to call a character with all the energy of a decrepit old nag capable to run with the thoroughbred big boys and girls of CSI: NY. Put 'er out to pasture.
 
Also, on a nitpick, the "Midwest" really is more like Minnesota, the Dakotas, Kansas, etc. In other words, the farming states.

Ranch country like Montana is the Mountain West.
 
I think she was better in "Can You Hear Me Now?" than for the majority of season 3 (much much better), but...

I can't really comment on the development of the character from previous seasons since we've only seen one episode so far, and it was an episode that provided no real 'character' moments for the more minor team-members. However, the acting...

It wasn't bad. Not spectacular, but not bad. She was just kind of there. As funny as the condom scene was, it could have been better (of course, a lot of that comes down to the writing, but Anna's facial expressions never do it for me). I didn't buy that phone call to Adam as teasing or joking--I think that's what they were going for, and I can almost tell, but overall it just didn't seem that way to me. The lines could have been better, but the delivery could have sold it, I think.

(But maybe I'm just biased since I don't think the term 'socially-awkward' is entirely appropriate to be using as part of a joke--call him a leprechaun, tell him to spend less time shaving his beard, something more funny and less of a...veiled insult. That, however, is down to the writing. If the delivery were better, I'd still dislike that line, but Lindsay is a combination of writing and acting, so I'll point out flaws in the writing if I see them. ;))
 
IronCastles, word. She still doesn't fit with this team, period, and it stands out so much because the rest of them do fit together so well. She might fare *a little* better on CSI: Miami where the team is more divided and at odds with each other, but still the acting problem crops up because the actors on Miami are very good as well. She just doesn't belong on a CSI show period.

Anna was better last night, but I still heard the shrill, whiny tone creeping into her voice towards the latter half of that phone call with Adam.

As I said in the grading thread, she seems to have two expressions: smiling or the scrunch face. There are variations of the scrunch face--concentrating SF, angry SF, whiny SF, crying SF--but as far as I can tell, she's only got two expressions. Has anyone spotted a third?
 
I still don't like her. She acts creepy, not for a second the video conversation she had with Danny was believable, and the phone call to Adam was too forced. If she's alone in the scene, if she don't have anyboy beside her, the story resents.

Really, I'm tired of giving her more oportunities.
 
As I said in the grading thread, she seems to have two expressions: smiling or the scrunch face. There are variations of the scrunch face--concentrating SF, angry SF, whiny SF, crying SF--but as far as I can tell, she's only got two expressions. Has anyone spotted a third?
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hmmm perhaps too much botox??

I don't mind having characters with limited facial and emotional expression though, whether its dileberate or not. I will never understand people's need to have extremely likable and perfect characters. It seems to be an american trend, since i don't see it on canadian or british tv shows. It is just more realistic to have characters like this around...a character with trouble expressing emotion and who doesn't 'fit' in with others just makes it more realistic to be in a scientific setting.
 
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