Gun Control

S

Showtime

Police Officer
The thread on Virginia Tech was beginning to lead to a discussion on gun control, a subject people obviously have very strong opinions about.

Do you think gun control laws are too lax, too rigid, or good how they are? If you're not happy with them, why not, and what would you do to fix them? If you're content, explain why.

I think that gun control should be tightened up. I've stated before that I don't see why any citizen should be in possession of an automatic/semi-automatic weapon. True, guns do not kill people, but with stricter control it'll be easier to prevent the would-be murderers from killing people.
 
I posted this in the Vtech thread...Many other countries that have changed their gun control have lowered their violent crime rate. The US really does have a crime problem, compared to other first world countries.

In 1989, Canada had a similar tragity, known as the montreal massacre, where a man killed 14 women, engineering students, because he blamed working women for his problems. He used a semi-automatic gun. As a result to this, canada put in serious gun laws and regulations.

In 1991, Bill C-17 tightened up restrictions and established controls on any firearms that had a military or paramilitary appearance. Legislation also made changes to the FAC system. FAC applicants were now required to pass a firearms safety course, pass a more thorough background check, and wait a minimum of 28 days aftering applying for an FAC before being issued one. Also an FAC was now required to purchase a crossbow. Finally in addition to the above changes, laws were put into place that restricted ownership of high capacity magazines, limiting handguns to 10 rounds and most semi-automatic rifles to 5.

In 1995, Bill C-68 introduced new, stricter, gun control legislation. The current legislation provides harsher penalties for crimes involving firearm use, licenses to possess and acquire firearms, and registration of all firearms, including shotguns and rifles.

The homicide rate in Canada has declined 40% from 1991-2004
 
I think we need more gun control here in the US. I agree that there's no reason average ordinary people should have automatic weapons, there's no point in having them unless you want to hurt someone. People say they need guns for protection, but more often than not, guns in homes lead to accidental death or the perp taking the gun and using it himself, most people that own guns for protection don't know how to use them, and if you get a gun for protection, you DON'T get an automatic weapon anyway. I think they do more harm than good, and need to be controlled.
 
I think that it's a double edged sword really. If you ban guns for example, then you'd lower the risks of accidental shootings in households and you'd make the weapons less accessable to criminals or people who have... 'snapped'.

But on the other hand, criminals, regardless of gun control, are going to access guns through illegal means. Logically, an armed criminal is going to have the upperhand over an unarmed victim but, if firearms are legal then the criminal doesn't know whether they'll be unarmed or armed. Criminals would more likely go for their targets if they were more certain that their victims are unarmed due to banning guns so that they don't have the risk of getting shot themselves.

I dunno. I did an english debate on this once. I think I found that in some countries where there was really strict gun control the violent crime rates (not just homicides, but assaults, rapes, muggins etc.) involving armed criminals were higher than in countries where the victims had the option to defend themselves using firearms. Maybe I made it up... I don't remember so don't quote me on it! :p
 
My sister actually suggested something I agree very strongly with after the Virginia Tech tragedy. Notice how in countries where it's illegal to own firearms or harder to get them, this never seems to happen, where here in the US it seems to be happening much too often, or even at all.

It's a tough debate, however, because most people own firearms for protection. If anything, people need to keep a lot tighter reign on their firearms. Children and teens should not be able to acess weapons like that. It's just asking for something like this to happen again.

When my uncle was just a kid, his uncle was drunk and handed him his pistol and told him to go shoot his mom. I don't think kids should be around guns initially. Nothing happened, but something could've and that's a risk we shouldn't be willing to take. If a parent owns a gun, keep it somewhere the kids won't be able to find it.

Just my two cents ;)
 
drkate said:
I think I found that in some countries where there was really strict gun control the violent crime rates (not just homicides, but assaults, rapes, muggins etc.) involving armed criminals were higher than in countries where the victims had the option to defend themselves using firearms. Maybe I made it up... I don't remember so don't quote me on it! :p
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It's entirely possible that the stricter gun control is a result of the high instances of armed assaults. Developed areas with higher crime rates tend to have more police, but that doesn't mean the police are causing the crime.
 
Logically, an armed criminal is going to have the upperhand over an unarmed victim but, if firearms are legal then the criminal doesn't know whether they'll be unarmed or armed. Criminals would more likely go for their targets if they were more certain that their victims are unarmed due to banning guns so that they don't have the risk of getting shot themselves.
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I get this. I don't honestly think it would be a good idea to just suddenly take away all the guns, but I don't see the point in letting people buy heavy artillery and stuff. A handgun is fine protection, but an automatic rifle? Unnecessary.
 
I dunno. I did an english debate on this once. I think I found that in some countries where there was really strict gun control the violent crime rates (not just homicides, but assaults, rapes, muggins etc.) involving armed criminals were higher than in countries where the victims had the option to defend themselves using firearms. Maybe I made it up... I don't remember so don't quote me on it
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nope, the violent crime rate is much higher in the US than other 1st world nations...the only crime that is higher in Canada than the US is breaking and entering. I would rather my house get robbed than to get shot. The homicide rate (per 1000 people) in the US is about 10X higher than Canada. There are other factors with crime though. In Bowling for Columbine, it is pointed out the differences between the US and Canada. Micheal Moore was trying to find a slum in canada...he couldn't really find one, lol. The US has more extreme poverty than the Canada, and less social programs. Also, american society is so fearful. The news is all about scaring people. Canadian news is way different. Even the elections are fear based. No one is saying take all guns away, but this gun crazy mentality americans seem to have is not good.
 
nope, the violent crime rate is much higher in the US than other 1st world nations...the only crime that is higher in Canada than the US is breaking and entering. I would rather my house get robbed than to get shot. The homicide rate (per 1000 people) in the US is about 10X higher than Canada. There are other factors with crime though. In Bowling for Columbine, it is pointed out the differences between the US and Canada. Micheal Moore was trying to find a slum in canada...he couldn't really find one, lol. The US has more extreme poverty than the Canada, and less social programs. Also, american society is so fearful. The news is all about scaring people. Canadian news is way different. Even the elections are fear based. No one is saying take all guns away, but this gun crazy mentality americans seem to have is not good.
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Have I mentioned I want to move to Canada...

What is the news like there? I know here every time something big happens thats bad, the news picks it apart and analyzes every little thing, and ALWAYS pays more attention to the criminal than to the victim, (which i think is stupid because thats exactly what they wanted, to be noticed)

sorry if this is kind of off topic, but Canada intrigues me, lol.
 
xfcanadian said:
Micheal Moore was trying to find a slum in canada...he couldn't really find one, lol.
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Though I agree with the rest of what you said, I just have to comment on this.

Michael Moore is an idiot. I can appreciate that he's trying to talk out against the big corporations that ARE doing wrong, he's doing it in an entirely inappropriate and unethical way. If I could call him a shock-journalist, I would. I respect him about as far as I can throw him.

You want a slum? Head West. I spent a day on the Down Town East Side of Vancouver and it's about as grim as a developed country can get. There's human feces, dirty needles, prostitutes, HIV/AIDs and mentally insane people all over the place, but suprisingly few violent outbreaks.
 
Here in the netherlands you can;t have a gun at all. except you're doing it as a sport but very strict rules are tihgt to that!

Hoera for how those laws are here. Just to see how less gun accidents and violence you have here they actualy might work.

none the less that if someone wants to harm someone it will happen.. Like a stabbing instead of a shooting.. but then again. Chanche on survival are bigger with a stabbing that shooting....
 
I am actually against overly controlling gun laws. As an avid collector and crafter of firearms, I think it would be a rather unintelligent decision to even attempt to enforce gun laws. By creating new laws and "cracking down" on those already existing, who is it really affecting? The people who are breaking the laws NOW with their guns will continue to break the law and possess/trade/modify them illegally, and the rest of us law-abiding citizens get, to put it in crude terms, screwed. I believe that the retailers are the ones that need to shape up, in a way...I think they are sometimes careless who they sell their ammunition and firearms to. (Though I don't think they are the root of the entire problem. They just contribute.)
 
I do not really have an oppinion on this. Its just I read stuff in the media when it comes to gun laws in the US. Here in Holland hardly anyone has a gun. Just the criminals and that sort of people do. You know, not the average next-door-neighbour.
But in the US it seems to me everyone has one and everyone can get one too. And the crime rate in the US is high. I think that if you do try to make the laws more strict, the crime rate will go down. On the other hand I believe that when you forbid things or want to make it harder to get something, people will try getting it illegally.

So my oppinion is not entirely clear on this one. Probably also cause I am not confronted with guns laws and stuff
 
Showtime said:
xfcanadian said:
Micheal Moore was trying to find a slum in canada...he couldn't really find one, lol.
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Though I agree with the rest of what you said, I just have to comment on this.

Michael Moore is an idiot. I can appreciate that he's trying to talk out against the big corporations that ARE doing wrong, he's doing it in an entirely inappropriate and unethical way. If I could call him a shock-journalist, I would. I respect him about as far as I can throw him.

You want a slum? Head West. I spent a day on the Down Town East Side of Vancouver and it's about as grim as a developed country can get. There's human feces, dirty needles, prostitutes, HIV/AIDs and mentally insane people all over the place, but suprisingly few violent outbreaks.
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I am from vancouver, so I do know about east van, and that is a problem area. No country is perfect, but there is way more extreme poverty and slum areas in the US per capita than Canada. Whether you agree with micheal moore or not, he did make a very good comparison of Canadians mentality verses Americans.

What is the news like there? I know here every time something big happens thats bad, the news picks it apart and analyzes every little thing, and ALWAYS pays more attention to the criminal than to the victim, (which i think is stupid because thats exactly what they wanted, to be noticed)
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We don't have the 'omgweareallgoingdie' thing...like all those catchy headlines, oh man. Our news is pretty boring, just telling the news, not sensationalized. Just an old guy telling the headlines.
 
I can't really comment on anything in the US cos I live in England. I do know that gun crime is definitely on the increase over here. A few years ago you never heard of people getting shot, but recently there seems to have been an increase, although that could partly be down to media reporting.

It's getting less and less unusual to hear of people getting shot and killed. A few weeks ago there were shootings only a few miles away from where I live, which is really scary. I'd hate to live in a time where gun crime becomes normal, perhaps like it is in the US, which is where it seems to be going at the moment.

I don't know what the solution to this problem is but I hope someone figures it out soon. People getting shot shouldn't be the norm. And I agree with whoever said that guns don't kill, people do. That's so true.
 
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