Could they just hook up Mac and Stella?

Discussion in 'CSI: New York' started by SnowScorpio, May 31, 2009.

  1. Ghawazee

    Ghawazee CSI Level Three

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    That's why i said IMHO. Because from my POV is wrong. I am not saying Alex or anybody else needs to think just like i do. It's MY opinion. Just ONE opinion.

    Plus, there are many things that make a show unbelivable. Not necessarily ONLY to put two characters together
    Besides Mac and Stella have been close since the Pilot. It would be silly not to put them together just because there were other couples in the show
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2009
  2. PerfectAnomaly

    PerfectAnomaly Resident Smart Ass

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    You said that talking about the show having too many couples was "wrong." There's no other way to interpret that than to say you think other people's opinions are invalid and yours is "right." It also isn't "silly" for people to think having another couple on the show isn't a good direction for the show to take. There's a huge difference between expressing an opinion and insulting other posters.
     
  3. Ghawazee

    Ghawazee CSI Level Three

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    I didn't insult anyone. In my opinion that idea is silly. I am not saying any poster is silly. Or i just can't say that and i didn't find it out???????

    In any case if my opinion is considered rude (and God knows is not my intention) the fact i don't have English as my mother tongue could be used to explain such a sin ;)

    Unfortunately not all posters have the same luck ;)

    Again, what's the problem if they put Mac and Stella together? Nothing IMHO Why? Because it would be the second time two main characters are paired up in the show.
    Danny and Lindsay were the first. I can't include Flack and Angell because as much i liked Angell she was a recurrent role ;)
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2009
  4. talkingtocactus

    talkingtocactus Coroner

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    it could be quite funny i suppose but it would also be totally wrong!

    i completely agree with this basically - i think the tension that's definitely there isn't a romantic thing at all - there are times it's hinted at but it's never seemed that way to me. i'd rather not see them get together at all but if they did it would have to be done very subtly.



    i now have a very strange mental image going around my head :guffaw:

    i think that would be the only reason to do it for me - to see whether their insanely stubborn and obstinate personalities were able to get together in a non-work way, and see which of them really wears the trousers! it could be interesting on that level. but i still don't want it to happen.
     
  5. Half

    Half CSI Level Two

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    I don't think PA is saying that your opinion was rude. I think it was more the way you worded it that could come off as rude.

    Well, even if you take Angell out of the equation, adding Mac/Stella to the mix would make it four out of eight. So half of the show would involve shipping of main characters. I mean, Numb3rs did something similar, but that's different because it involved two separate "teams", CalSci and the FBI. It's just a lot of romantic involvement in one small area.

    I don't see Mac/Stella as a couple. I just don't. And that's IMO, but I won't be happy if they get together and I don't think it's particularly the best move.

    But hey, you know, this is fiction. We're all going to have different opinions. Speaking of which, I have yet to hear a solid reason as to why it would be "silly" to not consider the fact that there are other couples on a show. Not trying to be mean, I'm serious.

    ETA:
    What? I thought it was a good enough comparison. Well, because H/H are both main characters that have a solid friendship but I never particularly saw romantic potential and... oh who am I kidding, it's Harry Potter. :guffaw:
     
  6. Fruitbat

    Fruitbat CSI Level Two

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    I would love to see them together. BUT not untill the end of the show.

    I would rather they hinted at things and gave us some great moments between the two that we can inerpret whatever way we want.

    I dont trust the writing at this point to do either character any justice. I mean just look at the whole D/L fiasco.

    So do I want them together? I will take what I can get freindship wise and hope that a couple of years down the line...once the current soap suds have faded, that we can get a good adult beleivable relationship.
     
  7. Curiosity

    Curiosity Prime Suspect

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    I think some of my views on this topic are similar to Fruitbat's.

    Mac and Stella are two of my favorite characters on this series, and in general, I’ve enjoyed the way their relationship has been handled. I think they have strong chemistry, and for the most part, their interactions are written in a natural and believable way – two people with a history who have normal conflicts and challenges but consistently show care, concern, and support for one another.

    Part of me wouldn’t be opposed to seeing the relationship evolve to a romance , especially if the writers and actors could just tweak what exists now and still keep it largely in the background. It would be interesting for a change to see a more subtle romance between two mature people as opposed to the angsty, roller coaster, somewhat juvenile material that seem more typical of t.v. romance these days.

    It’s a tricky thing, though, to put the leading man and lady together in the middle of a series. Just by virtue of the lead status, that type of move tends to create a major storyline and draw a lot of attention. And once it becomes a major storyline, writers seem to feel the need to develop a whole series of challenges and obstacles for the couple to overcome, which may or may not serve the individual characters well. That’s really the main argument in my view for not putting Mac and Stella together as an "official" couple or at least waiting until much later in the series to do so. I simply do not want to see the characters put through a series of soapy plots in an attempt to maintain fan interest over the next four or five years.

    All that said, this series (despite being a crime drama) probably will have some type of significant romantic storyline involving one or more main characters as it moves beyond the series midpoint. They are trying to appeal to the broadest audience possible, and the relationship storylines seem to be a major draw for at least some portion of the audience. I expect the writers will continue to mine the D/L drama as long as possible…. However, given the speed with which they’ve progressed through major milestones of that relationship, I suspect they will be looking for some different pairings to take the series down the stretch, especially if and when the ratings start to level out and possibly decline.

    Will Mac and Stella be one of those pairings? Maybe….If it happens, my guess is that it would occur later in the series and probably towards the very end. And at that point, those making the decision probably won’t be overly concerned about whether there have been one or two previous couples within the team or whether the novelty of a male/female friendship will disappear. I think it’s more likely they will weigh whether a romance (or the promise of one) is something that will generate near term interest and enhance whatever ending they have in mind for the characters – something that is very important for a series that hopes to enjoy a long life in syndication.

    As an ending comment, I’ll simply say that if the producers/writers are considering a Mac/Stella romance (even if it comes at the end), I hope they will continue to build up to it in a believable way and not have romantic feelings seemingly show up out of the blue or try to shock the audience by unveiling a full-fledged relationship which has been going on off screen for years.
     
  8. Elwood21

    Elwood21 Pathologist

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    Again gotta agree with PA here. How DL have been handled is a catastrophe unto itself. Had a relationship never been imposed onto the show with these two characters, or even were it somehow ended in the immediate future, I would still not want Mac and Stella to get together.

    True. Both points. But people have voted in this forum about a great many things, and I would offer that liking these characters is not exclusive to other additional possible reasons people might like the show.

    And here we simply get into personal preferences, and we're gonna hafta agree to disagree. And it's all good :p . I just happened to disagree at this point (a) that a relationship among it's characters must or should default to a romantic one within this reasoning; (b) I'm not entirely certain how you think Mac and Stella's relationship has been described since S4, though I suspect I can infer, and will again simply disagree; (c) sexual tension is subjective to a point, or I suspect DL and FA and Smacked and hell any other ship would not foster so many points of view; (d) even if sexual tension is present, flirting can be entertaining banter without deep, meaningful, pithy subtext being played out; (e) the execs and writers can do whatever the hell they want; nuthin is necessarily inevitable about what we see onscreen, all of it results from choices made.

    Yeah, this came up awhile back too, and I agree that the sheer volume within finite airtime would be overload in principle alone. Too many could alter the focus of the show from crime solving to a weekly update of everyone's relationships, one character at a time, with their jobs increasingly filling in the background as a premise and setting. That would be called a nite time soap.

    ...and yes, that could also happen if every character's off the clock time was simply devoted to a personal relationship. This is why I think relationships should not be the default or only way to show that a character has a life outside of work. In fact, continually pairing up the main roster makes the show rather insular, when what I'd also love is to feel it branch out and really dig into the city. I don't want that context to shrink even further, if everything is focused in their bedrooms. I want the city. I want the crimes. I want to see how they deal with all that, professionally and internally, solo and as part of the team.

    I also welcome seeing other aspects of their lives beyond that, outside of the Job; but widen the scope, round them out. That's why something like stoic Mac secretly playing weekly in a bar band is an interesting notion, why Stella teaching could be an interesting thing to dig into a little more, why Sid's stories are always so much fun, why I was delighted to hear Sheldon has parents ferchrissakes, and an uncle too, why Reed was a good way to shake things up for Mac, and of course, all the other family tidbits dropped into the show that it's so hard to find time to revisit, for Flack, Adam, and yes, Danny and Louie.

    I'm not totally against romance in the show. But when it is included, why not show relationships with people outside of work, or at least outside the same department. Give Hawkes a brilliant girlfriend who has nothing to do with law enforcement. Hell, while Brandon was bland and boring, it was simply a nice and believable notion that Stella could be seeing a fireman. Sid has a wife and family; go ahead and pop in and see them on Thanksgiving Mac, it would be nice for us to meet them. Adam alludes to a very interesting social life. I don't want to see the team jumping each other all over the place. There is a wider world. Or should be.

    -

    I really think the material DL gets already suffers for a soapdom effect. Their relationship tends to overshadow so much of the focus and screentime alloted to each, and sucks time from the rest of the show too.

    I think any pairing within the main characters would suffer the same. I suppose that's the bottom line. If I wanted a soap I'd watch a freakin soap.

    Yes, exactly. I would not be interested in that kind of shift in focus in the show. Again. If I wanted a soap, I'd watch a soap. DL is bad enough.

    I think you and I, m'dear, are simply destined to disagree on all this in general :p. Fair enough.

    I agree. Yes there are many ways to kill a show. I think putting the two main leads together would be a way to expedite the process :lol:.

    Couples are determined by what the writers and execs think will make for good teevee. They are more successful if they do have chemistry, and enjoyed in part for that reason by their fans, though doubtless there will always be viewers who won't ever agree on any given pairing. Fans derive their own ships from whatever is onscreen, be it literally depicted, or more personally perceived and interpreted.

    Quite possibly, the writers and the show could say any relationship that so stirs strong feelings is more successful than one that generates no interest at all. The networks want ratings and a bottom line in the green. The execs and writers try to do that with a show that maintains a loyal following and perpetually grows in viewers.

    Talking about the number of couples that could be vying for screentime and material from writers who have to deal with so much more than just romantic entanglements in order to put a coherent and engaging show together is perfectly valid.

    Bottom line for me, the show would be far stronger, with greater flexibility and options available, with Mac and Stella remaining friends and colleagues, than ever if it travelled down a path that hooked them up.

    I think we get to see that at work, with how they run cases and the labs. I don't think I'd be interested in seeing a more personal navigation of that sort of thing with sex and romance in the middle.

    I suppose that kinda reminds me of Vegas with Grissom and Sarah. I had mixed feelings about them, things I liked and appreciated in their handling and things I was less enamoured with. I'm pretty sure even as a sunset swansong storyline I'd not be keen on Mac and Stella getting together.

    As for the writing. It was an interesting exercise to go thru the various grading threads and a re-evaluation of the season. Overall, I think the characters are the anchors of the show that let it run about to investigate all myriad of things. I think the characters are generally stronger than the cases they've been given. I think the writing has been rather uneven. I would rather the show focus it's writing to challenge the characters more, and less in finding ways to hook them up; I want it to raise the bar for the show as a whole.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2009
  9. Mynerva24

    Mynerva24 Witness

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    Hmm, another thread discussing Mac and Stella relationship...

    Well, SMacked family know that i am a SMacked shipper. That being said, just as what i've always expressed in the thread, although having them together is going to make me an extremely happy girl, i don't want it to be a factor that ruin the show. I don't really see how having them as a couple will ruin this show, unless PTB make similar mistake to this couple as they did (and apparently are still doing) with D/L, or if they kill off one of them as they did with F/A. For now, PTB is in the right track, in my opinion. As long as they play it nicely, i'm not complaining... (Well, not too much, at least...:D )

    Now, i am well aware that there are people who are not in the same side concerning the whole Mac-and-Stella-getting-together issue, and i appreciate your opinions and arguments (I even admit that some of you do have valid reasons to not get them together). Now, Deb, as much as i want to defend you, your choice of words does sound like an insult. Knowing you as much as i do, i know that's not your intention at all, and if it happen, it's due merely to the fact that English is not your first language (please notice that i'm not a native English speaker as well, so my choice of words may not be any better than Debbie's. I know that my grammar is even worse. Hehehehe...). So, on behalf of all of us who ship SMacked, i profoundly apologize to any mistake we've unintentionally done in defending our ship, especially for those who feel insulted by it. Please believe we did not meant it to be that way... We are only a bit too exciting about the whole thing. Peace? ^o^V

    For all fellow SMacked shippers, let's just go to our beloved SMacked thread to discuss this, ok? There we can talk about them getting together as free as we want to, and the chance that our opinion will sound rude will be close to none, just to be safe. I hate having a debate about my beloved ship, especially one that will force people to be rude and accusing to one another. Normally, i will avoid thread like this, because it is widely open for any kind of opinion, and is not a good thread to convince anyone to have the same opinion as we do. I know it sounds like something a coward might say, but, well, that's me. I could be very persistent about something if i want to, but having people hating the idea of SMacked, because I, as a shipper, seems to be behaving badly, is not something that thrill me. We can always come here to propose our opinions and arguments why Mac and Stella must get together, but when we do that, please be careful. Remember, some people may not be normally into that idea in the first place. I'll discuss later about this over our thread, if you like.

    Now, i'm off topic. :lol: I know, i'm bad... Sorry...

    Gaby
     
  10. Ghawazee

    Ghawazee CSI Level Three

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    Alex, I apologize to you if you felt offended by any of my words. As my Dear Gaby said (it's everything ok dear ;) ) it's because of our English (i should said My because her English is much better than mine ) we can make mistakes and be misunderstood

    I don't think Smacked-haters need to run in despair. I think Produccers and writers know quite well why we didn't like how DL was unfold. So I think Smacked fans will have to wait forever until to see them together (who knows? Probably they will never be)

    regarding your question, why is silly to consider we had so many couples?

    As a very dear woman said (and she is not a Smacked fan) i believe is wrong not to give Smacked and their fans an oportunity to see them in a relationship before it is aired. I mean, I have made that mistake with 5.23. I thought i was going to dislike the episode from head to toe. However it was much better i expected despite i had the childbirth i didn't want to see.
    So my new mantra is not dismiss any storyline before it is aired because i would be losing a good chance to watch an interesting storyline

    Again, i am only a fan so i can't be sure if Mac and Stella are going to happen. EVER (unfortunately). Actually if Melina doesn't get a new contract i will have to say goodbye to Stella.

    But my hopes remain. Am i going to be happy with Smacked on my screen? Certainly i don't know. But my question is, why not? ;)

    Sorry for my short message. I have to go to the Hospital :)

    Debbie ;)
     
  11. PerfectAnomaly

    PerfectAnomaly Resident Smart Ass

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    I am sick to death of being called a "hater" because I don't like certain aspects of the show. I'm also sick to death of people who are repeatedly insulting to other posters pulling out every excuse in the book for why they were "misunderstood." It's all beyond old and I'm tired of having to watch what I say when other people don't have to.
    :scream: :brickwall: :mad: :censored:
     
  12. miss_blue

    miss_blue Lab Technician

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    *comes out of lurking* *cusses RL*

    Well, as others have stated the friendship between Mac and Stella is played out really nice. But I can only see it as a friendship. Leaving aside the possible writing issues, and the abomination that is DL, I strongly believe that between these two can only be a friendship. Why can't there be friendship love between a man and a woman, and always it has to go somewhere romantic?

    Again, someone else stated that hooking up two lead character will shift the focus of the show, which at the moment is very Mac-ish. There are people out there who don't want to everyone else fade into the background.

    For me it will be so very much unrealistic. If they get together that will defy the little realism this show had left. AZ himslef said that they aim to be as close to real life as possible, DL is already over the fence, and if Mac and Stella happened, throwing of rotten tomatoes may be involved.

    Just because fans have voted repeatedly does not validate it. We took polls about Danny's glasses. There are many polls creeping around, but none of them validate anything.

    And, there aren't any Smacked haters, there are people who don't see it, like for instance there are people who don't see Danny and Flack happening. It's a matter of perpective, and here one thing is for sure: there aren't any right or wrong opinions.

    Last, but not least, isn't the interpretation of what is happening on screen and being taken further better than just non stop squeeing? Isn't it better to leave it to each other's imagination and make whatever you want with it?
     
  13. talkingtocactus

    talkingtocactus Coroner

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    oh the fact that i totally got your point meant it was a great example, but it was still a very odd idea to have in my brain - mac & stella & hermione & harry all in the same sentence let alone with a romantic twist :lol:

    oh yeah, i agree. it was just that that was the *only*possible reason i could think of (for me at least) for thinking them hooking up could be a good thing but like you say, we see it in their work setting all the time, and i'm quite happy with that.
     
  14. Half

    Half CSI Level Two

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    Hey, give me a break, I'm 16. It's the best comparison I can think of. :lol: Although, you're right, it is a bit of an odd mental image.

    I accept your apology, as I understand that you weren't intending to offend. I also understand that Smacked is your own personal heroin. ;) However...

    I must agree with PA here. I'm not a hater, I just dislike. There's a distinct difference.

    And in regards to D/L, a number of fans reacted with dislike as far back as season three. Now we're finished season five with a marriage and a baby. I'm not entirely sure that the writers learned anything, so why should I doubt that they would do something stupid with M/S?
     
  15. meggzie

    meggzie Police Officer

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    i could never really decide whether or not i ould want these two to be together but i think even if they did it would have to be like people have said a very slow romance. but i do think with d/l ( as disastorous as that is) and f/a (even though angell is gone) if you hook them up its just really ends up as a 'date my co-worker show'.
    not a definite no but not a yes.
     

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