Why Lindsay Must Go

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I liked Peyton and Angell right away too and in an entire season, I still didn't like Lindsay. Why is that??

Lindsay was more likable to me in People With Money. The interaction with Flack was cute and with Mac and Stella. Maybe because she spent more time in the lab and she didn't interact with Danny at all. I didn't like the fact that she wanted to go with her instincts instead of the science part of it. Isn't that another change of her character??

It's gonna take more than a couple episodes to determine how I feel about her.
 
yea, there is still something about lindsay that i don't like either...can't really put my finger on it though. oh, and the last episode...the last scene....ugh!! NO!! danny, WTF are you doing?! :mad:
 
I know exactly what I don't like about Lindsay: she's fake.

I know people like her, and I can't stand them. I can't trust them in anything they do because I don't know they're motives behind doing it: do they want me to do something for them? Are they sucking up? They're behaviour is jumpy and unpredictable, and that can be a good thing, but it's downright annoying.
 
Whew, for a minute there Showtime I thought you were saying something totally different. I see now that you mean you know people who act like her and you can't stand them.
 
I really think that, as others have said before, Lindsay needs to be developed more independent of Danny. I was full-on fed up with the way nearly all of the episodes in season 2 had those little "scenes" with D/L hints, regardless of whether or not they were working the same case. I've watched enough CSI to know that the only time there's usually interaction between the team on the A case and the team on the B case is when the cases end up having connections. So by the end, I was completely sick of seeing them in the same room.

I don't know who Lindsay is without Danny. My biggest hope for season 3 ( other than finally getting some more background info on Hawkes and Flack ), is that Lindsay's character will be unified into a solid personality, so we as viewers know where she's coming from instead of just guessing from how she reacts to things, like the way she flipped in All Access when Stella ended up shooting Frankie. I don't want to keep speculating about a fully credited cast member. It will be easier for everyone -- probably Anna especially -- if we were dealing with ONE Lindsay and not a new Lindsay in every episode.

That said, so far I haven't been too bothered by her in season 3, and I hope that this means it's the beginning of change!
 
^The problem with Danny is that he tends to overshadow anyone he's with, just because he's so dramatic and emotional. I think Stella is the only character who doesn't get lost in the emotional whirlwind that is Danny. And Lindsay definitely does--she's either mooning after him half of the time or clearly trying to hide that she likes him the other half. That's not much for character development.

Showtime said:
I know exactly what I don't like about Lindsay: she's fake.

I know people like her, and I can't stand them. I can't trust them in anything they do because I don't know they're motives behind doing it: do they want me to do something for them? Are they sucking up? They're behaviour is jumpy and unpredictable, and that can be a good thing, but it's downright annoying.

Lindsay has always reminded me of that Little Miss Perfect type in the classroom--the one who is always raising her hand and is so arrogant and always determined to be right. Teacher's pet type, kiss ass, etc.

It always baffles me when people refer to Lindsay as cute, because there's nothing "cute" about the character's personality. She's competitive, sour and shrill much of the time. Sometimes she is discerning, but there's very little that's cute about her character. She's not sweet.

And that's okay--Stella's not really "sweet" per se, either. Female characters don't have to be sweet. But Stella is likable, and I rarely find Lindsay likable. I hope that changes, but after a whole season, I'm not sure it will.
 
Hee hee. I just have to laugh because I thought Showtime was saying he/she hated people who like Lindsay! Then I read on and realized Showtime was discussing fake people. Tee hee. Had to chuckle at my own misunderstanding. The rule I take away? READ THE WHOLE POST!!!!!
 
I have a quick question or three and this point in the season seems as appropriate for them as any other, because for me Lindsay is as unpleasant as she was the day she snatched from Sid and sealed her fate with me.

Why do you think the writers are having such difficulty seamlessly incorporating Lindsay into to the cast?

My answer would be that with Vanessa's departure they thought more about filling the void and less about the way to fill that void. It seems they had a name before they had a true understanding of the character's nuances and intricacies, which some could argue led to ineffective casting no matter how nice Anna may be in person or how well she has executed previous roles. The show and the character would have been better served by an introduction at a much later point than episode three of season 2. Zuiker has admitted the misstep and I suppose we will have to live with his lack of forethought. Imagine if you will a season two where the continuity was Hawkes indoctrination into the ways of crime scene investigation and the writers reaping all the dramatic potential available with Aiden's departure.

Do you think using tragedy to reveal character is truly the best way? It seems right now that Lindsay's character is simply Danny's potential love interest and a girl with a dark bloody past, shouldn't the writer's give her a bit more flesh before they try to play to viewer's sympathies? After all pity is a far cry from love or even like.

Again, my answer is I don't particularly care about the dark secret and frankly the way the writers have been dragging it out feels more like manipulation than any great burst of creativity.

Finally, about 12 episodes into Lindsay's arrival a thread emerged asking Lindsay or Aiden, the exact title escapes me, however there was a clear line even then between those that did not like the character and those that did. Among those that did a common refrain was give her a chance to develop, give the writers a chance to let her grow, etc. There were many rebuttals to that particular thought and I won't go into them here, but I will say as we approach the 30 episode mark when will there be enough episodes that time can no longer be an excuse for shoddy development, any thoughts?
 
I agree with the notion that Lindsay's character was rushed--she was basically thrown together quickly. That wasn't the writers' faults--it sounds like Vanessa told them of her departure after season one ended and didn't give them much time to create a new character in her wake. Waiting would have been preferable to the mismash of cliches that is Lindsay, though.

Let's see--we've got a dark secret. Check. We've got a crush on the sexy guy in the lab, check. We've got the over-eager, anxious to please attitude, check. We've got the occasional toughness mixed with the oh-so-weepy vulnerability, check. The character is one weak cliche after another, without any charm or likability that might otherwise save her from being thoroughly unwatchable.

It's been 30 episodes, and there's still nothing to like about her. She's still a cliche, and one that stands out like a sore thumb among an otherwise stellar cast of characters. The CSI: NY writers created 6 great leads initially, and subsequent recurring characters (Hammerback, Adam, Maka, etc.) have been equally as endearing. Why the constant cliches with Lindsay? Surely they could do better.
 
I agree that they should have waited before they just jumped in and cast someone else. Even Miami waited after Speedle died before they cast Ryan and I loved how they introduced him. He was a patrol cop, in Miami, wanting to be a CSI. Lindsay on the other hand came from across the country. Was there nobody competent enough in the NYPD to take Aiden's place?

They had initially named the new character "Summer". Wonder what she would have been like and I wonder what made them change their mind and cast Anna. It's obvious they made Lindsay for her. Apparently Summer would have never worked for her. Hell, Lindsay doesn't even work for her.

It's a shame that out of all the CSI shows, Lindsay's the only character I feel doesn't fit in at all and my least favorite character.

Like Top said, it's been 30 episodes. They still haven't established who she really is. It shouldn't take that long. Being Danny's shadow also does not help Lindsay at all.
 
Top41 said:
I agree with the notion that Lindsay's character was rushed--she was basically thrown together quickly. That wasn't the writers' faults--it sounds like Vanessa told them of her departure after season one ended and didn't give them much time to create a new character in her wake. Waiting would have been preferable to the mismash of cliches that is Lindsay, though.

Being left in the lurch certainly wasn’t the writers fault, but 30 episodes in and what you are left with is the writer’s continuing failure when it comes to Lindsay. Being fair I don’t think the writers shoulder the character’s failure all on their own, I think at least two other people share a heaping piece of that blame.

Let's see--we've got a dark secret. Check. We've got a crush on the sexy guy in the lab, check. We've got the over-eager, anxious to please attitude, check. We've got the occasional toughness mixed with the oh-so-weepy vulnerability, check. The character is one weak cliche after another, without any charm or likability that might otherwise save her from being thoroughly unwatchable.

You make an excellent point, cliché is simply not captivating, more importantly, a clichéd character lacks a certain humanity, an empathy, and most importantly likeability or believability. I find the character completely flawed and yet some seem to find her without flaws, competing perspectives and of that, the writers should take note. Certainly, no single character is the same for everyone, because we all bring lives lived to the table when we watch television, but for so little overlap to occur where Lindsay is concerned tells me that the job of creating a viable character for a lucrative franchise in this case is a dismal failure for a portion of the audience.

It's been 30 episodes, and there's still nothing to like about her. She's still a cliche, and one that stands out like a sore thumb among an otherwise stellar cast of characters. The CSI: NY writers created 6 great leads initially, and subsequent recurring characters (Hammerback, Adam, Maka, etc.) have been equally as endearing. Why the constant cliches with Lindsay? Surely they could do better.

I think this is the million-dollar question. Why is there such difficulty when it comes to Lindsay? What are the set of circumstances that have aligned to create such difficulty in adding just one more character that equals the caliber of the others? Lindsay’s characterization doesn’t even inhabit the same echelon of other regular and recurring characters. Honestly, the trouble the writers are having is a more compelling mystery than whatever Lindsay’s dark secret may be. I want the answer to the former, the latter interests me not at all.


1CSIMfan said:
I agree that they should have waited before they just jumped in and cast someone else. Even Miami waited after Speedle died before they cast Ryan and I loved how they introduced him. He was a patrol cop, in Miami, wanting to be a CSI. Lindsay on the other hand came from across the country. Was there nobody competent enough in the NYPD to take Aiden's place?

It is interesting that they shipped a character in to fill a void that didn’t exist, after all, Hawkes filled the space left by Aiden’s departure, and Lindsay was just another warm body. I regret that they didn’t tackle a storyline involving the aftermath of Aiden’s firing/quitting or Hawkes learning the ropes. After Hawkes first solo case involving the dead child, I was waiting for his over involvement to catch up with him at some point in the season. Instead, I got Danny carrying Lindsay for no reason whatsoever.

Apparently Summer would have never worked for her. Hell, Lindsay doesn't even work for her.

So, sad and so very true.

Like Top said, it's been 30 episodes. They still haven't established who she really is. It shouldn't take that long. Being Danny's shadow also does not help Lindsay at all.

She is so much Danny’s shadow that the writers are using the fauxmance as the vehicle to reveal her deep, dark secret past. Not even her bloody secret can come to light without Danny being involved in some way. It’s tacky and cheap.
 
Hey you guys... I just started reading this particular thread (it took me and hour and a half, by the way) and I totally agree with most of the anti-Lindsay things said. I would give my opinions, but then someone would probably make another comment about people on this thread saying the same thing over and over again.
Okay, so I really have a point here. Most pro-Lindsay people who leave comments say that by reading this thread, you would think that everyone that watches CSI:NY hates Lindsay. So I was wondering if a poll in the CSI:NY section about Lindsay would be appropriate: I love Lindsay, I like Lindsay, I don't care, I dislike Lindsay, I hate Lindsay. Is this a good/bad idea? What do you mods think about it?
 
Well, I don't know about the mods, since it's their call ;), but in my opinion I think that, since this thread is a place to debate about Lindsay's character, we don't really need another one. I don't think the writers assume that that everyone hates Lindsay, either. There are threads here for people who love her, grading and discussion threads (including this one) have both opinions, etc. So everybody has a place to say how they feel. :) My worry is that another thread of 'like her or hate her' would turn into more arguing. Again, just my opinion, we'll see how it goes. ;)

Anywho, you guys have made some good points in the past few posts. :) I'm still holding out hope that the writers will improve Lindsay's character and that I'll like her more than I do now. However, my main problem with the length of time is this (and I believe I've said it somewhere although I don't know for sure if it was on this site or not)--should people really be sitting there going, 'oh, in a few months they'll explain why she acts that way' or something like that? Should it be a matter of 'later on we'll understand'? I'd venture to guess that most fans of the show don't keep up with spoilers, so they aren't thinking about what's happening in the future, they're just watching the show that's in front of them. Yeah, people are smart enough to go 'hmm, that's interesting, I wonder if they'll say why she does that,' but this is taking them an awfully-long time to flesh out. Lindsay's story seems to be a serial drama element in a show that is generally procedural. Over the course of a longer period of time, the explanation of why she behaves the way she does, etc, might make lots of sense, but on a week-to-week basis it's unfulfilling...

I hope that made sense. :lol:
 
fly_casual, you can start the poll if you like, but I think it may have been done before. This is a good place to discuss Lindsay, and feel free to post whatever you'd like in here, without fears of being repetitive. This thread is the place to post negative thoughts about the character (or positive ones for debate), so definitely post your thoughts on her.

Like 1CSIMfan, Lindsay is the only character in all of the three CSI shows that I dislike. Usually the characters in these shows are done so well, but Lindsay is just impossible to like--and believe me, I've tried. I think that there must be an awareness of this from TPTB; otherwise, why try to sell her character with the "fauxmance" (brilliant term, JDonne!) with Danny? All the other characters are strong enough to stand on their own, without being propped up by another character.

I have to say, after 30 episodes I've stopped waiting for a turnaround in her character that will make me like her. I don't look for reasons to dislike her, but they pop up in almost every episode. The best NY eps seem to be the ones where she is in the background or of little consequence to the action. She almost always grates on the nerves when she's on screen.
 
Reason 2,467,328 that Lindsay should go. . . When you share a scene with Gary Sinese, Melina Kanakaredes, and have Carmine Giovinazzo looking in to add the final exclamation point on a moment that should be fraught with emotion and you as an actor manage to suck every ounce of energy and emotion out of the room it is time to pack up the toothbrush and hair spray in your dressing room and simply walk away – forever.

Honestly, what the hell was that scene? I haven’t seen an episode of NY since the end of October, maybe the beginning of November, so I’m not worked up about the characters failures or even the show’s slight rise from the ashes of Season 2. It’s just that I couldn’t help but chuckle at the delivery’s awfulness whereas last season I would have seethed through the eleven o’clock news.

Anna couldn’t have worked up a sob, a break in her voice, and ounce of genuine emotion, a pinch of believability - no, apparently she could not. Those lines were so flat and this time there simply isn’t room to blame the writers that was pure delivery or lack thereof. Here was your chance sweetheart, a chance to sell it, a chance to make us care, a chance to make a solitary tear trail down my cheek and what you delivered was so lacking in any emotion that I couldn’t believe what I was seeing. Tell you want why not inform the writers of your shortcomings, that when it comes to delivering potent lines filled with sentiment, feeling, passion, essentially emotion you are simply not capable.

When words espousing that you can still see the faces, of your murdered friends and their destroyed parents are delivered with all the emotion of the person at the Taco Bell Drive Thru asking for someone’s order it is time to stop speaking and possibly apologize to the viewing public. I imagine the faces in the screening room turning towards one another, throwing their hands and shoulders up in the air and thinking what can we do, especially if the wizened powers that be say we must continue down this road, a road that is as vacant as the emotional depth you lend to your character. Give the words some life or here’s a thought ACT as though you are moved.

When Sinese can’t save you, all hope may just be lost, but then again I’m not surprised it’s been a long time coming.
 
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