"Grave Danger" Discussion (Beware Spoilers)
- Thread starter Destiny
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Guest
Guest
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
I have one question consuming me, please somebody help-me !!! ((tragic))
The scene where Nick was recording his goodbye message, Grissom was lip reading and replied something like, "You never have/did, Nick." What do you think Nick said????
I have one question consuming me, please somebody help-me !!! ((tragic))
The scene where Nick was recording his goodbye message, Grissom was lip reading and replied something like, "You never have/did, Nick." What do you think Nick said????
lookyhere_kayla
Lab Technician
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
He said : "Grissom... I hope... I never meant to disappoint you."
He said : "Grissom... I hope... I never meant to disappoint you."
VerityKindle
Police Officer
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
Y'know...the fact that SO many people have had to ask this question suggests that the scene wasn't quite as successful as QT intended it to be.
I know it stopped me cold. I was all into the intesity of the moment, then the sound of Nick's voice completely vanishes and Grissom says "No, you never did, Nick," and all I can think is "Nick never did what? What the *&^% are you talking about?".
Y'know...the fact that SO many people have had to ask this question suggests that the scene wasn't quite as successful as QT intended it to be.
I know it stopped me cold. I was all into the intesity of the moment, then the sound of Nick's voice completely vanishes and Grissom says "No, you never did, Nick," and all I can think is "Nick never did what? What the *&^% are you talking about?".
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
I totally have to disagree with you there. I think that the scene was more effective because you didn't hear what Nick said. It was meant to be a private moment. Granted, I still would have been affected even if we did hear Nick's "I never meant to disappoint you," but it hit me even more because we didn't. It's like it was something meant only for Grissom to know.
I totally have to disagree with you there. I think that the scene was more effective because you didn't hear what Nick said. It was meant to be a private moment. Granted, I still would have been affected even if we did hear Nick's "I never meant to disappoint you," but it hit me even more because we didn't. It's like it was something meant only for Grissom to know.
MareGrissom
Prime Suspect
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
oh my goodness!! i have not yet seen this episode and I cannot WAIT to see it! I was a big CSI fan during the first 2 years but then was too busy and didn't watch TV. Now I have been newly obsessed and am dying to see Grave Danger!!
oh my goodness!! i have not yet seen this episode and I cannot WAIT to see it! I was a big CSI fan during the first 2 years but then was too busy and didn't watch TV. Now I have been newly obsessed and am dying to see Grave Danger!!
myfuturecsi
Corpse
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
Nick and Grissom have had a very complicated relationship. Nick was an eager beaver at the beginning of the show and was doing his utmost to please Grissom. Grissom, on the other hand, has always treated Nick like as Taratino said himself, 'the bastard stepchild'. Grissom always had time for Catherine, Warrick, and Sara, even Greg. Nick was always an afterthought for him.
For two seasons even three Nick took the blame for the complicated relationship on himself. He seemed to feel it was because of something he did wrong. He made some poor judgements that ticked off Grissom such as sleeping with a hooker in season one. But by season four, it seemed as if Nick had just come to conclude that Grissom was who he was and no matter what he did, he could never be pleased. Things took a turn for the better in their relationship when Grissom reccomended him for the promotion that was eventually cut. It seemed the moment that Nick told Grissom in 'Eleven Angry Jurors'. 'I'm not like you Grissom.' Grissom's attitude towards Nick changed dramatically and they got on much better.
However, I think Nick holds on to things for a long time and he probably still felt that he's let Grissom down in someway, and he's still the outsider in the crew. So I guess when Nick had resigned himself to his fate in the coffin, he felt that he needed to get that off his chest. He felt that if there was a few things he could say before he died, that was one of them. He didn't want to die without at least resolving the issues with Grissom.
Now I have a question...why did Nick aim the gun at his chin
instead of his temple when he attempted suicide after the air supply ran out? Isn't it quicker to die by a shot to temple then through the chin0.?Always wondered about that. Morbid, but this is coming from the person who wrote about Nick being a Grim Reaper.
Nick and Grissom have had a very complicated relationship. Nick was an eager beaver at the beginning of the show and was doing his utmost to please Grissom. Grissom, on the other hand, has always treated Nick like as Taratino said himself, 'the bastard stepchild'. Grissom always had time for Catherine, Warrick, and Sara, even Greg. Nick was always an afterthought for him.
For two seasons even three Nick took the blame for the complicated relationship on himself. He seemed to feel it was because of something he did wrong. He made some poor judgements that ticked off Grissom such as sleeping with a hooker in season one. But by season four, it seemed as if Nick had just come to conclude that Grissom was who he was and no matter what he did, he could never be pleased. Things took a turn for the better in their relationship when Grissom reccomended him for the promotion that was eventually cut. It seemed the moment that Nick told Grissom in 'Eleven Angry Jurors'. 'I'm not like you Grissom.' Grissom's attitude towards Nick changed dramatically and they got on much better.
However, I think Nick holds on to things for a long time and he probably still felt that he's let Grissom down in someway, and he's still the outsider in the crew. So I guess when Nick had resigned himself to his fate in the coffin, he felt that he needed to get that off his chest. He felt that if there was a few things he could say before he died, that was one of them. He didn't want to die without at least resolving the issues with Grissom.
Now I have a question...why did Nick aim the gun at his chin
instead of his temple when he attempted suicide after the air supply ran out? Isn't it quicker to die by a shot to temple then through the chin0.?Always wondered about that. Morbid, but this is coming from the person who wrote about Nick being a Grim Reaper.
lookyhere_kayla
Lab Technician
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
I'm betting that we do somewhere along the line...just hope Nick doesn't have to listen to it...it would be extra torment for him.
It would be interesting to see if he said anything to the others tho'. Can't imagine him not saying personal goodbyes to the others...he would have left one for Warrick for deffo.
I'm betting that we do somewhere along the line...just hope Nick doesn't have to listen to it...it would be extra torment for him.
It would be interesting to see if he said anything to the others tho'. Can't imagine him not saying personal goodbyes to the others...he would have left one for Warrick for deffo.
ford_prefect
CSI Level Two
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
I don't feel that way at all. I watched the rough cut clip of this scene online before the episode aired, and the first time I saw it I was only able to get the sound. Even without the picture, I was able to figure out basically what Nick said, because I was familiar with the characters and their relationship. It didn't really matter what the exact words were. I liked the way that it was done and thought that it was the most touching moment in the episode, and the only time that I cried.
I would love it if we got to see Grissom, and everyone else for that matter, listen to Nick's message. I'm not sure how Nick would feel about that though, since he only intended for someone to hear it if he had died.
I don't know much about this, but I think I read somewhere that the most efficient way to commit suicide by a gunshot to the head is actually through your eye socket. I think Nick put the gun to his chin because it was basically the same as putting the gun in his mouth, but I don't really know if that would be more or less effective than putting the gun to his temple.
I don't think he said anything else, since he was attacked by the ants and dropped the tape recorder. It looked to me like he was finished anyway.
I don't feel that way at all. I watched the rough cut clip of this scene online before the episode aired, and the first time I saw it I was only able to get the sound. Even without the picture, I was able to figure out basically what Nick said, because I was familiar with the characters and their relationship. It didn't really matter what the exact words were. I liked the way that it was done and thought that it was the most touching moment in the episode, and the only time that I cried.
I would love it if we got to see Grissom, and everyone else for that matter, listen to Nick's message. I'm not sure how Nick would feel about that though, since he only intended for someone to hear it if he had died.
I don't know much about this, but I think I read somewhere that the most efficient way to commit suicide by a gunshot to the head is actually through your eye socket. I think Nick put the gun to his chin because it was basically the same as putting the gun in his mouth, but I don't really know if that would be more or less effective than putting the gun to his temple.
I don't think he said anything else, since he was attacked by the ants and dropped the tape recorder. It looked to me like he was finished anyway.
VerityKindle
Police Officer
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoilers***
I understand the complexity of Nick's relationship with Grissom, and I understand why he might think that he'd disappointed Grissom somehow.
What I'm questioning is why Quentin Tarantino chose to turn the microphone off so that we--the audience--couldn't hear what he was saying.
It's just my feeling that the viewer is the only reason why you have a television program, so it's a little pointless to cut the viewer out of a private moment. It's not like we're really there eavesdropping in a private conversation.
I understand the complexity of Nick's relationship with Grissom, and I understand why he might think that he'd disappointed Grissom somehow.
What I'm questioning is why Quentin Tarantino chose to turn the microphone off so that we--the audience--couldn't hear what he was saying.
It's just my feeling that the viewer is the only reason why you have a television program, so it's a little pointless to cut the viewer out of a private moment. It's not like we're really there eavesdropping in a private conversation.
PonchoLives
Lab Technician
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoi
I also think it was meant to be a private moment between Grissom and Nick. Nick was able to say exactly what he felt because no one was listening. He could be completely open. In the same way, Grissom was able to be completely honest because he was all alone. Each man's response was done in private, all alone. I think that's how it was supposed to be. I don't think we've heard the last of this private exchange, though.
I don't think it's necessary for Grissom to hear the tape. It was evident from what Grissom was seeing that Nick was emotionally distraught. His face was mingled with pain which obviously would come through in his voice.
Perhaps it's as simple as that's the spot he could reach the best. He was in closed quarters so putting a gun in his mouth or at his temple might have been difficult because there wasn't enough room. What if he missed and he didn't die instantly? Shooting himself under the chin would do it just fine.
He said that he knew that they did the best they could to find him. We don't know if he said anything specific to anyone else. It makes sense that Grissom would have been the last person he would have addressed since he was apologizing for disappointing him. Regarding that, I was wondering if he was apologizing in general or for getting himself kidnapped. I suspect it could be both.
I also think it was meant to be a private moment between Grissom and Nick. Nick was able to say exactly what he felt because no one was listening. He could be completely open. In the same way, Grissom was able to be completely honest because he was all alone. Each man's response was done in private, all alone. I think that's how it was supposed to be. I don't think we've heard the last of this private exchange, though.
I don't think it's necessary for Grissom to hear the tape. It was evident from what Grissom was seeing that Nick was emotionally distraught. His face was mingled with pain which obviously would come through in his voice.
Perhaps it's as simple as that's the spot he could reach the best. He was in closed quarters so putting a gun in his mouth or at his temple might have been difficult because there wasn't enough room. What if he missed and he didn't die instantly? Shooting himself under the chin would do it just fine.
He said that he knew that they did the best they could to find him. We don't know if he said anything specific to anyone else. It makes sense that Grissom would have been the last person he would have addressed since he was apologizing for disappointing him. Regarding that, I was wondering if he was apologizing in general or for getting himself kidnapped. I suspect it could be both.
lemon_grass
CSI Level Two
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoi
I, too, had no problem figuring out the "I never meant to dissapoint you" scene, even though I didn't get the exact words. But for the viewers who are not as familiar with Nick and Grissom's past relationship - and there are a lot of them - I think the scene loses a lot of impact due to the confusion. For me, it was one of those moments where I go, "Hey, being an obssessive fan has finally paid off!"
Still, I would love to hear how Nick said it next season. I'm not sure how I feel about the others listening to that part of the tape, since it's a private message meant for Grissom. What I'm really dying to see, is for Grissom to tell Nick face-to-face what he said to the computer screen.
As to Nick aiming the gun at his chin instead of his temple, someone on the board said that this way his face would sustain minimal damage, which shows a) he cares about his appearance at the funeral, b) he cares about his mom who (he thinks) cares about his appearance at the funeral, or c) both of the above. I'm not sure where you aim the gun really makes a big difference on your appearance, but I think the theory has a lot of merit.
P.S. Someone mentioned, I think in another thread, the fingernail scratches inside the lid of the box. I never noticed that before, so I went back and re-watched the episode, and wow! There they are all over the glass. It gives me goosebumps to imagine how Nick must have been feeling when he made the scratches. I love this little detail.
I, too, had no problem figuring out the "I never meant to dissapoint you" scene, even though I didn't get the exact words. But for the viewers who are not as familiar with Nick and Grissom's past relationship - and there are a lot of them - I think the scene loses a lot of impact due to the confusion. For me, it was one of those moments where I go, "Hey, being an obssessive fan has finally paid off!"
Still, I would love to hear how Nick said it next season. I'm not sure how I feel about the others listening to that part of the tape, since it's a private message meant for Grissom. What I'm really dying to see, is for Grissom to tell Nick face-to-face what he said to the computer screen.
As to Nick aiming the gun at his chin instead of his temple, someone on the board said that this way his face would sustain minimal damage, which shows a) he cares about his appearance at the funeral, b) he cares about his mom who (he thinks) cares about his appearance at the funeral, or c) both of the above. I'm not sure where you aim the gun really makes a big difference on your appearance, but I think the theory has a lot of merit.
P.S. Someone mentioned, I think in another thread, the fingernail scratches inside the lid of the box. I never noticed that before, so I went back and re-watched the episode, and wow! There they are all over the glass. It gives me goosebumps to imagine how Nick must have been feeling when he made the scratches. I love this little detail.
ford_prefect
CSI Level Two
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoi
I too thought that maybe he felt that it was somehow his own fault that he was kidnapped, which is just ludicrous, but I think Nick has always been really hard on himself, and that’s one of the reasons he is always seeking approval. I also think that he feels like he’s never quite lived up to Grissom’s expectations, and who can blame him for feeling that way, given how Grissom usually responds to him.
I feel like that scene wasn’t so much, as some people have said, a private moment for the characters, but more of a private moment for the fans.
Yes, I definitely hope that Grissom tells Nick at some point that he is not disappointed in him. He obviously needs to hear it.
I had mentioned something about him being worried about his appearance at the funeral somewhere on the board. Because in his hallucination his Dad says “He’ll look great at the funeral. His mother will appreciate that.” I had thought that his concern was something that had prevented him from committing suicide even earlier, but I didn’t even think about that being his reason for wanting to shoot himself under his chin. Interesting.
I too thought that maybe he felt that it was somehow his own fault that he was kidnapped, which is just ludicrous, but I think Nick has always been really hard on himself, and that’s one of the reasons he is always seeking approval. I also think that he feels like he’s never quite lived up to Grissom’s expectations, and who can blame him for feeling that way, given how Grissom usually responds to him.
I feel like that scene wasn’t so much, as some people have said, a private moment for the characters, but more of a private moment for the fans.
Yes, I definitely hope that Grissom tells Nick at some point that he is not disappointed in him. He obviously needs to hear it.
I had mentioned something about him being worried about his appearance at the funeral somewhere on the board. Because in his hallucination his Dad says “He’ll look great at the funeral. His mother will appreciate that.” I had thought that his concern was something that had prevented him from committing suicide even earlier, but I didn’t even think about that being his reason for wanting to shoot himself under his chin. Interesting.
Re: Post - "Grave Danger" Episode Discussion/Review ***Spoi
An interesting idea, but I tend to agree with PonchoLives, in that there was just not enough room to aim it at his temple. He barely had enough room to reach into his pocket in that box, think of how difficult it would be to aim the gun. Minimal movement, minmal effort. Why make it a struggle to kill yourself after all that you've endured? The dream probably did play a part in his decision also, but any other option was limited by the space.
An interesting idea, but I tend to agree with PonchoLives, in that there was just not enough room to aim it at his temple. He barely had enough room to reach into his pocket in that box, think of how difficult it would be to aim the gun. Minimal movement, minmal effort. Why make it a struggle to kill yourself after all that you've endured? The dream probably did play a part in his decision also, but any other option was limited by the space.