Grade 'Forbidden Fruit'

[PerfectAnomaly]

Ovejaras, i wasn't talking about you. I read comments on other places (tv.com for example). This is not the first time there and it's not the first time in another forum as well where Melina is bashed as well Stella is

You have no problem criticizing other characters/actors so I don't see how people criticizing Stella or Melina Kanakaredes is considered "bashing." Also, I don't see how other forums have anything to do with this one.

Unfortunately there were scenes in the middle we couldn't watch as the one Stella telling Angell about Mac's direct order. So some people could assume she didn't inform Angell. I don't think that's the case here.. Yes, she is obssesive after this guy but she would never put in danger Angell's life.

If it didn't happen on screen it didn't happen. Unless we get something said on screen that makes it clear that Angell either does or doesn't know that Stella has gone rogue we can't say what's going on either way. I don't think Stella would put anyone's life in danger in a malicious way, but I can see her being so blinded to her determination to get the bad guy that she didn't tell Angell about Mac's disapproval. Angell is a cop so she knows that anything she does on the job has the potential to become dangerous at any moment; Stella doesn't have to tell her that. But if she didn't tell her about Mac's order to stand down she's taken away Angell's right to choose wether to put herself in danger or follow Mac's order and leave it alone.

Jolein--> i do think he was obssesive feeling guilty for something he wasn't responsible for. I'm not saying he was evil and mean because he wasn't. Just obssesive

I'n not Jolein, but I will respond to this. The thing is that Danny felt responsible, and actually there are a fair amount of viewers who felt he was partly responsible as well. No, he didn't pull the trigger, but Ruben was under his care and he left the boy to get home on his own in a dangerous situation. He felt responsible enough that he put himself in front of Ollie Barnes and told Rikki to shoot him if she wanted payback from the person responsible.

I personally don't equate extreme guilt and grief with obsessiveness.

 

[Elsie]

Ovejaras, i wasn't talking about you. I read comments on other places (tv.com for example). This is not the first time there and it's not the first time in another forum as well where Melina is bashed as well Stella is

You have no problem criticizing other characters/actors so I don't see how people criticizing Stella or Melina Kanakaredes is considered "bashing." Also, I don't see how other forums have anything to do with this one.

Please don't bring up what happens at other forums in here. It's not helpful. If either of you feel that there is a problem with the comments people are making about characters in this forum, please let either myself of Top know and we'll look into it.

 

[jolein]

Quote:
Jolein--> i do think he was obssesive feeling guilty for something he wasn't responsible for. I'm not saying he was evil and mean because he wasn't. Just obssesive
I'n not Jolein, but I will respond to this. The thing is that Danny felt responsible, and actually there are a fair amount of viewers who felt he was partly responsible as well. No, he didn't pull the trigger, but Ruben was under his care and he left the boy to get home on his own in a dangerous situation. He felt responsible enough that he put himself in front of Ollie Barnes and told Rikki to shoot him if she wanted payback from the person responsible.

I personally don't equate extreme guilt and grief with obsessiveness.

That is precisly what I meant,PA.
Feeling guilty and grieving doesn`t equal being obsessed.

Stella showed that she was starting to get obsessed with the case,to the point that she disobeys Mac,who is the boss of the lab.
In that process she pulls Angell with her,wether or not Angell knows Stella is disobeying Mac is not clear.

Danny did the things he did because he felt guilty and responsible,without pulling anybody with him.

 

[Ghawazee]

Elsie--> I'm sorry. I won't bring that up again

PA-->

If it didn't happen on screen it didn't happen.

Two words: DL

You have no problem criticizing other characters/actors so I don't see how people criticizing Stella or Melina Kanakaredes is considered "bashing

I don't have problems critizing other characters.I don't have problems people bashing Stella because she is just a tv character (and despite of i don't like it).
But I never bashed actors. Unfortunately i can't say the same about other fans on Melina.
And perhaps i will have to take a look at my English-Spanish dictionary. Maybe i'm putting my foot on my mouth using this word

But if she didn't tell her about Mac's order to stand down she's taken away Angell's right to choose wether to put herself in danger or follow Mac's order and leave it alone.

It was wrong she disobeyed a direct order. But as i said in the Discussion Thread if they were there without a back up team i think Angell is intelligent enough to realize they were on their own because Mac wouldn't agree with that

He felt responsible enough

he felt obssesive blaming himself for something he didn't do. Of course he was grieving but he couldn't get over the pain so IMHO he was obssesive

Debbie

 

[jolein]

double post,sorry

 

[jolein]

It was wrong she disobeyed a direct order. But as i said in the Discussion Thread if they were there without a back up team i think Angell is intelligent enough to realize they were on their own because Mac wouldn't agree with that

Angell is intelligent but that doesn`t mean that she knows that Mac disapproves of Stella`s action.
For all we know Stella told her that back up is on it`s way but like the others things,we don`t know.

he felt obssesive blaming himself for something he didn't do. Of course he was grieving but he couldn't get over the pain so IMHO he was obssesive

He was blaming himself because a child died in his care and he felt responsible for that.
The fact that he had a hard time getting over the pain is a normal reaction and not an obsession.
What should he have done? oh a kid has died and now i`m gonna party...yeah that would have gone overwell

 

[Ghawazee]

Angell is intelligent but that doesn`t mean that she knows that Mac disapproves of Stella`s action.
For all we know Stella told her that back up is on it`s way but like the others things,we don`t know.

and you are right. We must wait and see. Maybe Angell didn't know Mac's disaproval. Maybe she did...who knows?

He was blaming himself because a child died in his care and he felt responsible for that.
The fact that he had a hard time getting over the pain is a normal reaction and not an obsession.
What should he have done? oh a kid has died and now i`m gonna party...yeah that would have gone overwell

Sorry, but i do think he was obssesive. It's not an insult to say he was. I repeat again he was obssesive blaming himself which was a mistake in my opinion. And no, i didn't expect he went to a party

Once AXN repeats this episode i will pay more attention (I watched it just 4 times). Certainly it's not one of my fav but i will try to analyze the whole situation again. Until then i will think he was obssesive feeling as a crap for something he didn't do

Debbie

 

[PerfectAnomaly]

PA-->

If it didn't happen on screen it didn't happen.

Two words: DL

But with DL the things that didn't happen on screen were explained in interviews or referred to in later shows. Granted it's a lame ass way to tell a story, but they did go back and give an explanation. So far we've got nothing that indicates Angell knows or doesn't know about Mac telling Stella to stand down and until TPTB either tell us or show us one way or the other there's no way to say for sure.

As far as not having back up, they wouldn't need back up unless they were going in for a big arrest. The beginning stages of an undercover operation don't require a whole team most of the time. In this case Stella was Angell's back up.

 

[eyewitness]

I might be wrong, but I believe Angell is one of the cops officially assigned to the Diakos case. So, hypothetically, she would be just doing her job then, independently of Stella's direct involvement (or not) with the investigation. But Stella is not a detective, she is a CSI, so she (theorethically) would have no business getting directly involved in the Diakos investigation, unless she was called to collect evidence upon one of his crimes later again. Also, being Stella herself a victim of Diakos as much as a law enforcement member, she should be kept away from the direct investigation AND evidence processing (in order to avoid certain biases and ethical issues that could ultimately compromise the Diakos prosecution). But allowing stalked CSI's to break protocols in order to catch their stalkers seems to have turned into a pattern. But hey, if they all played by the book, it would be no fun at all, right !! ;-)
I'm not criticizing, I'm just saying...

My "dream-stalker": i wish i could see Mac stalking Stella. Or vice-versa. hehehe ;-)

 

[Ghawazee]

But with DL the things that didn't happen on screen were explained in interviews or referred to in later shows.So far we've got nothing that indicates Angell knows or doesn't know about Mac telling Stella to stand down and until TPTB either tell us or show us one way or the other there's no way to say for sure.

Yes, they were explained and it sucked completely. Maybe they don't think to explain Angell's position in this story (it's too early anyway). Also previous spoilers said Stella's job was going to be in danger so we can imagine it's only her position as a CSI will be compromised.

And i totally agree with you. We can't be sure so far so let's wait and see what Stella is going to do to screw up her career

But Stella is not a detective, she is a CSI, so she (theorethically) would have no business getting directly involved in the Diakos investigation,

No, Rach, she IS a Detective as well. I read the official page of CSI and it said they can be quiet because they have 2 careers beyond the fact there are civilian staff. Not all CSI are police officers (well i read it a lot of time ago. I think it said that

Debbie

 

[La_Guera]

If Angell is the primary detective on the Diakos case, then why did Stella take it upon herself to orchestrate this fake coin operation with the counterfeiter? Yes, Angell was there, but the scene read and played as if Stella were the officer in charge of the investigation. If Angell is nominally in charge, then Stella has no business going Dirty Harry/rogue cop on the investigation.

I'm sure the writers were going for gritty and compelling here, but the execution has been dreadful, and it makes Stella look reckless and selfish. This seems less of a quest for justice and more of a vengeance crusade against the cretin who tried to kill her.

If this story arc was Melina's big idea, then I am less than impressed with the fruits of her imagination.

 

[Ghawazee]

She said she is writing the Season Finale. I think something else is going to affect her because Melina mentioned something like" something that could happen to any woman" or "something that could happen to Stella or any other woman" (Maybe i'm totally wrong about this. Sorry. I don't remember)

Besides i'm not sure but i guess Stella shouldn't be in charge of the case she was investigating when she was almost killed by Diakos. But Angell was in charge of the case of this new Diakos's victim so i didn't understand that much (besides my English is not bad and i watched just once)

Anyway, i love Stella and any storyline with her it's more interesting than we had lately regarding her character

Debbie

 

[SaraRozic]

This was the best episode of the 5. season. The case was really inovative and funny
I loved the Smacked argue and I really cant wait to see whats gonna happen, cause Stell broke Macs order! omg cant wait to se the 5.12 promo

!!! csi ny rocks!!! Smacked 4 eva!!!

 

[Top41]

She said she is writing the Season Finale. I think something else is going to affect her because Melina mentioned something like" something that could happen to any woman" or "something that could happen to Stella or any other woman" (Maybe i'm totally wrong about this. Sorry. I don't remember)

Oh, I hope it's this storyline and not an "All Access" redux. Really don't want to see Stella or any other woman on a CSI show victimized like that again. I do like that Stella is being proactive in this Greek storyline, even if she's treading into dangerous waters. I do agree that she should be upfront with Angell and Danny (if he indeed does help her) about the fact that she's disobeying Mac's orders, but she probably thinks she's protecting them by not saying anything.

 

[SpeedyMeg25]

I do like that Stella is being proactive in this Greek storyline, even if she's treading into dangerous waters. I do agree that she should be upfront with Angell and Danny (if he indeed does help her) about the fact that she's disobeying Mac's orders, but she probably thinks she's protecting them by not saying anything.

That's what I think too.
Stella maybe doesn't want them to know that technically she was supposed to drop this, that way if/when they get into trouble from Mac, Stella can be like "well, they didn't know you didn't approve". Angell and Danny are on a need to know basis I suppose, and if Stella thinks they should be aware of something then I believe she'd tell them.
But that's just my opinion, so nobody yell at me please