I totally agree with what you said especially with the part about Lindsay. I hoped she would be different this year but the episode just changed her too much it was like she was a different person,I just can't see her changing so much in such a short amount of time maybe she did but i'm just not buying it.I'm back with part 2 of my review now that I've finally managed to read everything posted here. Pretty much all I wanted to say has already been discussed so I'll add a couple of things more:
Lindsay: I'll probably sound like a hypocrite because I repeatedly asked for a better Lindsay --both the character and the acting-- and now that my wish has been granted, I realize it's not enough. This Lindsay-is-a-whole-new-person situation is unrealistic and too forced for me and it's not about Anna this time -she was pretty convincing and made me root for her in almost all her scenes.
I agree with everyone that she is acting like a caring, responsible wife and mother, but people don't change that much in a short period of time. Let's not forget that they haven't been married for that long: if I remember correctly she was 7 months pregnant just before the wedding, so I'll put her at 7-8 months at that moment. I guess that no more than a couple of months passed between Lucy's birth and the shooting, add another month until "Epilogue" and they've probably been married for aprox 4-5 months. Since Lindsay left on maternity leave just after the wedding and Lucy was born the same day she returned, it's safe to say they haven't been together like a real couple until the birth. And with a newborn and a demanding job, I seriously doubt they had time to discuss their multiple issues: it wasn't that long ago that Lindsay didn't want to tell Danny about the baby or marry him and she apparently changed her mind moments before the wedding. It's obvious that these two have a huge communication problem and they couldn't possibly had the time to address it with everything that has happened since they got married, so the underlying fears are still there. They just don't magically evaporate with a marriage.
I agree that being married means a stronger commitment, therefore it's understandable that fears and doubts are temporarily put aside to build a solid foundation for the relationship, but they don't disappear with the exchange of the vows, and ignoring them will only bring more trouble in the future.
I can understand Danny lying about his chances of recovery to protect Lindsay, but why didn't she go to the doctor with him? I know, probably because Danny didn't want her to worry excessively or because they couldn't find a nanny or whatever excuse, but then why didn't Lindsay ask Hawkes or Sid for their professional opinion? If she claims to know Danny she should suspect that he isn't telling the truth or at least she should try to learn what's the best way to help him cope emotionally and physically. That shows IMO that nothing has changed with these two, even though they probably believe that they have put their problems behind them now that they are married.
I believe that Lindsay loves Danny -I've always believed it although I don't care about their relationship- so I predicted that Lindsay would act different if only for fear of losing Danny. Now, I'm glad that the writers choose to show this side of Lindsay, but it feels a little too much: what I really saw is that she was trying to put a brave front for Danny like she has probably been doing since the shooting. She can't afford to lose it with a newborn and an injured husband, but that doesn't mean she's not suffering and feeling alone. She was too reassuring and too optimistic and I found it hard to believe her, she sounded as if saying it out loud would make things easier. It seemed to me that she was trying to comfort both of them, not just Danny.
Lindsay can't possibly go from miss "it's all about me" to "I'll be at your side cheering you up forever and ever, no matter what, I'm unbreakable". She's been there before, she knows that Danny is difficult to handle when things are a mess, so even though they both are more equipped emotionally to deal with things this time, it's still too early and I doubt that Lindsay feels so brave as she sounds. She has to be terrified and unsure of what to do. She should lean on somebody else or she'll lose it and that's not what Danny needs. His optimism seems to be hanging by a thread, probably because Lindsay is acting the way he needs, but why if she can't do it anymore? Lindsay should seek comfort and advice in her friends and colleagues. If she continues doing this alone, I predict trouble in D/L land.
At least I hope the writers acknowledge that the transition between being married because they were having a baby and being a solid couple shouldn't be a smooth one in terms of realistic writing.
Danny: Am I the only one that noticed that everybody seems to bee walking on eggshells around him? They all seemed to accept that Danny is doing fine because he seems so and because he has Lindsay who seems very strong and supportive, so nobody is trying to reach out to see how things really are. The only one that seemed to sense that Danny is not a-ok was Flack and poor thing has a lot of things to worry about. It really proves how close they are -and it made my day- but he can't be 100% there for Danny this time and I doubt Lindsay will be strong enough if this ends up in a major breakdown.
There was something wrong about the way Danny acted, like he was breaking in the inside but trying to be his old self in the outside and even when he was speaking to Lindsay and he seemed a little bit more defeated he still sounded too nonchalant for Danny. That's just a facade IMO and that's why I hated that they showed us this scruffy, ragged Danny to prove he's really having a hard time instead of really showing us how he is feeling.
I hate unsubtle writing and NY's scripts are sometimes very in-your-face. It was unnecessary to show Danny that way because Carmine would have made us feel and believe Danny's pain without all the cheap, unsubtle visuals. Or at least have Danny talk with somebody other than his wife so we can judge how he really is. Being Danny, he will try to avoid adding more burden to his wife's problems with his fears.
If we have to believe in what we see, Danny is going to be a total optimist by next episode since his 10% feels like a 100% with all the support he is receiving.
I'm sorry but that's bullsh*t.
Or maybe she didn't change that much at all. I realize there were people who felt she was self-centered, selfish, etc, etc; but there were also people who felt she was the entire opposite of that -- and it's not like those people were pulling stuff out of thin air in order to see Lindsay that way. They were going based on their interpretation of what they'd seen onscreen. So it's not like her behaviour in "Epilogue" came completely out of left field. She's been caring and compassionate plenty of times before, even if she didn't handle Danny in S4 the same was she handled him in "Epilogue". I think there's a very simple explanation for that: growth. Which is natural for any character. And it's been two years since "Right Next Door"; how is it unrealistic for someone to grow in that amount of time?
Yeah, I don't buy D/L as completely issue-free now either, but I really don't think Lindsay's sticking-by Danny in "Epilogue" has anything to do with their relationship being on a solid foundation. (Plus, I think there was plenty to indicate that they weren't on a solid foundation.) It's not about their relationship, it's about Danny being paralyzed. Their issues can be put aside for now in the face of that, and I think that's what Lindsay was doing. That's what she did after "The Box" and "Triangle", after she knew Danny wanted to be around for the baby.
Being entirely fair, both Sid and Hawkes are pathologists, they specialize with the dead. Their being doctors doesn't mean they'd be able to pull out a random (let alone accurate) diagnosis of Danny's paralysis or how long it would last, not unless they actually specialized in that field and had examined Danny themselves. Which I think we can assume they didn't. We've never seen any of the other characters come up to them whenever they need a living diagnosis of X condition. Why on earth would Lindsay go to them?
I agree that Lindsay probably isn't as optimistic or as brave as she sounds, but IMO she doesn't have to be, so long as Danny believes she is. And even if she was entirely self-centered before, I don't see how or why it's utterly impossible for someone to do a reversal of personality. She's had up to a year to change/grow, and the shooting alone could've been enough to cause a reversal in personality.
They still have to dig out the Italian part of her past -- presumably where her last name comes from. Either her dad shows up (or something is unearthed about him) or we find out she used to be married :lol: It's weird... at times, Stella really seems to be one of the most fleshed-out characters on the show, but she's so clearly still a work-in-progress.
oh yes! Nobody denies they have created her. But certainly there are storylines that don't fit the way a character has grown on screen. At least that's how i feel as a viewer
The only inconsistencies I see with Stella are with her background. First we were supposed to believe she grew up in an orphanage and then we were supposed to believe she was in foster care for a while and then they went back to the orphanage story.
Well, they know more about this type of injury that Lindsay does. Plus, they are her friends, or at least colleagues. Why would she go? I dunno, maybe to have another opinion? To know what to expect and how to act? To confide her fears in somebody familiar?
I didn't express myself correctly. I tend to ramble and rambling and mixing languages is a bad thing. :lol:
No, I get what you're saying.Originally Posted by symbeline:
We could discuss this for hours or even days :lol:
I don't think Lindsay has evolved that much as you say, but I see your point. Problem is, the writing has been so ambiguous that even if you go strictly by what is canon you can always say that Lindsay's behaviour was justified at some points because there are enough holes in the storyline to support other theories. So you saw her as caring as compassionate where I saw her as immature, selfish and self-centered. And we both are probably right because so much has happened offscreen that it's difficult to state something as fact, just the bits that are canon.
What I mean to say is that some people can understand why Lindsay is the way she is, so they see the character grow and change, but some others don't and the writing has never been consistent enough for me to accept that now she is so different and that's the end of the story. I have seen Lindsay change over the years, but I've also seen her repeat the same mistakes and behaviours, so I'm not completely sold on this new Lindsay because I still detect some of the old Lindsay under the surface.
Hope that made some sense
And I can see how the writing on Lindsay has been ambiguous enough to allow several interpretations. Thing is, when faced with the writing in "Epilogue", to me it just makes more sense to assume the writers finally picked one interpretation and are running with it, rather than to assume they decided to Frankenstein her an entirely new personality. While I agree it would help to see Lindsay interact with someone other than Danny in a scene, ...I still have to say that Sid and/or Hawkes couldn't have helped much. As far as detecting Danny's lie, neither would've been in a better position than Lindsay: if Danny told her (and possibly by extension, them) that his doctor said he had a 60% chance of walking, what reason would either Sid or Hawkes have had to refute that diagnosis? Danny's doctor most likely has a stronger background in the subject than they do.
That's true (about her breaking inside), but I don't think it matters. Danny being in a wheelchair would be enough reason for her ultra-concern, since she obviously cares about him; him being there because he blocked a bullet that, for all she knows, was headed right toward her -- only solidifies that reason. It doesn't matter how much she trusts him right now. If he were a street-hobo she'd never met before, the situation would still justify her concern and her "optimist-front". Those two have massive issues, and I totally believe that Lindsay still doesn't trust Danny that much; but I can see why she might be putting that on the back-burner. His paralysis takes center stage, as it probably should. As for her optimism, yeah, I'm not sold on how much she buys into that. But again, I think it doesn't matter, so long as Danny believes she buys into it. That's what he needs now, more than he needs to be reminded of their massive issues.I didn't express myself correctly. I tend to ramble and rambling and mixing languages is a bad thing. :lol:
Of course she can change. She can and she has to. But I don't believe she has really really changed that much.
C'mon, she didn't want to marry Danny because she didn't trust him and that was 4-5 months ago. Danny hasn't change that much so why would Lindsay be that optimistic and positive now? I don't think she has had the time to really absorb everything that has happened, so that's why I see that Lindsay is obviously acting like Danny needs to save her family, but she has to be breaking in the inside.
Yeah, it would be unrealistic for her to keep going like Superwoman without ever reaching a breaking point...but I'm afraid I don't see what your point is?
If they handle this storyline right, then she'll obviously be breaking down (or preferably, turning to someone to vent) somewhere along the line. I fully expect to see that, and she'll have every reason to. I just don't see why they'd have to show her doing that right off the bat. Her eventually caving under pressure has little to do with her caring about Danny; and to me that seemed to what this episode was all about (at least, for both Lindsay and Mac). Additionally, it's obvious she's trying to do the right thing right now, even if later she caves under pressure.
) it's likely she could do some sort of damage to Danny's legs during the night because (random example) she might kick him and she's afraid he'd be hurt without realizing it because of the decreased sensation in the lower half of his body. Or something like that. Something minor or random or even less of a big deal than that. (Oh hell, I'd pay to see her ask any of her colleagues their opinion on suggesting that she help Danny shave or if they think he'd get offended. :lol I'd love to see a quick scene of them in the elevator together, and the awkward silence. And then Adam tries to break the ice with a random (most likely hilarious) comment. And Sid would just look up from whatever he's reading (a folder or something) and make eye contact with Adam over the top of his glasses. Then maybe the elevator would open before they can say more than a few words to each other, and Adam looks relieved - and maybe Hawkes is waiting outside the elevator and shares an amused glance with Sid. Bonus points if he teases Adam about it later.
Oh okay, I think I understand that -- like, asking around to Hawkes and Sid about how she could make things easier on Danny, or if there was any particular behaviour (physical or emotional or anything in between) that she should be on the lookout for, or something like that. Yeah, I really would've liked to see that too, especially since...well, I was proud and not-surprised that Lindsay was able to be there for Danny this time, but it did seem really strange that she was apparently able to say all the right things, at the right time, with no stumbling over her words or flubbing what she was trying to say....I guess I can see how that would've come off unrealistically, given her previous behaviour. When it comes to actually reaching out to people, she's awkward at best, IMO. And it would've come off more solidly if we'd seen her talking to someone about how she should deal with Danny first. Moreover, it would've helped because Danny wouldn't have been the only person Lindsay talked to all episode :scream:
This is the sort of scene I would've honestly paid a lot to see in "Epilogue"Like, say, Lindsay and Hawkes are processing a victim's bedroom and Lindsay looks thoughtful, so Hawkes asks what's on her mind - she starts to talk and then stops herself, and then when Hawkes says something like 'What were you going to ask?', she asks him if (in his professional opinion, of course
Especially about the shaving -- Danny wears the "going-through-hell" look very well, but it needs to go soon :lol: It would've been perfect if we'd seen some hint of Lindsay talking to someone else about being unsure with Danny, even if only to get an idea of how she was able to deal with him later in the episode.It's absolutely criminal that Sid barely got a 2-second cameo in "Blacklist" :brickwall: That had better not be something that's going to become a trend, because I'm demanding Sid/anyone scenes too! And I can totally picture the Sid/Adam elevator scene -- I loved the one that they did have (it was "Child's Play", wasn't it? 'Cause Adam was asking Sid to back him up with this theory he had, and Sid kind of gave him this look :guffawBTW, I want Sid/everybody scenes, like, yesterday. Especially Sid/Adam because the one scene they had was classic. Sid is definitely not a guy Adam is going to be comfortable around because they rarely interact and their jobs are pretty far apart - plus the dead body thing, of course.
Want. Waaaaaant. *makes puppy dog eyes*
. I dunno -- I can see how Adam might be awkward around Sid because of their jobs, but that would provide so much hilarious potential...I wish they'd explore this dynamic a bit more, because I think it'd be absolutely adorable. Not just going from their one scene, but also from the whole "eldest guy on the team/youngest guy on the team" kind of grandfatherly gimmick. I so think Sid would find Adam's awkwardness the perfect outlet for all his creepy stories :lol: And we haven't heard any of those stories for....waaayy too long.