Why Lindsay Must Go (Part 3)

[Top41]

The fangirl comments need to stop, Kimmy. You know better--both as a poster and an admin. I don't want to have to see give you a reminder in this thread again. Seriously.

 

[WhosLaughingNow]

My friend was telling me that she was watching the episode with her landlady and her landlady have never seen the show before. She started watching the show right when Danny confronted Lindsay in the hallway. The first thing she said when she saw her was "How far along is she?". And that was before she told Danny that she was with child. I thought that was funny:lol:. They had actually been doing a decent job up until this episode in hiding her belly. Part of me wanted to hit Danny and be like "Do you not see the bump detective boy!". But I had to keep reminding myself that Lindsay wasn't as far along (at least I don't think she is).

Did anyone else find Danny spilling his guts out to complete strangers out of character?

I kind of do and I kind of don't personally. I mean for one it just doesn't seem like him to spill everything like that in front of strangers, but at the same time sometimes it's easier talking to people you don't know all that well about your problems because they don't really know you and can be a lot less judgmental than people you know. But that might be just me.

 

[cSiNyFrEaK30]

Did anyone else find Danny spilling his guts out to complete strangers out of character?

I kind of do and I kind of don't personally. I mean for one it just doesn't seem like him to spill everything like that in front of strangers, but at the same time sometimes it's easier talking to people you don't know all that well about your problems because they don't really know you and can be a lot less judgmental than people you know. But that might be just me.

I thought it was extremely out of character for him, especially from what we've seen of Danny before this episode. He's always been the most empathetic character on the show, always feeling (at least most obviously) for the victims and being the most shocked and dismayed by the the things people are capable of doing. Assuming Danny knew who that couple was (which makes sense that he would know, since he was on the case and was involved in it from the beginning, and I assume that they the different CSIs would share information that they've learned), its shocking to think that he would ever emphasize with a couple who kicked their young daughter out of the house for being pregnant.

Again, thats just assuming he knew who they were...and as my dad has told me countless times, when you assume, you make an "ass" out of "u" and "me"...

Even so, Danny opening up to these complete strangers is even further out of character. He blew off Flack at first when he approached him about why he was missing work in All in the Family, and Flack is arguably his best friend. He didn't open up to Lindsay about Rueben's death, and didn't really open up to anyone about it until Flack tracked him down. Even as far back as On the Job, he was continually paranoid about people being against him on the issue of the shooting, and so only spoke briefly to Flack about his worries, and even then was still panicked and tense throughout the entire conversation. The fact that this same character could be asked "how are you?" by two complete strangers and proceed to tell them his entire life story is unbelievable. I'm guessing that TPTB wanted us to identify and connect that these parents regret ditching their daughter and having her end up being murdered with Danny now having a child by having them tell him to make sure his choice doesn't have any regrets....but even that didn't come across very well, in addition to the fact that Danny would more likely be talking to Flack-the one consistent person he's genuinely admitted his worries and feelings to in the show.


...and since I've talked about Danny for three paragraphs, I figure i should connect it to why Lindsay must go, since I'm in that thread To me, his whole telling his point of view in the episode was doing little more than to excuse Lindsay's behavior throughout the Rikki ordeal (by saying that she must have known about Rikki, and basically cutting himself down for being with her), and to justify that D/L was "real" (by having him mention that Lindsay was a "good thing"...and oh yeah, she's from MONTANA.). It was a waste of Carmine's talent, which could have been used through the episode by SHOWING us how Danny took the news throughout the whole episode, rather than showing us snippets of both the conversation and the case itself. To me, it would have been far more compelling for Danny to be experiencing it as it was happening...rather than having him just tell us what happened. Maybe its just me not liking the way they basically had him propping up Lindsay throughout the conversation, but I would have really rather had him A) not talking at all or B) talking to Flack or even Louie, or someone who've we've seen him open up to in the past.

 

[privatename]

What I think was the worst about it was that it makes the idea that Danny is the bad guy, and "Screwed up" canon. It further cements that Lindsay is a Mary Sue character and can do no wrong.

Yeah, until then it was purely interpretive speculation. What really got to me was TPTB using Carmine/Danny as an apologist voicebox to try and speak on Lindsay's behalf, defend her point of view in a way, and recontextualize Danny's past behaviour after the fact. That was nauseating. If things were so bad, why would either one want to get back together again anyways? Oh that's right. They didn't. TPTB did. In order to accomodate the decision to include Anna's pregnancy into production. Way. To. Go. :vulcan:

What I don't really understand is why they felt the need to include the pregnancy. They couldn't have possibly thought it was a good way to go, could they? Some have suggested that it is easier to include her pregnancy rather than trying to hide it, but they have to hide it anyway since Lindsay's pregnancy isn't (apparently) nearly as far along as Anna's so where is the benefit. As a matter of fact, it seems to me like Anna will deliver before Lindsay's time and so the show will actually have to make Lindsay pregnant in the show even after she is no longer pregnant in real life. Or maybe I am wrong about this. I don't know. I really am trying to understand why they chose to include the pregnancy at all.

Why Must Lindsay Go?
. . .

Lindsay is not a positive influence on the show. Most of the time, she does what any lab tech could be used to do in the processing side of things (and in that realm, she's far far easily outshone by Adam, and in the past the likes of Chad, and even Kendall, whom I didn't really like) and what any detective on the street side of things could be used to do (and in that realm is far and away easily outshone by Flack, Angell, and going back, in the likes of Maka). Lindsay is a negative, requiring the others to prop her up, Danny mainly, Flack, Mac, and Stella come next to mind with specific scenes, and any others who've been saddled with her in a given scene. The only way she's really impacted the show is because of that, and most grievously thru DL.

The effort to tune in to make the trade off of sitting thru Lindsay to watch the rest of the cast solving homicides on a freakin crime show in the vaunted CSI franchise may not be one that's worth making anymore.

I agree that she is not a positive influence and her role could be fulfilled better by other cast members. I really didn't care much at the outset that the show was getting someone new. I was open to it, but I very quickly began to see Lindsay as a poor addition for many reasons that have been enumerated before. AND it just keeps getting worse and I really am getting more and more resentful of having to sit through Lindsay scenes and D/L drama in order to watch a crime show I otherwise enjoy with a great cast of characters who I find compelling and interesting. It is sad, but it is true.

Just to add that I just watched two first season episodes on Spike and watching the first season episodes is so nice for me. I think the team worked together better and there was no need to dread the interminable Lindsay scenes because she was still working in Montana

 

[PerfectAnomaly]

I'd say this excerpt from the new TV Guide says it all (emphasis is mine):

Being pregnant on camera is a huge relief for Belknap, . . . "Hiding it last time became pretty ridiculous," she says, putting her arms under her belly for support between takes. "It's not only that you're standing behind a desk in every scene, it's that you have to act like you're not pregnant. You have to be perky and get up and sit down quickly. I was like, 'Ohhh, I can't do this!'"

You're a f*cking professional actress! Get over yourself and do your job! :scream: And since when has Lindsay ever been "perky?" Statements like these make me wonder why she became an actress in the first place let alone how she ended up with a co-starring role on a show that's part of the most popular franchise in the world. :wtf:

I'd say the speculation that TPTB put in the story line to accomodate one actress over thinking about how it will affect the show sounds like it isn't such an overstatement after all.

 

[Top41]

I'd say this excerpt from the new TV Guide says it all (emphasis is mine):

Being pregnant on camera is a huge relief for Belknap, . . . "Hiding it last time became pretty ridiculous," she says, putting her arms under her belly for support between takes. "It's not only that you're standing behind a desk in every scene, it's that you have to act like you're not pregnant. You have to be perky and get up and sit down quickly. I was like, 'Ohhh, I can't do this!'"

You're a f*cking professional actress! Get over yourself and do your job! :scream: And since when has Lindsay ever been "perky?" Statements like these make me wonder why she became an actress in the first place let alone how she ended up with a co-starring role on a show that's part of the most popular franchise in the world. :wtf:

I'd say the speculation that TPTB put in the story line to accomodate one actress over thinking about how it will affect the show sounds like it isn't such an overstatement after all.

Her dedication to her job is equal to her talent. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[PerfectAnomaly]

I'd say this excerpt from the new TV Guide says it all (emphasis is mine):

Being pregnant on camera is a huge relief for Belknap, . . . "Hiding it last time became pretty ridiculous," she says, putting her arms under her belly for support between takes. "It's not only that you're standing behind a desk in every scene, it's that you have to act like you're not pregnant. You have to be perky and get up and sit down quickly. I was like, 'Ohhh, I can't do this!'"

You're a f*cking professional actress! Get over yourself and do your job! :scream: And since when has Lindsay ever been "perky?" Statements like these make me wonder why she became an actress in the first place let alone how she ended up with a co-starring role on a show that's part of the most popular franchise in the world. :wtf:

I'd say the speculation that TPTB put in the story line to accomodate one actress over thinking about how it will affect the show sounds like it isn't such an overstatement after all.

Her dedication to her job is equal to her talent. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Sometimes I wonder if TPTB read her interviews and end up headdesking while facepalming. :lol: :shifty:

 

[Faylinn]

Well, I get what she's saying - you're carrying around the extra weight but have to move as if you're not. Not that Lindsay jumps around and does cartwheels in the lab or anything, but sometimes they do sort of jog to catch up to someone in the hall (or, in Flack's case, run in while calling 'Danno' to deliver a nicely-wrapped murder weapon to Danny ) or kind of pop out of the lab (I think Sheldon's fond of that one) and whatnot (although nobody dances around like Adam ). If you're heavier from the baby or feel off-balance or whatever, I'd imagine it might feel like you're being really obvious even when you're just walking.

As usual, I think it has a lot to do with the fact that Anna tends to not necessarily come across well in written interviews.

So, yeah - guess I'm playing Devil's Advocate with that one.

ETA: However, I do think the "Hiding it last time became pretty ridiculous" part is stupid - they have to work around a pregnant actress, but that comment implies that a pregnancy should be written in simply because the ways of covering it up aren't ideal. So you have to stand behind a desk - big deal. The show shouldn't have to leap ahead in a poorly-established relationship in order to accommodate the pregnancy onscreen. You can choose when to have a child in real life - TPTB should choose when to have such a storyline in the series itself.

After seeing the hack job they did to introduce the pregnancy, and after the way things went for the first 8 episodes of season 5, I just can't see it as "organic" and like it was planned exactly this way all along (or that the idea was 'hatched' last season, as the TV Guide article may suggest) - you can spin it until I get dizzy and puke on my shoes, but I'm not buying it.

 

[Poppet]

Well, I get what she's saying - you're carrying around the extra weight but have to move as if you're not. Not that Lindsay jumps around and does cartwheels in the lab or anything, but sometimes they do sort of jog to catch up to someone in the hall (or, in Flack's case, run in while calling 'Danno' to deliver a nicely-wrapped murder weapon to Danny ) or kind of pop out of the lab (I think Sheldon's fond of that one) and whatnot (although nobody dances around like Adam ). If you're heavier from the baby or feel off-balance or whatever, I'd imagine it might feel like you're being really obvious even when you're just walking.

I totally agree with this, being pregnant can be uncomfortable and very tiring, so I imagine some scenes do become difficult. However, pregnant woman go to work all the time and manage just fine without their employers doing a total u-turn to accomodate them.

I don't think allowing the show to be dicatated by Annas decision to have a child is a particulary well thought out idea. It may be easier for Anna but judging by last weeks episode it has only resulted in a poorly conceived storyline that has been crowbared in. Hiding Annas preganancy may have been a little arkward for her but I think it would have been a lot easier on the audience.

 

[PerfectAnomaly]

I realize that hiding the pregnancy and having to do physical scenes while pregnant would be difficult. But Anna doesn't do anything physical except get up and walk and sit down and hiding a pregnancy is a fact of life if you're an actress on a TV show and TPTB don't want your character pregnant.

It's not that it's hard and uncomfortable, it's that she has to whine about it instead of accepting that it's part of her damn job. You (the general you) don't hear other actresses whining about having to do their jobs while pregnant. What really got me was the whole "you have to act like you're not pregnant." It's like that is something that is so hard for her she can barely pull it off. You're a f*cking professional actress for godssake! No wonder she has no grasp of Lindsay's character. She has a hard enough time just trying to grasp that her character isn't pregnant when she is.

 

[privatename]

I don't think allowing the show to be dicatated by Annas decision to have a child is a particulary well thought out idea. It may be easier for Anna but judging by last weeks episode it has only resulted in a poorly conceived storyline that has been crowbared in. Hiding Annas preganancy may have been a little arkward for her but I think it would have been a lot easier on the audience.

It really bothers me that they seemed to rush this storyline to accomodate Anna's pregnancy. Although I don't think they did it solely for her sake -- someone must have thought it was a good way to go with the story for D/L. At least I hope it wasn't solely to accomodate one person because that would just be ridiculous.

I realize that hiding the pregnancy and having to do physical scenes while pregnant would be difficult. But Anna doesn't do anything physical except get up and walk and sit down and hiding a pregnancy is a fact of life if you're an actress on a TV show and TPTB don't want your character pregnant.

It's not that it's hard and uncomfortable, it's that she has to whine about it instead of accepting that it's part of her damn job. You (the general you) don't hear other actresses whining about having to do their jobs while pregnant. What really got me was the whole "you have to act like you're not pregnant." It's like that is something that is so hard for her she can barely pull it off. You're a f*cking professional actress for godssake! No wonder she has no grasp of Lindsay's character. She has a hard enough time just trying to grasp that her character isn't pregnant when she is.

Anna should simply not do interviews. She always manages to come off like she is an amateur with no real idea of her character's motivations and no real work ethic. For goodness sake she sounds like my 8 year old niece when she whines that something is too hard when really it is only because she wants someone to tell her either she doesn't have to do it or give her sympathy and to tell her what a great job she is doing even though it is really hard. Tolerable in a child but not in a Professional woman in her mid-30's. And it could just be that Anna doesn't come across well in interviews -- at least I hope that is the case.

 

[roximonoxide]

I've never really taken to ragging on Lindsay/Anna before but last night was the kicker.. I guess what just bugs me the most is that she has the same reaction to.. to everything. To having a baby, to losing all her friends in a shooting, to being in love, to finding that potassium did this here and calcium did this there. And it's really, really not very interesting to watch. Because whatever is going on in Lindsay's life, I know I'm not going to be able to glean a single thing of how she feels or what she thinks about it based off what I see on screen.

And to support a point,

It's very telling that in Season 3 when Anna missed three episodes after she had the baby that nobody seemed to miss her. The show didn't seem like it had a gigantic hole in it. In fact, it was like she had never been on the show at all. It's a shame Lindsay only has a connection with Danny but then again, how would she connect with anybody else?

I had nO idea that Anna was missing in season 3 until I read this. And like, I waTch this show. alot. Follow every episode. I either really didn't notice or it was so nonessential I forgot it.
/rag

And I think everyone here smiles a little when someone else has seen the light. Welcome!

You're right about her ability to emote. That's probably what has most of us grasping at straws to figure out her actual relationship to Danny. Yes, sometimes the show tries to tell us they're together, sometimes they suggest they are not, some people insist they're together but to most of us think it is murky at best. Writing and editing likely take their share of the blame, but I think it's noteworthy that SO many people seem to be unable to figure out just what Belknap is attempting to convey most of the time. There's a distinct difference between intentionally leaving something open to interpretation and just plain being unclear. And if like you, lynerjy, so aptly put, the audience can't tell the difference between her reaction "to losing all her friends in a shooting, to being in love, to finding that potassium did this here and calcium did this there" someone's falling a little short.

Something else I've always thought about in regards to the decision of TPTB to introduce Lindsay is that for a show about NYC, there's a surprising lack of diversity on the staff. And when Aiden, a girl with some some minoritiy background left the show they opted to replace her with a caucasian, middle American Mary-sue--errr Mary-Jane?

Ethnicity aside, it was made at least somewhat clear to us, as it was on other CSI shows, that the main characters are all chosen for their respective teams because they bring something individual, often a specialization, to their job; Aiden was a forensic artist, Mac had physics, Danny had more than his share of knowledge in the world of organized crime, Adam's the DNA expert, Hawkes is a doctor, etc etc. But I still look back and have to wonder what in God's name out of all the CSI's in American prompted Mac Taylor to pick some random girl out of Bozeman, Montana? What's so special that NYC needed her? She certainly hasn't done anything remarkable that I've noticed, unless of course New York is seeing a vast influx of cases involving young dead girls with scars on their hands from rawhide braiding...:shifty:

 

[jolein]

But I still look back and have to wonder what in God's name out of all the CSI's in American prompted Mac Taylor to pick some random girl out of Bozeman, Montana? What's so special that NYC needed her? She certainly hasn't done anything remarkable that I've noticed, unless of course New York is seeing a vast influx of cases involving young dead girls with scars on their hands from rawhide braiding...:shifty:

As I recall Mac choose her because she had done some bloodspatter analyse which put away a high profiled criminal in Montana and she was the expert he needed.

I always thought it was a shame that they didn`t work that part out more.

 

[kinkapoodles]

I recall that being the reason he hired her but have they used that expertise since Mac hired her? I don't remember anything centering on how Lindsay is an expert on blood splatter analysis. I think it was mentioned once and then forgotten.

 

[Lessien_Tinuviel]

Coming out of lurking (for the longest time) to give my two cents...

^ Yep, I recall that - that certain expertise was mentioned but never expanded upon. A bit of a shame, actually. It might have made her character slightly less boring.

Anna should simply not do interviews. She always manages to come off like she is an amateur with no real idea of her character's motivations and no real work ethic. For goodness sake she sounds like my 8 year old niece when she whines that something is too hard when really it is only because she wants someone to tell her either she doesn't have to do it or give her sympathy and to tell her what a great job she is doing even though it is really hard.

Agreed. Sometimes I wonder if she's being misquoted, but then it can't be happening every single time she gives an interview, can it?

Speaking of the TV Guide interview, Anna came across as being really unprofessional in addition to being all whiny because she had to act like she wasn't pregnant in S3- completely missing the point about the whole acting part. For the record, she's not the only actress who had to hide their pregnancy on-screen.

I can think of at least 2 actresses who had much more physical scenes to do while carrying around that big belly: Mariska Hargitay on Law & Order: SVU and Amy Jo Johnson on Flashpoint - especially Amy Jo, because her character has to carry those big sniper guns and wear all that Kevlar and other protective gear. But I don't think either of them has passed such comments like "Ohhh, I can't do this!" when asked about working through their pregnancy.

Okay, I'll go back to lurking now.