Eric/Calleigh storyline -- why we dislike it. Part 2 **spoilers**

[Delynn]

I was just scanning the "truce" thead. I'll be honest and state now that I've elected not to participate in that thread since my last comments. I don't think I have anything productive to add and while the intent of the thread may be honorable, sadly, I don't think it can overcome the strong emotions on both sides of this issue.

I did however, find an interesting point that Flo made over there that reminded me of a issue that I found a little concerning during the progression of season 8.

Flo's point was regarding the spoilers that appeared, and in some cases DIDN'T appear, during season 8. Again it speaks to E/C being the all encompassing focus - because almost every single spoiler posted was E/C related. And if it wasn't E/C related, we usually didn't get to see it unless we went outside the forum, searched and got lucky.

At one point one of our E/C non-supporters actually went outside our forum to someone in another area to get spoiler information because the Miami forum wasn't getting any spoilers. Why? I suppose there could be many reasons, but coincidentially it was during a time that there was no E/C activity.

Even when the spoilers appeared, there usually wasn't much information related to any other character on the show and I actually felt for a time that Horatio had died and I missed it because his name hardly EVER appeared. I actually remember someone asking if Horatio appeared in one episode. The spoiler provider then responded that he did and gave what spoiler information they had related to Horatio.

To me this is just another example of how the lines are firmly drawn. Because those who supply most of the spoilers are strong E/C supporters, that is where the focus of their spoiler information is and those of us who enjoy other characters are left to wonder if they even appear because our favorites are considered less important then the all consuming E/C, so they are apparently not worth mentioning.

 

[INACTIVEQuinn Fabray]

Wasn't Eric supposed to make some major decision about their "relationship"? (Don't worry, I'll spare you the nosepicking and barfing smileys)

*comes out of lurking mode for a few seconds* You don't have to spare us the smiley's. I find them humorous. :lol: Anyways, I pretty much agree with everything everyone has said so I won't repeat any details, I just wanted to add my "2 cents" on the "defining moment of the E/C relationship". Well I personally think we've already sat through the defining moment. (I'm sure many will disagree with me which is fine). I feel like the defining moment was at the end of Time Bomb when they were on the beach. Calleigh chose to forgive Eric (I wouldn't have ) for what he did indicating that she will forgive Eric and they will eventually reform their trust for another showing that their relationship can survive through "hard times" (I don't see how but it does). Thus the defining moment was made. (I hope that logic made sense...) I guess it would look like there wasn't one, because it was a lot more subtle then people thought it would be. This is just me speculating, so of course this could be wrong. But that's just my 2 cents on it. I'm sure many people will disagree with me here, which I am expecting. :lol: On another completely different note, I agree with everyone and hope that the season 8 dvd extras are not all about E/C... As I feel they might be, even though AR wasn't in most of season 8. Season 9 here we come.... :scream: *goes back to lurk mode*

 

[mjszud]

^^ Stargazer, I won't necessarily disagree with you. I think IF there was really that "defining" moment, then it was already seen -- that said, I honestly think it was all a line of poo. All season long there were things said to be seen, & they didn't deliver any of it -- Jesse's finale ordeal, Horatio & Kyle.. we were supposed to see the "man behind the shades" (& this was said AFTER the episode Dishonor).....they described the 'betrayal' to have some enormous emotional effect on Horatio...not seen.....H was supposed to give some outstanding performance in one episode (Mommie Deadest I think), again not seen. Those weren't even spoilers, they were all comments strait from the procucers. All a crock of poo, as far as I'm concerned. So, I honestly can't say yay or nay on e/c's "defining moment" 'cause I honestly wouldn't doubt it if that was just all talk from tptb -- they say what (some) fans WANT to hear.

If it was the defining moment, does it mean they're set & no more drama?
Doubtful, considering CSI:Miami. If they stay a couple, then the unwanted e/c drama will never end.
While I'm here, I may as well bring up the latest news.....Ann Donahue has signed on another 4 years with the show. The network seems to think Miami has that much more life ahead (meh, good luck with that). I can't stand to even think that TPTB will prolong this trainwreck of a storyline for another 4 years!!! :scream:

 

[greatfan]

Ann Donahue has signed on another 4 years with the show. The network seems to think Miami has that much more life ahead (meh, good luck with that). I can't stand to even think that TPTB will prolong this trainwreck of a storyline for another 4 years!!!

I saw that too . 4 years,that was almost funny.

 

[Delynn]

Anyways, I pretty much agree with everything everyone has said so I won't repeat any details, I just wanted to add my "2 cents" on the "defining moment of the E/C relationship". Well I personally think we've already sat through the defining moment. (I'm sure many will disagree with me which is fine). I feel like the defining moment was at the end of Time Bomb when they were on the beach.

Actually, your choice for the "defining moment" is better than most guesses I've seen, Star_Gazer! That scene certainly served no other purpose then to provide the increasing obligatory E/C "moments" that the writers have ripped off from some horribly bad fan fiction (obviously they are NOT reading Jag Lady's stories or their problems, and ours, would be solved! ).

Calleigh chose to forgive Eric (I wouldn't have ) for what he did indicating that she will forgive Eric and they will eventually reform their trust for another showing that their relationship can survive through "hard times" (I don't see how but it does). Thus the defining moment was made. (I hope that logic made sense...)

Yep. Sure did!

I guess it would look like there wasn't one, because it was a lot more subtle then people thought it would be. This is just me speculating, so of course this could be wrong. But that's just my 2 cents on it.

:guffaw:Well, "subtle" is a word that I very rarely see used when referring to E/C, but that doesn't mean the writers didn't have an accident. It was really all I could do to watch that scene. Calleigh is looking more and more like a Cougar as time goes by. Calleigh looks subtantially older than Delko these days. It actually distracts from the dialogue. So my memory isn't the best when it comes to what was said, but I do remember NOT being impressed. Then again, I don't think I've EVER been impressed with an E/C scene. Those scenes are so far beneath the characters and who they are supposed to be it's insulting.

I'm sure many people will disagree with me here, which I am expecting. :lol: On another completely different note, I agree with everyone and hope that the season 8 dvd extras are not all about E/C... As I feel they might be, even though AR wasn't in most of season 8. Season 9 here we come.... :scream: *goes back to lurk mode*

Actually, contrary to what is being said elsewhere, we're a pretty nice bunch here. When we disagree it is polite unless we are attacked. And you'll get no disagreement from me. As I said, your position on what may have been the defining moment we were all promised is better than most I've seen.

And please don't go back to lurking. I enjoyed reading what you had to say. I'd like to read more!

^^ Stargazer, I won't necessarily disagree with you. I think IF there was really that "defining" moment, then it was already seen -- that said, I honestly think it was all a line of poo. All season long there were things said to be seen, & they didn't deliver any of it -- Jesse's finale ordeal, Horatio & Kyle.. we were supposed to see the "man behind the shades" (& this was said AFTER the episode Dishonor).....they described the 'betrayal' to have some enormous emotional effect on Horatio...not seen.....H was supposed to give some outstanding performance in one episode (Mommie Deadest I think), again not seen. Those weren't even spoilers, they were all comments strait from the procucers. All a crock of poo, as far as I'm concerned. So, I honestly can't say yay or nay on e/c's "defining moment" 'cause I honestly wouldn't doubt it if that was just all talk from tptb -- they say what (some) fans WANT to hear.

I know what you mean, MJ. I kept wondering if they were releasing the wrong publicity blurbs - or if we were watching a different show. Makes you wonder if they even watch what they are producing.

It was going to be a real treat for me to see David get to really shine they way they were promising. Never happened and I felt really cheated.

I think when Rodriguez came back (I wanted it noted that I'm being polite here by not commenting on the terms by which he "returned"), the "defining moment" became less important to the nomance. Then again, these writers probably don't remember what they had for breakfast let alone what they wrote for a character last week. I've never seen such a dismal group of people who apparently care so little about doing a decent job.

If it was the defining moment, does it mean they're set & no more drama? ^^ Doubtful, considering CSI:Miami. If they stay a couple, then the unwanted e/c drama will never end.

"... no more drama?" Don't tease like that, MJ! E/C is the definition of over-the-top, bad soap opera melodrama. And what is the saddest part is that the people who run the show are so disengaged from the show itself and what a good portion of the fans are saying, that they actually believe the swill they are putting out is good.

Pathetically clueless.

While I'm here, I may as well bring up the latest news.....Ann Donahue has signed on another 4 years with the show. The network seems to think Miami has that much more life ahead (meh, good luck with that). I can't stand to even think that TPTB will prolong this trainwreck of a storyline for another 4 years!!! :scream:

If E/C continues to be the focus, the show won't last 1 more year. Why don't they do everyone a favor. Marry them off and then send them on a never-ending honeymoon and have the plane crash (hence no danger of them returning). The E/C people get their wedding and the dislikers get their end of the E/C nomance.

Everyone's happy! :thumbsup:

In all seriousness, Donahue's continued presence is not good news to those who love CSI Miami and are hoping that it finds it way back to what it once was. The show doesn't have a chance of finding its past glory with Donahue at the helm - despite the propaganda that CBS is putting out.

 

[Court]

If E/C continues to be the focus, the show won't last 1 more year. Why don't they do everyone a favor. Marry them off and then send them on a never-ending honeymoon and have the plane crash (hence no danger of them returning). The E/C people get their wedding and the dislikers get their end of the E/C nomance.

Everyone's happy! :thumbsup:

Seriously, I'm applauding you right now. :thumbsup: Now, if we could only get TPTB to take note of your brilliance ...

Four more years of Donahue? Boo, I say. This means that inevitably we're going to be forced to suffer through an E/C wedding, Baby Delko, probably Baby Delko's switch at birth or kidnapping and any other old soap opera storyline they can rip off. All we need is sappy music because they already give each other those cheesy soap "looks" (For those of you who ever watched "FRIENDS," I believe Joey Tribbiani referred to it as "smell the fart" acting).

I've said it before, I will probably keep watching as long as Caruso is on, but I'm going to have to stock up on antacid just to choke down the E/C scenes. If anyone plays the stock market, invest in Pepto Bismol, because once S9 starts, I will be buying it in bulk.

 

[Delynn]

Seriously, I'm applauding you right now. :thumbsup: Now, if we could only get TPTB to take note of your brilliance ...

Please, please. Hold the applause! I'm just trying to find a resolution that makes everyone happy.

But really, they need to do something here. There is open warfare all over the Internet between fans who worship E/C and fans who simply can't stand it anymore.

TPTB are in total denial if they think this will go away. And it is the ultimate in stupidity to think it is some kind of compliment that your fans care enough to become this emotional about a storyline. The result of people becoming overly emotional is that they eventually reach a breaking point and say enough. Everyone I know said enough two season back. I can't image what they would said if they were watching now!

And it disrespectful to the fans to play with them like this. I can see TPTB reading the horrible things being said back and forth and laughing at how invested their fans are. Don't mistake for one minute these people CARE about how invested we are. They don't!

Hence the reason I've switch my major investment to NCIS.

 

[Delynn]

Four more years of Donahue? Boo, I say. This means that inevitably we're going to be forced to suffer through an E/C wedding, Baby Delko, probably Baby Delko's switch at birth or kidnapping and any other old soap opera storyline they can rip off.

Yeah, I'm already feeling the nausea at the thought of what "drama" they are dreaming up for E/C in season 9.

They've created their own monster with regard to the feelings of foreboding that a lot of fans feel when they hear the term E/C. The fear and sense of anxiety is well deserved as we have had to sit though this ill conceived and very badly executed storyline for the past 4 seasons, with no apparent end in sight.

Disappointment is followed by more disappointment. Any brief moment of hope is short term as the hope is crushed. Rodriguez' departure gave us a brief moment to hope that E/C would finally be put to rest and the "defining" moment would be an end to the torture.

Without the constant interference of E/C, we were actually given half a season of a sense of promise that the team was finally coming back together. Two new characters gave us the hope that there was a new commitment to the science, the victim and solving the crime, rather than all the soap opera drama surrounding the personal lives of three of the characters (yep, I include Horatio in that group for Marisol and the mafia crap!) that was ruling the show.

And then Rodriguez returned and Delko and E/C again became the focus of the show and the team and everyone included in that team, with the exception of Delko and Calleigh, were kicked to the curb.

All we need is sappy music because they already give each other those cheesy soap "looks" (For those of you who ever watched "FRIENDS," I believe Joey Tribbiani referred to it as "smell the fart" acting).

Ah, Joey. What a perfect definition! :guffaw:

I've said it before, I will probably keep watching as long as Caruso is on, but I'm going to have to stock up on antacid just to choke down the E/C scenes. If anyone plays the stock market, invest in Pepto Bismol, because once S9 starts, I will be buying it in bulk.

Actually, Maalox is my nausea medicine of choice. Pepto Bismol always makes me hurl for sure!

I don't know if even Caruso is going to be able to hold me if they continue in the way they have in the past 4 seasons. Four seasons is a long time to wait for TPTB to see that something is horribly wrong. They dangle a brief half season of promise (the Horatio that so many love was finally making a return!), and receive some major positive feedback, and then smash all hope against the rocks in the second half of that same season by returning to the same tired, old story - with the same tired, old two-some, and with the season finale leave no doubt that any hope for season 9 is worthless.

 

[Florry86]

Man, are we safe anywhere? I just went into the Calleigh/Emily thread, and clicked on two video links to the Season 7 extras - my gosh! All they talked about was E/C!

I love any kind of behind the scenes clips. Be it bloopers or actual behind the scenes from any kind of show, I don't care....I love them all.
Being interested in this kind of stuff, I tried and watched that clip since it appearently was all about s7 behind the scenes (after all, it was supposed to be a DVD extra, right??)....I realy wish I hadn't done it, really.

As much I can respect the actors and as much I can try and cope with this "romance", I can't help thinking someone was really drunk while deciding what to talk about on this clip! Seriously, how can you talk abou the romance throughout the whole video which is supposed to be damn f***ing behind the scene video of crime drama tv show!!!!!

DVDs extras are supposed to show you how poeple work behind the scenes!!! They're supposed to show you actors reading their scripts, actor shooting a scene and, possibly, do it wrong so that we have bloopers as well. They are also supposed to show how they obtain special effect also with the help of stunt men!!!!

What about all those people who actually helped the actors reaching their goal? What about interviews with wardrobe people? What about the writers talking about every single character instead of one author/producer praising the romance???

Also, am I drunk or did I actually not see every actor in this interview?? Did I blink and miss Eva????

Seriously, in general I love this kind of stuff but those clips were insanely ridiculous and I still cannot believe CBS actually allowed TPTB to produce this kind of garbage 'cause that was it is...not a behind the scenes extra video

They call E/C "inevitable" b/c they work side by side under such dangerous conditions - ummm - hello, they ALL do! :wtf: :brickwall:

Yeah 'cause while they seriously work in dangerous conditions we have:
- Horatio playing soccer with some random cops or kids on the street
- Natalia playing strip poker with Valera and the other lab techs instead of working.
- Ryan playing farmville on facebook on his laptop
- Frank watching porn movies on his computer at work
Will they ever shut up instead of talking rubbish?????? :shifty:

 

[mjszud]

I didn't watch the video, & I don't plan to. Season 7 was the worst and it doesn't surprise me that the extras are all about the nomance -- aside from Julia/Kyle there was no other storyline in that season. Ryan and Natalia were non-existant.

Why don't they do everyone a favor. Marry them off and then send them on a never-ending honeymoon and have the plane crash (hence no danger of them returning).

I would demand to see the dead bodies first. Full autopsy report and all. Nothing left open to pull some All My Children *cough*Maria*cough* storyline that would equal me going: Nooo:screamooo!

If anyone plays the stock market, invest in Pepto Bismol, because once S9 starts, I will be buying it in bulk.

If this nomance has been good for anything at all, it's been a great diet plan. :thumbsup: Hehe, maybe that's really how Jon and Eva shed so many pounds last season. (they look FABULOUS! btw)

Four more years of Donahue? Boo, I say.

What happened to her?!! I can't say anything too awfully terrible about her because she did at one time create some great storylines, episodes, & characters -- but I have to wonder if she lost her creativity or just got bored/lazy after season 5.

As Delynn stated, the first half of season 8 gave us some hope, & things had improved in certain areas...so we do know Ann D. & Co. are capable of pleasing us & the rest of the fanbase. What gives?
I wish she'd get out of the e/c slump & start concentrating on other characters/storylines, and the science/crimes.
I honestly do!not!care! if it means that 2 of the "originals" will be in the background for awhile. Newsflash!: the fans of this show don't soley watch for those 2 characters anymore -- the days of wanting to see Eric and/or Calleigh be front and center are long gone for alot of viewers.

 

[greatfan]

Ann once said that Jonathan Togo was a perfect fit for the show,I wish she would remember that as well as getting out of the E/C slump.
Ann also stated the show would always be about Horatio and the team and crimes and solving them.Anything done with Calleigh and Eric will be a "flavor". I would like a different flavor,this one is old ,stale and over used.
mjszud, I agree about seeing the autopsy reports. I can see two certain someones washing up on a deserted island as a season finale.

 

[inthewind]

:wtf:Interesting note to all the hoopla about Season 7 dvd extras. A&E, in promoting their summer schedule, has included 3 frames from CSI Miami's Season 7; 2 of Horatio, the third of Julia.

While it's a shame the other cast members aren't shown, even A&E recognizes that Julia might play better with their audiences than E/C. You think maybe AD & Co. needs to have a chat with A&E? That network obviously doesn't understand the importance of the nomance.

 

[Delynn]

You think maybe AD & Co. needs to have a chat with A&E? That network obviously doesn't understand the importance of the nomance.

Obviously A&E didn't get the word that it's "CSI Miami: The Ongoing Saga of the Pathetic Sex Lives of Calleigh and Eric." TPTB had better get on that! They are seriously messing with TPTB's marketing strategy! You need to promote the nomance to the exclusion of everyone and everything else!

I do have to say that it's my bad luck that everytime I stumble on an episode on A&E it seems to be E/C or Calleigh centric. So I pretty much avoid CSI Miami on A&E as well as on CBS now. I'm not watching any episodes over the hiatus. Anything I liked I have on DVR.

I watch A&E and ION for Criminal Minds ( JJ) and USA and ION for NCIS (love the dynamics of that team!). CSI Miami is strictly DVD - seasons 1-3 and any non-Delko, Calleigh or E/C centric episodes, seasons 4 & 5. I'm through allowing them to force-feed me the nomance.

 

[Jag Lady]

That scene certainly served no other purpose then to provide the increasing obligatory E/C "moments" that the writers have ripped off from some horribly bad fan fiction (obviously they are NOT reading Jag Lady's stories or their problems, and ours, would be solved!

Thanks for the compliment, DeLynn. After the Time Bomb debaucle, I openly and officially declared my fanfics "E/C free". I'm amazed nobody on that board has tried to flame me into the middle of next week. (Oh God, please! Throw some fresh meat my way :devil

Hope I don't go too far off the subject, but that's what has been getting me as well--the lying, the overhyping, the lying, the E/C overload, the lying.... You get the idea.

I snorted when they tried to tell us we'd get to know "The Man Behind the Shades". Actually, I'd say I got to know Horatio a heck of a lot better in the early years. His guilt over his dead parents, his love for Yelina, how he came down here from New York, etc. When was the last time there was ANYTHING like that, except for maybe his love for Kyle in "Dishonor"?

That tells me tptb are not secure and confident about what they're doing. Don't overhype, deliver what you promised, STOP WITH THE CLIFFHANGERS ALREADY!!

I got a clue when some website said that you-know-who would "explore their relationship" during S9. Uh, okay, let's see. This has been going on for 4 years now, during which time Calleigh explored Jake, while Eric explored every willing female in and out of the lab.

Ms. Donohue, you're what we veterans would call a walking Charlie Fox as a forensics writer. (Anybody who needs me to explain what "Charlie Fox" REALLY stands for, pm me. It would definitely violate my standards of good taste and decorum to post here)

 

[MiamiWolfe]

To me this is just another example of how the lines are firmly drawn. Because those who supply most of the spoilers are strong E/C supporters, that is where the focus of their spoiler information is and those of us who enjoy other characters are left to wonder if they even appear because our favorites are considered less important then the all consuming E/C, so they are apparently not worth mentioning.

You know I never really thought about it, but you are right! Other characters are only mentioned when it directly pertains to E/C as if that is their only function on the show: to be E/C background dancers.

If E/C continues to be the focus, the show won't last 1 more year

I agree. Four more years is unrealistic under the circumstances.

Why don't they do everyone a favor. Marry them off and then send them on a never-ending honeymoon and have the plane crash (hence no danger of them returning).

:guffaw::lol::guffaw:

If anyone plays the stock market, invest in Pepto Bismol, because once S9 starts, I will be buying it in bulk.

Actually, Maalox is my nausea medicine of choice. Pepto Bismol always makes me hurl for sure!

I think after awhile only a bucket will do for me, but I appreciate the stock tip:lol:

Ann once said that Jonathan Togo was a perfect fit for the show,I wish she would remember that as well as getting out of the E/C slump.

Why develop a character, hire an actor to play them and then just IGNORE them?!! AD needs to take the blinders off and see all the other talent on the show.

Thanks for the compliment, DeLynn. After the Time Bomb debaucle, I openly and officially declared my fanfics "E/C free". I'm amazed nobody on that board has tried to flame me into the middle of next week. (Oh God, please! Throw some fresh meat my way :devil

You know Jag Lady, I am glad we are on the same side.:lol::lol: Would it be inappropriate to stand on the sidelines and scream GO GO GO?!

That tells me tptb are not secure and confident about what they're doing. Don't overhype, deliver what you promised, STOP WITH THE CLIFFHANGERS ALREADY!!

I will second third and fourth that. A good show doesn't need to end every season with a cliffhanger. The fans will naturally come back. Why not have a season ender like in Death Pool with the gang walking the beach? Or course, if these writers wrote it, E/C would be in the lead with the rest WAY WAY WAY in the background or in front with Nat throwing rose petals and Ryan, H, Frank and Walter hoisting them on their shoulders, trumpets blaring, choirs singing etc.