Episode #617 - "To Kill A Predator" ***CONTAINS SPOILERS***
- Thread starter Finch
- Start date
Callacrap
Rookie
I know Horatio doesn't exactly do things 'by the book', but I think he might have overstepped the mark a little bit with that ending. I know the guy was a pedophile and probably deserved it, but I still think that no matter what the suspects have done, that shouldn't be the action of the cops, especially with someone like Horatio! It would be the same as him killing every single murderer in Miami (although he has killed a few!)
Although, it did show him as a human being, rather than SuperH, which is nice to see from time to time! It seems to be the MD CSI way, pedo haters! First Alexx, then Delko and now H has joined in the act
I loved the scene with Kevin in the park when H spotted him through the binoculars! He was talking really slow and then it was like he got all excited and jumped when the guy started running! 'He... is... getting away!!!' Made me giggle
Also nice to see him doing some lab work! Him and Wolfe seemed to have swapped roles, Ryan didn't do very much in the lab this ep!
I also liked the reserved Calleigh, showing her dip in confidence after the kidnapping!
Although, it did show him as a human being, rather than SuperH, which is nice to see from time to time! It seems to be the MD CSI way, pedo haters! First Alexx, then Delko and now H has joined in the act
I loved the scene with Kevin in the park when H spotted him through the binoculars! He was talking really slow and then it was like he got all excited and jumped when the guy started running! 'He... is... getting away!!!' Made me giggle
Also nice to see him doing some lab work! Him and Wolfe seemed to have swapped roles, Ryan didn't do very much in the lab this ep!
I also liked the reserved Calleigh, showing her dip in confidence after the kidnapping!
Della
Police Officer
In all honesty, I think some people in this thread are mistaking speculation for fact. In my opinion, it is not at all definite as to why Horatio supposedly beat up the Paedophile and it isn't at all certain why he executed the gang member either. I honestly have no idea whatsoever as to why Horatio has all of a sudden gone rogue/vigilante and ignored/disregarded all that he seemingly believed in.
At least when he and Delko went after Riaz you knew without a shadow of doubt what Horatio's motivation was. The same just cannot be said for now.
...and yet, to be honest, even if I was to be shown in the next couple of epsiodes a reason why Horatio executed that gang member and supposedly beat this Paedophile to a pulp, it still won't justify his actions to me, it will only give me an explanation as to why he did it. So, as far as I'm concerned, they killed off the Horatio character the moment they had him executing the gang member.
At least when he and Delko went after Riaz you knew without a shadow of doubt what Horatio's motivation was. The same just cannot be said for now.
...and yet, to be honest, even if I was to be shown in the next couple of epsiodes a reason why Horatio executed that gang member and supposedly beat this Paedophile to a pulp, it still won't justify his actions to me, it will only give me an explanation as to why he did it. So, as far as I'm concerned, they killed off the Horatio character the moment they had him executing the gang member.
Wyoming
Head of the Graveyard Shift
I didn't get to see the episode last night, got home from work and completely forgot to watch it. *sigh*
But by the sounds of it, it would just aggrivate me if I did watch it now, because honestly, I am sick and tired of all of these plotlines centered around Horatio. Yes, he is the main character, but no, he is not the only main character! I agree with a lot of you, brazil was a joke, and I honestly think that it was a shitty way for the writers to close up that storyline, but I guess what's happened happened and I can't change it now.
I'm sure at some point I will watch this episode, but right now I'm not all that convinced that I'll like it.
But by the sounds of it, it would just aggrivate me if I did watch it now, because honestly, I am sick and tired of all of these plotlines centered around Horatio. Yes, he is the main character, but no, he is not the only main character! I agree with a lot of you, brazil was a joke, and I honestly think that it was a shitty way for the writers to close up that storyline, but I guess what's happened happened and I can't change it now.
I'm sure at some point I will watch this episode, but right now I'm not all that convinced that I'll like it.
Della
Police Officer
..Yes I am entitled to my opinion, thank you dogbert14...
Whether the gang member or the Paedophile deserved what they got or not, is neither her nor there, dogbert14, it is what Horatio did that is in question. As said before, just because the gang member and the Paedophile are criminals that does not justify Horatio committing a criminal act himself. He's a Law Enforcement Officer. He above anyone else should be operating within the Law, and executing someone and supposedly beating another to a pulp is not operating within the law.
CSIMandy
Lab Technician
This episode was disappointing for me. I was hoping to see Calleigh still a bit shaken up from what happened before or at least show a scene with her and Eric talking about it. Calleigh is back to work acting like nothing ever happened. The episode started getting interesting halfway through and I really did like the ending, too bad it was the ending! Just when I started liking the episode, bam - it was done!
xfcanadian
Pathologist
the 'science' bored me...sigh. There is no proof that H beat up the guy at the end, so i am not going to worry about it...
It was pretty obvious the daughter killed him...but the nail jewel wasn't exactly concrete evidence. At least Ryan got lots of screen time, i love him.
I do wish the writers would RESEARCH better, the publics misconception of what pedophilia is, is bad enough, but this episode didn't help. There is a HUGE difference between sexual predators and pedophiles. Pedophiles don't go after teenage girls, they are too old. A true pedophile is attracted to PRE-pubescent children. As soon as pubic hair or any other signs of puberty hits...then they completely lose interest. This is much much worse than older men being attracted to a 15 year old girl. A sexual predator is usually men who take advantage over women for sex, by using power and manipulation. That is one of the reasons they choose younger females...because they have the bodies of adults, but are innocent and easier to manipulate. But they are NOT pedophiles. It isn't unusual for men to be attracted to young females, it might not be appropriate, but not pedophilia.
Also, why do they have to show females to be so stupid? I used chat rooms at that age..i knew there could be some older men trying to sleep with me. Not stupid, i knew not to give out personal info. Jeeze...not all girls are dumb as bricks.
The case was ok...seemed like a filler eppy. I wonder if this was filmed before the two parter...
It was pretty obvious the daughter killed him...but the nail jewel wasn't exactly concrete evidence. At least Ryan got lots of screen time, i love him.
I do wish the writers would RESEARCH better, the publics misconception of what pedophilia is, is bad enough, but this episode didn't help. There is a HUGE difference between sexual predators and pedophiles. Pedophiles don't go after teenage girls, they are too old. A true pedophile is attracted to PRE-pubescent children. As soon as pubic hair or any other signs of puberty hits...then they completely lose interest. This is much much worse than older men being attracted to a 15 year old girl. A sexual predator is usually men who take advantage over women for sex, by using power and manipulation. That is one of the reasons they choose younger females...because they have the bodies of adults, but are innocent and easier to manipulate. But they are NOT pedophiles. It isn't unusual for men to be attracted to young females, it might not be appropriate, but not pedophilia.
Also, why do they have to show females to be so stupid? I used chat rooms at that age..i knew there could be some older men trying to sleep with me. Not stupid, i knew not to give out personal info. Jeeze...not all girls are dumb as bricks.
The case was ok...seemed like a filler eppy. I wonder if this was filmed before the two parter...
Zelda49
Rookie
Thank you!!! I'm glad I wasn't the only one annoyed by that. It's a pattern with this show and, because I'm kind of used to it on the job, I don't sweat it too much, but this ep laid it on even thicker than usual. I even actually yelled at the TV last night (which no longer scares my dog, but freaks out my new neighbors :guffaw
. I think they should just hire me as a writer...
Zelda49 said:
Yes ma'am. There are some really awesome writers (you included) in Fan Fiction who could do a much better job than even the most seasoned Miami writer these days.
Actually, anyone here could probably do a better job. *sigh* That makes me a bit nervous to think the fans actually have a better handle on the show than the writers.Yes, they often assume women/girls are stupid little automatons with boobs and short skirts. It's a wonder they even have Calleigh, Natalia and Alexx because those are some strong, independant women right there who don't take shit from anyone. Why are these victims constantly little fizz-heads? Ick. Yeah, I was on the internet when I was 13 and I participated in chat-room conversations--albeit the conversations weren't that engaging--and I never got sucked into "oooh baby let's meet sumwere n' have a cpl o' beers. I promize I wunt feel u up r nuthin....unles u lyke, wan it r sumthin."
That said, the episode was still entertaining for me. I always said Chris Hansen reminded me of Horatio. :lol:
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OK, I like that the distinction is made of predators vs pedophiles in this heated debate. I think the internet thing isn't overused this season but appropriate since we are in a technology age and crime is with the internet so that's a good s/l. Now about continuity for this season I think this episode was a fine example of showing that. I really love Horatio's face when the 16yr old girl admits to 'killing daddy' since he was a bad guy. Isn't it alluded in past seasons that H killed the guy who killed his mom-the killer was his dad and he has guilt over that and went to confession for that sin even dozens of years later??? So showing H's face as in one day he's confronted with this girl killing her dad AND the victim's father asking him "are you a parent?" seems like H's world is being rocked from foundation and up on this one. I for one LOVE to see H being HUMAN and not so shut down emotionally like he was after losing Marisol & Ray Sr. PLEASE Oh PLEASE someone post youtube or whatever the last few minutes showing H and the predator again so we can look at it!!!
Zelda49
Rookie
Zelda49 said:
Yes ma'am. There are some really awesome writers (you included) in Fan Fiction who could do a much better job than even the most seasoned Miami writer these days.
It is a little sad, isn't it? (And thanks!) That would be like my students knowing Geometry better than me when I'm trying to teach it to them
Every time I watch an ep from season 3 on, I sort of do this thing where I turn off the logical part of my brain (I do it with Bones, too) and just sort of try to go where the writers were aiming. Generally it works...and it hurts my head a lot less than trying to understand why they did what they did :thumbsup:But, even still, I liked it well enough, too. I love H in a lab coat again (although I had this weird sense of Deja vu the whole time he was working on that briefcase) and liked that I didn't predict everything correctly (freak at the door at the end--didn't see that coming). There was the eye candy as well, which is still a lot of fun no matter what the writers do :drool:
The thing is though, is that some people out there do get sucked into stuff like that. I highly doubt CSI: Miami are showing women as stupid idiots etc etc. The women are just as stupid and gullible as the men are in the show. I personally don't think it's really necessary to point out flaws from TV compared to reality (I know, I also did it too). It's a TV show.
Did you know that there was an episode where a cellular phone was used and because it sent out a spark while I think the guy was near gasoline, caused him to go up in flames? well, that is not true and it's actually a fact that cellular phones wont cause a fire even if you have gasoline vapors everywhere. just a TV show, maybe we should try and stick to the reality of TV I mean if we go by our real life rather then TV...Delko and Wolf should have been long gone, same with Horatio.
A lot of people are picking on this Horatio character for what he did and how bad it is while Eric should have been completely gone as in fired for buying all that weed for his sister. regardless if she had cancer he had a lot of frickin weed. LOL
Wolf should have been fired which he was but then he came back, I mean his friend was getting "burned" or how should I say it..I dunno but remember where Wolf owed that guy money but at the same time that guy was a criminal and wolf got busted on camera handing the guy an envelope. no way in real life would he have been able to come back from something like that.
I am trying to think of more but I can't at the moment. So really Horatio shouldn't be getting bombarded like this but to each their own. Also though there are lots of policemen out there that do this stuff to pedophiles or predators or whatever else you want to call them. I highly doubt they lost there jobs because of slapping around a sexual predator or a pedophile. unless he got beatin to death almost. I shouldn't say a lot of cops but it's safe to say a good dozen out there probably do it and more maybe.
the only problem now (thanks guys for bringing up all the problems, now it started making me think of them) is the fact that no one else was with Horatio when he showed up for the house. usually there are policemen outside or something. Since it's a TV show I am going to say good for Horatio and I hope he beats the crap out of the guy.
Did you know that there was an episode where a cellular phone was used and because it sent out a spark while I think the guy was near gasoline, caused him to go up in flames? well, that is not true and it's actually a fact that cellular phones wont cause a fire even if you have gasoline vapors everywhere. just a TV show, maybe we should try and stick to the reality of TV
I mean if we go by our real life rather then TV...Delko and Wolf should have been long gone, same with Horatio.A lot of people are picking on this Horatio character for what he did and how bad it is while Eric should have been completely gone as in fired for buying all that weed for his sister. regardless if she had cancer he had a lot of frickin weed. LOL
Wolf should have been fired which he was but then he came back, I mean his friend was getting "burned" or how should I say it..I dunno but remember where Wolf owed that guy money but at the same time that guy was a criminal and wolf got busted on camera handing the guy an envelope. no way in real life would he have been able to come back from something like that.
I am trying to think of more but I can't at the moment. So really Horatio shouldn't be getting bombarded like this but to each their own. Also though there are lots of policemen out there that do this stuff to pedophiles or predators or whatever else you want to call them. I highly doubt they lost there jobs because of slapping around a sexual predator or a pedophile. unless he got beatin to death almost. I shouldn't say a lot of cops but it's safe to say a good dozen out there probably do it and more maybe.
the only problem now (thanks guys for bringing up all the problems, now it started making me think of them) is the fact that no one else was with Horatio when he showed up for the house. usually there are policemen outside or something. Since it's a TV show I am going to say good for Horatio and I hope he beats the crap out of the guy.
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I'm not disputing that the show should be more like reality--as I've said, they bring in elements from reality but deep down it's still meant as an hour of television entertainment. Some would just like to see a bigger dose of reality, like research...lol.
In all fairness, it wasn't out of vengeance or personal gain and Eric wasn't physically hurting anyone. :lol: But yes, I see your point--it was illegal for him to buy the weed. If he can, why can't any average-Joe criminal?
I just think the main point some are trying to make is that H was violent, whereas Eric was not. Some might say tomaato, tomato but I think it's more like apples and oranges. (Yep, I've officially gone insane. I'm using vegetables and fruits to make my points. :lol
I don't think we're bombarding him. This is a huge detail in the character and it made an impact on a lot of fans. Some are more passionate than others. :lol: If Eric/Calleigh/Alexx/Wolfe/Natalia had done the same thing, we might be having this same discussion. *shrugs* TV show or not, this isn't set in la la land, it's set on planet Earth. It's never going to fully be reality and there will probably never be aliens on the show. (God, I hope not. I don't want this turning into Miami Vice)
Yeah, I agree, there are police who do that sort of thing so I can see why the writers injected that into Horatio. You make a really good point there, Bigdog. I just preferred him more when he was grounded. Heck, a huuuge part of me hopes he sends the guy into next Monday but at the same level, I think it wasn't the right thing to do legally.
Yeah, to each his/her own. I'm probably just beating the dead horse now. :lol: Ah, I love reading opposing ideas.
Yeah! I definitely didn't see that last part coming--with the guy who was tracking the bad guys, turning out to BE one. That threw me for a loop. And Horatio working in the lab was a nice bit of fresh air again too. I sincerely hope they keep him in the lab, it's been three in a row now!
Some would just like to see a bigger dose of reality, like research...lol.Bigdog said:
In all fairness, it wasn't out of vengeance or personal gain and Eric wasn't physically hurting anyone. :lol: But yes, I see your point--it was illegal for him to buy the weed. If he can, why can't any average-Joe criminal?
I just think the main point some are trying to make is that H was violent, whereas Eric was not. Some might say tomaato, tomato but I think it's more like apples and oranges. (Yep, I've officially gone insane. I'm using vegetables and fruits to make my points. :lol
I don't think we're bombarding him. This is a huge detail in the character and it made an impact on a lot of fans. Some are more passionate than others. :lol: If Eric/Calleigh/Alexx/Wolfe/Natalia had done the same thing, we might be having this same discussion. *shrugs* TV show or not, this isn't set in la la land, it's set on planet Earth. It's never going to fully be reality and there will probably never be aliens on the show. (God, I hope not. I don't want this turning into Miami Vice)
Yeah, I agree, there are police who do that sort of thing so I can see why the writers injected that into Horatio. You make a really good point there, Bigdog. I just preferred him more when he was grounded. Heck, a huuuge part of me hopes he sends the guy into next Monday but at the same level, I think it wasn't the right thing to do legally.
Yeah, to each his/her own. I'm probably just beating the dead horse now. :lol: Ah, I love reading opposing ideas.
Zelda49 said:
Yeah! I definitely didn't see that last part coming--with the guy who was tracking the bad guys, turning out to BE one. That threw me for a loop. And Horatio working in the lab was a nice bit of fresh air again too.
I sincerely hope they keep him in the lab, it's been three in a row now!
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aye same with me, I also liked it when he was more grounded. But being like that since how long? 2002. That's 6 years of CSI with not really much changing with Horatio. I think the producers or whatever thought that it's time for something to make a big impact. This definitely made a HUGE impact from all the CSI fans.
I wonder if they will do another CSI: Miami / NY.
I wonder if they will do another CSI: Miami / NY.
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