The Great Ship Debate - CSI:Crime Scene Investigation

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I completely agree, Kasey. The whole original cast really had chemistry with each other, and anything could have developed along the way. Grissom could have been with LH or Catherine, or even Terry, if the writers had chosen to pursue those storylines; but in the last 4 years (since Butterflied), it's been Sara. And once they made that choice, I'm glad they saw it through. Since my husband is 14 years older than me, and also started out as my mentor, it was easy for me to make sense of it. Two children, and 25 years later, he's still my one and only.
I wouldn't mind them bringing in love interests for Nick or Greg. I actually thought Greg and Ronnie would make a cute couple; he needs someone upbeat, and smart.
Catherine and Brass? I see them in a close platonic relationship like Catherine and Grissom.
That said, I'm pretty much up for whatever relationship the writers choose to develop. Those personal storylines help to keep the characters and the show interesting, IMO.
 
jtd94 said:
I wouldn't mind them bringing in love interests for Nick or Greg.
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The thing with bringing in someone to be a love interest for one of their characters is that it's hard, IMO, for a fan to become invested in a relationship when they barely know one of the characters. If Greg was in a relationship with a character who wasn't a CSI and wasn't established at all, I wouldn't like their relationship because I wouldn't know the other character at all. Hence why there aren't exactly shippers crazy about Warrick/Tina. You just can't invest in characters that you don't know. And I agree with Kimbo that the cast is definitely big enough already. I do not think that it would be a good idea to bring in a new cast member just to serve as love interest.
 
Still if they bring in love interests, I'd rather them try and find women their own age because the whole older man, younger woman storylines has been done. They did it with Grissom and Sara and so there would be comparisons all the time. That's why I think it is better to keep the age gaps a bit smaller if they should chose to bring in love interests ever again.

Or vice versa, have either of the boys dating older women. Let's be fair here. If Sara can date a man 15 years older than her, then why can't Greg or Nick.

I could see Greg doing it. He's very charming and seems to be very appealing to older women.

Nick, I could see him dating a woman much younger than him because he seems to have this dominant personality that Grissom had and that appeals to younger woman particularly those who have had daddy issues.
 
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Well, they could do what they did with the Kristy character (minus the prostitute part of course). Have the character on a couple of episodes to get the audience used to her and then later have her hook up with Nick or Greg. Nick's gotten to kiss someone on screen (Kristy). It's Greg's turn. I do agree with the whole thing about creating a character solely to be a love interest in general isn't a great idea.

That said, what they could do is do it in flashbacks. Like the team goes to a crime scene and the vic is Greg's old girlfriend from high school or maybe his early 20s (maybe the one he was talking to on the phone when Nick walked in that time lol) and he hasn't seen her in years. Greg has to excuse himself from the case. But, we see flashbacks of the two of them together (kind of how they did Hawkes with his ex gf on that one ep of NY). That way, the character would already be dead, so there would be no need for the auidence to get to know her, but we could get a look into some of Greg's past (since we dont' know that much about it) and get some emotional stuff for Greg at the same time, plus he'd finally get to kiss someone on screen. :lol:
 
Kimbo,If I were to pair anyone with Sara,it would be Hodges too.I still think she takes the light away from anybody so with Hodges there is no loss.He does the same to Wendy,IMO and that's why I don't like them together.

I also want to see Nick in a relationship.I mean ,I can't believe no woman notices him!!!He is smart and good looking.I am not completely against bringing anyone new becouse if it ends,there would be no tension.We don't need to see the whole relationship,just the two of them on a date once in a while.It will not take time from others.

The question about GSR is much more then age.Sara had daddy issues and Grissom was the one that helped her so it stayed that way in my mind.
 
electra said:
The question about GSR is much more then age.Sara had daddy issues and Grissom was the one that helped her so it stayed that way in my mind.
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I'm not sure I understand this 'daddy issues' comment. Sara came from an abusive home, it's true, but by the time she met Grissom she had survived foster care, graduated with an advanced degree, and had a successful career as a CSI in San Francisco. I don't see what Grissom had to do with any of this since she met him later. She did have issues with abusive husbands, just as Grissom had issues with abused children, and to some extent, this affected her work, but I don't think this had anything to do with her relationship with Grissom. I think they gravitated toward each other because of their shared interests and, to some extent, their shared social awkwardness. Both were introverts. You can argue that maybe opposites would be better suited to each other, as it would be with Catherine or LH; but in the case of Sara and Grissom, I think ultimately they helped each other discover what is truly important in life.
 
I agree that age doesn't matter in relationship, however, it can cause problems in a relationship.

I agree that Sara had daddy issues. What I mean by that, is she did come from an abusive home where dad beat her mom. Which means he probably wasn't much a father. Some women get attracted to older men because, subconsciously, they are looking for the father they never had.

This is what I see with Sara and her attraction to Grissom. She is looking for the 'father' she never had and Grissom fills that void. This is one of the main reason I cannot see this ship. Surviving through foster care, getting an advanced degree and having a successful career in CSI has irrevelant to what's going on her mind or her 'daddy' issues.

IMO, Sara was just not on the same level as Grissom to be with him. Like I've said before, I can see Catherine and Teri Miller with him, but I could see Lady Heather more.

Now I don't want to hear that Grissom went to Sara in Costa Rica. That's irrevelant to the fact that I don't see this pairing and never will.
 
speedystokesgirl said:
Some women get attracted to older men because, subconsciously, they are looking for the father they never had.
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I don't disagree with this; but on the other hand, a lot of men marry women who are like their own mother, but that doesn't mean they have an Oedipus complex.
I'm not trying to change anyone's mind about GSR (that we know will never happen), just stating why I don't agree with the 'daddy issues'. I just don't see that as a factor in their relationship.
 
Oh I know you're not trying to change my mind or anyone's elses.

I respect that you disagree with me and others. If we all agreed, what would we have to debate about? :lol:

And, yup, some men have that 'mommy' issue too. However, I tend to stay away from them :shifty:. I don't want to be with someone who's looking to be with their mother. :wtf: But that an entirely different thread.

Now for Catherine, I'm thinking that Vartann would be perfect for her. I still don't ship or slash anyone, but they would make a great pair.

I could've seen her with Warrick, but unfortunately, he is no longer in the picture, so I think Vartann would be good for her.

As for Nick, they were planning to bring in a love interest for him, but I highly doubt she was going to be a regular. Probably just a recurring character. She was going to be a social worker, who's beauty comes from within. However, because of the writer's strike, that idea has either been scrapped or on hold. I think the waitress in 'For Gedda' was just someone stating she was going to be his love interest. If that was true, then she would've been still around. Though I'm glad this never took place as she was way too young for him.

I think Nick needs someone closer to his age and a social worker would be perfect. George always said that if Nick had a love interest, that he would want her to be a teacher, social worker, etc.

Personally, I think I'd be perfect for him. :lol: But only in my dreams. :devil:
 
I just don't think TPTB should go the GSR route because it's been done already and whatever relationship gets starts where there's an older man and a younger woman people will compare it to GSR.
 
jtd94 said:
speedystokesgirl said:
Some women get attracted to older men because, subconsciously, they are looking for the father they never had.
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I don't disagree with this; but on the other hand, a lot of men marry women who are like their own mother, but that doesn't mean they have an Oedipus complex.
I'm not trying to change anyone's mind about GSR (that we know will never happen), just stating why I don't agree with the 'daddy issues'. I just don't see that as a factor in their relationship.
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I totally agree, and never thought that ever. She met him in San Francisco, and didn't know his age, nor obviously was not an issue with either of them..she was attracted to him and him to her, because their so much alike. It took him longer to come to terms with their relationship then it did her, but ultimatley when she left Vegas, he was a distraught, lonely, unhappy man, and knew where he wanted to be to start the next chapter of his life "It's time to up the ante" he told Cath and regardless [and I also don't pretend to know why some don't like this union],:rolleyes: I do know that there a mega GSR sites out there, and fans galore posting on them.. bottom line, is this is what they, and the writers wanted, and they did end up together~
 
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Desertwind said:
and I also don't pretend to know why or care why some don't like this union],:rolleyes:
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If you don't care, then why are you in this thread? You, obviously, cannot accept people not liking GSR, but you have to accept it. We are entitled to our opinion. It sounds like you're saying that we shouldn't voice why we don't like this union.

Just because you see the union and tptb wanted it, doesn't make it right or that everyone can see it or wanted it.

The fact that were put together in the show and ended up together, is still totally IRRELEVANT to the fact that some people don't get this ship and why they don't.
 
A Ship is subjective. Some people will like it and others won't. I dont like GSR nor do I like Greg/Nick but that's me. Others enjoy it. We don't know why but it's like ice cream. Some people like one flavour and others hate it.

The trouble with GSR was not so much the romance itself but how it was handled by TPTB. They insisted on it being the centre of the show and it felt to me as a nonGSR fan, they were saying, "We really don't care about fans of the other characters, all we care about is GSR." It was sad. I know Billy was the star, but it was AN ENSEMBLE cast.

And on top of that the fans from the website whose name I dare not say were absolutely nasty to those who did not support GSR. It was a George W. Bush mentality of "You're either with us, or you are not a true fan of CSI." It was sad. One poster there said, "Oh the other characters can have their 'very special episodes' but the rest better be GSR." I mean come on, this show was not about GSR it was about a group of forensics crime fighters.

I can't wait for the day when True Hollywood Report tells us 'what really went on behind the scenes' because I know the whole romance caused a lot of friction on set because some of the actors felt their time was being wasted when they would come on set for a whole day only to do two lines.

Anyways, that's my reason for not supporting the almighty GSR-TPTB and SOME of the fans-most GSR fans were reasonable, but others were just nasty and posted things about how the fans of other characters were 'stupid' and such.

It's too bad, really. Maybe someday I'll be able to watch CSI and GSR and not feel inclined to push the FAST Forward button every time a GSR scene comes on.
 
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myfuturecsi said:
A Ship is subjective. Some people will like it and others won't. I dont like GSR nor do I like Greg/Nick but that's me. Others enjoy it. We don't know why but it's like ice cream. Some people like one flavour and others hate it.

The trouble with GSR was not so much the romance itself but how it was handled by TPTB. They insisted on it being the centre of the show and it felt to me as a nonGSR fan, they were saying, "We really don't care about fans of the other characters, all we care about is GSR." It was sad. I know Billy was the star, but it was AN ENSEMBLE cast.

And on top of that the fans from the website whose name I dare not say were absolutely nasty to those who did not support GSR. It was a George W. Bush mentality of "You're either with us, or you are not a true fan of CSI." It was sad. One poster there said, "Oh the other characters can have their 'very special episodes' but the rest better be GSR." I mean come on, this show was not about GSR it was about a group of forensics crime fighters.

I can't wait for the day when True Hollywood Report tells us 'what really went on behind the scenes' because I know the whole romance caused a lot of friction on set because some of the actors felt their time was being wasted when they would come on set for a whole day only to do two lines.

Anyways, that's my reason for not supporting the almighty GSR-TPTB and SOME of the fans-most GSR fans were reasonable, but others were just nasty and posted things about how the fans of other characters were 'stupid' and such.

It's too bad, really. Maybe someday I'll be able to watch CSI and GSR and not feel inclined to push the FAST Forward button every time a GSR scene comes on.
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I really could not have said it any better myself. I agree 99.9%. The only thing I'm not sure about is the "friction on set" situation. As much as I'm sure it happened, we'll never know until, like you said, a behind the scenes expose is done. Like GE's article.

I am a non-GSR fan. Partially because I disliked the characters and partially because it felt like all roads led to GSR. Especially during the middle of season nine when there were ten episodes dedicated to Gil's personal grief. The whole team lost Warrick, and they are focusing on Grissom's girlfriend walking out...AGAIN? I understand when some people say that "That was the final straw for Grissom", but it is an ensemble show.

I think alot of truth came to light came from GE's article with AOL. It uncovered alot of emotions and feelings from one part of the team. I know there is three sides to every story(in this case, about fifteen), but it still shed light on how GE's felt. They knew WP was leaving so they shoved him down our throats. I personally believe that is why WP along with GSR was forced on many of us towards the end; because TPTB didn't care what fans wanted to see.

There is a constant argument over whether SOME or MOST fans wanted GSR (I think it's SOME). But regardless, TPTB can't make everyone happy. But I know for a fact that their number one priority was making sure the big kahuna(WP) was happy. And they did just that. AS myfuturecsi said, I know WP was the star, but it is(was) still and ensemble cast. Or at least, it was supposed to be:rolleyes:.

When a romantic pairing dominates more airtime in a procedural drama than the actual investigation, it is no longer a procedural drama; its a soap opera.
 
I think alot of truth came to light came from GE's article with AOL. It uncovered alot of emotions and feelings from one part of the team. I know there is three sides to every story(in this case, about fifteen), but it still shed light on how GE's felt. They knew WP was leaving so they shoved him down our throats. I personally believe that is why WP along with GSR was forced on many of us towards the end; because TPTB didn't care what fans wanted to see.
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I don't think GE meant for it to come out the way it did. However, there was an article a year before that where both GE and Gary Dourdan expressed discontent about having to come onto the set for only two lines.
And I can see Jorja being a bit of a complainer when it came to wanting all the screentime and then ironically she bails on the show. So I have no idea why she was so gung ho on GSR only to walk out on it. Can you imagine that. You sit around all day long for two lines while your co-stars hog up the limelight and then not bother showing up on set because they don't want to film a death scene for theri character. It was like whatever Jorja Fox wanted, TPTB gave. Then she bailed on the show anyways!

As I said, I would have been happy with GSR had it not been the be all and end all of CSI through season seven. I don't think any ship should dominate a show whether it would be GSR or if in the future Wedges. Heck I wouldn't even want my ship Nick/Mandy to dominate the show.

Poor George, he got nailed to the cross for those comments. OH and if someone wants to PM about this, please do so. I'd rather not see links to the website which shall not be mentioned. Then I wouldn't have to notify the admins about it. Really. Talk to me about it. My door is always open. Thanks.


Better yet, let's move on to more interesting topics than GSR which is pretty much dead in the water at this point since they've left the show!

Wedges..did anyone see the cute little scene in the finale with Hodges and Wendy when Hodges talked about porn..those two are so darn cute!
 
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