The Great Ship Debate - CSI:Crime Scene Investigation

[Drumchik]

It was interesting, because during the first season, Sara definitely didn't trust him. And I think into the second season as well (which we saw in Ellie). That's understandable since she was brought in to investigate what happened to Holly, she made her recommendation and Grissom ignored it, and she probably felt upset about that.

That being said, I think as the seasons went by they got more used to each other and the way they worked, and I feel that they were closer. As for a relationship, I really don't know. The only one I could ever see Sara with was Nick, but that's just me. Nowadays, I prefer him with Mandy

One ship I never did understand (apart from GSR), and not that I am slamming anyone here, but it was Greg/Catherine. Seriously, what? She'd eat him for breakfast.

 

[happyharper13]

WARRICK BELONGS WITH CATHERINE?! No truer words were ever spoken!

Maybe it's because Warrick and Sara were too much alike. Maybe that's why I can't see them together. They both, IMO, were the most screwed up of the bunch, with their family issues and weaknesses for braking the law. Both of them were in a general downward spiral. Like maybe, they would destroy each other...too extreme?

Other than that, I generally agree with what happy said about Warrick's character. Maybe I'm wrong and their alikeness would have worked?

I actually thought of Warrick as the least screwed up of the bunch. The whole 'Cockroaches/For Gedda/For Warrick' arc seemed incredibly OOC to me, and seemed like it was just the way they settled on to get rid of the character. I thought of Sara, Grissom and Nick as the most troubled characters, in that order, and Warrick as the least. Warrick was the only one who was able to maintain a healthy relationship and he was also the one who didn't (at least until the end of S8) really lose himself in cases. There were cases earlier on that he'd clearly get more invested in, but, if I recall correctly, all of those involved people who were basically like family to him -- basically, where anyone would react that way.

One ship I never did understand (apart from GSR), and not that I am slamming anyone here, but it was Greg/Catherine. Seriously, what? She'd eat him for breakfast.

Lol. I totally see what you mean. In earlier seasons, there was some hot Stacy's Mom-type potential there, but you are so right -- she would eat him for breakfast. Still, I think he's matured a lot lately and I can almost see something working between them at this point. Or at least I don't think she'd eat him for breakfast at this point. I think Greg has matured to the point that he can hold his own against Catherine, or at least hold his own as much as anyone can hold their own against Catherine, which is not very much because, simply, she just kicks butt. I think Warrick was the only character who really could hold his own against Cath.

 

[Kimbo08]

One ship I never did understand (apart from GSR), and not that I am slamming anyone here, but it was Greg/Catherine. Seriously, what? She'd eat him for breakfast.

:guffaw:Funniest. Thing. Ever. Oh my gosh. She totally would. I mean Cath is a cougar(IMO) but maybe not for Greg. Maybe some other young soul. Not saying she's old. (Wow. Digging myself quite a hole!)

What I'm trying to say is, I can see Catherine with Nick together, not Cath and Greg, although I prefer them as a kind of brother/sister thing. Yes, I know. I see almost everything as brother and sister. Why? Because I see them as one big, non-fraternizing, non-romantic, I-care-for-you-like-a-brother/sister type of family.

ETA- I agree about the OOC storyarc with Warrick. I think issues behind the scenes promted some of the storylines he received. AS fas as I've read the issues were getting out of hand, so maybe they needed an out for not only the character but the actor. Unfortunately, they jacked up the character comepletely.

 

[kinkapoodles]

How can there not be a discussion if they're gay or not? I got in trouble because I said the characters on CSI are not gay.

I'm all for people shipping and slashing who they want, but if the slashers can say the characters are gay then people should be able to say they're not gay.

I think you're misunderstanding me on this. Hopefully this will help.

Someone cannot say, "Character A is gay!" They can say, "I see Character A as gay." or "IMO Character A is gay." but they cannot come out and say that they are. If you don't see it then an appropriate response would be, "I don't see Character A as gay." or "IMO Character A is not gay." and state your reasons.

Problems always surface when it comes to slash pairings because a lot of people are so against them, which is their right. They just can't insist a couple or character isn't gay but they can tell us all day that they believe a couple or character is straight.

I read the rules and will abide by them, but if I say I don't see the Nick/Greg pairing or Catherine/Sara pairing because they're not gay or lesbian, I'm stating something that is established on the show. If I say it's because I don't think they're gay, it's because they aren't gay or lesbian on the show.

If they've never discussed their sexual orientation on the show or the producers/writers have never discussed their sexual orientation (and I do not recall that ever being an issue) then NO, you cannot say it was established on the show that they are not gay. It cannot be assumed they are straight even if they've only dated the opposite sex.

Also, this is a shipper forum. All ships are welcome here whether they're het or slash and whether they're canon or not. On NY, Stella once told a woman hitting on her that she wasn't into women so technically, one can say it's established that she is straight because she said so but slashing her is still allowed in this forum.

I just think shippers and slashers can say what they want (not about bashing, flaming, whatnot about a poster) but non-shipper/slashers can't.

Shipping consists of HET and SLASH ships. Shippers and slashers are the same thing. Slash is a type of ship, not something separate.

I've read in a slash thread, how everyone who doesn't see that the two guys are gay should get their heads examined. Really? Cause I could say the same thing about them.

Where? You show me proof (in a PM please) where that was said and a mod post wasn't made and I'll take care of that because that is bashing.

I mean I've had a slash shoved down my throat and I can't begin to tell you who much I dread those two characters being on screen together and a ship for that matter.

I'm sure the same could be said by slashers about het but I'd suggest that if a certain pairing bothers anybody so much, it's probably best to stay away from the threads where they are discussed. It is one of the suggestions in the Shipper Central Rules.

Also, NickyFan, I need you to resize your banner since it is 300x75 which is bigger than the allowed size of 220x75. thank you.

 

[Kimbo08]

I appreciate the clarification. I just hope it sticks. And could you possibly elaborate on the Anti-threads. Although I would love to have one, I doubt TBonz would allow it. Could you ask about it? Or do you already know the answer?

 

[Speedystokesgirl]

Warrick, to me, has been the character that has best embodied the potential perfect boyfriend.

Ok, I'm gonna have to take offense to that :lol:, because the only man in CSI that is perfect boyfriend material? Is Nick!

Ok, I'm not offended , just had to mess with ya, but Warrick? Perfect? Sorry, that I don't agree with. Ok, let's face none of the characters are perfect, no one is. However, if they had did the Warrick/Catherine ship, I would've been ok with it.

I actually thought of Warrick as the least screwed up of the bunch. The whole 'Cockroaches/For Gedda/For Warrick' arc seemed incredibly OOC to me, and seemed like it was just the way they settled on to get rid of the character. I thought of Sara, Grissom and Nick as the most troubled characters, in that order, and Warrick as the least. Warrick was the only one who was able to maintain a healthy relationship and he was also the one who didn't (at least until the end of S8) really lose himself in cases. There were cases earlier on that he'd clearly get more invested in, but, if I recall correctly, all of those involved people who were basically like family to him -- basically, where anyone would react that way.

Actually, I think Nick was the was the least screwed up. Warrick had a gambling problem and his relationship with his wife was not healthy. He married her on a whim and then got divorced. I didn't see any of those three episodes as OOC for Warrick. However, don't get me wrong. I love Warrick and agree with a lot of what you said about him.

Nick isn't troubled, however I agree that Sara is. I don't know if Grissom was troubled, but more eccentric. Though he became eccentric in later seasons, not the first few seasons.

I couldn't see Sara and Warrick. Actually, I couldn't see Sara with anyone, but that's my opinion. She has way too many men issues to be able to be in any relationship.

Grissom I could see with Catherine, Teri Miller or Lady Heather. I think they were on the same level has him.

Nick and Catherine? Well, they were suppose to be a couple and then that was changed or ended up on the cutting room floor, but I could've seen that. Now I think it's more brotherly and sisterly.

Greg and Riley? I could see that. I think they've got great chemistry together. The writers really could have some fun with them. Maybe not a relationship, but bickering or something along those lines.

ETA:

I'm sure the same could be said by slashers about het but I'd suggest that if a certain pairing bothers anybody so much, it's probably best to stay away from the threads where they are discussed. It is one of the suggestions in the Shipper Central Rules.

Sorry, this happens in the other threads on this board, that have nothing to do with ships. I rarely go in the shipper threads.

I appreciate the clarification and answering my questions and for listening too. Thanks, Kinkapoodles!

I will behave myself. Let me know if I step out of bounds.

 

[happyharper13]

Warrick, to me, has been the character that has best embodied the potential perfect boyfriend.

Ok, I'm gonna have to take offense to that :lol:, because the only man in CSI that is perfect boyfriend material? Is Nick!

Lol. To each his/her own, I suppose. Greg Sanders is my McDreamy :adore: I think he's the most attractive man I have ever seen, and he has a wicked sense of humor, very little shame and is an unabashed and open-minded geek. But after Greg would be Warrick.

Actually, I think Nick was the was the least screwed up. Warrick had a gambling problem and his relationship with his wife was not healthy. He married her on a whim and then got divorced. I didn't see any of those three episodes as OOC for Warrick. However, don't get me wrong. I love Warrick and agree with a lot of what you said about him.

Nick isn't troubled, however I agree that Sara is. I don't know if Grissom was troubled, but more eccentric. Though he became eccentric in later seasons, not the first few seasons.

I guess it depends on how you define words like 'troubled' or 'screwy'. I don't think any of the characters' major flaws/issues were their fault. Sara had a horrific childhood, and Nick's wasn't easy either. Still, I think Nick definitely has issues. Warrick's marriage may have had its problems (not that we could really tell based on the little we saw of it on the show), but at least he managed to hold a relationship. As far as we know, Nick never did. I think Nick is a character who has had issues repressing a lot over the years and that that has given him problems. The fact that he barely showed a significant emotional reaction until what was I think somewhere between six months and a year after Warrick's death was, IMO, the most telling. He's also been the character who's seemed the most judgmental. He's always the first to dismiss behaviors that fall outside of the norm and I think that perspective is what would make him and Catherine a disastrous couple.

I couldn't see Sara and Warrick. Actually, I couldn't see Sara with anyone, but that's my opinion. She has way too many men issues to be able to be in any relationship.

I can definitely see what you're talking about here. Sara did have issues with men. Still, a part of me definitely wishes that she could find a healthy relationship and work through those issues. Heck, maybe by some miracle Grissom could provide that. I guess that's up to TPTB now...

Nick and Catherine? Well, they were suppose to be a couple and then that was changed or ended up on the cutting room floor, but I could've seen that. Now I think it's more brotherly and sisterly.

Agreed (about the last part). I think they are much more like friends.

Greg and Riley? I could see that. I think they've got great chemistry together. The writers really could have some fun with them. Maybe not a relationship, but bickering or something along those lines.

I agree. I love the teasing between those two. I think they have great chemistry, but I don't want to see them go canon just because I think TPTB have proven once and for all that they can't do canon romance.

Two characters that nobody has brought up are Sofia and Brass. I always alternate back and forth about whether Sofia could have worked with Grissom, but I can definitely see her with Brass. She's such an awesome character that I feel like she must have also worked with other characters as well. Thoughts?

 

[myfuturecsi]

Lol. To each his/her own, I suppose. Greg Sanders is my McDreamy

GASP. Bite your tongue girl! Don't call poor Greg that. He's far from a doctor on a cheesey soap opera.:lol:

Greg and Riley would be so cool together. I love the term 'hair pullers'. That is a kinky name for them. I could imagine them being the ultimate kinky couple with leather boots, cuffs, Riley in a dominatrix suit! Greg would never get any sleep.

 

[Desertwind]

Read and understood....for right now, I can't see any thing with anybody, but that's not to say in the future, there will be another twosome, I always thought that Warrick and Catherine would be great together, he seemed to bring out the best in her, and visa versa. And I'm thrilled, as many are, that Grissom and Sara ended up together, they had such a long relationship since San Francisco, which was brought up in 'Ala Cart" "you had a pony tail" he was her teacher in a class she took up there, as they discussed in the car scene. They had many struggles but always maintained their strong bond, and strong love. What I always admired and respected is how discreet and private they kept their affair, very cool. And when Cath [in the deleted scene] in "Grissom's Divine Comedy" found the pic. of them in San Francisco pinned up on his fridge, and asked Gil "How long have you and Sara been together"?, and he shinned her on, which he was famous for... Also they only 'came out' when Ecklie busted them when Grissom rode with Sara in the helicopter, and asked her "How long have you been in a relationship" she replied "We've always had a relationship": and to Gil "Why didn't you tell me"? Grissom 'WE didn't want you to know", They had everything in common which he or her didn't have with anyone else. He left Vegas, to start a new chapter of his life with her, and her with him, and may they live happily ever after

note Golden Gate Bridge in the background~

Kinkapoodles I hope the little pics. are OK, they go with the post~

 

[happyharper13]

For right now, I can't see any thing with anybody, but that's not to say in the future, there will be another twosome, I always thought that Warrick and Catherine would be great together, he seemed to bring out the best in her, and visa versa. And I'm thrilled, as many are, that Grissom and Sara ended up together, they had such a long relationship since San Francisco, which was brought up in 'Ala Cart" "you had a pony tail" they had many struggles but always maintained their strong bond, and strong love. They had everything in common which he or her didn't have with anyone else. He left Vegas, to start a new chapter of his life with her, and her with him, and may they live happily ever after

How does him knowing that she had a ponytail prove that they had a relationship in San Francisco?

 

[Kimbo08]

I agree with what you said about Warrick and Catherine, btu as far as GSR goes, I kind of felt like TPTB made it up as they went along. Kind of created new backstory for them to make their relationship more believable and less random. I feel like the line in "A La Cart" was kind of like an "Oh! See! We meant for this to happen all along!" type of moment. To add more of a support for the ship. IMHO.

 

[GregNickRyanFan]

read and understood.

Lol. To each his/her own, I suppose. Greg Sanders is my McDreamy

GASP. Bite your tongue girl! Don't call poor Greg that. He's far from a doctor on a cheesey soap opera.:lol:

ROTFLMAO! That cracked me up, mfcsi.

Greg and Riley would be so cool together. I love the term 'hair pullers'. That is a kinky name for them. I could imagine them being the ultimate kinky couple with leather boots, cuffs, Riley in a dominatrix suit! Greg would never get any sleep.

:lol: Or if Greg went back to drinking so much coffee, Riley would never get any sleep... cause Greg was a hyper little bunny in the earlier years. :lol:

 

[happyharper13]

Lol. To each his/her own, I suppose. Greg Sanders is my McDreamy

GASP. Bite your tongue girl! Don't call poor Greg that. He's far from a doctor on a cheesey soap opera.:lol:

Lol. :guffaw: I stand corrected. I don't know what came over me. Must be the weather. Greg is much better than anything on *that* show. (I'm tempted to just go Harry Potter and call it the Show that Shall Not Be Named, as it is just about as evil in my mind. The Grey's fans have now taken the television this Thursday. For the finale. Ugh. Okay, back on topic...) Greg is then just... the man. The hottest nerd ever? :devil: Sigh.

 

[Deirdre]

Read and understood the rules

Interesting discussion and I don't know how to begin:lol:

It was mentioned Sara/Warrick. While I was watching first two season I saw something between them. There was some kind of tension which possibly you could read as a sexual tension. I noticed that but they couldn't end up as a couple. Many things you said why not, and with most of the statements I totally agree. It would be a toxic relationship - both had issues from the past and after some time they wouldn't have enough room for themselves.

I haven't seen romantic vibe for Greg and Riley. I love them both and I see great friendship. They're more like brother and sister, and I love it

And shipping Catherine. I stated earlier that I hadn't seen Cath and Nick. I know, they wanted to make them couple from the beginning but it didn't click. And still won't. Cath and Grissom was kinda my first ship in CSI. From the very first my CSI ep I saw that they're in some way attracted to each other. They would make great couple 'cause Grissom needed strong woman, just like Catherine (or, for example, Lady Heather). But well, I think they as couple wouldn't work in CSI universe, maybe in other dimension, with other work and without Grissom being a boss and Cath second in command. I think you know what I mean Cath and Warrick would be a great couple and they they had a big potential to be a canon ship. Very natural and, let's face it, very hot From the beginning they had great chemistry. Oh, and well, I liked the idea of Greg and Catherine. Not in a way to make them canon but definitely Greg had a crush on Cath (who wouldn't?). It's natural that young guy like Greg had been attracted by a intelligent beauty like Cath. They still have great dynamic and I'm enjoying every scene with them but at the moment no potential for being together (and I don't think it'll happen in future).

I'm slashing Cath and Sara and I will always like this pairing. It's not because of the sexual tension etc. It was more 'cause I saw in them great potential to be close friends. They had ups and downs, conflicts (sometimes serious ones) but Cath could be a person who Sara could trust. Sadly TPTB lost the potential for both of them. And it really didn't need to be read as a femslash - just great friendship.

From the femslash I saw Sara/Sofia too. Sofia was a strong woman and Sara needed more someone like her, not Grissom who not always had good social skills. Of course, again, I considered great frienship between them but sadly, again it was dropped.

 

[hiphugger17]

When I started watching CSI I immediately fell in love with the dynamic and chemistry between Gil and Cath. I loved their banter and teasing and how she could make him ease up and joke around. I loved that they could be very blunt with each other and still listen and respect and take into account what the other was saying. I think that kind of trust and respect is great to watch. So Grillows was definitely my first CSI ship.

As I continued watching I couldn't deny the chemistry between Warrick and Cath because IMO the two of them were just simply hot!! If Griss and Cath couldn't be done because of them being the leads, etc then I would've loved for the big canon ship to be Cath and Warrick.

Sara and Warrick I just never saw. Don't know exactly why other than for me they just don't click. Could also be that I never really liked Sara but if I saw her with anyone I guess it's Nick.

I agree with Cath eating Greg for breakfast :lol:. IMO he's just way too young and boyish for her. Of all the girls in the show IMO Riley's the one that clicks with him the most.