Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** I think it's pretty obvious that David and Emily don't get along. I've heard horror stories about David's temper tantrums on the set (I heard about one today, actually), so I'm not surprised. And everyone I know who's met Emily tells me she's the sweetest person on the planet, so there ya go. It started out as a rumor, but at this point it's pretty hard to deny it's true. In that sense the lack of H/C scenes don't bother me, because when there ARE H/C scenes all I keep thinking is how much the actors dislike each other and it really comes through in their performance (they're never in the same frame, anyway, so Emily probably only interacts with David's stand-in and vice versa).
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** Hello miamirocks I do understand what you’re saying, however, Horatio hasn't suddenly been pulling away, he's been pulling away since Rio, so his sentiments towards Calleigh during “Going Under” (the episode directly after “Rio”) was perfectly understandable to me because he hadn’t had the chance to completely back away at that point. I think Eric’s incident was the final nail in the coffin, because that’s when there was nothing like the interaction at all between Calleigh and Horatio that we’ve had before and he was rather curt towards her in “No Man’s Land” when she asked him what they were going to do. This too was an indicator to me on how affected Horatio was by it all. I think Calleigh and Horatio do still have their friendship, only it's changed for the moment and I think definitely because both of them have been changed by certain events that have happened to them both. Also, if we were to take 25 episodes as being real time, it would be just over a year that has elapsed and so, in all honesty, things would still be a bit raw from Horatio in certain circumstances. However, having said that, there have been some glimpses of late that Horatio is making a slight return to what he was like before, such as his words to Ryan and what he did for him, his backing Calliegh in this episode and the promise he makes to Stetler about making sure that she is proven right and what not, but, in reality, it does take time. You’re right, Horatio does show some amount of concern towards Yelena when she returns in the episode ‘Burned’, but, again, in my opinion, it is considerably diluted compared to what their relationship was like before and yet also, in all honesty, Y and H do have a stronger, perhaps deeper, certainly longer history than H and C has and it’s a lot more complicated too. Still, having said that, to me, there were no undercurrent tones of a possible relationship brewing on the horizon for H and Y back then, though maybe that could be more to do with, in my opinion, a clear cut case of it seeming improper to want such a thing after Ray’s death rather than it exclusively being Horatio withdrawing emotionally. And in “Dangerous Son”, H basically used Y to find out what she could about Kyle, because even their chat about Kyle and Julia was instigated by Y and H’s responses were to the point and lacked the same emotion I’ve seen from H in the past when it came to family – and I think this lack of real emotion when discussing Kyle and Julia should have been an indicator of just how far he had withdrawn. Was it also this episode where Yelena remarks that Horatio hasn’t visited Ray Jnr and her for a while? I’m not sure. In my opinion, I don’t think Horatio has an out-and-out aversion towards Calleigh, but I do agree that he does have an aversion towards working closely with her, but I honestly think that’s all to do with his own situation rather than anything to do with Calleigh herself. I do agree that it would be nice if the SWs did address this lack of communication between the two with a verbal chat between them, just to settle things once and for all, but, for me, it’s not completely necessary, not when I look at what’s happened to Calleigh, who and what has influenced her, (Jake, Delko, Hagen's death and her Promotion), and what not – and also when you take into consideration what’s happened to the team and also what’s happened to Horatio. But, as said, I do miss their friendship and flirtations and good humour, but I also have faith that it will return, it’s just that it may take a bit more time to show because of what’s happening to Horatio and also what is now being shown concerning the Calleigh character.
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** I don't think last night was out of character for Calleigh. She's been keeping shit bottled up inside for so long that it was just a matter of time before she exploded. I didn't think she was being arrogant or obnoxious about the whole thing. I think it makes sense that she's overly sensitive about people accusing her of having her judgment impaired because of alcohol, given what she's gone through with her dad. The lack of interaction between Horatio and Calleigh doesn't worry me at all, because first of all, I've never liked Horatio, but also, I never thought their scenes were worth much to begin with. Fine, it'd be nice if they had some interaction if only for the sake of realism, but if you want realism, you're watching the wrong show.
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** To be honest, somethingsdont, it's not realism, it's believability in characters and what's going on with them, or in this case, with Calleigh and Horatio, what's not going on with them. How you managed to translate that into someone wanting 'realism' bemuses me.
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** Realism would make the characters and their interactions believable, so I don't see why you're picking on semantics and missing my point. There's so little about this show that is believable (e.g. events that lack realism) in the first place. My opinion is that Horatio and Calleigh's interactions bring nothing to the show, the same way you might not like how they're pushing personal/romantic relationships onto the characters.
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** What I think is we don't see too much of Calleigh and H because something big will come at the end of this season between this two...
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** somethingsdont - Hmm, I wouldn't call it semantics to be honest, because you can have a believable character in amongst an unbelievable situation, which I think might be a good description of CSI Miami. In my opinion, from your first post, your usage of 'realism' was used to describe a situation, whereas I have been talking about believability of character, which is why I replied as I did. In all honesty, I think Horatio and Calleigh's interactions brought a lot to the show, if only because they gave a certain depth to both characters and their relationship, and from that how they handled themselves when working a case together. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, which is why I never questioned yours in the first place, but it does appear that our opinions differ greatly Still, my apologies for taking this wildly off-topic.
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** I wanna put my 2 cents worth in on this Horatio and Calleigh interaction issue...or rather the lack of interaction. I think there should've been at least one, maybe 2 scenes with Horatio and Calleigh talking and interacting with each other. Here's why I think that. There was a scene where Stetler told Horatio "it's nothing personal." Horatio said "you're going after a member of my team." What I got from Horatio's response to Stetler was "you're going after a member of my team. I take that personally. So, yeah it's personal." If Horatio cares so much about "his team" and is so protective of "his team", then to me, it would make senses that him and Calleigh would have at least one or 2 scenes together. I'm starting to wonder, myself, if there is some kind of off-camera fued or spat going on between David Caruso and Emily Procter. The last interaction between Calleigh and Horatio I can remember and would call "memorable" was in season 5's Going Under where Calleigh was run off the road into that pond (lake, swamp, river...whatever). After she got out of the sunken Hummer, she was sitting on the ground between a little dirt road and the pond (lake, swamp, river...whatever). Horatio told her he didn't want her to move till the paramedics checked her out. I think somewhere in that conversation Horatio called Calleigh sweetheart. I'm hoping it's the characters and not the actors that's the reason for the lack of interaction between Horatio and Calleigh. If the writers strike ends soon, they could write an episode for later in season 6 that has a flashback that explains Horatio and Calleigh's lack of interaction. Maybe they had some kind of big blow up and they're trying to keep it from Eric, Ryan, Frank, Natalia and Alexx. So they've decided to be civil to each other. And their ideal of being civil is to avoid each other as much as possible. One last thing on this Horatio/Calleigh interaction business: if you go back and watch the season one episode KILL ZONE on DVD. There were very few scenes where Horatio and Calleigh weren't working together. It was almost like they were handcuffed to each with a pair of handcuffs no one had a key to.
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** I totally agree with u that Calleigh wasn`t out of character. Even Stetler to try make his work I can understand why she lose control there. Everyone have theirs limit and exploded in the end. Calleigh go through a lot in this epi and in the end she just start scream. Emilly do more then great job this week, as do Addam. Also I too don`t bother at all form the lack of interaction between Horatio and Calleigh. As a whole H don`t have any interaction with his team from long time. And most of the time when H have some kind of interaction the scene is thoughtless. The show don`t have to be focus only at H. It`s good that the rest characters of this show have chance for some development, not only to be in shadow. For me as far away they stay from H the things work better. Also I`m glad that this way have more screen time for Eric and Call. I don`t understand what have to do the discussion of this week epi with Yelina name in it ?! And what don`t make sense to me is to compare H/Yelina and H/Call screentime. ?! After all Yelina is part of H character and Call is only H`s work colleague. Two big different things. As I remeber right in the Shipper Central forum of this board have Horatio/Calleigh thread and if I want to read some fanfiction thoughts to why they have lack of interaction I`ll go there. Uhhh this is still Miami forum and runing epi thread, right ?
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** I agree, it really doesn't bother me either. I used to hold the Horatio character in much higher regard, but post Season 3, he has aggravated me no end. In my opinion, the writer Steve Maeda made Horatio far more sympathetic. Since his departure from the show, H hasn't been the same at all in my eyes. Calleigh however, rocks! I don't really mind who she interacts with. She always shines and I thought her portrayal was entirely in character this week. Again, agreed, hence the fact I haven't missed it really. The ratings for Monday's episode were pretty high apparently, so I doubt the lack of Horatio/Calleigh screentime is effecting the show's performance. I think many people tuned in for the Calleigh drama, after seeing the promos. As has been said, it may have seemed more natural in the circumstances if H had asked her if she was okay, but did it bother me that he didn't? Not at all.
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** Hey - just wanted to reply to a few commments about our posts here: Pusher: Hey, easy. I'm not looking to push a ship or anything. If this were Season 2 and Eric and Speed, who were good friends, had suddenly stopped working together, I'd complain about that too. I see it as the same thing. I'm calling TPTB out on continuity - they set up a friendship between H/C - much like Grissom and Cat or Mac and Stella - and now, a ll of a sudden there's no interaction at all? That seems rediculous. Mentioning Yelina was only a way of comparison - she's not a regular on the show anymore, and yet she and H have had more screen time than H and Cal, who work together every day. It's just odd - I'm not dissing the ship - I actually liked the Season 1-3 relationship between H and Yelina. (I was miffed and confused when they wrote her off the show.) I think mentioning character interaction is totally valid here, and I try not to get "shippy," and I'm sure the mods would let me know if I'm getting too off-topic (I apologize if I am). SwanSwan_H: Umm...I don't know if you've compared the ratings from the past two years with the first three seasons, but you'll see a sharp decline in Seasons 5 and 6 (which, incidentally is when H started pulling away from the team, including Calleigh.) Bottom line - I'm not trying to diss any ship , I'm just stating the facts here. Watch the first four seasons, and you'll see H and Cal having a close relationship and being there for each other - I could list several episodes that evidence this, but I don't want to bore you guys. Now there's no interaction between these two, and it makes no sense based on their past - they work together, she's his second in command. There needs to be an explanation. (BTW - If Cal and Eric suddenly stopped having scenes together, I think a lot of people here would flip out, and understandably so. I'd call TPTB out on that too. So I hope you can try and understand where I'm coming from.)
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** I'm linking this here only because it relates to the discussion regarding "Stand Your Ground" and the lack of interaction between Horatio and Calleigh (as in non-existent). From TV Guide (courtesy of Dojo's Blog) http://community.tvguide.com/blog/Dojos-Blog/800056801
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** i give a 8/10 to the episode..and a 10/10to emily's work!she was amazing! but i have a doubt and i think that i'm not alone! the distance between calleigh an horatio after "man down" episode" until now it's an authors decision or maybe there's somenthing else??? everybody knows that david caruso have a bad-tempered but..is it possible that emily and david have some problems??? i mean...emily is the sweetest person in all the world... it's impossible fight with her...but it's to strange this freezing cold between the main characters of the show
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** If Caruso and Procter really do have an issue, I think the writers are handling the sitaution very well as far as accomidating them with shooting and interaction and as long as the writers are willing to accomidate them...I don't think there will be a problem long term. The fact that it has been going for 26 episodes should be enough to tell you that it isn't much of a problem from the writers standpoint and they are willing to work around any issue, if there is one. The two do scenes together when needed, like in Man Down. H seems more concerned these days with being Dirty Harry than he does with the actual investigating of a crime. I just feel the more attention we(fans) draw to it the worse it could get. If there is an issue and they wish to keep it private, let them. By exposing the problem to the press it could cause one or more of the actors to leave the show....then where will we be? IDK that is just my opinion. To be honest, I feel indifferent to it...whether or not DC and EP interact on the show is not the reason I watch the show nor is it high on my "what could be done differently with this show" list.
Re: Episode #609: 'Stand Your Ground' ***CONTAINS SPOILERS** I couldn't agree with you more delkolover. In all honesty, I am missing the interaction, but the distance between Calleigh and Horatio I think is explainable, but like yourself, it wasn't and certainly isnt the only reason I watch CSI Miami. As long as they keep to the character establishments and explain any out-of-character occurrences, then I'll keep watching and being entertained without complaint.