Could Canon Slash Work?

I kind of get your point Adzix. It would be sudden for people (ok, the majority) but it could work if you let the relationship built slowly. GSR was extremely sudden (and in our face). Of course everyone knew that Sara was in love with Grissom for years but showing them being in a relationship that had been going on for a while unknown to the viewers was more than sudden and didn't go down well with some viewers.

If TPTB decided to do the same thing to a slash couple I bet there'd be a lot of negative comments. BUT if they slowly built it, it could work.
Take N/G for example. They'd just have to increase the touching, the (subtle) flirting, send them on "dates" (watching football, basketball, playing video games, going on breakfast) and not that many people would be too surprised it they became involved.

I get your point, too, Deirdre. Just because there are some countries where gay relationships on TV aren't that big of a deal (and I'm glad I live in one :thumbsup:) there are others who might have a problem. And of course TPTB take that into consideration. I mean look at the US where a gay couple in a daily soap (Luke and Noah on As the World Turns) gets so much attention. In Germany we had gay couples on daily soaps for years, I basically grew up with them. No big deal.
 
love_fan said:
I kind of get your point Adzix. It would be sudden for people (ok, the majority) but it could work if you let the relationship built slowly. GSR was extremely sudden (and in our face). Of course everyone knew that Sara was in love with Grissom for years but showing them being in a relationship that had been going on for a while unknown to the viewers was more than sudden and didn't go down well with some viewers.

If TPTB decided to do the same thing to a slash couple I bet there'd be a lot of negative comments. BUT if they slowly built it, it could work.
Take N/G for example. They'd just have to increase the touching, the (subtle) flirting, send them on "dates" (watching football, basketball, playing video games, going on breakfast) and not that many people would be too surprised it they became involved.
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ITA. That would be the best way to handle a slash pairing. Well, actually, that would be the best way to handle any pairing. I personally found GSR kind of just ... jumped out at me and I'm pretty sure the writers could have handled it better. If they [TPTB] were learning from their mistakes, they'd have to write a relationship slow.
 
Adzix said:
well, i didn't really mean that the problem lies within their sexuality. to me Nick, Greg, Bobby or Henry could be gay, bi, or straight, and i don't think many people would be against the sole fact of it. (and to be exact i'm talking about LV only, i hardly ever watch the other 2 shows).


now to respond to all of you who are going to argue that they've seen many signs of homosexual preferences of some characters. sure there were some moments that could be interpreted that, for example, Nick and Greg are gay. heck, i think you could find as many moments with Grissom and Warrick together. the problem is, even though those scenes exist, the interest to the same sex has never been confirmed in any way. and it gets worse, you got both Nick and Greg talking about 'chicks' countless times.

again, i don't say Nick and Greg could not be gay. they definitely could be hiding it. the problem is, imo such storyline would be jumping the shark.

Bobby's case is a little different b/c he was actually suppossed to be gay (and probably is), it's just that the scene with him talking about his partner didn't make the final cut. i remember how Gerald was so excited about filming it. i bet he'll get another chance, though.

new characters are a different matter, and as i said, it would be interesting to see a slash ship with any of them canon.
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Well, there hasn't been any signs of aversion to homosexuality from really anyone on the show. Yeah, Nick seemed a bit weirded out in "Ch-ChChanges" when they went to that bar, but he never expressed an aversion to homosexuality or homosexual relationships at any point on the show, neither has Greg. I could see them making that stretch of one or both of them being bisexual quite easily. Honestly, IMO it's not that much of one.

love_fan said:
I kind of get your point Adzix. It would be sudden for people (ok, the majority) but it could work if you let the relationship built slowly. GSR was extremely sudden (and in our face). Of course everyone knew that Sara was in love with Grissom for years but showing them being in a relationship that had been going on for a while unknown to the viewers was more than sudden and didn't go down well with some viewers.

If TPTB decided to do the same thing to a slash couple I bet there'd be a lot of negative comments. BUT if they slowly built it, it could work.
Take N/G for example. They'd just have to increase the touching, the (subtle) flirting, send them on "dates" (watching football, basketball, playing video games, going on breakfast) and not that many people would be too surprised it they became involved.
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Wow, I'm glad I'm not the only one that thought that about GSr. It was like one or two episodes they're flirting a whole lot more, and then Boom, she walks out of Grissom's bathroom. Very unrealistic, IMO. Especially when I hear that the relationship is "Not New"

Other than the ethical issues that i'd outlined in the "Great Ship Debate" thread, I don't have too many other qualms about the GSr. I don't like the way it seems to have taken over the show, with other people's screentime and storylines seemingly getting sacrificed for GSr.

I think if they were to do a slash relationship, even something with ONE of the established characters, like Nick, Greg, Wendy, Hodges, Bobby, etc, they'd have to do it right, and make sure it didn't take over the show/be too abrupt. Ditto with two characters, like Nick/Greg, etc. Take it slowly, have them spending more time outside of work together and the like. Then, they can build it to an actual relationship. They don't even have to devote much screentime to it, just do a nod to it every now and then.
 
Exactly my point! It doesn't have to take over the show, doesn't need to become a main focus, just some more flirting, more subtext and ... boom (haha, no pun intended) they'd be on their way to a relationship.

I mean we've (well, not me yet) have seen Flack and Danny's "date" on NY, why not go further with it? If it's done right, no one will complain (much)!


ETA: About GSR, I'd preferred it if we'd seen them over dinner or something but that, that was too much! The best thing about that scene were definitely Sara's legs. I remember thinking, wow, nice legs, but Gil in that horrible robe. Way too much for my poor eyes!!
 
I get your point, too, Deirdre. Just because there are some countries where gay relationships on TV aren't that big of a deal (and I'm glad I live in one ) there are others who might have a problem.
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yeah, that's definitely true. and i think it should be respected on some level too. for instance if in one country the society is rather not too keen on homosexuals, it doesn't mean they are 'retarded' or '100 years behind'. other countries shouldn't press and tell them what to think. if people do not want certain behaviors to be emphasized and 'crammed down their throats' like some of you like to say, they shouldn't be. if in a country where culture/religion suggests one thing, other people from somewhere else come and try to change their thinking, b/c 'if you don't you are called a church-fanatic', then something is not right.

now, if this country needs more time and maybe will embrace the new 'world order' inside their society in their own way by their own standards and by thinking by themselves, that's ok. but if you want others to be tolerant of homosexuals for example, be tolerant to other people who think slightly differently and their religion says something opposite (even if there are some people who are truly fanatics and who are quite hostile). maybe in 20 years everything will change. *shrugs*

and while i'm not opposing the gay community (i have gay friends myself), i don't like when people word their views on more conservative countries with a negative connotation.

Wow, I'm glad I'm not the only one that thought that about GSr. It was like one or two episodes they're flirting a whole lot more, and then Boom, she walks out of Grissom's bathroom. Very unrealistic, IMO. Especially when I hear that the relationship is "Not New"

Other than the ethical issues that i'd outlined in the "Great Ship Debate" thread, I don't have too many other qualms about the GSr. I don't like the way it seems to have taken over the show, with other people's screentime and storylines seemingly getting sacrificed for GSr.
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About GSR, I'd preferred it if we'd seen them over dinner or something but that, that was too much! The best thing about that scene were definitely Sara's legs. I remember thinking, wow, nice legs, but Gil in that horrible robe. Way too much for my poor eyes!!
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guuuys, let's not talk too much about GSR ... it's a slash thread. i don't think we want anybody here to get modslapped again. ;)
 
Honestly, I think the reason that GSr is being brought up so much is because it's really the only Canon LTR between two main characters on the show. Therefore, The comparisons are valid. I can understand not wanting to Go There, but I think we're just using that as a reference point.
 
^ i understand that (that's why i said 'not too much' and not 'at all'). it's kinda hard for me to ignore some comments, but i really don't want to start debating about it again. i think it's fine as long as we remember not to get too wrapped up in it. :)

but since we compare the current canon ship to the potential slash one, i want to say that it would be great if TPTB used any of the great things GSR is known for: the complexity of the relationship, the compelling subtlety, the ongoing will they-won't they, the originality of personalities, or the long history both characters have together. :)
 
i think it could absolutely work..but i think it might work better with non-series regulars. i'm not too sure how to say this..i mean somebody like Bobby Dawson or Henry because they're not in every episode and don't get that much camera time so it would be very subtle and they're very easy characters to bring in whenever they want them there ;)
i would say Hodges or Wendy but they already kind of have a thing lol. but i don't think the writers would write another huge romance, because they've done that with Grissom and Sara and they are both huge characters on the show, i don't think the writers could match that or that they would want to, because with another big romance comes another reputation that the producers etc. do not want. if it had to be another big one it would be Cath and Warrick (No offense to any other ships! just my opinion.) but that obviously is no longer possible :(
aaaaanywho..So we had GSR scenes through out almost all of S/7, the show kind of started to revolve around it (no complaints there!) but i would love to see a canon slash :bolian: i too think that a guy slash would be better, not because they're more socially accepted because a don't believe that they are. just my opinions...lol
 
If we talk about socially accepted I think we'd better go with a lesbian couple since people seem to cope better with two women being together than with two men.

I'd love to see Wendy turn out a lesbian because since day one when she asked Cath out for breakfast I got that vibe from her. And she's not a regular yet, so no major storyline! Anyway, you're right, NO couple, be it straight or gay should take the focus from the show! It could just be a side story, or wouldn't even have to be a story at all, just let it be canon. Just let one or two characters admit, yes, I'm gay/bi ...
 
love_fan that was exactly what i was trying to say!
i got that vibe from Wendy too! when the whole "Lab Rats Love" thing-y started i was like 'no way!' i totally thought they were going to out her
 
love_fan said:
If we talk about socially accepted I think we'd better go with a lesbian couple since people seem to cope better with two women being together than with two men.

I'd love to see Wendy turn out a lesbian because since day one when she asked Cath out for breakfast I got that vibe from her. And she's not a regular yet, so no major storyline! Anyway, you're right, NO couple, be it straight or gay should take the focus from the show! It could just be a side story, or wouldn't even have to be a story at all, just let it be canon. Just let one or two characters admit, yes, I'm gay/bi ...
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Exactly! It doesn't even have to be a big focus. Even a throwaway line or lines like Super Dave had all through season 7 about his wedding and his wife, or even stuff like Doc Robbins has said with regards to his wife.

Wendy can mention her partner or even moving in together that type of thing. It can be a small nod to her relationship. I mean, we got Henry and his Icelandic Pen Pal who thinks he looks like Warrick, so why can't Wendy or Bobby D. have a partner?
 
It's amazing to me that there are no acknowledged gay workers in at least one of the three labs, given the installments are set in Las Vegas, Miami and New York, three gay-friendly cities. Of course a real city government would employ gays; they're not allowed to discriminate. So why don't the shows reflect the reality. And, please, don't do it like Law & Order, where the ADA of several seasons standing mentioned being a lesbian as she walked out the door after being fired.
 
love_fan said:
If we talk about socially accepted I think we'd better go with a lesbian couple since people seem to cope better with two women being together than with two men.

I'd love to see Wendy turn out a lesbian because since day one when she asked Cath out for breakfast I got that vibe from her. And she's not a regular yet, so no major storyline! Anyway, you're right, NO couple, be it straight or gay should take the focus from the show! It could just be a side story, or wouldn't even have to be a story at all, just let it be canon. Just let one or two characters admit, yes, I'm gay/bi ...
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Well said there my friend!! Brownies for you!. Exactly, personally i dont mind if its two women, or two men, I'm easy and open to either but i want both. Am i too greedy?
 
If American network TV weren't so close minded, yes. But we know they are. I don't think anything could work, unless they were on cable. I loved Queer As Folk. I didn't have Showtime, but I rented the DVDs from Netflix.

I loved Michael and Ben!

:D
 
I hardly think it's purely the result of the network that realistic gay relationships are, generally speaking, not a part of most 1 hour, prime time, crime dramas. Lord knows networks would air anything they could get away with if it ensured them better ratings, without negative audience response, since ratings equal bucks in the long run. Censors are responding to the political views of their majority broadcast audience.

And the fact that situations like this DO exist to some extent on cable shows, says to me that some of the viewing public are entirely ready to accept this from their network shows as well, and it's important to note that some places in the world have already integrated this reality into their programming.

However, I don't think this thread was started to debate that. It's kind of a hot button issue for some people.

I think, and for a lot of the reasons other members have already outlined here, the fact that it has worked on cable shows is proof it can be done with tact on network shows, without allowing the characters to fulfill some swishy stereotype, or have it become the primary focus of the drama. QAF was not a crime drama, but rather just a drama, and as such was pretty much Melrose Place with gay people. Which, while the caliber of acting is better, is still pretty much a soap opera; where relationships are the focus of the show. Just a rather more risque and slightly down to earth soap opera. No one was getting amnesia every other episode, but they sure were bedhopping just as much.

With a show like CSI, I consider how much we actually get of the characters personal lives in comparison to their private lives, and while some people firmly believe that sometimes we get TOO much relationship in there, overall, I think it's a pretty fair assesment that the shows are MOSTLY crime dramas. Look at it this way, there have been shows in which we never see the characters in their personal time, but there have never been shows when we haven't seen a character at work. The balance is pretty heavily towards their work, but we as fans probably spend more time looking at the personal touches, so it might feel evenly distributed.

Now, I think if that balance remained the same, while introducing a homosexual character, I really don't think that would detract from the show. I'm not talking about graphic sex, or anything like that, but casual mentions of partners and spouses. Momentary looks into their homes and personal lives. Just enough that we'd know they were gay, maybe even see a boyfriend/girlfirend/spouse in passing would be enough. No more of their personal lives than we're alread getting. I think it would work. In fact I think it would fall under the radar for a long time at first. Hardcore fans would be chatting about it, speculating, and end up being the first to know for sure, but the general public people who probably don't tune in or watch as closely as we do might not notice at all. Just like they probably don't notice the private lives of people around them in their day to day lives. Neither of which would effect anyone else negatively.
 
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