** Season 10 Spoiler Lab - Take Two **

[DCHC4ever]

Well this seems to be something many fans have been asking for and asking for. According to information on this site Evan E. will be reprising his role of Kyle Harman, aka Horatio Caine's son in episode 12 in early January. The episode is called "Friendly Fire". While the murder under investigation has to do with the inventor or a gun. The gun is supposedly faulty and someone is still trying to sell it to the military. Where does Kyle fit in? Is he hurt? Does he hurt someone else though it is not his fault? Is there a totally unrelated reason?

 

[silentdisco]

Calleigh looking like a ho, & Eric acting like a stupid fool.

Your internalized sexism is showing.

I'm sorry, but...wait, I'm not sorry, actually. I shouldn't have to apologize for this: I find your casual labeling of Calleigh as "looking like a ho" extremely offensive. And I'd be offended no matter who you put this label on, even if I wasn't particularly a fan of the character, so don't even try to pull a "you're just mad because not everybody likes your favorite character".

How is Calleigh acting like a ho? She has relationships? She's gone out with more than some bullshit number of guys that YOU deem is acceptable? She kisses them? Has sex? GOD FORBID, I'M CLUTCHING MY PEARLS! She's not sleeping with a new person every night, and even if she was, SO FUCKING WHAT? She's an adult who can make her own choices, and her value as a person should NOT be determined by her sexuality.

Once again: A PERSON, MALE OR FEMALE (but especially female, since they're the ones that suffer from the negative consequences of slut-shaming), IS NOT DEFINED BY THE NUMBER OF SEXUAL PARTNERS THEY'VE HAD, THE KIND OF SEX THEY HAVE OR DON'T HAVE, AND THE PEOPLE WITH WHOM THEY HAVE OR DON'T HAVE SEX WITH.

I know it may seem like I'm blowing up over nothing, but the truth is, this is a serious issue. Calling someone a "slut," "whore," or "ho" may seem harmless, but it's not. Casual use of these terms enforces the idea that women are worth less if they express their sexuality in certain ways. Jessica Valenti puts it best:

How many times has rape been discounted because a woman was deemed a slut? How many times are women called whores while their partners beat them? How often are women’s sexual histories used against them in workplace harassment cases? The sexual double standard is a lot more dangerous than we’d like to think.

 

[snowbunny]

I just read they are bringing Kyle back for the 12th episode in early 2012, I think the episodes name is "Friendly Fire" and they say there may be another return later on as well. It seems someones requests are being answered. That's good.

I read the spoilers about E/C and I really don't think when they say that Eric slowly gets involved with the suspect from epi 4 they mean in a romantic way. Eric in seasons 1-4 maybe but even that is a far stretch, but not the Eric post brain injury. I think he just gets wrapped up trying to help her in a non-sexual way. Being involved with someone doesn't mean you're sleeping with them. And we all know how over blown a lot of the spoilers tend to be, especially when they come from O'Brien.

But I do have to say I'm tired of the drama, TPTB just need to piss or get off the pot already.

 

[mjszud]

Calleigh looking like a ho, & Eric acting like a stupid fool.

Your internalized sexism is showing.

I'm sorry, but...wait, I'm not sorry, actually. I shouldn't have to apologize for this: I find your casual labeling of Calleigh as "looking like a ho" extremely offensive. And I'd be offended no matter who you put this label on, even if I wasn't particularly a fan of the character, so don't even try to pull a "you're just mad because not everybody likes your favorite character".

How is Calleigh acting like a ho? She has relationships? She's gone out with more than some bullshit number of guys that YOU deem is acceptable? She kisses them? Has sex? GOD FORBID, I'M CLUTCHING MY PEARLS! She's not sleeping with a new person every night, and even if she was, SO FUCKING WHAT? She's an adult who can make her own choices, and her value as a person should NOT be determined by her sexuality.

Once again: A PERSON, MALE OR FEMALE (but especially female, since they're the ones that suffer from the negative consequences of slut-shaming), IS NOT DEFINED BY THE NUMBER OF SEXUAL PARTNERS THEY'VE HAD, THE KIND OF SEX THEY HAVE OR DON'T HAVE, AND THE PEOPLE WITH WHOM THEY HAVE OR DON'T HAVE SEX WITH.

I know it may seem like I'm blowing up over nothing, but the truth is, this is a serious issue. Calling someone a "slut," "whore," or "ho" may seem harmless, but it's not. Casual use of these terms enforces the idea that women are worth less if they express their sexuality in certain ways. Jessica Valenti puts it best:

How many times has rape been discounted because a woman was deemed a slut? How many times are women called whores while their partners beat them? How often are women’s sexual histories used against them in workplace harassment cases? The sexual double standard is a lot more dangerous than we’d like to think.

Good grief, we're talking about characters on a television show. If you can't ignore my posts or let them roll off your shoulders, then perhaps you should step away from the keyboard for a bit. This is the place to discuss spoilers - not to go off on other posters for speaking thier mind.

~~~

Good to hear that Kyle's coming back.

 

[D&Daddict]

....Calleigh looking like a ho, & Eric acting like a stupid fool.

The main reason why I rarely post in these general threads is because I don't like all the negativity... but I had to step in.
While I'm all for each one of us having our own opinion and the right to express them freely, what I cannot tolerate is name calling and being disrespectful, both to the actors and their fans... it is unacceptable.
Calling someone a "ho" or "stupid" is by no means considered expressing an opinion, or "speaking their mind"

 

[Hollyyo]

Oh my goodness. This is out of hand. Let's talk about Kyle.

I'm EXCITED he's coming back!! I've always loved Evan and that storyline. I wish we could see him a little more.

 

[vegaslights]

....Calleigh looking like a ho, & Eric acting like a stupid fool.

The main reason why I rarely post in these general threads is because I don't like all the negativity... but I had to step in.
While I'm all for each one of us having our own opinion and the right to express them freely, what I cannot tolerate is name calling and being disrespectful, both to the actors and their fans... it is unacceptable.
Calling someone a "ho" or "stupid" is by no means considered expressing an opinion, or "speaking their mind"

The characters are FICTIONAL. The actors are real. mjszud was referring to a character, not the actress. It's a fair criticism. Let's face it, these people are professionals and sometimes the way they dress is eye boggling.

 

[silentdisco]

Good grief, we're talking about characters on a television show. If you can't ignore my posts or let them roll off your shoulders, then perhaps you should step away from the keyboard for a bit.

Here's a great idea- don't say offensive shit, and I won't have to call you out on it.

I can't let slut-shaming roll of my shoulders because it's hurtful and offensive, even in the context of TV characters. TV is influenced by society and vice versa. Attitudes we have about fictional characters often mirror attitudes we have or have had about real people. I seriously doubt you've never passed negative judgement on a real person (especially a female) because of their sexual history.

This is the place to discuss spoilers - not to go off on other posters for speaking thier mind.

So if I said something racist, it's okay because "I'm just speaking my mind!" Yeah, no, it doesn't work like that. You didn't just speak your mind- you said something offensive and hurtful that contributes to a culture that shames women for being too sexual.

 

[Jennifer]

Calleigh looking like a ho, & Eric acting like a stupid fool.

Your internalized sexism is showing.

I'm sorry, but...wait, I'm not sorry, actually. I shouldn't have to apologize for this: I find your casual labeling of Calleigh as "looking like a ho" extremely offensive. And I'd be offended no matter who you put this label on, even if I wasn't particularly a fan of the character, so don't even try to pull a "you're just mad because not everybody likes your favorite character".

How is Calleigh acting like a ho? She has relationships? She's gone out with more than some bullshit number of guys that YOU deem is acceptable? She kisses them? Has sex? GOD FORBID, I'M CLUTCHING MY PEARLS! She's not sleeping with a new person every night, and even if she was, SO FUCKING WHAT? She's an adult who can make her own choices, and her value as a person should NOT be determined by her sexuality.

Once again: A PERSON, MALE OR FEMALE (but especially female, since they're the ones that suffer from the negative consequences of slut-shaming), IS NOT DEFINED BY THE NUMBER OF SEXUAL PARTNERS THEY'VE HAD, THE KIND OF SEX THEY HAVE OR DON'T HAVE, AND THE PEOPLE WITH WHOM THEY HAVE OR DON'T HAVE SEX WITH.

I know it may seem like I'm blowing up over nothing, but the truth is, this is a serious issue. Calling someone a "slut," "whore," or "ho" may seem harmless, but it's not. Casual use of these terms enforces the idea that women are worth less if they express their sexuality in certain ways. Jessica Valenti puts it best:

How many times has rape been discounted because a woman was deemed a slut? How many times are women called whores while their partners beat them? How often are women’s sexual histories used against them in workplace harassment cases? The sexual double standard is a lot more dangerous than we’d like to think.

Good grief, we're talking about characters on a television show. If you can't ignore my posts or let them roll off your shoulders, then perhaps you should step away from the keyboard for a bit. This is the place to discuss spoilers - not to go off on other posters for speaking thier mind.

~~~

Good to hear that Kyle's coming back.[/QUOTE]

....Calleigh looking like a ho, & Eric acting like a stupid fool.

The main reason why I rarely post in these general threads is because I don't like all the negativity... but I had to step in.
While I'm all for each one of us having our own opinion and the right to express them freely, what I cannot tolerate is name calling and being disrespectful, both to the actors and their fans... it is unacceptable.
Calling someone a "ho" or "stupid" is by no means considered expressing an opinion, or "speaking their mind"

Oh my goodness. This is out of hand. Let's talk about Kyle.

I'm EXCITED he's coming back!! I've always loved Evan and that storyline. I wish we could see him a little more.

NO, Hollyyo, lets not talk about Kyle. Lets talk about mjszud and her cowardly act of calling Calleigh a "ho", getting called out on her d**k-move and then acting like she was all innocent with her "... but its a fictional character we're talking about" weak defense.

I rarely come to these forums for 2 reasons... (1) the double standard in what is acceptable in one section of these threads and what is acceptable in other sections, and (2) the utter hatred that is spewed and tolerated. But this angered me enough that I had to step in.

If you have a valid argument, state it and back it up when it is challenged... but when you bring hate into the act, or make accusations based upon that hate, and when called on it you can't support it and give such a weak a** defense, then you've gone too far. Calleigh is by far NOT a 'ho', and for you to call her one is unacceptable. And I don't care one iota whether or not Calleigh is real or a fictional character. You said it. You meant it. And if you want to call someone out for getting pissed about your dumba** generalization about a fictional character, then you yourself are just as much of jerk for hating a fictional character enough to call her a 'ho' for *gasp* having a relationship with a guy.

Perhaps if you can't ignore posts about a relationship you can't stand, or let them roll off your shoulders, then perhaps you should step away from the keyboard for a bit.

And...SpookyLights...
Please... show me where Calleigh has dressed in an "eye boggling" way any time within the past several years. I'd like to see it.

 

[D&Daddict]

... mjszud was referring to a character, not the actress. It's a fair criticism.

Spookylights, with all due respect, I don't agree that describing people/characters as "ho"s and "stupid" constitutes a "fair criticism"... It's called "name calling"!

 

[vegaslights]

... mjszud was referring to a character, not the actress. It's a fair criticism.

Spookylights, with all due respect, I don't agree that describing people/characters as "ho"s and "stupid" constitutes a "fair criticism"... It's called "name calling"!

It's a fictional character! Good God, what is so hard about understanding that? You guys are going to take offense over a person that is not real? C'mon now.

 

[GregNickRyanFan]

about Kyle.

I'm EXCITED he's coming back!! I've always loved Evan and that storyline. I wish we could see him a little more.

I agree, Holly. I'm so glad to hear that Kyle is returning. I can't wait to see those scenes. I loved his last scene with Horatio when he went back to the army or whatever. So sweet. I wish there was more about what he'll be doing in this episode.

 

[miamirocks]

Wow - let's all take a deep breath! I'm not sure "yelling" (in an internet-like way ) and getting angry at someone who's offended you is a good way of trying to bring peace to the situation. (And certainly not calling them a jerk - at least the first comments were about a fictional character - the "jerk" comment was about mjszud, and that definitely wasn't called for. It's kind of hypocritical - let's simmer down!) So there was some vocabulary that was not very PC or even offensive. My thing is, I see stuff like that quite often, even on these boards, and honestly I didn't think twice when I saw the word "stupid" or "ho" was used - to me they are just kinda throw-away words compared to more vulgar language. However, I guess we all should be a little more attentive to things, although - and I can't speak for her - but I think mjszud didn't mean any offense - she was venting and it happens. I've known her on these boards for a long time and she's never come off as disrespectful to me. Just my two cents.

Second (language aside) - some may believe that it doesn't matter if a person is sleeping with a different person every night or whatever, but some people do and their opinions should be respected too. Some people find it offensive that someone would sleep with a different person every night (not that I'm saying Cal is, but just in general) - and as long as they're not using offensive language, I think they have a right to that opinion, too. Again, just my two cents.

OK...back to spoilers.

YAY! KYLE IS BACK!! I feel like all our posts were actually heard on this one! How many times have people been asking for this? This is great news, and I'm so glad Kyle will be returning. I'm interested to see how he'll be involved in the case - sounds strange. Hope he's OK - I wouldn't want him to come back just to be killed off or anything...Besides, he brings out a great side to Horatio.

 

[silentdisco]

... mjszud was referring to a character, not the actress. It's a fair criticism.

Spookylights, with all due respect, I don't agree that describing people/characters as "ho"s and "stupid" constitutes a "fair criticism"... It's called "name calling"!

It's a fictional character! Good God, what is so hard about understanding that? You guys are going to take offense over a person that is not real? C'mon now.

Yes, and I won't apologize for being offended. Is it hard to understand that TV shows don't exist in a vacuum? That calling a fictional character a "ho" isn't really that different from calling a real person one? At the very least, it's enforcing the idea that it's okay to judge women, fictional or not, by their sexual behavior. I don't think that mjszud meant "Calleigh looks like a ho" as a compliment.

Bottom line: calling fictional characters derogatory terms like "ho" only enforces the idea that it's acceptable to make negative judgements about women based on their sexual history. It perpetuates a culture of shaming women into feeling bad about their sexual choices. And I find that offensive.

 

[Finch]

There are a couple of overlapping issues here, so I'll touch upon both.

1. It's been said, but fictional characters ARE NOT REAL PEOPLE and thus is not, nor has it ever been against the board rules to criticize a fictional character. Usually it's good form to elaborate on the aforementioned criticism (and it's something I would have preferred to see here) but if we're getting offended over make-believe people and jumping on other posters like this, I think it's time to log off for a while and get some fresh air. There are really more important things in life than getting worked up over CSI:Miami with a bunch of strangers, and I'm sure many know that.

I don't agree that describing people/characters as "ho"s and "stupid" constitutes a "fair criticism"... It's called "name calling"!

Speaking from an official standpoint, 'name calling' with regards to a fictional character is not against the board rules as I've said above so we're not going to jump and censor it. And I think mj can distinguish between a character and an actress, so I don't believe she was referring to the actual actress, the social implications aside as I'm concerned principarly with this forum right now and not the shortcomings of society.

I do realize, however that the issue of how women are portrayed in the media and globally is an important one for many people, so understand that I'm not missing the points raised about that but this entire situation has gone a little overboard and probably could have been handled differently.

You're free to disagree with a poster and everyone is entitled to their opinion as well as to contribute to the discussion, but it's not okay to attack someone (ie: sling insults) over one comment that I'm sure could have been elaborated had someone asked for clarification (whether it would have helped or hurt remained to be seen, at any rate).

2. Stuff like this:

And if you want to call someone out for getting pissed about your dumba** generalization about a fictional character, then you yourself are just as much of jerk for hating a fictional character enough to call her a 'ho' for *gasp* having a relationship with a guy.

*emphasis mine

Totally unacceptable behaviour here.

It's up to the poster reading these forums whether they become offended over something said, or whether they let it go as I think there's a certain degree of subjectivity when wading through discussion. If you think that someone has crossed a line in accordance with the rules at TalkCSI, contact a moderator so that we can review it (if we haven't already) instead of responding if one is unable to respond with a cool head. I know it's tempting to go off on someone and trust me, I've been there, but it usually ends like it has tonight and it's why I'm closing this thread temporarily so that we can evaluate the matter and allow everyone some time to cool down.

Closed.