"Redrum" Discussion **Spoilers**

I kinda kept waiting for the 'punchline' so to speak...you know...for Cath or Keppler to say "congratuations, you all passed your proficiency tests and evaulations! No silk, silk, silk riddles this time, people! This time we were checking your moral compasses, observation skills and ability to play as a team!"

...not sure if they passed or failed!
 
athlov said:
It seems to me that everything seems to be a little out of whack without Grissom there. Maybe that's the point.

The mystery box on his desk seems to be a promise that he'll be back eventually. But right now things are weird. I don't think Catherine would have done something like that if Grissom was a round.
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Yess, indeed. a bit out of whack.. maybe alot.. the whole team is falling apart. I think because of lack of respect for the new guy.. I don't even think they'd behave like this if Ecklie was around, an BTW where is he!! during this mess? it's disturbing that everything is so chaotic, and everyone seems so confused!! hopefully this will pick up SOON!!!
 
NicknGrissom said:
I forgot about the fake crime scene. Catherine and Keppler are not good at faking the crime scene. Nick wouldn't act that way if he didn't see that same cup as his last crime scene with Catherine.
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No they aren't very good at it. Someone commented that Simon had made a mistake allowing them to find his fingerprint in the first place. Then they made the fake scene too much like the real one by including that mistake. They were lucky he came out of hiding.

Susan
 
Just my thought since I only watched the last 15 mins or so and haven't seen the tape and from reading what you all had to say.

Regarding what Grissom would have done, vs what Catherine did, does anyone remember the episode "Strip Strangler" in this case the "Sheriff" removed Grissom from a case when he refused to go along with him and the FBI. At the press conference she warned him when he spoke.
LYNDA DARBY: Mr. Grissom-- As the lead CSI on this case, do you have anything to add to the FBI statement?
CATHERINE: Politics ...
(GRISSOM glances at CATHERINE.)
GRISSOM: (to LYNDA DARBY) No.
LYNDA DARBY: (to GRISSOM) So, Las Vegas can breathe easier? You do have the Strip Strangler behind bars?
(Unwilling to lie, GRISSOM answers her.)
GRISSOM: No, we don't.

By going with the truth what did it get Grissom?
GRISSOM: Oh, do I get the weekend off?
SHERIFF MOBLEY: For starters, and a two-week holiday, anywhere but CSI. You brought this on yourself. Now, the next time you want to play with my career, maybe you'll think twice.

Could it be that Catherine remembered that situation, Grissom didn't play ball and it got him kicked from the case, and Catherine in charge (I know that is what you all are thinking but I remember catherine telling grissom.
GRISSOM: You don't want to be a Supervisor?
CATHERINE: Well, if I get a promotion, I want it to be on merit ... not because you're politically tone-deaf.

In short while from what knowledge I have it seems to me comparing what Grissom would have done, to What Catherine did do or didn't do, it just seems to me that they are two different people, who have two different approaches to their jobs, who compliment each other in the essence of balance she reminds him of politics and he reminds her of the boundries. OF which BOTH have screwed up on at one point or another. Not to mention comparing would be like comparing oil to water.

She is the acting supervisior but her hands were tied, say she told them, it comes out, busted and removed then what? I have to say in one respect yes should could have said to heck with it and told them, but by not doing so she gave them deniablity if it all headed south. They could be the ones to come in with fresh eyes if that was the case. She knew the hurt, but she knew her team no matter what happened they respect the job.

As to Catherine being out of her whelm I liked that idea, she wasn't acting like the catherine we know the writers made her different, guess what thats sometimes a good thing, its called change and growth and learning/falling and learning again, everything people need. Nick wasn't exactly the good old nick, a mutiny? taking charge over and asking Warrick, Sara and Greg to join him, he is changing and evoling and again something everyone needs to do at some point.
 
Great point Destiny. Catherine has learned that there are times that you just don't screw with the higher-ups. Not only in Strip Strangler, but also (as I'm watching on SpikeTV right now) Identity Crisis, where he defies the judge's order to sit down in the courtroom and gets himself in contempt of court and thrown in a cell. Also I believe if he had played politics "just a little bit", Ecklie wouldn't have been such an ass to him and would have actually considered Gil's request to actually consider Catherine for the dayshift position when he was promoted.

I will say again - I really, really hate this Undersheriff. He's an ass. Bring back the sheriff from season 4. He was kind of cool. Not all Sheriffs are underhanded and power-hungry to that extent.

And where was Ecklie when all of this politics was going on? I figured he'd be the first one in on the discussion.



Anyone looking for clips of this episode -- they're up at my place.
 
I doubt the under-dork err under sheriff would want to many knowing about it should it go south, look at the DA she didn't know and I bet he gets reamed a new one for that stunt, or one can hope. :D
 
I have to add, I agree with you two :D
I don't like this undersheriff
I think he's dirty

I want them to explore that....
 
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That's an excellent example, Destiny, and yes - Catherine likely would've just been told to take a hike, but that also outlines why I simply like Grissom more - it's about ethics over promotions.
 
Hmm, a few more random thoughts...

Catherine has shown herself not to be the best of bosses. She is very arbitrary in her decisions as to who does what, and way to willing to make her bosses happy rather than support her team. At the end of the day, unless there is a better reason to be revealed later, there was absolutely no reason to go through the whole "reverse" deal. Just picking someone up and charging him with the murders of the politician and the girl in the hotel room would have been enough. Further, if you are going to do a reverse, there is absolutely no reason to leave key players out.

The "not telling the DA" thing is a weak, weak script hook, and the flag was put up during the scene at breakfast. it is not quality script writing when you put something out there so obvious. At bare minimum, having the DA come down when the guy is in the room and say "I was told about this, but I don't agree" would have been at least slightly more acceptable.

If Keppler is a test balloon to try a new player in the CSI world, he isn't a success in my mind. If we wanted that type of "supposing" crime fighting, we would just watch CSI Miami, which is, in their own words "much more fanciful".

My feeling is that someone is going to find out what it is from Kepplers past that is haunting him, and he will disappear as quickly as he appeared, leaving the team worse for wear and Catherine less trusted than before.
 
My take is that years ago when Nicky quoted Grissom, Catherine's answer was that Grissom wasn't always right "trust me" and suddenly, the person he's always looked up to is on sabbatical, (even with the recent distance that has developed between them since GD) and now the one other person he's always trusted with his 'secrets' has suddenly gone and betrayed the trust by lying to the team for someone new.....I can see him holding it in...it's been coming for awhile
 
The thing is, they were the ones that needed to trust Catherine this time around - that she knew what had to be done - and they were the ones that broke that trust. They were pissed that they were being shut out of things, but where was their trust in her?
 
sarahvma said:
That's an excellent example, Destiny, and yes - Catherine likely would've just been told to take a hike, but that also outlines why I simply like Grissom more - it's about ethics over promotions.
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I as well agree Destiny both of your posts about the ep. made sense.. thank's for putting it in perspective!! and I truly think maybe Catherine needs to take a "sabbtical" and look at things differently. sure wouldn't hurt, and might help.. she maybe too, is burnt out too!!! cause she's definately blowing it all the way around :(
 
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