Speedystokesgirl
Judge
Yup and looks like Brass will get away with it and Catherine and Nick will be reprimanded and demoted.
Oh why oh why did tptb do that with Brass!!!!!! :scream:
Season 12 Spoiler Lab Discussion Part 2
- Thread starter Smokey
- Start date
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Yup and looks like Brass will get away with it and Catherine and Nick will be reprimanded and demoted.
Oh why oh why did tptb do that with Brass!!!!!! :scream:
Rizzoli
Lab Technician
Zuiker and TPTB f****d every character during the Raskell saga, I'm sure they meant nothing personal to Brass :shifty:
I don't think there is any way he can be reprimanded. I would think what he did would be cause for termination, if not prosecution. And the only way they would know for sure that he did it is if he or Ray tells. I think whatever happens with Ray, they are going to try to put the rest of it behind them.
BUT...going forward, we know what Brass did....and he knows. It's going to be hard for me to watch him if there is no resolution. Maybe he'll do or say something at some point to at least let us know he regrets it...if he does regret it, that is.
Rizzoli
Lab Technician
It would be nice to have a little scene where Brass goes to resign and one of the CSI's convince him not too, "we all did things we regret protecting a dirty cop", or something to that effect.
Raynn
Coroner
I agree. It's so out of character too, after he was supposedly "squeaky clean" in Jersey and when he first came to Vegas (turning down McKeen).
Ladybronco
Pathologist
I guess I'm in the minority here, but I'm not as bothered by what Brass did as some of you are. I hope to see it addressed this season, at least just once, but I'm ready to move on now that LF is gone. I still believe Brass is a good cop, and was just looking for a way out of a sticky situation that they were all put in by Langston.
All of the CSI's have done something that was against regulations, i.e. something they could've/should've gotten reprimanded/demoted/fired for. Catherine using the lab to find out Sam Braun was her father. Sara mouthing off to Ecklie. Sara and Grissom hiding their relationship. Nick and Christy the hooker. Greg abandoning all protocol because he was thinking with his dick in "A Kiss Before Frying". Warrick's gambling issues early on, and later, drug and personal issues interfering with his ability to do his job.
I think this is less about Brass than it is about who Brass picked up the cuff for. If it was for anyone else but Ray, I'm pretty sure people would be singing a different tune.
I think this is less about Brass than it is about who Brass picked up the cuff for. If it was for anyone else but Ray, I'm pretty sure people would be singing a different tune.
PerfectAnomaly
Resident Smart Ass
Everyone has done something they should be fired for, yes. Ray is the only one who committed murder. That's on a whole other level of "against regulations." Covering for a murderer, regardless of who it was, taints Brass as a character for a lot of people.
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The only place Ray has actually been convicted of murder is on this board. It remains to be seen if that's how it went down with I.A. Personally, I don't see Ray selling Brass up the river to save his own ass. That would be soooo out of character for Ray.
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Kasey47
Police Officer
While I get what you're saying and I know we've been round and round on this one, but Ray killed Nate Haskell - bad dude, serial killer, no redemptive bone in his body. Not saying it's right but it wasn't like the blasted the Domino's guy for being over the 30 minutes time....
PerfectAnomaly
Resident Smart Ass
The viewers saw it happen so it's pretty easy for "this board" to say he murdered Haskell because that's what he did. Yeah, Haskell was a really evil guy and some people think he deserved it, but it is a canon fact that Ray had him subdued, let him go and then killed him. That's murder no matter how you look at it. Brass taking the cuffs will help him get away with it if Ray chooses to claim self defense. That taints Brass as a character to a lot of people and I think that some of those same people would have the same view of Brass if he acted in the same manner to "help" another character.
ETA: Actually, I don't personally know anyone who doesn't think Haskell deserved to die, but some people don't think Ray was justified in taking the law into his own hands. For the sake of argument I'll say Ray was 100% justified in killing Haskell. What's to stop him in the future from taking the law into his own hands when the circumstances are different?? Obviously we'll never know because Ray won't be on the show any longer, but it's a pretty slippery slope determining when it's OK to take the law into your own hands and when it's not.
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Personally, I don't care who Brass did it for, it's wrong no matter which character he was covering for. If his daughter killed someone and he covered for her, it would still be wrong (slightly more understandable, perhaps, but still wrong). If he had found out about Keppler (who I really liked as a character) killing that man and had covered for him, I still wouldn't like it. It would still be out of character for Brass. I'm more upset that THE WRITERS tainted his character by having him cover for someone who committed a crime. It doesn't matter to me at all who the character being covered for was.
And for the record, I didn't dislike Ray. I disliked how the writers wrote some of his storylines. And I hated the whole Haskell storyline when it became the focus of Ray's existence more or less. I thought Ray as a character and LF as an actor deserved better than that. It's just a shame that the writers didn't do better by him.
And I kind of agree with Kasey to a point. Although murder is still murder, better it be someone like Haskell who totally deserved it than it be someone who didn't deserve it like some of Haskell's victims... you know? What bothered me most about the whole situation is not that Ray killed him, but what the writers had Ray say when he stabbed him. Ray talked about his kidney, like that was the only reason he was stabbing him. He said "you took my kidney, I'll take yours" or something to that affect. I really wish the writers hadn't put that line in there. I really wish they'd had Ray make a point to make it more about what Haskell did to Gloria, whom Ray was still obviously in love with. I think it would have been much better if Ray had said, "this is for hurting the woman I love". I was expecting him to say something like that and then he didn't and I was kind of disappointed that the writers didn't go there.
And for the life of me, I still don't get what the whole point was of the way the Ray/Haskell thing ended. I mean, did the writers know LF wouldn't be back before they wrote the season finale? Cause everyone seemed to be kind of stunned that he left, so I can't imagine they knew. Did the writers really write the ending to Ray/Haskell like that thinking that Ray would be there the next season? That whole thing just kind of puzzles me because I don't know how they would have gone on with him still on the show with his co-workers knowing what he did or well, suspecting it. :shrug:
And for the record, I didn't dislike Ray. I disliked how the writers wrote some of his storylines. And I hated the whole Haskell storyline when it became the focus of Ray's existence more or less. I thought Ray as a character and LF as an actor deserved better than that. It's just a shame that the writers didn't do better by him.
And I kind of agree with Kasey to a point. Although murder is still murder, better it be someone like Haskell who totally deserved it than it be someone who didn't deserve it like some of Haskell's victims... you know? What bothered me most about the whole situation is not that Ray killed him, but what the writers had Ray say when he stabbed him. Ray talked about his kidney, like that was the only reason he was stabbing him. He said "you took my kidney, I'll take yours" or something to that affect. I really wish the writers hadn't put that line in there. I really wish they'd had Ray make a point to make it more about what Haskell did to Gloria, whom Ray was still obviously in love with. I think it would have been much better if Ray had said, "this is for hurting the woman I love". I was expecting him to say something like that and then he didn't and I was kind of disappointed that the writers didn't go there.
And for the life of me, I still don't get what the whole point was of the way the Ray/Haskell thing ended. I mean, did the writers know LF wouldn't be back before they wrote the season finale? Cause everyone seemed to be kind of stunned that he left, so I can't imagine they knew. Did the writers really write the ending to Ray/Haskell like that thinking that Ray would be there the next season? That whole thing just kind of puzzles me because I don't know how they would have gone on with him still on the show with his co-workers knowing what he did or well, suspecting it. :shrug:
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I don't think that's quite right. I think Ray said the thing about the kidney before he put the cuff on Haskell when he was punching him around the first time. Ray would have been satisfied with just subduing Haskell with the cuff. It wasn't until Haskell revealed that he had raped Gloria that Ray cut off the cuff and proceeded to beat the crap out of Haskell. Ray didn't give a rat's ass about his kidney at that point--it was all about Gloria.
All Ray has to do to get self defense--or justifiable homicide at the very least--is to tell the truth: they fought, he subdued Haskell, put the cuff on him, Haskell goaded him by telling him he raped Gloria, that pissed him off, he cut the cuff off, a struggle ensued and whoops! Haskell fell over the railing to his death. He doesn't know what happened to the cuff. That would save his bacon, and Brass's.
I remember reading something that said the writers had to scramble and do a lot of re-writing when they heard that LF was not coming back. So I really think he was expected back.
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