CSI:NY Season 6 Spoiler Discussion - Start Spreading the News!

[La_Guera]

Flack's personal problem(alcoholism)

Since when? So, grieving your girlfriend's violent murder by drinking too much makes you and alcoholic and a "chronic screw-up? Guess they've retconned the perfect service record into oblivion. Fuck you, TPTB.

 

[Elwood21]

Thanks for the Belga link, some nice pics. Also some with Laurence Fishburne; not at all surprising they'd fly him out to get some shots of him being Not In Vegas anymore. Fun stuff.

 

[PerfectAnomaly]

Flack's personal problem(alcoholism)

Since when? So, grieving your girlfriend's violent murder by drinking too much makes you and alcoholic and a "chronic screw-up? Guess they've retconned the perfect service record into oblivion. Fuck you, TPTB.

It all depends on how much of a time jump we're talking here. The premiere was a month after the shooting, so they could showing that Flack has been hitting the bottle way too hard for an extended period of time and he could be screwing up his work for an extended period of time. Getting drunk a few times grieving your dead girlfriend doesn't make you an alcoholic and having a few tough days at work after that doesn't make you a screw-up; but if you let alcohol be your crutch and it impairs your ability to function you are an alcoholic and if you've been having major issues at work for months on end you are a "chronic-screw up."

It doesn't mean Flack has always been that way and TPTB are retconning his past stellar record. People aren't concerned with how great you've been in the past. It's what you're doing now that's going to get the attention.

Plus, Flack is also dealing with the fact that he killed a man in cold blood out of revenge. That's going to factor into this story as well hopefully and will have an impact on how well he does his job and how he deals with it emotionally.

 

[La_Guera]

Flack's personal problem(alcoholism)

Since when? So, grieving your girlfriend's violent murder by drinking too much makes you and alcoholic and a "chronic screw-up? Guess they've retconned the perfect service record into oblivion. Fuck you, TPTB.

It all depends on how much of a time jump we're talking here. The premiere was a month after the shooting, so they could showing that Flack has been hitting the bottle way too hard for an extended period of time and he could be screwing up his work for an extended period of time. Getting drunk a few times grieving your dead girlfriend doesn't make you an alcoholic and having a few tough days at work after that doesn't make you a screw-up; but if you let alcohol be your crutch and it impairs your ability to function you are an alcoholic and if you've been having major issues at work for months on end you are a "chronic-screw up."

It doesn't mean Flack has always been that way and TPTB are retconning his past stellar record. People aren't concerned with how great you've been in the past. It's what you're doing now that's going to get the attention.

Plus, Flack is also dealing with the fact that he killed a man in cold blood out of revenge. That's going to factor into this story as well hopefully and will have an impact on how well he does his job and how he deals with it emotionally.

Mmm, but given TPTB's past track record of failing to give viewers a hint of a character's slow deterioration, I'm not convinced the revelation that Flack is no longer doing his job effectively or safely or to his previously high standard won't be sprung out of nowhere. I'm betting Flack's CO just declares Flack has been a "chronic screw-up", as though it's been obvious to everyone for months even though no one's mentioned anything. And really, if Flack is "a chronic screw-up, which to me denotes a period of longer than, say, the six months that likely will have elapsed since Angell's death, then why is the CO covering for him at all? It makes no sense and reeks of yet another excuse to have Mac play the Big Damn Hero, even though I think Stella or Sam would be better candidates in this case. Hell, even Gavin Moran would make more sense.

 

[PerfectAnomaly]

Flack's personal problem(alcoholism)

Since when? So, grieving your girlfriend's violent murder by drinking too much makes you and alcoholic and a "chronic screw-up? Guess they've retconned the perfect service record into oblivion. Fuck you, TPTB.

It all depends on how much of a time jump we're talking here. The premiere was a month after the shooting, so they could showing that Flack has been hitting the bottle way too hard for an extended period of time and he could be screwing up his work for an extended period of time. Getting drunk a few times grieving your dead girlfriend doesn't make you an alcoholic and having a few tough days at work after that doesn't make you a screw-up; but if you let alcohol be your crutch and it impairs your ability to function you are an alcoholic and if you've been having major issues at work for months on end you are a "chronic-screw up."

It doesn't mean Flack has always been that way and TPTB are retconning his past stellar record. People aren't concerned with how great you've been in the past. It's what you're doing now that's going to get the attention.

Plus, Flack is also dealing with the fact that he killed a man in cold blood out of revenge. That's going to factor into this story as well hopefully and will have an impact on how well he does his job and how he deals with it emotionally.

Mmm, but given TPTB's past track record of failing to give viewers a hint of a character's slow deterioration, I'm not convinced the revelation that Flack is no longer doing his job effectively or safely or to his previously high standard won't be sprung out of nowhere. I'm betting Flack's CO just declares Flack has been a "chronic screw-up", as though it's been obvious to everyone for months even though no one's mentioned anything. And really, if Flack is "a chronic screw-up, which to me denotes a period of longer than, say, the six months that likely will have elapsed since Angell's death, then why is the CO covering for him at all? It makes no sense and reeks of yet another excuse to have Mac play the Big Damn Hero, even though I think Stella or Sam would be better candidates in this case. Hell, even Gavin Moran would make more sense.

I agree about Mac playing the BDH. That just needs to stop. I can see Flack being a chronic screw up for several months and it only coming to the absolute forefront in one episode. I think it would make sense for people to have cut him some slack for the drinking because of what he's going through with the loss of Jess combined with his past unblemished record. But there comes a point when you have to call someone on the carpet for their behavior and if he's screwing up at work and his job is being a cop I don't think that time frame of leeway is going to be too long.

But you're right about them showing it. If they don't follow up with even brief glimpses of Flack drinking himself into oblivion and messing up on the job in the next six episodes it's gonna be really hard to swallow. So after all that round about rambling, I totally agree with you. :lol: :shifty:

 

[Elwood21]

In their eagerness to provide pithy circumstances, TPTB really do seem to be following in their old habits of thrusting all their wonderful developments out inna mass heap, with more suggestion than depiction as to what's led to them. I'll put that as par for them going for a certain omg!shock value to try and grab viewers.

For Flack. Man. If they'd just omitted the word "chronic" from all this, it would be a little easier to digest. I guess I might like to see the possible implication that it's the Flack family that's looked at as a chronic screw up, though that too would require a retconning of past material to make it fit. That Flack Sr., as well as Sam, and apparently now Don, have issues with using alcohol to cope. I would love to see Sam make a return here. The storyline is a perfect opportunity to have her back. It's too bad it sounds like that won't be the case.

For Mac. UberMac often does get up my nose. At the same time, I wanna see what they're gonna write up here. They're having no trouble taking the shine off Flack's gold badge, and my hope is that mebbe other characters won't be exempt either. Mac's already apparently lying to create some space for Don. (Nor does that equate outright with anything as extensive as 'Rescuing'). There could be a potential for the writers to have Mac less than squeaky clean here, and I suppose I'm fostering a naive hope, since they're going there with Flack, that the whole thing could be a little more grey and gritty for everyone involved.

I'm also looking at Flack and Mac, some similarities, and how they've helped their friends. Should Mac play a more prominent role in aiding Flack, how would that necessarily be so different than Flack going after Danny, with regards to Rikki and the gun? Flack bent the rules to give Danny some time to do what he felt he needed, and then went after him to help. This sounds like it could be Mac doing the same, though all that's indicated is a bit of cover. How can I look at Mac and Flack so differently here. Flack, at the time, was really looked at as the by-the-book straight up cop helping a friend as best he could, in circumstances labelling Danny as going off the ranch again. Because it's Flack in the deep this time, Mac can't be the one to do the same for him? What exactly is he supposed to do as a leader and a friend? Delegate his friendship? I get that Mac's airtime is often flying to the rescue, but I also can't begrudge the logic of his character being used to cover for Flack, using himself as a buffer on Don's behalf.

Should Sythe be portrayed as a challenging character and less a supportive one, then it could also make some sense to have Mac as a character of similar status butting heads than one who could be pressured or dismissed due to holding a lesser rank. Yes, if it's done up to be the predictable same-same for Mac, yet another confirmation of his place in the Superior Man 'Holla, Fame, then absolutely, my head already hurts and my eyeballs are on the floor rolling in disappointment at the contrived nature of Flack's alcoholism and Mac's superhuman tendencies both.

I'd actually love for the team's involvement in Flack's arc to be more widely shared, but I have my doubts how they'd balance that out with screentime and crimes to solve, etc, and so could see it more focused on one or two characters going to help him. I'm also glad to hear that Terence is somehow being included in the mix.

I'd have loved a primary to be Stella too, she was actually the first person I'd hoped would be written to help Don; but, if I'm looking for ways to stretch the characters a little, we already know she's quite willing to bend the rules come what may to pursue what she needs to. I wouldn't mind it being Sheldon, because he's not been challenged in that way so directly or as often, and he's also one who's typically come out unsullied regardless. Mac and Don have had some good scenes between them, and have also butted heads. If Don and Mac mix it up again, that could also be interesting. Who's to say Flack will welcome Mac's intervention; I doubt Flack would welcome anyone's, but therein lies the potential of some tension before recovery too. If this storyline additionally brings Mac as well as Flack into greyer territory, I think it could be a good change and a way to mix things up, a way to bring Mac off of that uber-plane he's often written on, even as the writers insist on dragging Flack thru the mud.

I won't deny a stone of dread in my stomach suspicious that NY hasn't improved or changed and that better teevee viewing hasn't a snowball's chance, but I do want to give the actual show a shot. I guess Imma sucker. But I suppose i'm not completely fed up and beyond hope for it yet. It's only been one eppie after all

-
eta/ ( PS. thanks very kindly FieryRed :alienblush: )

 

[FieryRed]

In their eagerness to provide pithy circumstances, TPTB really do seem to be following in their old habits of thrusting all their wonderful developments out inna mass heap, with more suggestion than depiction as to what's led to them. I'll put that as par for them going for a certain omg!shock value to try and grab viewers.

This is exactly what I have been saying!!! But sometimes I feel like that TPTB is "mixing the deck" but the combinations that are coming out are really weird, I mean really weird!!

PS: Elwoodd I <3 your linguistic skills

 

[talkingtocactus]

Getting drunk a few times grieving your dead girlfriend doesn't make you an alcoholic and having a few tough days at work after that doesn't make you a screw-up; but if you let alcohol be your crutch and it impairs your ability to function you are an alcoholic and if you've been having major issues at work for months on end you are a "chronic-screw up."

true - although i'm still of the opinion that even if you are using alcohol as a crutch and it's affecting your work, you're not necessarily a chronic (or even acute) screw up. it can get that way of course but i think it's sad when people think one instance of dependency (on drink, or whatever else) writes someone off. that's a horrible thought!

Mmm, but given TPTB's past track record of failing to give viewers a hint of a character's slow deterioration, I'm not convinced the revelation that Flack is no longer doing his job effectively or safely or to his previously high standard won't be sprung out of nowhere. I'm betting Flack's CO just declares Flack has been a "chronic screw-up", as though it's been obvious to everyone for months even though no one's mentioned anything.

but it has been alluded too i think in epilogue - there was the obvious scene of flack in the bar but also the more subtle scene at the shooting scene where mac gave him a "look" which seemed to suggest that at least one of them has noticed something's up. also, flack did sound a little slurry at that scene, i actually wondered if he was drunk right then, and that was the reason for mac's look. even so, i think it's hard to map a slow deterioration in only one episode, we'll have to see how much it's referred to in the episodes before the one where his boss talks to mac. also, these things can happen pretty fast, so maybe a slow deterioration isn't even that necessary.

 

[Cyn-B-Demented]

Wow.. would Stella have been less of an office slut if she'd had the one-nighter with Mac?

Not that I'm completely behind Adam/Stella or the coworker-dating-train (or Mac/Stella for that matter) either, but what's with the trend of labelling CSI characters as office sluts whenever they hook up with a coworker they're "not supposed to"? Calleigh and/or Natalia on Miami get slapped with the label (but never both by the same person); Sara on Vegass gets hit with it; now Stella? It's really a demeaning term, and I've never once seen an instance where it's been deserved. In the course of six years Stella's hooked up with two guys, and only one of them from the office - it's even less deserved with her.

I totally agree with you. But I see it like people would treat these characters like any woman from their workplace hooking up with a coworker. All the stereotypes of woman dating a guy from work would surface again, and it's just an never ending stupid cycle (she wants a raise, she's a whore, who's next on her list, blabla). That being said, I never thought Stella would date anyone from work because she's got some ethics too -- and now that she said it was just a one night stand, it made it seem even less like her. For her defence, she was overwhelmed and just like most women out there she found comfort where she could find it because the one she needed most wasn't there AGAIN, being selfish. And Adam would have never said no to her :lol: (like the majority of men, I suppose LOL). And since we're deep in stereotypes, ain't it weird that the man in the story never once been called anything?! It's ALWAYS the woman that get the wag of the finger and name calling, never the man. And what is most disgusting is that we, woman, are the one doing that to our sister.

I could almost see your point about Flack, though (although we probably can't assume he was sleeping with the girl at the second crime scene just because he gave her a flirty smile). But the spoilers for "Cuckoo's Nest" have me feeling excited about his player-bit now, because I feel like they're going somewhere with it. And that right there is probably why we never saw Flack with a comfort-moment at the end of "Epilogue" - he hasn't found it yet, and likely won't for a while.

That's what I'm thinking too. They're probably going to take it a step at a time with him. He did look too fresh for someone drinking and mourning but it was probably just for show. He looked in denial of the events in the finale and I refuse to think that he's out of it already. I'll keep my fingers cross for Flack. I haven't read the other episodes summary because I don't want to spoil the surprises :lol:

For Lindsay, all I have to say is oh, snap. And how it's beyond uncool that I can literally count on one hand the number of non-case-related words she said to anyone else on the team who wasn't Danny during this entire episode.:scream: Apparently it's still okay to sacrifice her individuality on the altar of D/L. But I did love Adam's "chiquita" line to an unhealthy degree.

Hahaha, I can count them on my fingers too. But I didn't expected anything else, really. I don't think any of us did either! My few hopes for a better Lindsay in S6 are a little bit shattered by that, I have to admit.

I've watched the episode 3 and a half times tonight and I'm still on the fence about Haylen, though I think I'm leaning toward liking her. She's not as much of a stereotype as I worried she'd be. I mean, I'm not too impressed that I think we're supposed to be seeing her as super-smart and cutely determined, like Mac and Stella do (even less impressed that the only way they could think of to demonstrate those traits is by having her show up Adam). But I like that she seems to know perfectly well how book-smart she is; she's very sure of herself, and if handled correctly that could actually turn out to be an interesting character flaw.

I'm totally liking Heylen. She's totally different from what I thought they made her to be on the show. Most people didn't like her because she was trying to steal Adam's job and was completely ballsy about it but that's exactly what I liked about her. It was not nice from her, granted, but it made her less Mary-Sue. And she does seem to know her stuff, indeed. Though I'm really wondering if she changed her voice for the role, pretty much just like AJ did?! :lol: Her voice really sounded high for me compared to that interview with her and AJ.

FWIW, I don't think that comment was meant with any malice at all.

But it was directed at me...No big deal, and again, my reply was not of a personal nature just my own response... I was not neither "gullable" or "amused" with the scene in referance to this comment.

Like Top41 said (and thanks for the support, by the way), NO malice was meant in my comment nor was it even personal! I seriously don't understand why you snapped at nothing. I was just laughing at the contrast of my joyful comments compared to yours. That what was amusing me. Very uncool attitude, I have to agree too... By the way, it just fictional characters on a television show -- I understand how frustrating it could be when they mess with your favourite character but at the end of the day, nothing from the show exist. Get over it.

 

[Lori K.]

I seriously don't understand why you snapped at nothing. I was just laughing at the contrast of my joyful comments compared to yours.

Huh? I guess I dont get the part where it wasnt personal, if you are comparing my comments to yours.. And like I said I ,Me Myself and I by the way, was not gullible (into thinking Stella cared enough about Adam to sleep with him) or found it humorus (as a Smack fan) I dont think any one was even referring to you

I was just laughing at the contrast of my joyful comments compared to yours. That what was amusing me.

I'm glad your so full of joy and easily amused

Very uncool attitude, I have to agree too... By the way, it just fictional characters on a television show -- I understand how frustrating it could be when they mess with your favourite character but at the end of the day, nothing from the show exist. Get over it.

Thanks for the scolding mom can you get over it now?

As I said from the very beginning I was not amused or gullible with the storyline go back and read the post Its really time to move on...

 

[Cyn-B-Demented]

Seriously, Lori, cut the tone and loose the attitude already. If you don't understand it, then move on yourself. If you have any further off-topic and unpleasant comment to make TO ME , you can hit the PM button (which you probably should have done in the first place if I said anything that could have offended you somehow?). Nobody likes unnecessary drama so let's get the conversation about CSI:NY starting again.

 

[perlnoir]

I also found this pic but not sure which episode... Could be the cross-over episode

This pic concern episode 6.08 Cuckoo's nest. ​

 

[Lori K.]

Nobody likes unnecessary drama so let's get the conversation about CSI:NY starting again.

I believe I already tried to do that once and as I said my original comment NEVER was dircted at you personally...Consider the case closed on this end...I'm getting bored with it.

For Flack. Man. If they'd just omitted the word "chronic" from all this, it would be a little easier to digest

But they want to stir things up. As far as the Flack storyline is conserned who ever elected to bring back Nelly is the one who makes the most sense.

__________________

 

[Cyn-B-Demented]

I was bored when it started, if you ask me. I'm not continuing the stupidity, just saying that we both agree about it.

Anyways, finally a conversation :

Perlnoir & michmac, I didn't read the summaries of the upcoming episodes but it's a nice picture. I'm curious as hell now that I've seen this picture but I must resist!!! :lol: Don't want to ruin the fun!

 

[Maya316]

Originally Posted by *lisasimpson*:
but it has been alluded too i think in epilogue - there was the obvious scene of flack in the bar but also the more subtle scene at the shooting scene where mac gave him a "look" which seemed to suggest that at least one of them has noticed something's up. also, flack did sound a little slurry at that scene, i actually wondered if he was drunk right then, and that was the reason for mac's look.

Heehee, I love finding out that it wasn't just me who noticed these kinds of things I saw Mac's look too, and that's when I started feeling better about the Player!Flack bit - I knew it was on purpose, and they're going to be addressing it sometime soon (and yeah, he was slurring just a little bit. He looked more than up to doing his job, so I don't think he was actually drunk, but I think he'd been drinking).

Originally Posted by Cyn-B-Demented:
Hahaha, I can count them on my fingers too. But I didn't expected anything else, really. I don't think any of us did either! My few hopes for a better Lindsay in S6 are a little bit shattered by that, I have to admit.

I of course think Lindsay's fine the way she is , but we've already got signs of a better Lindsay in S6 - a more mature one, anyway. I just don't want to see her improvement and character arc entirely limited to and/or orbiting around Danny only, or else I really will have to break my TV. And then complain loudly to TPTB. I know she'll probably have a lot on her own plate, but there're going to be several reasons that she could focus her energies on the other team members too; it'll be criminal if they let that potential go to waste.

I'm totally liking Heylen. She's totally different from what I thought they made her to be on the show. Most people didn't like her because she was trying to steal Adam's job and was completely ballsy about it but that's exactly what I liked about her. It was not nice from her, granted, but it made her less Mary-Sue. And she does seem to know her stuff, indeed. Though I'm really wondering if she changed her voice for the role, pretty much just like AJ did?! :lol: Her voice really sounded high for me compared to that interview with her and AJ.

I don't really notice the thing with her voice - it sounded the same to me as it did in the interview, although I've only watched the interview once. But yeah, I'm definitely liking Haylen as she is; she's not a Mary Sue yet! So much for being on the fence about her :lol: And I don't know if my feelings will change in the next few episodes: I know one of my pet peeves with Lindsay in S2 was how everyone but Danny seemed to love her - Danny was the one hope I had for her not being a Mary Sue, till I figured out the writers had a completely-shallow reason for him being the only one to not like her And I'm worried the exact same thing's happening here with Haylen and Adam, considering how Mac and Stella (and that one police officer she was talking to outside the office) seem to adore her already - it's one reason I'm actually glad for Stella/Adam right now.



And on the Flack-issue:

Originally Posted by Elwoo21:
For Flack. Man. If they'd just omitted the word "chronic" from all this, it would be a little easier to digest. I guess I might like to see the possible implication that it's the Flack family that's looked at as a chronic screw up, though that too would require a retconning of past material to make it fit. That Flack Sr., as well as Sam, and apparently now Don, have issues with using alcohol to cope. I would love to see Sam make a return here. The storyline is a perfect opportunity to have her back. It's too bad it sounds like that won't be the case.

See, I'm not having such trouble with Flack being labelled as a "chronic" screw-up - I mean, if he's actually shown constantly screwing up on the job in the next few episodes, then it's not going to be anything more than stating a fact. And I think the fact that they're having this senior Police Chief bring up the issue with Mac at all - as opposed to letting it pass with very little acknowledgment or more than a tiny p*ssing contest, like they've done before with Danny, Mac and even Hawkes to a slight extent - is TPTB recognizing that such "chronic" screwing-up is really OOC for Flack. I don't think it's supposed to be a reflection on either his behaviour from previous seasons, or his family.

And I'm re-watching all of Nelly's/Terrence's episodes right now, just so I can be prepared. I love the dynamic between him and Flack...and it makes perfect sense for him to still be helping Flack out, even with the contract between them having been terminated.