08 Presidential Elections

[Desertwind]

Have you all seen the sleazy video of Obama, featuring Paris Hilton and Britney Spears. beacuse "he's so popular" like them, who are they popular with? bad taste and embarassing, the McCain campaign are digging a big hole for theirselves with crap like this!

 

[rahkira]

McCain keeps saying he's not like Bush, but on every issue, he seems to want to keep us on the same road which is leading us to elimination of the middle class, the same dependence on oil instead of alternative fuels (the Bushes are an oil family, by the way, with very close ties to the Saudis), continuing a war we never should have started in the first place (yes, we started; Al Qaeda had little influence in Iraq in 2003 and remember that 15 of the 19 suicide bombers on those planes were from Saudi Arabia).
Obama is going to be the Democratic party candidate. But I start to sweat every time I hear talk of potential conservative Democrat running mates; there are so many loonies out there with guns in this country that I'm afraid someone will assassinate Obama just to get a more conservative leader. I don't think Obama and Hillary work together well right now, but that could change (that's what America is, constantly changing) and if she were his VP running mate, well, most of those loonies would probably prefer Obama to either H. Clinton or the next in line, Speaker of the House of Representatives, Nancy Pelosi of San Francisco.
Isn't it terrible that we should even have these fears? You Canadians and British out there never seem to have this problem.

 

[Adzix]

Have you all seen the sleazy video of Obama, featuring Paris Hilton and Britney Spears. beacuse "he's so popular" like them, who are they popular with? bad taste and embarassing, the McCain campaign are digging a big hole for theirselves with crap like this!

oh man i saw it! and i have to admit i loved it, lol. it's not b/c i think Obama is just like Paris Hilton or Britney but to me it was almost arrogant to go to Berlin and give a speech to 200,000 Germans as an American leader. he put himself in JFK's, Reagan's and Clinton's shoes not even being the President of anything yet. thank GOD Erica Steinbach said no to Obama giving the speech in front of the Brandenburg Gate. that would be not right on so many levels.

what i don't like in Obama is first of all that he is a Democrat. i do not agree with their economic views. being even a tad socialistic is sadly populistic these days. we all know helping the poor too much, raising taxes on the rich, setting minimum wages does not work, and every economist, hell a freshmen econ student, will tell you that. the only reason D-party is still for it is to be different from Republicans in some way, and b/c most voters don't understand the basic principles of economy. in the short run all those policies seem to be great. in reality they only worsen the situation.

second thing i don't like Obama for is that he is too young, too unexperienced. comparing him to McCain in those matters is almost grotesque.

one thing BO does right, is he knows how to present himself. he knows how to look good in a well crafted suit, knows how to speak to the crowds, how to look young, vigorous, sharp. and all this, is what the masses want.

but does he have any idea how to rule, except giving speeches and promising heaven on Earth for Iraq? to me, not really. i like McCain for the fact that he is so well-rounded and that he proved himself in many situations. this guy knows what he is talking about. Obama is too young to have done any of it. i'm not saying he never will, but give the guy at least 10-15 years to grow up a bit.

Anyhoo, in regards to a VP for Obama, he doesn't really have a choice; he has to pick Hillary.

i think it would be almost suicidal if he did. her program is much different in quite a few important matters, and besides, she is too strong, too independent to become a VP. she has higher aspirations, imo.

 

[Desertwind]

FIRST of all a big Happy Birthday today he's Obama 47, and young is great, he's so fresh, and has so many stellar ideas, he stays steadfast and doesn't let anything get to him even the odd video, and that's a good thing as a great leader! and I was a delegate in Nevada, for John Edwards, but when he dropped out, I switched to Barack, 'YES WE CAN" he will be our next president, without a doubt, his ideas are fresh and new and he'll change America for the better. I like his ideas on everything! And on McCain, beside being out of touch with reality and way to old 72 vs 47 & it's a continuation of the Bush administration, and we all know how well that worked out:klingon:and he'll never pick Hillary. I go to Obama meetings and no one that's there wants him to pick her as his VP. She's disagreed with him on everything in the debates, and although she is campaigning for him now, if he was going to choose her he would have done it by now!

 

[xfcanadian]

what i don't like in Obama is first of all that he is a Democrat. i do not agree with their economic views. being even a tad socialistic is sadly populistic these days. we all know helping the poor too much, raising taxes on the rich, setting minimum wages does not work, and every economist, hell a freshmen econ student, will tell you that.

er...Europe called, and they say you are wrong. The top three places in the world to live right now are Sweden, Norway and Canada. In fact sweden has very high taxes, but has the best living standards in the world for their citizens.

Bwahaha McCain. His campaign is horrid. What a joke...he keeps insisting on winning the war on terror. Yeah, ok, you can really fight a war against an ideal and win. Right, never mind that actually causes more terrorism. Although that is probably what he wants, since the US government loves to start wars. Good for arms dealing and keeps the citizens afraid. Fearful people are more easily controlled and they can get away with their systematic torture and police state. I saw an article about he hasn't figured out email and the internet yet :lol:

Edwards can't be Obama's VP anymore...he is wrapped up in a big sex scandle. Well that isn't a surprise in American politics, but i don't think Obama will take that chance.

Gotta love American politics, a president was almost impeached for lying about a sex affair, yet Bush can torture people, ignore the people of New Orleans, start an illegal war, lie about the CIA leak, illegally wire tape US citizens, and be an embarressment to your country...and he gets away with it.

The US NEEDS Obama, badly. Your government is the laughing stock of the world right now. Literally...

 

[rahkira]

Before anyone starts jumping on you, xfcanadian, I have to say, sadly, I think you're telling it like it is. We in the U.S. seem to be proud of our unwillingness to learn other languages and to learn about other cultures. I've lived on three continents and never understood my fellow Americans thinking we're better than others. First of all, the only true "U.S. citizens forever" are our sadly mistreated idigenous people (Well-named "First Nation" as their Canadian counterparts are known, right?). The rest of us came from somewhere else, so I don't get the attitude. Before anyone jumps on me, know that I earned the right to make these observations because I spent 20 years defending my country. And as I said in my previous post (#137), McCain seems to be just another Bush, so I'm willing to take my chances on Obama (but I do wish that, if it's true, he'd return the $400,000 he allegedly received in campaign contributions from oil industry folks; goes to credibility).

 

[Desertwind]

It's interesting that other countries know so much about American politics, I have no idea what's going on in say Canada, nor any other country unless I choose to read about it, I guess we're shoved down most of the population of those other countries , I just know what I know, from campaigning for a new fresh man somewhat like the JFK and Bobby Kennedy of their day, our country is excited again, after that quack/idiot that's been in office ruining everything and has dragged our country down the toilet, and sexual shenanigans go on all over the world not just in America I could rant and rave so much more, lets just say Obama is the man:bolian:

 

[Showtime]

First of all, xfcanadian? Rofl. Completely agreed on everything in there (the first sentence in particular)

It's interesting that other countries know so much about American politics, I have no idea what's going on in say Canada, nor any other country unless I choose to read about it, I guess we're shoved down most of the population of those other countries [...]

This isn't entirely true - most of what I know about the US election is because I choose to read about it, and I think that's true for most Canadians. I'd know the main candidates names because of how broadcasted the election is: it comes up in American shows, during commercials, on Canadian news and in the papers.

I think its mainly because the US government has such a habit of f*cking things up, even if they're doing good. Bush doesn't even need an explanation, Clinton had his whole Lewinsky fiasco, Bush Sr. had tradings with Hussein and started the War in Iraq, Reagan, Nixon, etc, and most of the f*ck ups are on a pretty large scale.

Canadian politics rarely go hitch-free, but I can't think of a single instance where we started a war. The only population affected by our mistakes is our own.

 

[Adzix]

The top three places in the world to live right now are Sweden, Norway and Canada.

According to/based on what? i would never want to live in a country where you have to give away half of your income to the government like it is in Sweden, thankyouverymuch. they are very attractive for investors *snort* but i think you forgot Switzerland. what about Luxemburg, Ireland? what about Hong Kong??

i don't have time and strength to explain all the economic principles that prove socialism wrong. i will never understand people who still think that system is great. it's just ... *facepalm*

and you're trolling again.

 

[Ducky]

The top three places in the world to live right now are Sweden, Norway and Canada.

According to/based on what? i would never want to live in a country where you have to give away half of your income to the government like it is in Sweden, thankyouverymuch. they are very attractive for investors *snort* but i think you forgot Switzerland. what about Luxemburg, Ireland? what about Hong Kong??

Finland! Ok, I assume these "the best place to live" have something to do with enviroment and ...crimes and stuff perhaps? I know Reader's Digest has chosen FInland as the best place in last Oct.

Anyways, about high taxes (since we are quite similar to Sweden) - have you ever thought what all we have here with our high tax? Free health care, free and equal education (no private schools). If you get a child, you can be at home until kid turns 3 etc (http://www.kela.fi tells all of it)
And if I remember right, in Sweden they've decided that everyone has to have computer and internet.

Ok, fine..with taxes we don't get as high as Sweden but they are strange country anyways. And I think it is not bad place to live despite the high tax rate.

to US politics. I think the reason why others know so much is because it's in the news everywhere. I mean it's one of the leading countries in the world and who leads the country, has big affect to the rest of the world.

Of course I am personally always annoyed the fact that US news and stuff tells pretty much about only themselves.

 

[Adzix]

^ you describe it quite nicely. it seems there might actually be a lot of benefits from high taxes. but a country has to be absolutely free from corruption and the society cannot be biased towards any form of government that makes you do something. i still think that i'd rather earn more and choose what computer i want or where to go to the hospital, and not let other people choose for me.

i understand how it could be quite comfortable, but this kind of system has to have a healthy base. without it money will get 'lost' somewhere on the way or to bureaucracy. free hospitals create long lines, corrupted doctors etc. public institutions are never making money, but loosing it which prevents from better/higher quality service. that's at least how everything looks in my country, and we have high taxes too.

the more money people have to spend, the quicker the economy grows. the more people are motivated by working for their private benefit (and not public which is always going to get help from the government no matter what) the higher the effectiveness and efficiency.

it's all based on the assumption that most societies are individualistic. we all know that in all countries, maybe except some Asian ones, collectivism doesn't work. communism proved it way too many times.

 

[_Hush_]

but a country has to be absolutely free from corruption and the society cannot be biased towards any form of government that makes you do something.

Must be nice, Utopia. The fact is, as soon as you put people in charge, there's gonna be corruption, no matter what system. And nobody makes you do anything. You sick? Fine. Go to a doctor. You wanna choose which one? Fine. Pay up. You don't have the money? You'll still be taken care of. Where's the mistake in that?

i still think that i'd rather earn more and choose what computer i want or where to go to the hospital, and not let other people choose for me.

Must be fun if you got the cash for it. Some people just don't. Are they being left behind? No. Do they really care if it's a brand? Doubt it.

the more money people have to spend, the quicker the economy grows. the more people are motivated by working for their private benefit (and not public which is always going to get help from the government no matter what) the higher the effectiveness and efficiency.

How's that bad?

it's all based on the assumption that most societies are individualistic. we all know that in all countries, maybe except some Asian ones, collectivism doesn't work. communism proved it way too many times.

Every society is individualistic, even collectivist ones. (Maybe not the idea, but as soon as you put it into practice, it will be be. Why? Because it's run by humans.) Maybe democracy isn't the best system in the world, but it's the best we've got so far.

 

[Adzix]

You don't have the money? You'll still be taken care of. Where's the mistake in that?

anywhere you go when you compare any kind of private vs public business, which one looks better, has more money, better staff? it's hardly ever the public.

but when it comes to medical care it's different. USA has a private system and it's a bit of a disaster lately. my country has exactly the system you described and it's a disaster as well.

Must be fun if you got the cash for it. Some people just don't. Are they being left behind? No. Do they really care if it's a brand? Doubt it.

the basic idea is to pass liberal economic laws which are not going to be popular with the public and in short run might financially harm some people, but the long run results will benefit the whole country.

what i think would be great is to lower taxes for small businesses and allow people to create firms with minimum bureaucracy involved and time needed. entrepreneurs should have an easy start, and laws should be the simplest possible. just like in Hong Kong. if something doesn't work, the market will take care of it.

How's that bad?

come again? more money for people=lower taxes.

 

[Desertwind]

I guess for me on other countries and their leaders and elections, I wouldn't began to analyze nor criticize, or critique the leaders and what's going on, because it's not my country and I really have no idea what goes on, on a daily basis, and it would be dis-respectable for me to judge them, or try to understand what or where they're coming from, or why! NO government is perfect and or the politicians, I guess we try the best with who and what, and try to choose the correct candidate that is running!

 

[MaddyAnn]

I guess for me on other countries and their leaders and elections, I wouldn't began to analyze nor criticize, or critique the leaders and what's going on, because it's not my country and I really have no idea what goes on, on a daily basis, and it would be dis-respectable for me to judge them, or try to understand what or where they're coming from, or why! NO government is perfect and or the politicians, I guess we try the best with who and what, and try to choose the correct candidate that is running!

I thank you for that. It was a very smart thing to say. I agree with you completely. I was recently critisized by someone because I only understand my own country's election system (that would be the US, by the way) and not other countries. While I admit there's nothing wrong with having a basic understanding of other countries goverments, I don't think that it should be expected of me. I barely understand the United State's system! And it's true that even if I did know about other goverments, it's not as if it has much relevance to me.

One thing I have been angry about lately is the media's blatent pushing of Obama. I won't pretend I'm not bias, because I'm definetly in support of McCain. But I don't think it's right that shows like SNL and even my beloved House are pushing the Obama ticket. Did anyone catch the little Obama sticker in the background of a shot in House? It was completely uncalled for! Now, I would be just as upset if it were McCain, but the simple truth is that no one (besides maybe Fox News) is pushing him.

I have my issues with both candidates, and McCain was nowhere near my first choice for president. That being said I think that Obama is possibly the worst thing that could happen to our nation. I'm too tired to get into it now, but I think that Obama could end up making Nixon look like a saint.
So yes, my vote will go to McCain.