Grade 'Indelible'

[JoeyDC]

It feels wrong to me to grade an episode that was in honor of 9/11 to pay tribute, or so I thought.

I don't feel bad when I say that the episode didn't do justice to all the real fallen heroes at all. On the contrary, it makes me so angry that this incredibly tragic day was somewhat 'reduced' by some horrible performances of non-existing or faked emotions that couldn't have come across more insincere. My husband is a veteran who joined the military shortly after 9/11, so I look at all this with even more sensitive feelings. I already found all the promotion about CSI: NY's premiere episode completely wrong since 9/11 really happened and is not a fictional idea by one of the writers. From the very beginning, I was against a 9/11 theme on CSI: NY and it saddens me that the entertainment industry doesn't realize that especially such a major tragedy should not be honored in a TV show where simply not enough air time is given. Most importantly, it should not be used to make money out of it. And I'm still very much convinced that some of the bosses behind CSI: NY did not do it just for paying tribute to 9/11 but to promote the show itself more.

None of the characters made me believe the emotional pain they were going through when 9/11 happened in the flashback scenes. The episode felt rather rushed through which makes it a complete disaster, in my opinion.

Not everything was bad though. I enjoyed the team moment and watching another side of Mac Taylor when he was shown with his wife Claire portrayed by the very talented Jamie Ray Newman. I adore Sela for a long time now and to have her on CSI: NY is such a treat for me. She's not only beautiful and a gifted actress, but she brings such lightness to the whole team that I could watch her on screen forever. The Adam moment was funny, but it didn't make me laugh out loud as it normally does. It was also great to see Danny in a new role and with new responsibilities although I'm still unsure what exactly his new job is.

It was so wonderful to have Don Flack back on the screen. Eddie had some good scenes and a decent screen time as well as was he given good lines again. I enjoy the friendship between Jo and him, they both seem very easy-going towards each other.

I love Sid. I want more Sid too. Robert Joy is such a joy to watch He's such an adorable character and charismatic actor, I wish they would give him more screen time.

Simply said, the show clearly failed to pay tribute to 9/11 in a real and sincere way it so deserves. It should have never been used as a theme on a TV show and everything seemed rather forced than truly dedicated to the purpose of honoring the 10th anniversary. The only time I cried was at the end when the REAL heroes were shown and remembered. The REAL people that were at the ceremony right next to Gary Sinise when he spoke from the bottom of his heart. This was the only moment where I felt this is solely contributed to the brave souls that gave their lives on this never-forgotten day!

 

[MoonyGirl]

It was brilliant episode in my mind. I really enjoyed it. It was sad, moving, sweet all things among many others combined.

And of course it honoured the memory of the 911 greatly too.

My favourite parts were The flashback in the beginning. I'm a Gary/Mac fan so you might guess why!

Adam's mimic! HILARIOUS!! Gosh I've missed Adams humour and he's sooo sweet too!

Loved to see Sid again too and his flashback also

As for the other characters. I didn't realize how much I've missed'em during the brake! :lol:

So yeah, I loved this premiere of season 8 and can't wait what will happen later this season!

My grade was A+

 

[PerfectAnomaly]

It feels wrong to me to grade an episode that was in honor of 9/11 to pay tribute, or so I thought.

I don't feel bad when I say that the episode didn't do justice to all the real fallen heroes at all. On the contrary, it makes me so angry that this incredibly tragic day was somewhat 'reduced' by some horrible performances of non-existing or faked emotions that couldn't have come across more insincere. My husband is a veteran who joined the military shortly after 9/11, so I look at all this with even more sensitive feelings. I already found all the promotion about CSI: NY's premiere episode completely wrong since 9/11 really happened and is not a fictional idea by one of the writers. From the very beginning, I was against a 9/11 theme on CSI: NY and it saddens me that the entertainment industry doesn't realize that especially such a major tragedy should not be honored in a TV show where simply not enough air time is given. Most importantly, it should not be used to make money out of it. And I'm still very much convinced that some of the bosses behind CSI: NY did not do it just for paying tribute to 9/11 but to promote the show itself more.

None of the characters made me believe the emotional pain they were going through when 9/11 happened in the flashback scenes. The episode felt rather rushed through which makes it a complete disaster, in my opinion.

Not everything was bad though. I enjoyed the team moment and watching another side of Mac Taylor when he was shown with his wife Claire portrayed by the very talented Jamie Ray Newman. I adore Sela for a long time now and to have her on CSI: NY is such a treat for me. She's not only beautiful and a gifted actress, but she brings such lightness to the whole team that I could watch her on screen forever. The Adam moment was funny, but it didn't make me laugh out loud as it normally does. It was also great to see Danny in a new role and with new responsibilities although I'm still unsure what exactly his new job is.

It was so wonderful to have Don Flack back on the screen. Eddie had some good scenes and a decent screen time as well as was he given good lines again. I enjoy the friendship between Jo and him, they both seem very easy-going towards each other.

I love Sid. I want more Sid too. Robert Joy is such a joy to watch He's such an adorable character and charismatic actor, I wish they would give him more screen time.

Simply said, the show clearly failed to pay tribute to 9/11 in a real and sincere way it so deserves. It should have never been used as a theme on a TV show and everything seemed rather forced than truly dedicated to the purpose of honoring the 10th anniversary. The only time I cried was at the end when the REAL heroes were shown and remembered. The REAL people that were at the ceremony right next to Gary Sinise when he spoke from the bottom of his heart. This was the only moment where I felt this is solely contributed to the brave souls that gave their lives on this never-forgotten day!

The end was a tribute to the first responders, which made sense since this is a show about first responders. The rest of the episode was a story that showed us where the characters were and what they were doing on 9/11 and not meant to be a "tribute" per se. Since it was established in the pilot that Mac lost Claire on 9/11 and the show, again, is about first responders I don't see how they could avoid doing a show about 9/11 on the 10th anniversary, especially when the show premiered a little less than two weeks after.

Obviously this is a YMMV aspect of it, but I think all of the actors portrayed the emotions of being in the moment of that day very well. You could see the looks of disbelief, of shock, of not really understanding the situation on Carmine's and Eddie's faces. You could see the seriousness and determination on Sela's face as Jo tried to get "all hands on deck." You could see the fear for Claire on Gary's face and the respect and sadness Robert, Hill and Gary had in the scene with the fallen firefighter. You could sense the guilt in AJ for sleeping through the event and the compassion and reassurance in Anna.

I thought it was done very tastefully and with a lot of respect because they didn't show gore and chaos or any gratuitious scenes meant to shock/anger/sadden, etc. They simply showed glimpses of what the people were doing and feeling on that day and to me that was very powerful.

 

[hiphugger17]

The end was a tribute to the first responders, which made sense since this is a show about first responders. The rest of the episode was a story that showed us where the characters were and what they were doing on 9/11 and not meant to be a "tribute" per se. Since it was established in the pilot that Mac lost Claire on 9/11 and the show, again, is about first responders I don't see how they could avoid doing a show about 9/11 on the 10th anniversary, especially when the show premiered a little less than two weeks after.

Obviously this is a YMMV aspect of it, but I think all of the actors portrayed the emotions of being in the moment of that day very well. You could see the looks of disbelief, of shock, of not really understanding the situation on Carmine's and Eddie's faces. You could see the seriousness and determination on Sela's face as Jo tried to get "all hands on deck." You could see the fear for Claire on Gary's face and the respect and sadness Robert, Hill and Gary had in the scene with the fallen firefighter. You could sense the guilt in AJ for sleeping through the event and the compassion and reassurance in Anna.

I thought it was done very tastefully and with a lot of respect because they didn't show gore and chaos or any gratuitious scenes meant to shock/anger/sadden, etc. They simply showed glimpses of what the people were doing and feeling on that day and to me that was very powerful.

I totally agree with this. You described their expressions and emotions perfectly.

 

[pretty_in_pink]

First of all, I think this episode should have been longer. Make it an hour and a half, take out the case (which I thought was kind of out of place anyway) and it would have been better. I was hoping we'd see more of Mac and his wife (along with the rest of the team, but especially Mac because he lost his wife that day), either pre-9/11 or on the very day. They didn't really leave much for us to go off of as to what happened to her. She was out of the building when the second plane hit, so did she go back into the building or...the writers left a lot to the imagination.

I thought the transitions from the present case to the flashbacks were a little cliche (how everyone just kind of zoned out with an intense stare...) but the flashbacks were all really tastefully done. I would have liked to see the episode feature a lot more of the flashbacks tbh.

I liked the fact that they included Adam, and the fact that he was asleep when it happened. It seemed really in character and it's probably something that a lot of other people went through as well but nobody really talks about.

Though I thought it was really weird for Lindsay to have been part of the "bucket brigade" (I think that's the term they used), simply because when she first came to NY in season 2, they made it seem like she had never been there before. And, it kind of took away from Adam's storyline. I think it would have been a lot more realistic to hear her perspective from being in Montana. There were so many things she could have referenced-flags on the streets, vigils, so many people giving blood or trying to find ways that they could help from where they are...I think it would have been more interesting and brought up another, different perspective, which would have been better, seeing as the episode was trying to show how people were affected/reacted to 9/11.

Oh, and I'm kind of sad that Mac didn't let go of the beach ball from season 1, just because when someone said "beach scene" that's immediately what I thought of and I was like, "Yay, continuity!!!!" and the writers were like, "LOL NO."

Overall, I thought it was a tastefully done episode. There are a few things I would have changed, but it was a good episode and I'm excited to see where the season goes.

 

[MacsGirlMel]

I was hoping for the ball too, lol.

Well said, pretty_in_pink.

 

[CRM]

I thought that this episode could have been done with more, I am actually glad that it paid tribute to the 9/11 anniversary 10 years later. With the very first episode for season 1 with Mac written in as one who lost his wife during that tragic day, I was definitely expecting this to be written in. I wasn't expecting it to throw in storylines or plots that can save the show from being cancelled. As I know that some will use the tragedy as another way to bash this CSI even when I knew that these same people have had bashed this show episode after episode. I won't mention names since this isn't the place to do it. This is actually my favorite CSI and I wouldn't care to further read on the bad things that people would say about this show.

I have two brothers who are serving on the Air Force and I do worry constantly about them being deployed at any time, so this episode does affect me. I don't enjoy or applaud any 9/11-related story, film, or show that I have seen. I'm not really fond of World Trade Center, The Space Between, or United 93. I'm not some tabloid-loving Cheetos-addicted 400 lbs. weighing film/T.V. buff who has to criticize every single plot or conflict from a show's episode or a film's weak lines while mommy pays for the cable bills. In a nutshell, this episode is, by far, above average. I truly enjoy almost every scene in it. And the emotions by Mac with his friend can rival with his emotions in Yarzheit and in Blink.

I can say this is my favorite CSI, even though I do may have missed out on some things. Or because I do enjoy Mac's no-nonsense sense of authority as a way for me to imagine that I do sometimes need that authority to keep myself in line and to respect that rather than to resent it. Or it's because I personally want to move to or see New York so much. If I heard right, did Adam mentioned NYU?? I thought that he was a new transplant from Arizona when Danny was making fun of him freezing in the NYC cold on an old episode. And I do love his mocking Jo and Lindsay watching him do it. I could've seen more of Jo during the attacks after the phone call. I'm not sure how long Ellie was adopted, but I think that Jo said, "Kids" rather than "kid".

As for Danny, I could get used to his being promoted to Sargeant as well as the badass Sargeant suit. Hopefully, he doesn't get a bit distance from his team since that's how I've felt when Flack remembered meeting Danny on 9/11/01. I wanted Danny to remember that moment, which was unfortunate for me not to see Danny remembering meeting Flack.

The recent crime scene could've been done with more. Maybe, I was just caught up with wanting to see flashbacks rather than the recent crime that I didn't care much about how it all went down. This episode gets a B+.

 

[miamirocks]

I usually don't watch too much of CSI:NY, but I wanted to make sure I tuned in for this one (well, I watched it online... )

Anyhow, I'm from NY and live a couple hours drive from the city. I know some of the families who lost firefighters, EMS and WTC workers that day. Looking at the memorial and seeing the names and pictures of people whose families I've come into contact with since as a journalist (particularly the Vigiano Family), I was very touched by the ending. I also thought the episode was tastefully done and didn't have a problem w/the characters' emotions.

I can empathize w/Adam and his story - I slept through the planes hitting the towers, although I watched everything else live. It was scary being a NYer that day, but I loved Mac's talk w/his friend - particularly how such great good could come out of such great evil. That was what I took away from 9/11 and still remember to this day.

The one thing I wish they would've done is explain a bit more about Claire's death. They should've just left her in one of the towers, it would've been more believable. I mean, I know people who were in the towers when the second plane hit and made it out alive. So someone who was already outside would have a great chance of survival. When the second plane hit, it seemed on the news that cops escorted almost all civilians away from the site, so unless she got hit w/debris, I don't get how she died, and if she was so far away how was her body never found? I really hope they don't do the whole "she faked her death" thing - that would be totally stupid and insensitive.

Anyhow, I was hoping for more flashbacks and explanation for Claire - where did she work, what tower, what did she do for a living? Like someone else already said, I also found the beginning a little "cheesy" w/the "911 call", although I did like the Opera tickets. (I remember that NSync song very well - that's almost all they played on MTV in the days following 9/11).

Overall, I thought it was a nice tribute w/an OK B-storyline. I actually liked that the guilty woman didn't realize it was 9/11 - shows how she was in her own world w/drugs and stuff and also shows how some people really don't realize it - kind of jarring, actually. 10 years is a long time, but God bless all those heroes and souls that died that day!

 

[Geeno]

I agree with those who loved/liked the episode. It was well done. I didn't mind the case of the week. Yes it was simple and quite boring but I understand why.

A+

 

[talkingtocactus]

hmm yeah well i guess i had mixed feelings on it. before i go into that i just want to say i find it really interesting (on a very abstract level, just kind of fascinating) how very different the reactions were by the 2 people on this thread who probably had the most invested in this episode - jade nolan and joey dc - and i can see both sides really. i think jade was right that they were obviously focused on first responders as that's the thrust of the show and it was good that that resonated so well with her as one of those. i think even joey felt that to a degree, but i can also see the point they made that it was somehow "reduced".

anyway as to the ep itself....

i actually (and i suspect i'm in a minority of one) really liked what they did with the opening titles. i kind of wish they hadn't put in the usual titles at all. i liked the green fading to grey as a reference to it being a past event and not a fluid past but one set in stone. i thought it was simple and effective and i think the fact they put the titles in kind of ruined that. if i'd been the producer (!) i'd have just shunted the titles to the credits and had them as the standard list along with the other credits. unusal, sure, but i think the titles just interrupted the flow. and in a show attempting to tackle such a serious issue i think things like titles can be made to take a back seat.

there were bits of the show i liked - a lot, like:

adam imitating jo, and adam and jo's interaction generally

sid

claire being shown as playful and lighthearted which really highlighted the contrast between mac then and mac now.

the a case - sure it was nothing particularly flashy or intricate but that's as should be the case when the other half of the show is devoted to more important matters. i liked that it wasn't totally clear cut tho, and had something of a little twist to it, and allowed the characters to remain in the present a bit as well as the past.

flack. he looked good and had some great lines - the conversation about donuts was good.

mac's interaction with the reluctant responder - i liked the bit about the grumpy guy and the charismatic charming cop - again it showed that mac *does* have a sense of humour, even in the present of the show.

the other thing i really liked was the speech part at the end - it was really hard to tell whether that entire scene was mac or just straight up gary, i ended up feeling it was gary but that the cast were there in character. it was very hazy tho. i think that was quite good in a way but on the other hand it made me wonder about the show - i think all the stuff gary does in that area of raising funds and support for troops/first responders is great but that scene being *so* much like "him" as opposed to just his character made me wonder if people might see it as him just using the show as a vehicle to make a speech to a biggish audience. and i can understand that. although on the other hand i think it goes to show how much of gary is in mac and that's also good - and it did fit with (a) the show more broadly and (b) mac as a character. it just was maybe a little too blurred between fiction and reality. then again the whole show was to take an event from reality and tie it in with fiction so that could apply to the whole thing i guess.

i also really liked gary's little afterword.

...

but there were things i didn't like

hawkes & lindsay - both as irritating as ever

danny's tache. whyyyyyy????

the bit with mac & claire on the bus. mainly because i loathe that song at the best of times and that particular version of it even more, so it just really didn't help.

as for the rest and the actual 9/11 stuff - i don't know, i found some of it a bit... well as others have said really, condensed. i agree with whoever said maybe it should've been an extended/double ep, because trying to squish (a) mac's entire backstory and (b) a massive event into 40 mins was just... well i don't think it was ever really gonna work.

i think out of anyone on the planet who was best placed to tackle the topic of 9/11 on tv, gary was that person and i really think he did his best. for me it fell a bit short and i didn't think it was amazing. however, i think in terms of trying to connect with relevant people (first responders for instance) he did a good job on that score. i think really that he probably did as best as he could with only 40 minutes, and i doubt anyone else could've done more. but i think it should've been extended so he could really do it some justice.

it also doesn't help at all that i'm really over csiny at the moment. i've just lost my mac mojo. actually, not true, i still think mac is ace, but the show as a whole? meh, i've kinda lost it. so i think maybe i was coming at this ep from a hyper critical standpoint. then again i also had high hopes for *ahem* gary's massive input, so i wasn't closed minded either...

so i'm grading C+ - kinda fair to middling...

 

[MacsGirlMel]

I'm curious, why did you find Hawkes and Lindsay irritating this time? It's not terribly surprising though with Lindsay, a lot of people find her irritating lol

 

[stormymac]

It feels wrong to me to grade an episode that was in honor of 9/11 to pay tribute, or so I thought.

I don't feel bad when I say that the episode didn't do justice to all the real fallen heroes at all. On the contrary, it makes me so angry that this incredibly tragic day was somewhat 'reduced' by some horrible performances of non-existing or faked emotions that couldn't have come across more insincere. My husband is a veteran who joined the military shortly after 9/11, so I look at all this with even more sensitive feelings. I already found all the promotion about CSI: NY's premiere episode completely wrong since 9/11 really happened and is not a fictional idea by one of the writers. From the very beginning, I was against a 9/11 theme on CSI: NY and it saddens me that the entertainment industry doesn't realize that especially such a major tragedy should not be honored in a TV show where simply not enough air time is given. Most importantly, it should not be used to make money out of it. And I'm still very much convinced that some of the bosses behind CSI: NY did not do it just for paying tribute to 9/11 but to promote the show itself more.

Like PA said, since we have known Mac was a 9/11 widower since the first episode, there is no way they couldn't acknowledge the 10th anniversary. I also have to say that I am bothered by your insinuation that this was done mostly for money or promotion of the show. I know the show is filmed in LA but both Carmine and Eddie are native New Yorkers and the two producers who wrote the episode are a former NY DA and an actual first responder on 9/11. As for how personal this was for Gary, it is easier to just quote him:

"There’s a memorial in Brooklyn that honors all the first responders that were killed on Sept. 11 called the Brooklyn Wall of Remembrance. There are 417 faces of first responders that were lost that day. Back in 2006, they had completed about one-third of that memorial and they ran out of money. A firefighter friend of mine took me out to see it and I offered to try and help them raise the additional money to complete the memorial. They liked that idea, so we put a concert together at Brooklyn College where my band, Lieutenant Dan Band, played, and we raised all the money to complete the memorial, and it was open and dedicated in May 2008.

I met Anthony Zuiker, the creator of CSI: NY, back in 2004. It was always in his mind that my character, Mac Taylor, was a guy who was very personally involved in what happened down at Ground Zero, and also somebody who had lost a loved one there. And over the years, I’d been pitching an idea to the writers and our showrunner about doing an episode that would focus on the 9/11 anniversary and feature the Brooklyn Wall of Remembrance. At the end of last season, we weren’t sure if we were going to be coming back or not, but when we left each other we said, “If we do come back, our season premiere has to be this episode since it’s the tenth anniversary of the Sept. 11 attacks. It’s time to do this episode.”

I do feel, IMO, it is rather disrespectful to say this wasn't a very personal episode for everyone involved when it clearly was.

Also, believe me when I say that I mean no disrespect and please tell your husband how grateful I am for his service to our country.

 

[talkingtocactus]

I'm curious, why did you find Hawkes and Lindsay irritating this time? It's not terribly surprising though with Lindsay, a lot of people find her irritating lol

lindsay's little lines with adam just felt horribly contrived and, well, lindsayish.

as for hawkes, really i only need to see his smug, preachy face and my irritation rises.

 

[MacsGirlMel]

Interesting. I never saw him that way.

 

[Ceindreadh]

Seems to me that the show was always going to be in a 'damned if they do, damned if they don't' situation with regard to 9/11. If they *do* feature it in an episode they'd be accused of being tasteless/using it for ratings etc, if they didn't feature it, they'd be accused of insensitivity in ignoring it. It's different for other shows, but a show set *in* New York, and about first responders, I'm not sure how they *couldn't* have used it. (my only complaint would be that they could have done so much more and made it a 1.5 hour or even a 2 hour ep)

Danny, big swing and a miss on the mustache. And why would he want to go out in the field, which is more dangerous, when he has a family? Dumb move my friend.

Yes, because working as CSI in the crime lab has been soooo much better for his health? ;-)