Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!!!)

[Top41]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

I think it's possible that it will never be confirmed the true status of D/L at the point where Danny and Rikki hooked up. PL's response to the cheating question indicates that, he was ambiguous at best.

He was asked directly if Danny cheated on Lindsay; his answer was that their relationship had "cooled" at that point. It was a "down" point. I think that answer makes it clear that TPTB don't feel Danny cheated. Some viewers still do, of course, but it seems to me to be pretty obvious that that wasn't the intention of TPTB.

Taking a slightly moral standpoint in this, while I get what you're saying re. Danny not mentioning a girlfriend, I think it's also possible that a man who is saturated by guilt and seeing the only way out of that as 'using sex as a bandage' [quoting Top] isn't likely to mention having a girlfriend, in fact isn't likely to even think in terms of a girlfriend.

Danny definitely used sex as a bandage with Rikki, but he also used it with Lindsay in 419. Danny sees a situation where a woman has reason to be upset with him, and he seems to think putting out is the way to "fix" the situation. Danny thinks he was responsible for Ruben's death, Rikki turns for him to solace, and Danny gives the kind of solace he feels he's good at: sex. He acted the same way with Lindsay; she got upset with him, she wouldn't talk to him, she said she was in love with him and had to let that go...so he calls her up, apologizes and asks her to come over. Clearly, since the baby was conceived in 419, Danny put out. And since they're together now, apparently, that worked.

Does that necessarily make said 'girlfriend' delusional in terms of believing the exclusivity of their relationship? I'm not saying that's what happened here, because really none of it has been clear. But, if one person in a relationship doesn't think they're exclusive while one does, who's in the wrong?

I'd tend towards the one who says they're not exclusive or maybe even in a relationship. Usually when a couple is exclusive, both people are aware of it. Lindsay clearly hadn't told Danny she was in love with him before 416. She couldn't even talk to Danny about what he was going through after Ruben's death in "Child's Play." Clearly there are some communication problems, and I wouldn't necessarily take the word of the woman who clearly has communication problems over the guy who pours his heart out at the drop of a pin.

Looking at the poll, interestingly it seems like the fans here are fairly split. It's 43 'yes' to 37 'no' right now, with 19 people saying they're not sure yet. And one person with no opinion. So it seems like people are pretty split on both sides. I'm still in the "I'm not sure leaning towards no" camp, but I will be curious to see how it plays out.

 

[La_Guera]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

I'm tempted to amble in and offer my two cents, but I've waxed so furiously on the subject for so long that it would be like an aged and toothless lioness leaping onto the decomposing corpse of a wildebeest and gumming it in a show of dominance. I'm sure most of my long-suffering readers could recite my diatribe verbatim. The slicker ones have probably had earplugs jammed into their tormented ear canals for the last hundred iterations and have learned to smile and nod and offer a tired "Amen" in all the right places just so I won't feel like I'm shouting into an empty barrel.

I don't have to wait for the D/L drama llama to stagger out of the starting gate to know this storyline will be a disaster; I have precedent on my side.
CSI:NY writers are not Criminal Minds writers or NCIS writers or Numbers writers. These writers have a firm grasp on not only continuity, but on pacing and nuance and emotional credibility. They carefully consider how potential actions will affect their characters and their audience's perception of them. These writers are also able to assess a storyline or character's efficacy and make changes if necessary. When NCIS realized Dir. Sheppard and her crazy crusade weren't working, she and her Daddy issues were quietly scuppered in an effective way that helped the show. Granted, Lauren Holly might have decided to leave, but the writers were smart enough to leave themselves trapdoors in case she did.

The NY writers are not smart. They aren't even competent most of the time. They ignore continuity when it's inconvenient to the story they want to tell in a given episode, and they have an unassailable history of dropping storylines when they're no longer fun to play with.

A few examples:

Louie: Oh, Louie, you had so much potential. When Sonny first alluded to Familia Messer having ties to Tanglewood in the bygone year of S1, I thought he meant Danny, but then you appeared in "Trapped". The way Stella encouraged Danny to return your call, I expected to see more of you. When you got your head caved in "Run Silent, Run Deep," I was sure it was the beginning of a juicy storyline ripe with Messer family drama. I thought we'd see Danny at your bedside at least once in the coming episodes.

But apparently, they sent you to Kingdom Hospital, where patients go in, but never come out. We've never seen or heard from you again.

Then there is the mystery of Stella's upbringing. In S1, she tells a smirking juvenile delinquent that she spent 18 years at St. Basil's Orphanage, but by S3, she's a foster child whose older foster sister killed their foster father to save Stella from the clutches of Chester Molester. Guess St. Basil's was just too boring. Better to have the unfettered, prurient angst orgy of nasty, lecherous foster fathers who might want to do disgusting things to innocent little girls.

Better yet, Stella, who doesn't believe past wrongs should excuse present misdeeds, lets her murdering foster sister go because she had it rough, and besides, the dirty old goat had it coming.

If that weren't enough, poor Stella is exposed to HIV in "Heart of Glass" and has to take drugs that might make her violently ill. Do we ever see her so much as woozy or green around the gills? Nope. She never so much as complains of a headache. Either the ER nurse gave her shitty, Mexican knockoffs, or the writers couldn't be assed to have Melina hug the porcelain for a take or two. And when the writers got bored with playing "Does she or doesn't she?" they had Mac pull a military contact out of his ass to get her the results in days. How that works when the window period is 12 weeks, I don't know.

Oooh, and then there's Mac, who is a grumpy douche cankle to everyone. He fires Aiden for thinking about tampering with evidence and yells at Hawkes for knowing a victim for an hour, but fails to so much as admonish Lindsay for a)leaving evidence unattended b)leaving a crime scene without explanation or c)boning her co-worker, which is probably against departmental policy. And he blithely investigates Reed's mugging, Stella's shooting of Frankie, and the bombing in which he was involved and Flack was nearly killed.

Which brings us to Flack. It was fun to show Flack all blown up, but not fun to address the issue at all after the fact. Never mind that Eddie Cahill would've chewed on those scenes like they were top sirloin.

Oh, and Mac was accessory to a murder he helped cover up at fourteen, but that won't get him into any trouble. Nope. Nor will blackmailing his superiors.

Whatever happened to that leaked memo that had Sinclair's pants in such a bunch? The liaison from the mayor's office? Hawkes needing extra shifts to make his bills? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

I could list another fifty-four instances of rampant inconsistency in D/L alone, but my fingers don't have that type of stamina. The point is that NY writers lack the talent or the discipline to pull this off. They'll play with the story until the baby becomes inconvenient, and then they'll drop it as best they can. Aside from the inevitable sweeps drama, when the kid will be kidnapped by a crazed Sonny Sassone out for revenge, no one will mention it. Neither Danny nor Lindsay will ever look like the shambling undead after sleeping forty seconds the night before. Neither will be late for work because the sitter was late or couldn't get there. Nor will they bicker over whose turn it is to do the colic march at butt o'clock in the morning. Everyone, including Mac, who will be two CSIs short on occasion, will heartily endorse this blessed event.

They will become Pod People, bent impossibly out of true to accommodate this ill-conceived(and I mean that in every sense of the word)pestilence.

And please, God, spare us the birthing scene. I don't want to see any of the rolls that come from Lindsay's breadbasket.

And what are they going to do if Anna Belknap decides to quit? Do they even have a contingency plan? If they kill her off, then Danny gets the baby, which would almost necessitate that he either quit or foist the sprog on his parents. If she just leaves, then either she becomes a SAHM mother or drags the baby off to Montana and Clan Monroe, which, you know, turned out such a specimen with Lindsay.

If the prop guys have any sense, Messer Jr. will be nothing but a whoopie cushion wrapped in bunting. That way, when it's all but forgotten, we can be treated to this scene:

Danny(comes home and plops on couch. There's a mournful bleat from his backside).

Lindsay(from the kitchen): Danny, do you need the Bean-o?

Danny(rummages underneath butt until he pulls out a whoopie cushion in a rumpled blanket): Uh, no(looks vaguely guilty as he surveys a wilted "Junior"). No, I'm good. (He tosses "Junior" over the back of the couch, where "he" begins to wail.

Oh, boy, oh, boy. I can't wait.

 

[Elsie]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

The NY writers are not smart. They aren't even competent most of the time. They ignore continuity when it's inconvenient to the story they want to tell in a given episode, and they have an unassailable history of dropping storylines when they're no longer fun to play with.

I have to say, that whilst I agree that they do drop storylines when they've had enough of them, I think that the writers are definitely smart and competent. Yes there are poor continuity issues and things I might like them to revisit, but at the same time they have delivered some wonderful episodes and fantastic cases.

They'll play with the story until the baby becomes inconvenient, and then they'll drop it as best they can. Aside from the inevitable sweeps drama, when the kid will be kidnapped by a crazed Sonny Sassone out for revenge, no one will mention it. Neither Danny nor Lindsay will ever look like the shambling undead after sleeping forty seconds the night before. Neither will be late for work because the sitter was late or couldn't get there. Nor will they bicker over whose turn it is to do the colic march at butt o'clock in the morning. Everyone, including Mac, who will be two CSIs short on occasion, will heartily endorse this blessed event.

I hope they drop it as best they can. :lol: I personally can't think of much worse than having to sit through CSI: NY 'the family edition'. Yes, they'll bring the kid back out for some excitement every now and then. But I imagine that at some point one of them will be late for work and struggling to balance work life with having a young child (good way to mention said baby without having to dwell on it too much), and quite probably they'll only struggle from it once or twice and then it will never be mentioned again, thank goodness. :lol: For me, this is no different from how any other similar TV shows would handle this situation. Despite Lenkov saying they won't be typical about it, I seriously doubt they'll be anything but. I don't think it's because they are poor writers, in my opinion it's simply that this type of character development can only go one way.

I'm never going to love this storyline, but I am still interested in seeing some aspects of what might come from it.

 

[Ghawazee]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

So, I don't see Danny and Lindsay having a healthy relationship. However, that doesn't really matter, IMO.

What matters is that once again, it staples Danny and Lindsay together. Lindsay has never had any character development that is independent of Danny, and now it's likely that she never will.

Also, quite frankly, Danny and Lindsay are secondary characters. They are not the stars of the show. However, with all this stuff about their relationship, and the way people have treated it, it almost seems like they should change the name of the show from "CSI: NY" to "The Danny and Lindsay Show."

It seems as though other characters, including main characters like Mac and Stella get the shaft for the sake of Danny and Lindsay. Note Mac's relationship with Peyton. Mac is a main character, and it seems as though that relationship was somewhat shelved for the Lindsay "Dark Secret" storyline.

Another thing that says thatthis is not a good idea is the number of people who feel that Lindsay pregnant with Danny's baby is either not a good idea, or aren't sure about it. That fact alone raises a red flag.

i doubt i could express my feelings any better than you have done. They are not the main stars but producers and writers have tried to convince the audience they are. Worse than that, they have tried to convinced us their storyline was the best and the most interesting thing on Earth. Maybe a bunch of fans could think that but clearly are fans who don't like the show. Or should i remember that girl who sent the annoying email to Ausiello saying " Tell me why should i watch CSI NY Season 5". That's clearly, if i were a producer, the kind of audience, i WOULDN'T want to have at all or the kind of fans who say "I want DL together because i love Danny" lol: I swear i read such messages time to time:lol: as our Mod said)

Besides i don't understand so big change in the
storyline to save a character who couldn't be developed for the last 3 years. I don't dislike Lindsay as i said before but i can't be thrilled with the idea of a remake of Season 3 where ALL storylines were under the shadow of a romance that never existed. Sex yes of course but relationship? Gezzzzz I have watched more developed relationship between Flack and Danny than between Danny and Lindsay. And i don't see Donnie pregnant with Danny's seed:wtf:

Also being a Mac and Stella fan i feel more than insulted. We expected a little more of development in their relationship (maybe a little hint, something to make us happy) because unlike most of DL fans we were faithful fans to the show and we don't send annoying messages to Ausiello ( we do send messages. It's just he doesn't publish them:vulcan: We never asked a marriage on Season 5 and suddenly we find out this season will be "The Danny and Lindsay Horror Show" again:vulcan:


Again i feel sorry for Danny. I have critized him many times before (I missed my rebellious kid after Season 1 and his relationship with Mac was transferred to Reed) but now i think it's a train wreck. His character dissapeared. He is nothing more than a Siamese twin and if you ask me i can tell you i don't like this. He became part of a creature called DL and he lost his well defined personality just for the good of a couple made in H*ll

But the curious thing is i feel sorry for Lindsay because she will be forever Danny's appendix. She didn't have her own development and she 'll never have one now. Or changing diapers is a GREAT development character?

Of course i feel sorry for all the drama we will have to swallow:wtf:

And again, producers say Mac and Stella's storylines won't be affected:wtf: And it's true. The whole show was already affected :wtf:

I want to make clear a last thing: the show was doing quite well on ratings BEFORE the future train wreck was revealed so some DL fans have not reason to enjoy NOTHING! (not all DL fans are annoying. I found adorable people here at this forum:bolian

Debbie:klingon:

 

[Top41]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

La Guera, I was so hoping you'd post! You're dead on, of course: the one thing this show hasn't done so well with is follow through. They've had some great stories--Stella's past, Danny and Louie's relationship--that have just been dropped inexplicably. That's a big part of the reason I love the Ruben storyline so much--the writers really followed through with it and showed exactly what Danny was going through. It wasn't forgotten a few episodes later. And I loved that. So I think the writers have proved they can do follow through rather well, when they want to devote the time to it.

That being said, as others have also commented, I don't want to sit through endless baby drama. I don't want to see the baby have health problems or get kidnapped, or be used as the rope in a tug-o-war when Lindsay inevitably gets pissed at Danny for the umpteenth time and decides she's going to prevent him from seeing his child.

 

[jolein]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

I don't want to sit through endless baby drama. I don't want to see the baby have health problems or get kidnapped, or be used as the rope in a tug-o-war when Lindsay inevitably gets pissed at Danny for the umpteenth time and decides she's going to prevent him from seeing his child.

That is what my fear is aswell,but ever the optimistic i`m just gonna wait and see.

 

[melanie33]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

I don't want to sit through endless baby drama. I don't want to see the baby have health problems or get kidnapped, or be used as the rope in a tug-o-war when Lindsay inevitably gets pissed at Danny for the umpteenth time and decides she's going to prevent him from seeing his child.

That is what my fear is aswell,but ever the optimistic i`m just gonna wait and see.

Seriously can Danny do any wrong? I mean really. Lindsay gets pissed AT/WITH him? Apart from the whole speech in RND, I cant remember a time she has been pissed AT/WITH him. And IMO Danny deserved that in RND. I don't care if he was grieving. That doesn't give him the right to treat her like he did. He was callous, he was cruel, and tried to justify his actions by turning things around on her. Dannys problem was while he was self destructing, he forgot the world was still going on around him. He was so self absorbed, he couldn't see what he was doing was hurting both Women Rikki and Lindsay. Lindsay he cheated on, lied to and basically treated like crap. Rikki, he made her a part of his destruction of that relationship. You never try to fix a mistake by making another mistake. Danny felt responsible for what happened to Rueben so he slept with Rikki, with no thought of what the consequences of his actions might be. He was thinking only of himself IMO. Seriously. Watch the scene again, I saw no love between D and R, what I saw was someone whom looked like an addict desperate for another hit. As if he thought this was a quick fix to his pain and his guilt. So you tell me, whom is the self centred, self absorbed one here?

Saying that. everyone deserves a second chance. Like I have said, it takes a strong person to forgive. Lindsay was mature enough to realize why Danny did what he did, so she forgave him. I dont see how that can be viewed as selfish or weak.

Also a baby is not going to ruin a show, can't see how that could be possible. Unless of course the whole 16 million stop watching because they have PAEDOPHOBIA. Seriously, if people didn't stop watching because of the whole cheating with the greiving mother fiasco, they certainly ain't going to stop watching because two characters are going to become parents.

There is no pre requisite to become a parent, people like Danny and Lindsay have children everyday. People have flaws, they have issues, we are not perfect, relationships are not easy. Maybe becomming parents will make Danny and Lindsay face up to some of their seperate personal issues and try to resolve them.

I actually like that D and L have flaws and their relationship isn't perfect, it makes things seem more real, because thats exactlly how things are in the Real World.

 

[jolein]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

Seriously can Danny do any wrong? I mean really. Lindsay gets pissed AT/WITH him? Apart from the whole speech in RND, I cant remember a time she has been pissed AT/WITH him.

Yes,Danny can do wrong.
In fact a lot of people who are fans of Danny including myself have said on many occasion that they way he handled the whole Ruben situation not in the best manner or wrong but atleast he dealed with that.
Lindsay didn`t have any reason to be pissed or be angry with Danny cause forgetting a birthday isn`t a reason to give a selfish whining speech like she did in RND.

He was callous, he was cruel, and tried to justify his actions by turning things around on her.

Wow,that is really a harsh thing to say about someone who is grieving the death of a boy who he was obviously fond of.
Also when did Danny turn things Lindsay?
The only one who put things on other people is Lindsay.

Dannys problem was while he was self destructing, he forgot the world was still going on around him. He was so self absorbed, he couldn't see what he was doing was hurting both Women Rikki and Lindsay.

He is selfdestructing that is true but he wasn`t/isn`t selfish.
If anyting,he care`s too much about people.
The one person who has the right to be hurt is Rikki,but she forgave him.
Something which Lindsay probally never will do.

Danny felt responsible for what happened to Rueben so he slept with Rikki, with no thought of what the consequences of his actions might be. He was thinking only of himself IMO.

Uhm,when did he think about himself?
He only wanted the pain go away and I think he was more thinking about Rikki`s pain then he was thinking about his own.
Yes,it wasn`t the right way but they both knew that.
I saw 2 people who were bonded by a tragedy which will always be part of them.
Wether it was love or not,is not the question here cause frankly what is love?
It certainly isn`t the thing that Danny and Lindsay have going on.

Like I have said, it takes a strong person to forgive. Lindsay was mature enough to realize why Danny did what he did, so she forgave him. I dont see how that can be viewed as selfish or weak.

Lindsay and being mature are 2 things which don`t fit.
I`m not sure if she forgave him because she never said that explicit plus saying someone is hard to love,doesn`t show any matureness or forgiving.

So you tell me, whom is the self centred, self absorbed one here?

To answer your question: Lindsay stays the selfcentred and asorbed one.
Anyone who drops a speech like that on a grieving person with out any reason at all is selffish.

Ah yeah,let`s have the real world coming in again.
I always thought I was watching a tv serie with fictional characters which tries to be close to real life but always be fictional

 

[PerfectAnomaly]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

Seriously can Danny do any wrong?

Considering many people have said that Danny and Rikki sleeping together was unhealthy at best added with many comments that people love Danny because he is flawed, I'd say the majority of people are very aware Danny can and does do "wrong."

I mean really. Lindsay gets pissed AT/WITH him? Apart from the whole speech in RND, I cant remember a time she has been pissed AT/WITH him.

As many people have said over and over, it wasn't that she was mad per se. If She had known Danny slept with Rikki and they were an exclusive couple then she had every right to be pissed. She didn't. Going off on a grieving man because he didn't grieve the way or within the time table she wanted him to grieve was uncalled for, however.

And IMO Danny deserved that in RND. I don't care if he was grieving. That doesn't give him the right to treat her like he did. He was callous, he was cruel, and tried to justify his actions by turning things around on her.

Danny thought she was pissed at him for forgetting her birthday. He had every right to say what he did to her. That's hardly "turning things around on her." As for "callous" and "cruel," I'd say that describes Lindsay way more than Danny. Why was he "callous" and "cruel?" Because he had the audacity to believe she was over reacting by being so pissed about her birthday and him declining lunch and told her so? I'm sorry, I don't see him being either of those things. Lindsay going off on a grieving man and making the situation all about her was both of those things, however.

Dannys problem was while he was self destructing, he forgot the world was still going on around him. He was so self absorbed, he couldn't see what he was doing was hurting both Women Rikki and Lindsay.

Usually when people are self destructing they tend to be a bit self absorbed. But Danny wasn't. He wasn't hurting Rikki at all. They talked about what they were doing and Rikki herself said she was using Danny. They turned to each other in their moments of extreme grief because they are the only two people who could remotely understand what the other was going through. That's not even close to the same thing as Danny hurting Rikki.

No, he didn't pay attention to Lindsay much while he was grieving. Lindsay didn't pay him much attention when she was grieving in S3 either. Lindsay isn't so special that she gets to treat someone a certain way and then demand they treat her differently under similar circumstances. Plus, if anyone would understand why he would be pushing her away it should be Lindsay. Instead she get's pissed because something he's going through doesn't revolve around her. She also made some huge assumptions about the status of their relationship. If she was hurt, it was her own doing; it wasn't Danny's.

Lindsay he cheated on, lied to and basically treated like crap.

That's not a fact. Even TPTB refuse to come out and say he "cheated" on Lindsay. He also didn't treat her like "crap." He went through a tough time and chose not to go to her with his issues. That's not even close to treating someone badly.

Rikki, he made her a part of his destruction of that relationship.

Unless he had a gun to Rikki's head, Rikki was an active participant in whatever they did. As far a destroying any relationship, I don't see it. Rikki left and remained friends with Danny. Lindsay and Danny's relationship hasn't been destroyed as of yet, so thre's a huge flaw in your statement.

You never try to fix a mistake by making another mistake. Danny felt responsible for what happened to Rueben so he slept with Rikki, with no thought of what the consequences of his actions might be. He was thinking only of himself IMO.

Danny was grieving and last time I checked he is human. Making mistakes is part of living and so is dealing with consequences of mistakes. Danny is more than aware of that. Lindsay, on the other hand, seems to get a pass for all of her mistakes. But this incident is completely different. Danny, flawed as it may be, thought that being with Rikki would bring her comfort just as much as it would ease his guilt. Rikki even told him she was using him for comfort. He wasn't just thinking about himself. He was also trying to help Rikki the only way he knew how. Flawed thinking? Yes. Selfish? No.

Seriously. Watch the scene again, I saw no love between D and R, what I saw was someone whom looked like an addict desperate for another hit. As if he thought this was a quick fix to his pain and his guilt.

I've watched the scene. Who's talking about love? There was more care and concern and affection in that scene than there has ever been between Danny and Lindsay. That would've had the potential to eventually turn into love, but TPTB are taking the convienent, easy way out. He did think it was a fix to his pain and guilt and also to Rikki's pain. They also did think they were "fixing" their pain. Were they? No. But under such extreme grief and guilt it is understandable why Danny and Rikki would turn to each other to try and ease the intensity of what they were feeling.

So you tell me, whom is the self centred, self absorbed one here?

Lindsay. It's not even a contest.

Saying that. everyone deserves a second chance. Like I have said, it takes a strong person to forgive. Lindsay was mature enough to realize why Danny did what he did, so she forgave him. I dont see how that can be viewed as selfish or weak.

Danny never apologized and Lindsay never forgave him. He said he missed her and she jumped in the first taxi (while there was a taxi cab killer on the loose) to go to his apartment and get laid. That's not mature at all. And she wasn't the one dealing with extreme grief and guilt. To me that doesn't paint her in the best light. As a matter of fact it illustrates that she doesn't even care about Danny. He said something she wanted to hear so everything was fine and dandy again. It was all about her, as usual.

Also a baby is not going to ruin a show, can't see how that could be possible. Unless of course the whole 16 million stop watching because they have PAEDOPHOBIA.

Who has said 16 million people are going to stop watching the show? No one that I've seen. A lot of people have said they can see this story line ruining the show for them personally, but not for 16 million people. People are curious as to how the casual viewer is going to respond, however. That's completely different than saying it's going to ruin the show for anyone who watches it.

Seriously, if people didn't stop watching because of the whole cheating with the greiving mother fiasco, they certainly ain't going to stop watching because two characters are going to become parents.

Seriously, if people don't think Danny cheated, don't like him with Lindsay, don't like the idea of two main characters being eternally tied to each other through a kid, and/or don't like too much personal stuff on a procedural crime drama; some may quit watching just like I'm sure some stopped watching after RND.

There is no pre requisite to become a parent, people like Danny and Lindsay have children everyday. People have flaws, they have issues, we are not perfect, relationships are not easy.

No one is saying people don't have flaws or relationships are easy. The fact that it happens IRL doesn't automatically make Danny and Lindsay having a kid a good thing for the characters or the show.

Maybe becomming parents will make Danny and Lindsay face up to some of their seperate personal issues and try to resolve them.

I'd like to see them face up to some of their issues and try to resolve them before there is a kid in the mix. Once a kid comes everything is all about the kid. It's not an opportune time to focus on themselves and their issues.

I actually like that D and L have flaws and their relationship isn't perfect, it makes things seem more real, because thats exactlly how things are in the Real World.

I like that Danny has flaws and that the other characters recognize and call him out on those flaws. I don't think Lindsay is made out to have flaws, because she never gets called out on bad behavior. Everything bad she does is excused or explained away. That's not realistic. Danny and Lindsay's relationship was undefined and almost non-existent for the beginning of the season. Forget perfect. I'd just like to be able to somewhat see what TPTB try to convince us is happening when they discuss the relationship in interviews.

 

[cSiNyFrEaK30]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

And IMO Danny deserved that in RND. I don't care if he was grieving. That doesn't give him the right to treat her like he did. He was callous, he was cruel, and tried to justify his actions by turning things around on her.

Maybe I was just out of the room for this scene, but when did Danny ever act "cruel" or "callous" to Lindsay? If we go by the reasoning that Lindsay doesn't know about Rikki, the only things she has to be pissed at Danny about where the forgetting her birthday, declining her lunch date, and not coming to her with his grieving. I don't understand how choosing not to come to Lindsay with his grief, when she obviously pushed him away in S3 when she was going through hers AND made only one feeble attempt to even talk to him about Ruben in RND, is such a terrible thing to do. Likewise, who says that Danny had to grieve according to her schedule?

This just continues to show how self centered Lindsay is, not Danny.

 

[La_Guera]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

La Guera, I was so hoping you'd post! You're dead on, of course: the one thing this show hasn't done so well with is follow through. They've had some great stories--Stella's past, Danny and Louie's relationship--that have just been dropped inexplicably. That's a big part of the reason I love the Ruben storyline so much--the writers really followed through with it and showed exactly what Danny was going through. It wasn't forgotten a few episodes later. And I loved that. So I think the writers have proved they can do follow through rather well, when they want to devote the time to it.

That being said, as others have also commented, I don't want to sit through endless baby drama. I don't want to see the baby have health problems or get kidnapped, or be used as the rope in a tug-o-war when Lindsay inevitably gets pissed at Danny for the umpteenth time and decides she's going to prevent him from seeing his child.

Of course I'd wade into this. I'm just an old diplodicus who needs to mosey on in after the whippersnappers have left the marsh.

I don't want to beaten about the head with the spawn of Twu Wub, either, but once the baby arrives, there's no getting around it unless it's placed up for adoption. Baby will redefine "normal" for Danny and Lindsay, and I have zero faith that the writers will portray such seismic changes in both their joint and individual lives with any realism whatsoever. The hardships created by the addition of an unexpected child to two parents who work long, irregular hours will likely be ignored until it's good for another stirring rendition of "You're a Mean One, Danny Messer," as performed by Cindy Lou Wh-, I mean, Lindsay Monroe.

I don't want to be subjected to such a poorly-executed embarrassment, but that horse is out of the barn. Let's just hope the none of the other characters' storylines are throttled to make room for this Huggie-clad leviathan.

 

[Top41]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

As others have said, Lindsay's anger easily could have been justified in "Right Next Door" if the writers had her anger be about Danny sleeping with Rikki, not about Danny doing the same thing she did to him in season three. And at least in season three Danny reached out to Lindsay. Lindsay couldn't even make the effort because she's "not good at this kind of thing."

Danny never apologized and Lindsay never forgave him. He said he missed her and she jumped in the first taxi (while there was a taxi cab killer on the loose) to go to his apartment and get laid. That's not mature at all. And she wasn't the one dealing with extreme grief and guilt. To me that doesn't paint her in the best light. As a matter of fact it illustrates that she doesn't even care about Danny. He said something she wanted to hear so everything was fine and dandy again. It was all about her, as usual.

This really got me thinking...I've always kind of felt Lindsay takes advantage of Danny. Her manipulation of him in "Oedipus Hex" really rubbed me the wrong way--coming off of the episode where he told her he had feelings before ("Love Run Cold"), it sure felt like her childish outburst was meant to play on his feelings for her and take the unpleasant job himself. Which, of course, he did. And then in season four, when Danny is grieving, she treats him poorly at work, forcing him not to focus on working through his grief, but to repair his relationship (be it friendship or more) with Lindsay because she's storming away from him in the lab at every chance. So finally he calls her to grovel and ask to her to come over and use the only way Danny seems to find effective at 'making nice,' sex, and boom, of course she goes for it. I can almost see Lindsay sitting in bed afterwards puffing away at a cigar as Danny sleeps, saying, "Well, he won't make that mistake again!" :lol:

Does anybody else feel like she takes advantage of Danny's emotional nature, that she knows just what buttons to push to bring out his insecurities?

I don't want to beaten about the head with the spawn of Twu Wub, either, but once the baby arrives, there's no getting around it unless it's placed up for adoption. Baby will redefine "normal" for Danny and Lindsay, and I have zero faith that the writers will portray such seismic changes in both their joint and individual lives with any realism whatsoever. The hardships created by the addition of an unexpected child to two parents who work long, irregular hours will likely be ignored until it's good for another stirring rendition of "You're a Mean One, Danny Messer," as performed by Cindy Lou Wh-, I mean, Lindsay Monroe.

Definitely my fear as well. I hope we'll eventually see Lindsay's selfishness addressed and it won't be all Lindsay on her high horse because Danny didn't get up to feed the baby and she had to.

 

[Curiosity]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

Does anybody else feel like she takes advantage of Danny's emotional nature, that she knows just what buttons to push to bring out his insecurities?

As someone who is rather indifferent to this couple, I admit I don't spend much time analyzing the deeper meanings or nuances to their interactions. That said, I don't really see Lindsay as consciously manipulative of Danny. However, I think it's possible she has emotional weaknesses and insecurities (just as Danny does) which cause her to sometimes react to him in immature and non-productive ways. So, if she is taking advantage of him, I guess it might be her weaknesses (which are part of her personality/makeup) playing into his own insecurities.

Re: the poll question, my vote is "I'm not sure yet" whether the baby storyline will be good for CSI:NY. LIke others, I think a lot will depend on how it's handled and its prominence during the season. Near term, I suspect it might have some positive impact in that it will keep people watching and talking both on the positive and negative side. Longer term, I doubt it will have much effect on the overall success or failure of the show.

The producers and writers want to appeal to the broadest (and largest) audience possible, so I guess they feel the need to include some type of relationship drama storyline like the D/L one to appeal to a segment of the fanbase. However, they have to be aware that some (and perhaps the majority) of that 15 million + audience may be watching this series for reasons that have little to do with D/L, and I doubt they will risk undermining the series by letting it get too far out of hand.

And although CSI:NY has an ensemble cast, it seems there are two clear leads for this show (GS/Mac and MK/Stella), and I doubt that will change because of one storyline. Yes, there will probably be a few D/L baby-centric episodes during the season, and it may in fact turn out to be the biggest personal development arc for any of the main characters this season. However, this is still a crime drama, and imo, the crime element of the series is driven largely by Mac, Stella, and Flack, so as long as the cases are interesting and those characters are getting their share of screen time (and I have no doubt they will), the series should be fine.

The bigger question for me is what the baby storyline will do to the characters of Danny and Lindsay. As someone mentioned elsewhere, my gut reaction is that this is too much, too soon, and I wonder if the writers are writing the two of them into a box that they will find it difficult to work with in future.

Really, I suspect this is seen as a good thing for Lindsay near term. IMO, the spunky, enthusiastic, Montana girl thing was not working, so the "mother" storyline actually gives them an opportunity to re-invent Lindsay to some degree and maybe in a role that feels more natural to Anna B.

For Danny, I'm not sure what the baby storyline will lead to. A lot of potentially interesting Danny storylines (Tanglewood connections, professional advancement, relationship with Mac) have been left hanging over the last couple of years, so I don't really know if and how they will pick up on those again with this new development.

Anyway, I'm trying to take a longer term view with this series and the "wait and see" approach when it comes to storylines like this -- especially since it's mid-life for the series and what's happening now may have less relevance and/or prominence as the series moves down the stretch. I realize that's not much comfort, though, to fans that are watching their favorite characters stagnate or be overlooked this season.

 

[electra]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

This is probably the writer's worst idea ever.I honestly don't mind Danny and Lindsay if they don't take much screentime from my favorites.I liked Danny when he was witty and charming but I IMO Lindsay brings him down.But if I have a good story and Mac,Stella,Flack and Angel are on a lot ,it's a good show for me.

I will wait and see but this storyline is the similar to the ones ones that turned me against CSI Miami.I saw something in this show that made me stop watching Law and Order and I am afraid it will be lost.

 

[racefh853629]

Re: Your Thoughts on the upcoming Danny/Lindsay development (SPOILERS!

Seriously can Danny do any wrong? I mean really. Lindsay gets pissed AT/WITH him? Apart from the whole speech in RND, I cant remember a time she has been pissed AT/WITH him. And IMO Danny deserved that in RND. I don't care if he was grieving. That doesn't give him the right to treat her like he did. He was callous, he was cruel, and tried to justify his actions by turning things around on her. Dannys problem was while he was self destructing, he forgot the world was still going on around him. He was so self absorbed, he couldn't see what he was doing was hurting both Women Rikki and Lindsay. Lindsay he cheated on, lied to and basically treated like crap. Rikki, he made her a part of his destruction of that relationship. You never try to fix a mistake by making another mistake. Danny felt responsible for what happened to Rueben so he slept with Rikki, with no thought of what the consequences of his actions might be. He was thinking only of himself IMO. Seriously. Watch the scene again, I saw no love between D and R, what I saw was someone whom looked like an addict desperate for another hit. As if he thought this was a quick fix to his pain and his guilt. So you tell me, whom is the self centred, self absorbed one here?

Yes, as a matter of fact, Danny can do wrong. I think most people would agree that he's done plenty wrong throughout the course of the show thus far. Season 1 and his open defiance of Mac? Getting involved with Rikki? He's flawed, deeply.

Did Danny really deserve that speech in RND? Put yourself in his shoes- your neighbor's child was murdered under your watch. How would that make you feel? How would you deal with that? (And I'm not asking to be snotty, I'm just asking because I'm curious)

If it were me, I'd be self-absorbed. If I knew that because I wasn't watchful of someone, they were killed, I would be guilty. I would be self-absorbed. I'd be thinking about how I failed someone. It's all relatively normal given the situation. I'd be inclined to forget birthdays. Hell, I sometimes forget even when I'm not in as drastic a situation as Danny was. You get caught up in things, and you can't remember. It happens.

If my boyfriend forgot my birthday because he was grieving, I wouldn't care. I'd rather he take care of himself and get his head on straight, whether that involves me or not. And I wouldn't get mad at him if it didn't. Maybe that's just because I have a more altruistic streak, though.

There are five stages of grieving- denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance. You can stay in denial as long as you want, but it's really not gonna help you gain acceptance. Danny didn't deny it. He jumped to anger at himself, and bargaining that if he had "just stayed with him and made sure he got home," none of this would've ever happened. He was depressed, and he tried to bargain that away with sex.

Both Danny and Rikki were using each other. They were both destructing, and they both were just trying to make things go away. Is Rikki selfish for using Danny? Is she so self-absorbed too? And Danny knew Rikki was using him, but he was trying to fix her by seducing her. He wasn't only thinking of himself there, he was thinking of both of them.

Out of Danny and Lindsay, I'd say Lindsay is the more self-centered and self-absorbed one. You never heard Danny giving Lindsay a speech complaining about how she didn't go to him with her problem. He was too busy trying to fix her to chastise her about not coming to him. Whereas Lindsay did not even seem to make much of an attempt to help.

Yeah, I'm not good at that kind of thing either. I'm not good at dealing with people who are upset. I'm an emotional person, and watching other people break down kills me. But I'd rather be their person to turn to and be the one to help them through than just add to their problem.

Danny needed time to worry about himself and get his head on straight. He needed the opportunity to take care of himself. Granted, he didn't go about it in the best way, but his need for solitude is no different than Lindsay's need in Season 3. So why did he deserve the speech in RND, and she didn't?

Does anybody else feel like she takes advantage of Danny's emotional nature, that she knows just what buttons to push to bring out his insecurities?

I do. I don't know that she does it intentionally or maliciously, but I do think that she knows just what to do or say to get him to do what she wants. I think she can see his weaknesses, and she uses them to her advantage. I mean, we can all see Danny has issues and isn't perfect, and that he's insanely emotional and sometimes impulsive. He needs to feel like he's doing good for someone, or else he can't handle it. And I think she knows that, but I don't know that she intentionally uses that to get what she wants from him.