Grade "Grounds for Deception"

How would you grade Grounds for Deception?

  • A+

    Votes: 28 27.2%
  • A

    Votes: 14 13.6%
  • A-

    Votes: 6 5.8%
  • B+

    Votes: 6 5.8%
  • B

    Votes: 5 4.9%
  • B-

    Votes: 6 5.8%
  • C+

    Votes: 5 4.9%
  • C

    Votes: 9 8.7%
  • C-

    Votes: 3 2.9%
  • D+

    Votes: 1 1.0%
  • D

    Votes: 10 9.7%
  • D-

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • F

    Votes: 10 9.7%

  • Total voters
Just a few quick points:

Mac was too easy on Stella, taking into account the way he has chewed people out before for a hell of a lot less, he was ridiculously easy on her.

Baby Messer in the lab? someone call social services, its dangerous and totally irresponsible.

How can Stella just waltz into the lab after she has resigned? Don't they have security? Did Mac not think she may come back to look at stuff and try to find out about the case or did he think she was just going to drop it?

I always thought Alexander the Great was from the Republic of Macedonia not the macedonia region of Greece? Although they do border each other, so maybe.

How can Mac walk around Greece with his gun? How on earth did he get it through customs? He may be there officially but they don't just let you keep your gun so you can go around doing your own investigation and shooting people.

And now Stella was born in Greece was she? how many different stories do they want to make up for Stellas childhood? Pick a back story and stick to it!

To be honest I didn't really enjoy it at all which I feel bad about as Melina wrote it, but truth is I didn't think it was very good.
About Stella's background, that you all seem to think contradicts itself, I don't see so many contradictions added in this episode, aside from the fact that she's novv born in Greece, vvhich technically isn't a contradiction as she sas she's been living at the orphanage for as long as she can remember. I'm only 16, but I cant remember a thing from vvhen I vvas 2, so that makes perfect sense to me. But the contradictions came along already in cold reveal, vvhat makes it a little less believable right novv is that professor p came along, and got her out of fostercare, vvhich in no vvay makes sense, since vve knovv from cold reveal she vvas sent back to the orphanage at the age of 7 after her fostersister ran avvay... So hovv could he get her out of fostercare, vvhen in the cast list, it says that the girl playing young stella, plays Stella as a 10 year old? That's by far the most contradicting thing I've seen in this episode. And as it is a TV shovv I dont really see hovv important it is vvhether or not Mac carries his gun around in Greece... Lots of things happen in TV, that isn't possible IRL.

VVell, just my opinion :p But I agree it could've been better vvritten. Still enjoyed the episode very much.
Hold on... I'm in no way an expert on Stella's backstory, but if her foster parents sent her back to the orphanage at age seven... if the professer got her out right around then, isn't it entirely possible that she was in his classroom at age ten? I don't see the plothole in that, so if anyone can explain what I'm missing by all means go ahead...
Englebarn, I remember bits here and there, nothing really clear, though. However, it's not the memory thing, but the fact that he got her out of foster care. First she said she'd been to St. Basil all of her childhood, but then, surprise! She was in foster care too, although she was sent back because Mindy ran away, or so I thought. Nonetheless, now we learn that professor P, who didn't have her custody or anything -otherwise, why wasn't she living with him?- was the one to get her out of foster care. Ok, let's assume he did that. What did he do then? Did he keep her? Did he just send her to St. Basil and looked after her in a strange way? How come he was allowed to do so if he wasn't her relative? Maybe he was her father, maybe, but then, he would have kept her. Also, if he is her father, why is her family name Bonasera and not Papakota? Last but not least, I don't remember the exact date mentions or the episodes where Stella talked about her job when she was a cop, which is highly inconvenient, but I think they make the fact that she's suddenly 34 impossible. I'll try to remember...
I wanted to like this episode but I really didn't.

The good bits of the episode were Adam (always) and Flack's barely veiled disapproval of Stella and Angell's activities. I also loved how he was quite prepared to kick down the Professor's door and tell Stella to stand aside so he could do so.

Now we come to the not so good bits...

The baby in the lab for a couple of hours whilst Lindsay AND Danny worked was stretching things past breaking point. Cute kid and I like the name but could we not have her spending some time with Grandma?

Dead guy managed to get back from Cyprus...hmmm...stretching things even thinner.

Flack can't trace the Professor back to Greece but he can trace Stella? Why can't he trace him? If Stella can find a reference to him travelling then I'm pretty certain Flack can get a hit off his name on a flight manifest!

Then we get the "American-abroad-in-a-backward-country-with-police-who-can't-be-trusted-to-do-their-job-properly"...


And Stella is 34?

No, she isn't.

I could go on but I can't be bothered. I had high hopes but I was bored pretty much the whole way through (although that final scene should inspire hope in the Mac/ Stella shippers hearts :) )

Sadly it's a D from me.

I have high hopes for tonights episode though...
SO MUCH SMAckED!! <3 <3

still the episode didn't hold together too strongly for me.. it was very rushed if anything, for all those episodes of build up. Regardless I'm glad Stella has her family roots now, although that too was devoted all of 10 seconds.
Ah! Where do I start?!! Do you want the good points first or the bad?? Wait!! There ARE no good points. So let me just list out the bad.

Mac - the God of CSI:NY......its OK to chew Danny out in Season 1 for following a case that Mac had specifically forbidden him to ( This is the case regarding the homeless man who made money being a statue) but he goes easy on Stella. Just how far is your two faced sh#*ty ideals going to take you, Mac?

So, lets see, viewers, its Ok to follow a case you have been forbidden to just b'cos you are personally invovled in it, but its not OK to follow a case b'cos of your sense of justice (as was in Danny's case). :wtf:

I'm going to leave it to La Guera to come up with a few choice epithets for our Wonderful Mac.

Stella - As everybody pointed out, she is now 34!!!! Really?? That makes me 20. :guffaw:

Danny & Lindsay - I am not even going to go into the travesty that is this disaster. Not only do we get oh! so fluffy moments of baby Messer in the lab, are TPTB seriously expecting us to drool over the fact that Danny is acting as an overbearing jealous dad?? Seriously, if I was a D/L shipper, I'd be very insulted right about now!

Angel - Where art thou? They put her in the middle of a clandestine operation with Stella & yet when it all comes to a climax, she conveniently takes the time off so that Stella may have all the limelight. Honestly!! :rolleyes:

Flack, Hawkes & Adam - You are my only hope of keeping this show on my list........long live the three of you!!!!!!:)
In first, it’s a very good episode.
Stella is sublime in this episode, l' actress with worked very well so much of the point of the episode’s writing that of job’s actress.
I found her radiant and the moments Smac perfects.
There was really of beautiful moments, full with complicity, duality and emotions.
This is the big class.
L' investigation was well tied up, I' liked in any case.
Lindsay is already of return to the job, with the baby moreover.
Thus one knows finally his first name, Lucie.

The flat if I then to say, is why bring back the baby to work?
Ok, they perhaps didn’t find yet of baby-sitter, this would explain that, but except this small detail, I found Danny excellent and super jealous when one approaches its baby.
J' adore when he says, a trick as I will raise your DNA, he kills.
I found brilliant scene Mac/Lindsay. I like to see them working together all both, it' is as with Adam, obliges, one comes out from it with a smile at the end of the lips.
I liked much what is released from the episode, complicity between the characters, and also friendship and the bond which them plain.
Since several episodes already, one feels it, and is very pleasant. I loved the small experiment improvised in the street, by Mac and Stella.
They are brilliant there these two together. The scene final with the coffee cup, superb and funny, there still one has sublimes moments between our two friends, a happiness

B+ (I was feeling generous :)).

While I am impressed with how character driven this season has been, the downside of that is it seems to highlight the lack of consistency and continuity all the more. I like that we got to see more of Stella's backstory, but there are glaring holes in it, or at the very least major confusion.

As other's have said, I'm not sure whether prof P was her father or not, if he was his actions don't make a lot of sense. I guess it was possible for him to love her mother yet not be her father though.

I agree that Mac was way too lenient on Stella. As much as I like what she did for dramatic purposes, the reality was that she was acting like a spoiled brat, not least in Mac's office where she refused to see his point of view. But, I'm prepared to overlook that because I like it when Mac & Stella go up against each other.

It was a nice touch showing Flack being cautious/protective for Angell and it was great seeing some good moments that highlighted the depth of Mac & Stella's relationship. Again, as other's have said Stella's 34? Melina looks damn fine for a woman of her age and she gets away with being portrayed several years younger than a lot of guest stars have done. It annoys me how ageist tptb seem to be, they have great actors and guest stars but they often try and portray them as a lot younger as though there's something wrong with being the age they are. :rolleyes:

Now for the DL scenes. I'm happy that the baby is called Lucy, not because I love that name but because Danny won. Where other's have commented Danny getting his own way is another form of this being all about him I don't see it like that. Lindsay has always been portrayed as the 'winner' in all of their battles stemming from the competitive element of their relationship so it was a nice touch to see Danny getting his own way.

I don't get what tptb's issues with showing DL only in the lab. It's ridiculous. I get that 'home' sets are likely to be tricky and costly but it would be easy to have scenes where one of them is dropping the baby off somewhere, or where they're going to or from work. I get that they wanted a lab scene with the baby, that's fine but make it work in real terms. I don't mind the first scene with the baby in the breakroom or office because that's realistic-ish, but having Danny traipsing around with her through the actual lab is just stupid.

I did quite like the whole 'god of virility' thing, it highlighted the Danny I love, full of bravado and trying to seem like the tough guy when really he just makes them all laugh. I didn't mind the whole protective/get away from my girl thing either - I took it as something based on a streak of reality but again is more funny than menacing which just sums Danny up really well - not to be taken too seriously. :)
Here goes my jumble of words.

*At 6:30p the power goes out. Brief moment of panic ensued.
*At 7:30p the power is still out. Panic is mounting. Power Company is nothing but useless information.
*At 8:00p the power comes back on. Melt down avoided.
*At 9:00p the lights dim but remain on.
*At 10:00p the party begins!!

Whew! :lol:

I kinda liked the "away" from the normal New York thing. If you all beat me, make sure it is with something soft!!!

A few things.....
*I thought Mac was going to pop a vein when he found out about Stella's involvement. I thought if she got her badge back, she would/should be suspended.

*I think Flack was keeping it in check when Stella told him to tell Jess to step back. Did you see that look on his face? Ohhhweee....for a moment there I thought Flack was going push a little harder for info.

*Correct me if I'm wrong...I am a bit slow on the uptake...I guess Flack doesn't share much with others. I mean, I would have thought he would have at least confided in Mac about him and Jess? We know he cares for he a lot, but would he tell anyone else??

*I can see bringing baby to the lab for a visit. But for work? Hmmm...if one wasn't working with chemicals....okay. But it was cute. Danny is a bit jealous of other men making over his Lucy. It was cute! Can't wait to see what happens when Flack gets a shot!!!

*Don't we all do the wrong thing when we are suddenly stressed or under undo pressure? Stella was a but...all over the place. I can't see her destroying valuable things. I did feel bad for her. She didn't get to find out who her father was or anything more about her mother. And yes...continuity!!! Ah...the favorite word of choice.

*Mac is the man!! If that man wanted to carry a gun into my country I would let him!!! Just as long as he promises not to shoot anyone! Guess that went to hell in a hand basket.

*Hawkes and Adam?!!? Did I miss them?!!? Were they there!?!? Oh that's right..they were running the crime lab!! They are the men!!!!:cool:

As for the next episode...I pray the power doesn't go out!!!! How can they torture like that?? How can they play with fast moving images, voices yelling and total chaos?!!? And that is not what is going on in my head! :lol:
I'm struggling here. I'm not sure how to go about grading this one because it is so off base from the usual NYC backdrop that the usual reference points don't apply. I'm glad they did the "previously seen..." thing because, honestly, this has been in the background long enough that it needed to be tied back together.

The play scene was really COOL. I love theater and this was an added bonus for me. However, I think the entire show would have worked better if the dressdown scene between Mac and Stella had come first to set the stage for the rest of the episode to play off of.

I don't know...the whole episode seemed off. Stella running off to Greece, Mac going after her, Stella solving the biggest mystery of history. It just doesn't work for me as an episode of CSI:NY. Just like some think the Montana thing is overused with Lindsay, I get tired of the Greek ancestry thing constantly being thrown in my face. But that's just my personal gripe.

Maybe I should grade it based on Stella's wardrobe. At first I thought they had heard me complain about her plunging necklines because they had her all zipped up in a top with a decent neckline at the beginning of the episode. Oh, but wait, once she gets to Greece they put her in a sundress that looks like it could be a swimsuit top with material sewed onto the bottom. Stella's cleavage is back in the forefront of everything else and this plunging neckline goes even deeper than anything before. Then we get to see her stumble around in platform sandels on cobblestones. Did anyone else notice that by the end of the episode she is in the flattest pair of flats...lesson learned, perhaps??? Can I ask a question: how hard is platinum? She flattened that earring like it was putty and I thought platinum was one of the strongest jewelry metals available.

I could grade it on emotions I guess. Mac is furious, with good reason, but then when he finds out where Stella went he immediately dumps his responsibilities at the lab, climbs on his white horse and rides to her rescue because he cares about her. Awwww. How sweet. And what kind of position does THAT put him in with his superiors?????????? I just don't get it. Then we get to see Prof. P take a bullet for Stella, and die in her arms while confessing his love for her mother. Now THAT is right out of a soap if anything is, including the fact that we are left with the question of "who's your daddy".

I can't wait to get to tonight's episode because I am going to need a really good episode of CSI:NY to cleanse my pallete of this one, which, I think gets a D from me.
I would give this ep a B. It wasn't a total mess for me. In fact, I appreciate how good this episode could have been. We finally get some background on Stella's past. That was good. Now we know why she was in an orphanage for most of her young life. I often wondered about that. I think Melina's acting was great in this episode.I really felt for her when Prof P was dying in her arms and she was crying. This was probably the only time she would learn about her past. I think it would have been better if she was in Greece alone. Mac being there was kind of a distraction really.That should have been written differently,but I do like how we have those moments that show just how close Mac and Stella are with going completely overboard. There where some parts of this story that felt kinda rushed and cut,like I bet this was a great episode but the "cut-and-paste guys" in editing had to cut in down and we only see the main parts of the story.This story maybe could have fleshed a little more.Maybe not entirely another episode,but at least a few more minutes.

Now,Im all about bringing your child in for a visit to where you work (especially if you are close to your co-workers,as this team is on this show).The child could be in another room and your not there to work,but visit....I'm ok with that.Even if you're just going to tie up a few work related loose ends before leaving (not going to be there but maybe an hour or 2 at most). I can see that...


WHY IN THE HELL would you strap your kid to the front of you and process fingerprints and actually run evidence in a lab!!! There are so many things wrong with this,I don't know where to begin.I know with the 2 of them together,1 of them can afford daycare or someone to keep this child during the day.OR have Danny and Lindsay work diff shifts so someone is always home with the baby.Having them work different shift would also solve another problem:they wont be in the same scene all the time (which would be a delight to non-dl lovers,like myself) and only give them scenes at home or passing each other during the day (which may satisfy the casual DL fan).I'm not bashing in any way.I've accepted them as a couple.It's just that sometimes,less is more.

Off the subject a little bit,but I feel the need to rant:Why does CBS keep rescheduling or moving CSI:NY to put in Criminals Minds on their time slot?If Criminal Minds needed a 2 hour finale,then they should have scheduled it like every other show does:part 1 and then finish part 2 the following week!No offense to CM viewers,but I don't watch it so I shouldn't have to move my viewing schedule to watch my favorite show. I bet they do this because Cm pulls in a few more viewers that CSI:NY. I'm not going to say anymore on the topic right now...
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^^Criminal Minds was supposed to air from 8-10 next Wednesday, but because the President had a press conference thing from 8-9 the other week, it pushed the stuff that normally airs in that timeslot back a week. Since next Wednesday is the final day of sweeps, if they want to get those 8-9 shows' finales in during the sweeps period, they have to air them next week - which pushes Criminal Minds back to 9-11 and pushes NY out completely.
--She’s not supposed to be in the lab, but she’s getting paid overtime? Once again Lindsay gets all the special treatment. :rolleyes: :scream:

I thought she said "you're paying me to work part-time".

Overall I enjoyed it. There were some moments that could've been much stronger but I had fun watching it. I really thought that the professor would end up saying that he was her father and I was cringing waiting for him to do so, but thank God that was not the case. I liked that Mac showed how angry and frustrated he was with her but at the same time he showed concern and helped her not because of the job and the department but because he does care.

The treasure thing with the burying and stuff I could've done without (I would've prefered for them to only be stealing from the museum) but it didn't bother me that much to take away from the things I liked.
For those who have wearied of my lengthy screeds on why CSI:NY sucks, I offer you an abridged review of last night's episode: I couldn't have asked for a bigger, more insufferable pile of shit if I'd fed an elephant some Ex-Lax alfalfa and asked it to build me the Leaning Tower of Pisa in my living room. "What a bunch of shit," I opined when the episode was over, and my Roomie, who's quite accustomed to my one-sided conversations with the TV, just started laughing.

What a pile of shit. Thus ends my abbreviated review. Those of you who can't stand my negative witterings but are too lazy to put me on your Ignore list may now proceed to the next post.

For those of you who enjoy watching a macaque seize, allow me to elaborate, because if I don't, I might explode.

Stella, who has been Mac's partner for ten years as of S1 and fourteen years as of this season, is thirty-four. Also, even though she graduated from the academy ten years ago in S3's "Cold Reveal", she graduated in 1998 last night(It said so on the banner behind her in the graduation flashback).

Bzzt. Wrong. If Stella had been Mac's partner for ten years in season one, which took place in 2004-5, that means the latest she could've graduated from the academy would've been 1992, since it takes a minimum of eighteen months to earn a detective's shield, and in "...Comes Around", Stella mentions her first collar as a beat cop, so we know she didn't immediately work for Mac and the lab. Since Stella would've been sixteen or seventeen in 1992 according to this concession to Melina's vanity, er, revised timeline, she cannot be thirty-four. She must be at least thirty-eight. Even if we accept the retconned timeline offered in S3, which aired in 2006-7, then she graduated in 1997, not 1998. That also means she would've graduated in the same academy class as Flack, who joined the NYPD in 1997. So, if Stella was born in 1975, that would've made her twenty-two in 1997, and Flack, who probably attended juco, no matter what "Bad Beat says, twenty.

So, Stella who's been working with Mac for fourteen years, is only two years older than Flack. My ass.

Don't even get me started on the astounding convenience of Mac just happening to find a picture of Stella's mother while poking around. Are you kidding me? Aside from the unintentional hilarity of seeing Melina in a dated bouffant wig that should've breathed its last in 1968 and not 1975, it assaults credibility to think that the Greek detective would just hand Mac a picture of Stella's mother. Then again, this episode also tells us that Dr. Papakota is probably Stella's father and that he stole Alexander the Great's dagger from his undiscovered tomb, so perhaps I should regard that coincidence as a mere trifle.

Dr. Papakota "rescued" Stella from foster care at an undetermined age and placed her at St. Basil's Academy. This wouldn't happen to be St. Basil's Orphanage, would it? You know, the place Stella claims to have spent her childhood in "for as long as she can remember" in "Three Generations are Enough". So, it's an academy now, and not a lowly orphanage run by nuns. All right then. If he really was her father, why not claim her and raise her rather than leave her to languish in a boarding school? And why do I even care? What dreadful Dickensian melodrama fanfiction am I reading?

That was this episode was, Melina's wish-fulfillment fanfic put to film and presented as canon. Super!Tragic but plucky heroine who defies her crusty boss and flouts numerous rules of the office she's sworn to uphold in the name of a revenge quest, and who eventually softens his tight-assed heart with her determination. Oh, and those rules she broke--the lying, kidnapping, and disobedience of a direct order--? There won't be any consequences for those. In fact, the crust old boss, who once yelled at another subordinate because a victim had his phone number in her pocket, will just smile warmly and return her badge, because she's just that damn awesome and feisty.

And ooh, bonus angst: she discovers her father only to have him die tragically in her arms in the former family peach orchard. Woe! Woe! And the super!Tragic plucky heroine who has heretofore kept her head under pressure will suddenly throw a fanbrat angsta-tantrum about her father holding out on her during a firefight. If I wrote that and presented it as fanfiction, the fandom would roll its eyes and declare it soppy Suefic, but because it's canon, I'm supposed to find it awesome and compelling?

I don't. It stinks.

Speaking of fanfic come to life, are we really going to see baby hijinks in the lab every week? Because I see no problems at all with distracted lab techs leaving evidence unattended to coo over the Messer crotchfruit, nor do I foresee howling outrage when a defense attorney wonders why there is baby powder in a DNA sample. Because there's no potential for contamination there at all. And never mind the dangerous chemicals to which the baby's developing systems could be exposed. The sheer power of Danny's throbbing Daddy boner will keep the toxins at bay. Just like he fended off the innocent lab tech.

If my ass could've clenched any harder, my glutes would've been peering balefully from my eye sockets.

A sheer embarrassment to the franchise. F-