I DVR'd it since I wasn't going to be around and was able to finally get to it this afternoon. I thought it was a good episode but personally I can do without Sara. Nick looked great! :drool: Poor Greg was barely on! It was an interesting case I thought.
Exactly! The part about the writers, I mean. Because we know that in Gum Drops they told George to pull back in the scene with Cassie because he was TOO emotional.
What they don't realize is that some of their highest rated episodes involved George being emotional- such as Gum Drops and Grave Danger two of the highest rated shows (I said shows because I don't want to get into a debate with GSR fans because I know some of the GSR shows are also some of the highest rated shows as well). So while I'm not saying we need to have emotional Nick in every episode..they are some of the most popular ones.
And the fact is, this is a drama-therefore we want DRAMA. It's a procedural DRAMA. If wanted 'business as usual' we could simply go to the Discovery Channel. I mean I've watched Animal Cops and Animal Precinct on Animal Planet (sorry too many animal words used) and HELL they show MORE EMOTION than the characters on CSI and those are REAL people doing REAL jobs.
This episode proves the writers really don't care about what the audience wants-perhaps if their ratings go into the tank, than they will.
Grey's Anatomy's showrunner, Shondra Rimes, cared enough to give her viewers want they wanted-she knows who butters her bread-it's not ABC or the sponsors-it's the audience!
And procedures can be emotional-Law and Order:SVU is a very emotional show with its characters going through the ringer. Oh and they've been nominated for Emmys as well.
Yeah, definitely. Mariska is always nominated because emotionally they push her further and further every year. Emotional Marg episodes are also some of the highest ratings. I want emotion; not a poorly written, half-ass episode where the actors might as well not even be there.
Finally watched this one last night. Such a sad twist at the end, with the boy being the child's father rather than brother. He was screwed from the very start. For a change, enjoyed the GSR time because of the look on Grissom's face when he was lying on top of the bed: "What have I gotten myself into?" Don't despair GSR fans; given the writers' bias toward this ship-that-never-should-have-been, and Sara's return in Grissom's final epis, I'm sure G will have worked out all his worries by then and they will ride off into the sunset together. Just hope their emotional insecurity and fascination with Natalie will not result in Grissom and Sara becoming successful serial killers. :lol:
Wow, way to start off the new season kicking! More like sinking like a rock. But was it any surprise seeing as they started it off pretty much the same way as last season.
So, I am wondering if this was on of the episodes that were rushed out at the end of the last season due to the writers strike. It certainly seemed like it. It also seemed like they had taken stuff shot from two entirely different episodes and just pasted them together. Even with more than one case, it should still flow...
The writing just stank. The acting wasn't so great, but that was probably a result of the bad writing. The cases were predictable, not to mention the hypnotist one was science FICTION.
Sara and Grissom looked so awkward on the bed. Grissom's eyes were screaming 'what the @$%& is this' and looked like Sara's hostage. Maybe she had him cuffed at the ankles. At least they have crappy communication, yay some continuity! Oh and their scene talking about Sara's case but it wasn't her case since she is not a CSI but worked it anyways, OH MY GOD THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT THEMSELVES!! I did NOT see THAT coming. Gee writers so original, you really tricked me!
Sara's 'case' was pointless, and was rammed into the eppy. It took away from the other cases, they should have not had three cases when including this storyline, it was too much. Well, it was Greg's case, but Sara took it, even though they kept reminding us that it isn't her case since she can't work it, but she did anyway. Maybe they thought we would all be confused and think she came back to be a CSI when we saw her working the case? I can't come up with any other reason for that stupidity in the script.
But that was short lived as Sara remembered why she can't be in Vegas. Although if she was struggling with the job, hey here's an idea, stay away from the crime lab! I don't see why she has to be away from Vegas to not freak out. And if her relationship with Grissom ONLY revolves around work, than they don't have much of a relationship. And she leaves again...running away from problems. I guess even their super fantastic relationship can't help her now! Wait...didn't this happen LAST season. Seriously writers, if you are going to do a cheesy, chiche storyline, at least change it up!
But whatever...they are just creating DRAMA!!11!! before Grissom leaves...i bet Sara will come back and Grissom will give up his job to leave with her, because apparently Vegas sucks all life away and no other jobs that don't cause people to die don't exist. And that would make him even more pathetic, i seriously hope he doesn't take her back, that would be retarded.
Oh, and i LOVE how they used Greg to bring in Sara to take over, WELL done writers. Also how Nick and Catherine managed to work at the same time, yet didn't bump into anyone else. Another dimension, perhaps?
The only thing I liked from the episode was "Coldplay" at the beginning intro and Grissom saying that casino daycare was the 5th sign of the apocalypse. I'd prefer to forget the rest.
The only thing I liked from the episode was "Coldplay" at the beginning intro and Grissom saying that daycare casino was the 5th sign of the apocalypse. I'd prefer to forget the rest.
I felt the acting was phenomenal, and the writing awesome, riveting, the team showing their grief and shock, they were all at their best, like when Nick was buried and Brass and Greg were wounded. And on ratings last week's brought in 23 million fans and this week it scored in at # one, so 'sinking' I think not
I know it's really late, and I wasn't going to comment on this ep, but I'm feeling wretched and can't calm myself down enough for sleep. So, I guess I'll chime in.
This episode felt incredibly disjointed and pieced together. The opening was really fun and surreal with very little dialogue, very little ambient noise... Just the sounds of the song and the phone ringing. Of course, I suspected something was screwy with that phone call from the very beginning, but it was a very nice opening to me.
It does feel like they're grooming Nicky to be that leader in the lab, like many of us have discussed in the past.(SEE FOOTNOTE) I don't believe this is the first time he's had the quip right before the main credits (Nicky fans, feel free to correct me). I'm not sure if that's something that will change when they have new blood, but I feel like he has a good command over that. I know that might sound silly, but delivering those quips without making them seem too groan-worthy to bear? Yeah, he rocks it.
I really adored the Gil/Sara in bed scene, and it really worked for me. Yes, I get I'm a GSR fan, so I'll have a different perspective, but lemme say that as one, I didn't see this scene as one of those "OMG, Call the neighbors!" moments. To me, it felt so organic, I almost forgot to squee. I liked them just laying there, her playing with his hand, him playing back. She wants him to go with her, he wants her to stay with him, but when he says he can't go with her on the trip, you almost feel the air escape from her balloon. When she says "It would be nice to get away.." you can hear it in her voice that she's given up a bit. She's almost whistfully daydreaming about what can never be. She puts her hand on his chest, and I feel him grabbing it is almost him trying to keep her from letting go completely, as though his hand could capture her heart and keep her from losing all that hope. It's touching.
The whole bank teller thing was strange to watch because I have my husband beside me telling me how no bank would keep that many hundreds in their drawer to minimize how much money was lost in a robbery. I countered that Vegas law may be different, but if someone knows, I'd be happy to learn! The hypnotism angle was interesting, but I think it could have been used a lot more effectively. I remember hearing rumors that Nick would see what he thought was Warrick walking down the streets, and that could have been a nice connector between "For Warrick" and the next episode.
where they all get therapy
.
I liked Gil's case a lot better, actually, because I was not expecting the twist that he was her student. I did get the Oedipus vibe from the situation, but I couldn't have called the rest of it, and I thought it was a nice, new way of telling that story. Back on Dawson's Creek, it was a huge deal when Pacy hooked up with his teacher, and even news organizations thought it was a big deal that a show would take on something like that. Now, people treat it as old hat, and some called the so-called "Cougar scenario" on Gossip Girl earlier this season "boring" because it had been "done so many times before." I definitely liked the twist here. But, oh, I hated the delivery of that final line by the kid. More on that later...
Then, we have Greg's case, which we didn't get to see him work much. My husband and I were both bothered by the way this case was used in the context of the episode. My husband wanted real catharsis through this, with the perpetrator getting his commupance and justice. I thought it was a little too anvilicious for the whole Gil/Sara thing.
Sara completely and utterly ignored the evidence on this one and went just with her heart. I'm still not sure where in her character I can put this.... in or out. To me, I remember "Too Tough to Die" as one of the episodes that actually endeared Sara to me (Since I started out wishing Holly had never died and didn't like Sara at all). Sara got carried away, but she used evidence as her weapon. Here, she seemed so blinded by her emotional connection that she could not see clearly, and tried to argue with Gil about the emotionality of the situation rather than confronting the likely scenario that she was the victim of a lie.
Oh, and THAT conversation? Gil returned to talking in circles, and even I'm still confused about what his meaning was, but I am SO glad Sara finally called him on it. I just kept flashing back to the Snakes Gil/Sara conversation where they talked in complete circles, and when he was at a loss for words, she let him off the hook. I remember thinking how out of place that scene was in the episode back in the day (5x12, I think...) and then how it made sense as set up for Nesting Dolls. This scene had that same "out of place" feel for me. I just haven't been able to wrap my head around what the reason was besides to try to drive doubt into Sara's head about her stability with Gil. It didn't affect either of their cases in any way, and seemed only to give us another roundabout conversation with no ends for the reasons of prolonging the suffering for GSR fans until Gil's last episode (or maybe beyond. I have no clue what TPTB has planned). Anyway, it just threw me off.
I really was bothered by the (no longer a teen) man who assaulted Mrs. Adler all those years ago saying "Too Tough to Die." Ask the hubby. I groaned. Seeing him in a wheelchair was a wakeup call for Sara, who came into that conversation prepared with both cannons loaded to let loose on him (which did remind me of her circa season 3 when Brass had to tell her off for trying to chase down a perp), and that took her down a peg, but, again, it all felt like a plot device to drive Gil and Sara apart.... not to bring any real closure to this case.
Thomas Adler's reasoning for pulling the plug on his wife was really sad, but he's not going to get to live a life. He's being charged in her death and will spend many of his days in jail now. He has effectively taken himself from one cell to another, which makes no sense if his whole argument was that pulling the plug would set him free. Seriously, I understand that in those types of situation, everyone makes their decisions differently, but if he really wanted to move on, pulling the plug himself was not the way to do it.
I know he tried to pin it on the kid, so maybe he wasn't thinking he would go to jail, but he still pulled the plug himself. He still did that. He had to know there would be consequences. I mean, until Greg asked them not to, the cops were prepared to drag his tail out of there.
I did LOVE the Greg/Sara interaction in this ep. That was one of the bright spots (as someone else already said). I loved him calling her in, and thinking it would be something she would want to know about. Sara told Thomas she would visit, and when he said he'd heard she was away, it seems like they've kept up with one another to a degree. So, maybe Sara told Greg about all that once upon a time, and he never forgot.
I really loved her grabbing his hand in gratitude, too. With Gil communicating in riddles, Thomas Adler being held for his wife's death, and her perceptions of villains and victims on the line, Greg really came through. He gave her someone fighting in the same direction she was moving. Was it ultimately the direction that gave them answers? Maybe not, but it was touching, nonetheless.
Sara's "confrontation" with Adler was confusing to me in some ways. I think they were trying to somehow link it to her earlier conversation with Gil, but I just did not feel it. The only connection I could find, honestly, was back to his sabbatical however long ago that was. Anything said by Adler that she could connect back to Gil only made sense when I went that far back... To me, that's where it made sense.
See, Sara was finally secure with Gil, and thought things were tight, and his leaving without hardly any warning was the first real break for her. I seriously think a lot of her issues with their relationship go back to that moment, to that choice, to that seeming break of trust. I think that's why she left again, if anything. Her trust in Adler was broken. Her trust in a VICTIM she FOUGHT for was broken. Her trust in Gil suffered a hard hit so long ago, a wound that never fully healed, but was only temporarily taped over after the emotional high of her rescue from the Miniature Killer. And then there was that whacked out conversation in his office that day where it felt like he was telling her to break up with him... I still haven't wrapped my head around that one.
So people don't think I hate Gil, I don't. I think he is dealing with Warrick's death in his own way, and besides Catherine's small comments at the beginning of the ep, he seemed to be the only one really still reeling from Warrick's death. Everyone else was pushing through, and while I think that's significant in terms of Gil's character and development as we build to his sendoff, it felt disjointed. I really wanted to see EVERYONE still hurting.
I mean, "For Warrick" was an emotionally gut-wrenching ep for CSI fans across the board, regardless of ships, fav characters, etc. There was so much going into that, and the funeral had many of us teary eyed.. This ep felt like they dropped the ball in favor of ramping up the Gil/Sara emo-thon, and that just didn't do it for me, honestly. I know, I know. Shocking.
That final confrontation with Gil and the killer son/student bothered me because of the shoutout to "Butterflied" with the "She promised me the world and then she took it all away." Really? I felt like it was thrown in there just to try to get an emotional pull out of Gil, just to try to get us to feel something, but the delivery of the line really bothered me, first of all, because it felt forced. Not just that, but I felt like this ep really wanted to PULL something out of me, to force me to feel something. I'd rather feel it because there's something in the ep that hits me.
"For Warrick" resonated without seeming contrived, without seeming forced, but this episode really felt written to MAKE you FEEL something rather than writing a solid story through which you feel something. Maybe that only makes sense in my head... But, what I mean is, I didn't buy into this episode like I think they wanted me to.
Overall, it was a meh for me.
FOOTNOTE: I don't mean that he'll be taking over Gil's position in any way, but while Gil once called Warrick the rock of the team, I often felt it was Nicky. YMMV
This ep felt like they dropped the ball in favor of ramping up the Gil/Sara emo-thon, and that just didn't do it for me, honestly. I know, I know. Shocking.
This ep felt like they dropped the ball in favor of ramping up the Gil/Sara emo-thon, and that just didn't do it for me, honestly. I know, I know. Shocking.
I'm a GSR fan who likes when it makes SENSE. Yes, I know my degree of what makes "sense" is only inside my own brain, but I tend to think I'm a fairly sensible person, and more than that, I'm a writer. No, I'm not making big bucks on a television series, but that's why I expect those who do to write better than I could. I typically adore Sarah Goldfinger scripts. She's written some AMAZING ones, and I'm not sure where the ball was dropped in this one, if it was in conception, or a producer's decision or another writer's influence, or simply Ms. Goldfinger having an "off" episode.
It just didn't hit the mark for me. I never like it when I feel like a movie or TV show is trying to MAKE me feel something, even if it revolves around my fav ship.
This ep felt like they dropped the ball in favor of ramping up the Gil/Sara emo-thon, and that just didn't do it for me, honestly. I know, I know. Shocking.
I'm a GSR fan who likes when it makes SENSE. Yes, I know my degree of what makes "sense" is only inside my own brain, but I tend to think I'm a fairly sensible person, and more than that, I'm a writer. No, I'm not making big bucks on a television series, but that's why I expect those who do to write better than I could. I typically adore Sarah Goldfinger scripts. She's written some AMAZING ones, and I'm not sure where the ball was dropped in this one, if it was in conception, or a producer's decision or another writer's influence, or simply Ms. Goldfinger having an "off" episode.
It just didn't hit the mark for me. I never like it when I feel like a movie or TV show is trying to MAKE me feel something, even if it revolves around my fav ship.
I agree, it all seemed forced. They brought Sara back to mourn Warrick and support Grissom, which made sense, not to mention great ratings. But then they had to find a way to get rid of her. So they introduced the scenario in the office, out of the blue. Well, if my SO described our relationship as 'withering', then I would certainly leave ASAP, and never look back. The problem is tptb have developed this relationship to be deeper than that, so it just didn't make sense.
And the reference to the Butterflied speech was confusing. Older man, younger woman; older woman, younger man. Counselor vs. teacher. idk. Grissom essentially told Sara to leave him because he couldn't end it, so how does the 'she took it all away' fit into that?
I definitely think they tried to cram too much into this episode and it left many fans dissatisfied. I'll give Sarah Goldfinger the benefit of the doubt and blame it on tptb.
They brought Sara back to mourn Warrick and support Grissom, which made sense, not to mention great ratings. But then they had to find a way to get rid of her. So they introduced the scenario in the office, out of the blue.
They could have put the storyline in a later episode instead of the second one. Then it would have given the impression that Sara stayed with Grissom for some time and problem developed and her leaving was a result of that. It was too abrupt and out of place.
I don't support the ship, but if had to be there at least make it watchable.
