Eric/Calleigh romance - why we dislike it. **spoilers**

[starzsgirl]

I am really start loosing my respect for her....

I wish I was still in the losing stage, but I have lost all respect for Calleigh. She was such a strong woman and even with the small realtionships she was in before this train wreck she was the one wearing the pants, esentially.

And the ep on Monday sealed everything that Calleigh has become a different person and no longer goes to the lengths it takes to get the anwers or evidence needed. It's horrid that TPTB have ruined such an amazing character, she was so strong now she is weaker than a lot of the already weak characters.

What gets me the most is that they changed her to comform to a man, I'm not a feminist but women's rights are important, and so many younger girls watch this show and to see something like that....they will surely copy it and use it because that is one of the examples that they see on a weekly basis. So much time is spent teaching that changing to fit to someone else is never a positive thing and the writers are trying to put a positive spin on it. It's sad that TPTB has to stoop this low by taking away one of the positive influences on television.

 

[Florry86]

Ok I watched this episode & for a person like me who doesn't enjoy this couple, who's hating Eric Delko with every fiber of her being, who's lost her respect for Calleigh....surely this episode wasn't good :lol:
I mean wha't was the purpose of the scene in the bathroom with Eric shirtless for the second time in this season?
Except for watching Calleigh's house & the contrast between her spitting some water while Ryan was spitting blood or her sipping the water while Ryan was dropping salt in his water for his lip or also the difference of the set where Ryan or Delko woke up :lol: & other things like these....I really can't find the purpose of having Eric shirtless for the second time in a season of a show named CSI .

I'm sure it made all the e/c fans happy or, even better, squeeing, but quite honestly I was rolling my eyes.
Also the fact tht EP had to pinch AR on his back just to show their great chemistry was :wtf:. At least make them kiss another time, if you really think they have this great chemistry between them.
Ops I think I may have just given such a bad idea to TPTB....please TPTB don't read this one...I'm drunk

As for their reaction to Ryan's situation.....
On one hand I wanted to kill Eric with my own hands b/c of his behaviour towards Ryan.
Eric telling Ryan to get his head in the game....am I that stupid to think that it was ridiculous juts b/c of 2 very simple reasons???
- As far as I know that person without head is Eric. He's the one with the bullet lodged in his temporal lobe & he's the one who's suffering from hallucination or daydreaming while working on case.
- do you remember Doug Benson from 7x12 - "Head Case"? He was suffering from memory loss b/c of a shocking experience which blocked his memory & look at that...the experience was this one. He killed an entire family even if was forced to do it. Eric was identifying with this guy just b/c he tthought he had shared the same experience, throughout the whole episode. I really hoped he had actually had that kind of experience so that they could have thrown him in jail getting rid off the keys. Sorry but whenever Delko behaves like this I want him dead!! :lol:
And he wants Ryaan to get his head in the game?

On the other hand you could see that Calleigh did want to help that poor guy, yep I loved also the fact they kinda shared the dentist experience (btw I think I'm gonna say bye bye to mine after this episode LOL) . I mean she asked him more than once what was wrong with him, in all the scenes they had together & you could see she just wanted to help him b/c she cares about him.

But in the last scene I do think that something really bad happened. While Eric was just yelling at that poor guy without reasons (ok that he didn't know anything about the whole Billy's stuff, still he could have easily avoided yelling at him), Calleigh didn't do anything except being the most hurt person of the world.
IDK I felt so sad both for Ryan & her. I mean when a person like Calleigh looks hurt as she was in the last scene, I do think that that person has lost any faith & trust in you & I do think that Ryan will have tons of things to regain her trust. I'm not saying that he lost her friendship b/c, eventually, she'll know wha happened to him....still there'll be some tension between these 2 b/c he didn't trust her (his best friend) enough to explain to her the whole situation.
But, the fact Calleigh didn't do anything left me :wtf: especially considering the person she's always been throughout the seasons. Whenever Ryan had problem & he didn't trust her (b/c it already happened also when he froze during a shooting & she explaind her experience with her visual problems when she changed her shifts) she was there to help him b/c no matter how the situation is a solid friendship like the one they have makes you do everything!!!

So yeah I find myself agreeing with all of you telling that her behaviour was not normal. It seemes like she won't do anything to help her friends unless Eric tells her she can do it. It really looks like they're concentrated on eachother ignoring the rest of the team & even their friends & their action will have to be the same. Eric does one thing, she'll follow him & viceversa.

IDK this isn't my Calleigh & yeah I lost my respect for her long time ago

 

[GregNickRyanFan]

Well at least Eric did sort of apologize to Ryan for the "get your head in the game" part. :lol: That was nice at least and it surprised me, pleasantly. Why the writers felt the need to add that last part, the only thing I can figure is that with what Ryan told H that the mafia is trying to break them, and this left the episode open that maybe they are a little broken now. I'm pretty sure that if Ryan doesn't tell Calleigh and Eric what really happened with Billy and with him being tortured, that Horatio will smooth things over by next episode. :lol: Or maybe Ryan will have to tell IAB what happened and Calleigh and Eric will overhear. Calleigh will probably feel bad that she didn't put two and two together and figure out that the mafia had kidnapped him and threatened people he cares about. Eric will probably feel guilty for not letting Ryan explain. At least I hope so. This is not the time for this team to be at odds with each other.

 

[mjszud]

See, but how many times is there a much needed conversation between the team & we never end up seeing it? TOO MANY! I have the feeling that it won't even be brought up again. I see it being another one of those "to be continued but never actually continues" kinda crap. They'll probably blow it off & just act tense around each other until the big finale, & then whatever happens there will be something they all have to face & somehow we'll just assume that E & C figure out what Ryan had to do & be ok with it. Maybe they'll be next to have to take that kind of action, who knows, but I honestly can't see them actually talking to Ryan about this last incident. I'd be very surprised.

this left the episode open that maybe they are a little broken now

I'm definitly getting that "broken" vibe from all this, including the e/c romance & how it's effecting the team as a whole. It all seems to be tying in to one another. Maybe that's the reason TPTB keep consistantly showing e/c in all these scenes working together ...perhaps it's purposely to show how it's breaking the team. That's certainly what I see when I'm viewing.

Ops I think I may have just given such a bad idea to TPTB....please TPTB don't read this one...I'm drunk

:lol: **snort** yeah, can you edit that please, 'cause I don't think I could endure that kind of pain again.

 

[CSIMandy]

On the other hand you could see that Calleigh did want to help that poor guy, yep I loved also the fact they kinda shared the dentist experience (btw I think I'm gonna say bye bye to mine after this episode LOL) . I mean she asked him more than once what was wrong with him, in all the scenes they had together & you could see she just wanted to help him b/c she cares about him.

But in the last scene I do think that something really bad happened. While Eric was just yelling at that poor guy without reasons (ok that he didn't know anything about the whole Billy's stuff, still he could have easily avoided yelling at him), Calleigh didn't do anything except being the most hurt person of the world.
IDK I felt so sad both for Ryan & her. I mean when a person like Calleigh looks hurt as she was in the last scene, I do think that that person has lost any faith & trust in you & I do think that Ryan will have tons of things to regain her trust. I'm not saying that he lost her friendship b/c, eventually, she'll know wha happened to him....still there'll be some tension between these 2 b/c he didn't trust her (his best friend) enough to explain to her the whole situation.
But, the fact Calleigh didn't do anything left me :wtf: especially considering the person she's always been throughout the seasons. Whenever Ryan had problem & he didn't trust her (b/c it already happened also when he froze during a shooting & she explaind her experience with her visual problems when she changed her shifts) she was there to help him b/c no matter how the situation is a solid friendship like the one they have makes you do everything!!!

So yeah I find myself agreeing with all of you telling that her behaviour was not normal. It seemes like she won't do anything to help her friends unless Eric tells her she can do it. It really looks like they're concentrated on eachother ignoring the rest of the team & even their friends & their action will have to be the same. Eric does one thing, she'll follow him & viceversa.

IDK this isn't my Calleigh & yeah I lost my respect for her long time ago

I disagree. Calleigh's hurt and not going after Ryan had nothing to do with Eric. Calleigh is still her own person, Eric does not have control over her. She was just torn with her emotions, she's angry and hurt at Ryan at the same time. Throughout the episode, she asked Ryan repeatedly to confide in her she was willing to help him. Calleigh finding out later on about Ryan only hurt her to know he didn't confide in her. Also, this is not the first time Calleigh has shown tough love for Ryan when he messes up, she's done it in the past when she found out about his gambling.

 

[Orla_Dark]

I disagree. Calleigh's hurt and not going after Ryan had nothing to do with Eric. Calleigh is still her own person, Eric does not have control over her. She was just torn with her emotions, she's angry and hurt at Ryan at the same time. Throughout the episode, she asked Ryan repeatedly to confide in her she was willing to help him. Calleigh finding out later on about Ryan only hurt her to know he didn't confide in her. Also, this is not the first time Calleigh has shown tough love for Ryan when he messes up, she's done it in the past when she found out about his gambling.

Yeah, but every time when Ryan hurt her or not trust her, when she mad at him she still listen what he say!!! I last ep i saw that Calleigh wanna hear it, and she look at Eric and make decision don't tell anything. Old Calleigh listen Ryan and only then make conclusions. New Calleigh can't do this, cuz Eric is her man, as he thinking she thinks the same.

 

[Ginnna]

I disagree. Calleigh's hurt and not going after Ryan had nothing to do with Eric. Calleigh is still her own person, Eric does not have control over her. She was just torn with her emotions, she's angry and hurt at Ryan at the same time. Throughout the episode, she asked Ryan repeatedly to confide in her she was willing to help him. Calleigh finding out later on about Ryan only hurt her to know he didn't confide in her. Also, this is not the first time Calleigh has shown tough love for Ryan when he messes up, she's done it in the past when she found out about his gambling.

Yeah, but every time when Ryan hurt her or not trust her, when she mad at him she still listen what he say!!! I last ep i saw that Calleigh wanna hear it, and she look at Eric and make decision don't tell anything. Old Calleigh listen Ryan and only then make conclusions. New Calleigh can't do this, cuz Eric is her man, as he thinking she thinks the same.

They each listened as he offered the maddeningly vague explanation of "extenuating circumstances". They were each already upset at his apparent betrayal and then when they were offered such a paltry explanation, they obviously didn't want to bother trying to pry anything else out of him.

As another user (in a separate thread) has said, "Eric & Calleigh did not stand as one against Ryan. They were both upset with him and it just so happens that Eric is the one who wears his emotions on his sleeve."

From what I saw, he wasn't speaking for her and she wasn't deferring to him for representing her emotions. Like I said, they were obviously so upset and frustrated that they figured it would be like pulling teeth to try to get any straight answers out of him. Eric simply happens to be the one that blusters.

*sigh* I'm sorry. I know, I'm supposed to keep my mouth shut on this thread. I'll go now.

 

[Orla_Dark]

They each listened as he offered the maddeningly vague explanation of "extenuating circumstances". They were each already upset at his apparent betrayal and then when they were offered such a paltry explanation, they obviously didn't want to bother trying to pry anything else out of him.

As another user (in a separate thread) has said, "Eric & Calleigh did not stand as one against Ryan. They were both upset with him and it just so happens that Eric is the one who wears his emotions on his sleeve."

From what I saw, he wasn't speaking for her and she wasn't deferring to him for representing her emotions. Like I said, they were obviously so upset and frustrated that they figured it would be like pulling teeth to try to get any straight answers out of him. Eric simply happens to be the one that blusters.

*sigh* I'm sorry. I know, I'm supposed to keep my mouth shut on this thread. I'll go now.

He not speaking for her, it was her choose take Erics side and don't listen Ryans explanation. It's just show how much she changed, i think in bad side. She look like she wanna hear what Ryan say, but can't because of Eric, her choose, but she did it because of Eric. Just my opinion.

 

[Ginnna]

He not speaking for her, it was her choose take Erics side and don't listen Ryans explanation. It's just show how much she changed, i think in bad side. She look like she wanna hear what Ryan say, but can't because of Eric, her choose, but she did it because of Eric. Just my opinion.

Like I said, it didn't seem like she was "taking his side" so much as she had already reached the same conclusion and simply was not as vocal about it as he was.

But, like you said, you have your opinion... and I have mine. It looks like we interpreted the scene differently and we're not going to sway each other on this.

No problem. I can accept that. And now that I'm done responding, I'll leave this thread alone... again. Sorry... again.

 

[GregNickRyanFan]

I don't understand why Ryan didn't say instead of extenuating circumstances that "the mafia kidnapped Billy". That would have been just as short an explanation and I'm sure after that, Eric and Cal would have understood better and maybe would have let him further explain. I don't know unless the writers were trying to make it seem like the mafia was suceeding in breaking the team, I didn't really get the way that scene was written. Ryan normally wouldn't have backed down from that. He would have explained to the fullest just like he did in Resurrection.

 

[Florry86]

See, but how many times is there a much needed conversation between the team & we never end up seeing it? TOO MANY! I have the feeling that it won't even be brought up again. I see it being another one of those "to be continued but never actually continues" kinda crap. They'll probably blow it off & just act tense around each other until the big finale, & then whatever happens there will be something they all have to face & somehow we'll just assume that E & C figure out what Ryan had to do & be ok with it. Maybe they'll be next to have to take that kind of action, who knows, but I honestly can't see them actually talking to Ryan about this last incident. I'd be very surprised.

I can't see it either. I do think they'll never talk about it unless this storyline will involve them as well. Of course they didn't give him any chance to explain the situation in the proper way & I don't think they'll ever do it

this left the episode open that maybe they are a little broken now

I'm definitly getting that "broken" vibe from all this, including the e/c romance & how it's effecting the team as a whole. It all seems to be tying in to one another. Maybe that's the reason TPTB keep consistantly showing e/c in all these scenes working together ...perhaps it's purposely to show how it's breaking the team. That's certainly what I see when I'm viewing.

Well when Ryan said to H "they're separating us" or something like that....I do think that he was referring to the whole team b/c hey it's too evident there's no team spirit on this show .
And yeah it would be nice also to know that E/C was part of it as we're saying.

Ops I think I may have just given such a bad idea to TPTB....please TPTB don't read this one...I'm drunk

:lol: **snort** yeah, can you edit that please, 'cause I don't think I could endure that kind of pain again.

I'm so sorry :lol:

I disagree. Calleigh's hurt and not going after Ryan had nothing to do with Eric. Calleigh is still her own person, Eric does not have control over her. She was just torn with her emotions, she's angry and hurt at Ryan at the same time. Throughout the episode, she asked Ryan repeatedly to confide in her she was willing to help him. Calleigh finding out later on about Ryan only hurt her to know he didn't confide in her. Also, this is not the first time Calleigh has shown tough love for Ryan when he messes up, she's done it in the past when she found out about his gambling.

See you're mentioning his gambling problem....the same thing which makes me interprete that scene from a completely opposite POV. When Ryan was gambling she yelled at him, she got mad & pissed off. Look, when he gave her that supernote she was ready to cut his head off & when they talked about his gambling problem in "Switch Kill" she was ready to destroy that studio and put a bomb in there just to kill him off. She got mad, she had a reaction, a proper one for the situation. This time she didn't do anything. Except for trying to get what was wrong with him, she didn't yell at him (well she did it when he took that jacket w/o gloves, but still she didn't confronted him at all when Eric was yelling.
She may need her own private space to do it &, of course, with Eric there she couldn't do it at all, but the thing which left me :wtf: was that she didn't say any word while Eric was yelling like a mad at that poor guy. She could have easily said "let's talk about it later" or "you disappoiinted me".
She wasn't able to express her feeling verbally. This thing shocked me.

I don't understand why Ryan didn't say instead of extenuating circumstances that "the mafia kidnapped Billy". That would have been just as short an explanation and I'm sure after that, Eric and Cal would have understood better and maybe would have let him further explain. I don't know unless the writers were trying to make it seem like the mafia was suceeding in breaking the team, I didn't really get the way that scene was written. Ryan normally wouldn't have backed down from that. He would have explained to the fullest just like he did in Resurrection.

I think that Ryan knew perfectly that the mafia is trying to kill the whole team & to separete them (look they already di it, even w/o the Russians :lol.
It's dangerous & telling them about it would have been like putting them in an even more dangerous position. We all know that he cares about both Calleigh & Delko & he doesn't want them to risk their life. Explaining it to them would have been like involving them in the storyline & we all know that right now it's all about the Russians against H & Ryan. Calleigh's attack was just a coincidence, IMHO.
Plus I do think that he didn't say anything also b/c of H. After all, H managed the situation for him at the end .
Maybe once this russian stuff is finished, Ryan will explain it to them.

Still I don't see how they could rebuild the team spirit

 

[GregNickRyanFan]

I don't understand why Ryan didn't say instead of extenuating circumstances that "the mafia kidnapped Billy". That would have been just as short an explanation and I'm sure after that, Eric and Cal would have understood better and maybe would have let him further explain. I don't know unless the writers were trying to make it seem like the mafia was suceeding in breaking the team, I didn't really get the way that scene was written. Ryan normally wouldn't have backed down from that. He would have explained to the fullest just like he did in Resurrection.

I think that Ryan knew perfectly that the mafia is trying to kill the whole team & to separete them (look they already di it, even w/o the Russians :lol.
It's dangerous & telling them about it would have been like putting them in an even more dangerous position. We all know that he cares about both Calleigh & Delko & he doesn't want them to risk their life. Explaining it to them would have been like involving them in the storyline & we all know that right now it's all about the Russians against H & Ryan. Calleigh's attack was just a coincidence, IMHO.
Plus I do think that he didn't say anything also b/c of H. After all, H managed the situation for him at the end .
Maybe once this russian stuff is finished, Ryan will explain it to them.

Still I don't see how they could rebuild the team spirit

But it was all over then. The guy who kidnapped and tortured Ryan was dead. What was the harm in telling them then? We can pretty much guess that Horatio is going to tell them anyway. I'm not saying Ryan should give them every detail, but at least could mention the Billy thing... that he was forced to do it because Billy's life was in danger. I agree about Calleigh's attack. I don't think it had anything to do with the Russian mafia targeting the team. If it had, the guy wouldn't have left when Calleigh announced that she's a police officer... unless he only left cause he heard Eric. But when they confronted the guy, he didn't sound like he was doing that to Cal at the mafia's request. He just didn't want her to find the evidence to implicate him in the stabbing of the girl. I'm thinking and hoping that Cal will figure out on her own about Billy. Maybe someone random will mention seeing Billy and that'll cause her to put it all together and figure it out. Then maybe she'll explain it to Eric. He surely wouldn't stop her from explaining. :lol:

Spoiler: possible about future eps

Eva said something about the last three eps of the season possibly dealing with the mafia too, so maybe that means that the remaining three team members who haven't yet been attacked will be. Cal, Eric and Nat. They're attacking Horatio by attacking his team, so they don't need a direct attack on him personally. As for Eric, Cal and Nat... they've yet to be attacked. Maybe Frank will be attacked along with one of them. I don't know. Tara shouldn't be an issue. Its sounding like she might end up getting fired for the pill thing, unless there's extenuating circumstances there too, but I hope not. I hope her pill stealing has nothing to do with the Mafia or with Saris. I hope she's doing it on her own otherwise it would be a cop-out as far as I'm concerned.

 

[mjszud]

:lol: I feel like shouting in a Pheobe Bufay voice "stop the madness!!"
It's so sad that TPTB have not only divided this team, but the fanbase as well.

At this point, everyone has stated thier opinion over who's right, who's wrong, if Calleigh was OOC about it or not, & etc. This issue can't be debated. That doesn't mean I don't mind the discussion, but it feels like it's going no where. I can understand all sides of the characters' POV's, I really can. Regardless of which character was right & vice versa, it's still showing how split the team is, & that's, overall, what I don't care for.

That episode felt like Eric & Calleigh on one side, & Horatio/Ryan on the other - (where the hell Natalia was, I do not know) & the fact that E & C are now in this relationship doesn't help the situation in how it looks & the vibe that comes from it. They've been "paired off" for far too long now, & it's put a huge damper on the team spirit. Personally I have felt that for a while now (2 years & counting), & so have others, but this last episode made it 10x worse - I'm putting it up there with the suckish 'SGIYC' as far as shitty teamspirit goes.

What I think would've really worked better in this situation was having Eric & Calleigh have different opinions, or at least having different ways of handling it. Maybe throw in some odds their way. If E & C could've had some little tiff themselves over what was going on with Ryan then it still would've given off the team falling apart vibe, but AT LEAST it wouldn't have looked like the team was being divided -- divided with E/C in lala-fanfic-bullsh*t-land & everyone else seemingly on thier own to look after thier own asses. That is not a team & it certainly isn't what I expect from this type of show.

 

[Florry86]

But it was all over then. The guy who kidnapped and tortured Ryan was dead. What was the harm in telling them then? We can pretty much guess that Horatio is going to tell them anyway. I'm not saying Ryan should give them every detail, but at least could mention the Billy thing... that he was forced to do it because Billy's life was in danger.

Actually hadn't seen Billy yet so he wasn's sure 100% that Billy was ok & that this story was over also for him.
IDK if I were him, I would have done exactly the same thing w/ both Eric & Calleigh...well I would have killed Eric but that's another story :lol:

I agree about Calleigh's attack. I don't think it had anything to do with the Russian mafia targeting the team. If it had, the guy wouldn't have left when Calleigh announced that she's a police officer... unless he only left cause he heard Eric.

Still he should have tried anything. He should have finished his work on Cal & should have attacked Eric as well, IMHO.

:lol: I feel like shouting in a Pheobe Bufay voice "stop the madness!!"

:guffaw: OMG I think I'm going to join you!

It's so sad that TPTB have not only divided this team, but the fanbase as well.

Well I think that most of the shows are in the same situation concerning the fanbase, but I feel so sad too for this show

At this point, everyone has stated thier opinion over who's right, who's wrong, if Calleigh was OOC about it or not, & etc. This issue can't be debated. That doesn't mean I don't mind the discussion, but it feels like it's going no where. I can understand all sides of the characters' POV's, I really can. Regardless of which character was right & vice versa, it's still showing how split the team is, & that's, overall, what I don't care for.

You're totally right my dear. Sometimes I do find it useless to go on w/ certain arguments regarding the character.
What Calleigh did (or didn't do) in this episode is way too subjective & it's impossible to be right or wrong, so I agree...no more talking about this stuff.
Though, I thought this thread was created to talk about the reason why you don't like this couple &, quite honestly, I don't get why we're always having arguments to defend our opinions.
Sorry, but I really don't understand this fact

That episode felt like Eric & Calleigh on one side, & Horatio/Ryan on the other - (where the hell Natalia was, I do not know) & the fact that E & C are now in this relationship doesn't help the situation in how it looks & the vibe that comes from it. They've been "paired off" for far too long now, & it's put a huge damper on the team spirit. Personally I have felt that for a while now (2 years & counting), & so have others, but this last episode made it 10x worse - I'm putting it up there with the suckish 'SGIYC' as far as shitty teamspirit goes.

You couldn't have said it better!!!

What I think would've really worked better in this situation was having Eric & Calleigh have different opinions, or at least having different ways of handling it. Maybe throw in some odds their way. If E & C could've had some little tiff themselves over what was going on with Ryan then it still would've given off the team falling apart vibe, but AT LEAST it wouldn't have looked like the team was being divided -- divided with E/C in lala-fanfic-bullsh*t-land & everyone else seemingly on thier own to look after thier own asses. That is not a team & it certainly isn't what I expect from this type of show.

You know this would have been such a nice touch b/c you could know this team was falling apart, but still it was a TEAM! Right now I don't see any team & surely the fact Calleigh didn't tell anything in that scene or didn't argue w/ Delko helped us to interpret it as a key evidence that there won't be any team......I do think we won't see it till the finale episode of the whole show.
Look they were able to have E/C (even if she wasn't suspecting Ryan) against Ryan even when H "died" so it wouldn't suprise me at all not seeing this team anymore.

 

[GregNickRyanFan]

If I had been Ryan, I would have given Calleigh some subtle hint to what was going on. Like taking out a photo of Billy and handing it to her and then walking out of the room.

I agree with you, MJ about how the scene could have gone differently. I think it would have been interesting to show Calleigh and Eric having different opinions and Calleigh saying to Eric "Eric, I know what he did stalled our investigation, but I think he had a really good reason, I just can't figure out what it was yet."