Debate/Dislike a Ship Thread -- CSI:NY

Discussion in 'Shipper Central' started by lament, Aug 28, 2006.

  1. lament

    lament Captain

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    Whenever someone starts a thread to discuss a general topic from all three shows, I've noticed that CSI: NY and CSI: Miami always seem to be overwhelmed by various permutations of Grissom/Sara/Catherine/Nick. Thus, this thread is for discussing and debating the pros and cons of the various ships from CSI: NY only.

    There will be some ground rules. If the rules are followed, we should be all right.

    Ground Rules
    1) No personal attacks/flames on individuals or groups (ex: "Those Danny/Flack people are jerks" or "All Mac/Stella shippers are whiney babies"). You have to respect each other.

    2) No homophobic comments when discussing slash.

    3) No trolling. (ex: Don't jump on and say "This ship SUCKS!!!") This is a discussion thread, so present a reasoned argument.

    4) No polls. We have TONS of poll threads. This thread is for discussion and discussion only.

    5) It does not matter if a couple is CANON or not. No pairing is off limits in this thread.

    6) There will be NO discussion that couple A or character A cannot be gay since everybody has a right to ship who they want.

    If you use this thread to flame or otherwise abuse each other, we'll warn the offenders and lock the thread. When in doubt, check the Board Rules.

    So, what are your thoughts on the various NY ships? Would you like to see romance on the show? Is there a couple that doesn't make sense?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 3, 2009
  2. Top41

    Top41 Administrator Administrator Moderator Premium Member

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    I'll start! :D

    Not a fan of the idea of NY going for "canon" ships. I've always been about subtlty. So the idea of them going with the Danny/Lindsay thing is pretty lame to me. I think if you need a scene in every episode between the two characters, somethng is seriously wrong. Real chemistry doesn't need to be "sold" like that. If it's there, the audience doesn't need to be beat over the head with it in every episode. It's just not there with Danny and Lindsay at all.

    I'm intrigued by the Mac and Peyton relationship. I'm not a fan of the Mac/Stella pairing either--love them as friends, but don't see anything more there. I like the idea of a mini-arc where Mac has to grapple with dating someone he has to work with. I can't wait to see where that goes.

    My favorite ships are the implied ones--Danny/Flack, Flack/Stella, Mac/Lindsay--where small flirtation happens but we aren't hit over the head with it.
     
  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    I too find the Danny/Lindsay a bit too much of cringe fest to be taken seriously. I hope they handle Mac/Peyton thing with a bit more subtlety and finesse, or something like Mac and Stella's relationship, much lighter and snapper.

    My personal ships are Mac/Danny and Danny/Aiden. Because angry, angsty relationships are fun like that.
     
  4. MacsGirlMel

    MacsGirlMel Mac's Personal Assistant

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    My main one is Smacked, but I can go for Danny/Lindsay too. My main problem is that I haven't seen much of S1 at all so I can't comment really on the Aiden ships until I see more
    :( I'm not a fan of the spoilers but won't mind if it still eventually leads to my smacked hehe.
     
  5. Fabian

    Fabian Pathologist

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    I agree that the writers may be trying to 'sell' Danny/Lindsay a bit too much, but nevertheless, the chemistry IS there in the scenes that they have. These two sparkle on screen. The idea of the 'ghetto guy' falls in love with 'country girl' intrigues me. I know it's not new or anything, but it certainly works for Danny and Lindsay.

    I am also intrigued by Mac and Peyton, though I don't want to judge yet, since I haven't seen them together. But it's a good idea to bring Mac into an romantic arc.
    I love the Mac/Stella relationship and hope that they will grow closer one day...I just don't want it to happen now. What I do hope is that they will have more intimate scenes like in season 1, because they were hardly there in season 2 (maybe because they both had a relationship, or something like that).

    I am very happy about the Season 3 spoilers, and I actually encourage romance on the show. This show was supposed to be more personal, so I am glad that the writers are heading that way. The writers can take some risks, like putting Danny and Lindsay together this soon in the show, because that was what I expected from CSI: NY. It sets them apart from the other shows in the franchise.
     
  6. DoreenCSI

    DoreenCSI Captain

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    My main ship has always been Flack/Aiden. They don't get many scenes together but I can feel a romantic tension between them. Like in "Till Death Do We Part" when Stella jokingly told Aiden to hold Flack's hand and Aiden actually waited for him and Flack let out this nervous sort-of-chuckle. From the episode "Tri-Borough" and "What You See Is What You See", we can also see that Flack and Aiden have this nice thing going on. They're very relaxed around each other.

    I also ship Danny/Maka. Again, these two don't have many scenes together but who could ever forget the scene in "Till Death Do We Part" when Maka sort-of openly asked Danny out? To me, Danny and Maka have lots of chemistry together.

    Apart from Flack/Aiden and Danny/Maka, I also ship Flack/Stella and Danny/Stella. I sometimes ship Danny/Lindsay and Mac/Stella though.

    I've been an on-off shipper of Danny/Aiden but I have reason to believe that no matter how hard I try to see them as more than just friends, in the end, I always see them as just that; friends. They have good chemistry with each other, no doubt about that, but they give off more of a brother/sister and best friends vibe.
     
  7. Faylinn

    Faylinn Adam Fangirl Super Moderator

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    Er...could you explain what that means, because my concept of 'ghetto' doesn't exactly apply to Danny...

    I agree that I don't think any of the various ships on the show should go canon. Yes, NY is meant to be more character-driven and personal, but there's so much more to that than just romantic involvement. Hooking everyone up with everyone else is a cheap cop out, in my opinion. The friendships between the characters, the relationships that the characters have with their families, etc. would be more of what I'd like to see--and it would still fall under the realm of being 'character driven.'

    However, for the sake of the debate, here are my thoughts on the various possible ships for NY:

    I am a huge Danny/Flack shipper, and I make no bones about it. If you've seen me around the board, it's pretty obvious. CSI:NY is the first and only show I've actually shipped. Generally speaking I'm much more intrigued by the slash ships than the het ones. Maybe it's because it's something you don't see on tv and the idea of developing the relationship is more interesing...*shrug* In any case, I like to read fanfiction for various pairings, D/F being the most common one. Initially I might have been very gung-ho about having this ship go canon, but time and serious thought (along with discussion amongst fellow shippers) has made me realize that, as much as I love the ship, it's really much better in fanfiction. On-screen relationships, for me, are better if implied.

    I don't know what it is that makes me love D/F. Maybe it's the fact that the two characters are so different and yet have a lot more in common than they realize. Maybe it's the contrast of their upbringings and the conflict that can bring to the table. There are countless reasons that this ship intrigues me and keeps me interested, and I'm sure I've said them over and over in the Danny/Flack threads. :lol:

    As a slash fan, I'm all about the subtlety and subtext. Maybe that's part of the reason why the Danny/Lindsay relationship just rubs me the wrong way. The only 'chemistry' I can see between these two is as co-workers who can get along, and maybe a hint of the friendship that I saw between Danny and Aiden (more on that ship in a minute ;)). Danny, to me, is someone who just flirts. Period. Whatever I see between Danny and Lindsay I also see between Danny and just about anybody he's in a scene with. I can understand why people would be interested in the pairing (however cliche it may seem at this point), and I can see why the writers would want to pursue it, but that doesn't make me think it's a good idea. In the end, I don't see anything more in that relationship that I could see if I switched on a soap opera in the middle of the day, and I don't particularly think that's a positive thing to add to the show. I've given countless reasons against that at one point or another, as have other posters, and I'm sure you're all well aware of them and don't need to read them again. ;)

    I've read one or two stories for Mac/Stella and I could see that relationship in fanfiction, but on the show I'm not so sure. I love the deep friendship between them, the sense that they've been there for each other through a lot. I just don't think that, at this point, it would work on the show. Maybe in the future I'll change my mind, but right now I have to say no.

    The only character on the show I could really see Flack in a relationship with (other than Danny, of course ;)) would be Aiden. There was a certain something there with Flack/Aiden that didn't need to be featured on every episode or specifically pointed out in a scene to be obvious. I don't know that I would have wanted a canon relationship out of the ship, but I liked what happened in season 1.

    Danny/Aiden, on the other hand, I just don't see. They flirted (and Danny flirts with everyone) and they had a great dynamic, but I could never actually see them together. Aiden's line about being out of Danny's league at the end of "Crimes and Misdemeanors" sort of sums it up for me--they had definite chemistry and a great relationship, but I couldn't see it getting romantic. I've read a few excellent fanfiction stories for the pairing, so in fanfic maybe, but I never saw the right situation for it on the show.

    The idea of Flack/Stella is interesting to me, but I really just don't see it. I view Stella as more of a friend to Flack, someone he can confide in, and the opposite is true as well. The scenes in "All Access" were wonderful between them, but it really just felt like a very deep friendship to me, not remotely romantic.

    Mac/Lindsay has amazing chemistry. The scenes between these two are great to watch. But maybe it's the fact that he's her boss, I can't see it becoming romatic. If I read the right fanfiction I might change my mind, you never know. ;)

    Poor Hawkes, I can't pair him with anyone on the show. The man has chemistry with a brick wall, but when it comes to the people on the team, it doesn't cross into romantic territory for me. I'd love to see him in a relationship, but I can't see it with another member of the team. In fanfic I like to read pairings of him with Mac or Danny, but on the show we'd be seeing a het ship, and I can't imagine him with Lindsay or Stella. Well, that's not entirely true--sometimes there are hints that make the idea of Hawkes/Stella intriguing, and maybe some more scenes that showcase their chemistry could make me a shipper. ;)

    Danny/Stella I just can't see. Friendship yes, romantic relationship definitely not.

    Flack/Lindsay, for me, isn't even a viable ship at this point. There have been what, two or three scenes with them? They've only spoken to each other once or twice. In fanfiction maybe (and I've written two stories for the pairing, so I have to agree with that :lol:), but on the show I can't even begin to imagine a romantic relationship between them.

    I have to admit that the idea of Stella/Hammerback is too funny not to be intriguing. Hammerback is such an interesting character, you have to admit. :lol: Even though it might have started out in jest, I'm sure I'm not the only one who's thought, "well, maybe..." :p

    Mac/Flack is an interesting dynamic on the show, but I don't see it as anything more than friendship. In fanfiction, it's one of my favorite ships to read, but that just illustrates my preference for ships in fiction rather than canon.

    Mac/Danny is a ship I've never really jumped on board. I love slash, and I've read a few fics for the pairing, but I just can't get into it. Maybe I haven't been reading the right fics. ;) For these two, I don't think there's a real equality between them. Mac is in charge, Danny is the subordinate, and that doesn't really intrigue me as far as romance goes. I think Danny needs someone who he feels is on a level with him, and maybe it's just me, but I think that Mac refuses to be in that position. In my opinion, Mac sees Danny as someone he cares about and wants to protect, but also someone that he needs to keep in line. There's a certain tension there that I can't get past, and it prevents me from seeing this as a real pairing.

    Mac/Aiden had a great dynamic, they worked well together, they were comfortable with each other. But I don't see it as a romantic relationship (although I don't even know if there's a thread for this pairing. I think I'm just trying all of the combinations right now :lol:).

    Another pairing that I don't think I've seen much of is Aiden/Hawkes. That could have been interesting, but I didn't get a good enough feel for their dynamic to say one way or the other whether I could see it as a real ship or not. Right now it just seems like a missed opportunity with Aiden gone, as do the other Aiden ships.

    Let's see, what did I forget? Well, there's femslash, for one. It's never been something that intrigued me, I have to admit, but I might read some fanfiction for it at some point. I have to say I'd see Stella/Aiden more than Stella/Lindsay, but I did read a story that had Aiden and Lindsay in a relationship and it was written in a way that makes me more likely to accept femslash with Lindsay in it. ;) On the show, I don't see any of these pairings realistically, but in fanfiction it can work. ;)

    I think I've mentioned just about every possible pairing on the show. :lol: The only thing left to mention might be the Mac/Peyton relationship, but that one I'm waiting to see. I like the idea of Mac in a relationship with someone outside the team, but since I know next-to-nothing of this woman right now, and we haven't actually seen thim in a scene together, I'm going to hold my judgment on the relationship until the start of the season. :)

    Edited to bold some ship names for clarity.[/b]
     
  8. Radical618

    Radical618 Coroner

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    Okay... so Fay basically just set the standards for every ship ever on this show.. how am I going to compete? :lol:

    I'll do my favorite ships then (I'm a huge multi-Lindsay shipper)... that way I'm not dissing on anyone elses...

    First off: My favorite EVER Danny and Lindsay. Amazing chemistry. They play off of each other so, so well. I can see why people might not like this ship- a lot of people were DnA fans, and with Aiden being let go, it was like there goes that... (I felt that way too...) But I quickly adjusted- quickly as in when Danny said "How ya doin'?" And did a quick check out of his new co-worker. From that moment I was hooked. I hope to see this ship progress next season.

    Secondly: Mac and Stella- Always have, and always will be pulling for these two. They have great chemistry together, some of the best on any show. I like the way they can communicate about each others cases- even if they're not on the same one. I also like that occasionally Mac will ask what Stella's Opinion is on something. I find it very cute. One of my favorite scenes is from "Officer Blue" where Stella's line during a small argument is "Time to get the bullet out of the horse Mac." Slams the gun on the table, and walks out. Such a great angsty scene... I could go on, but I wont.. ;)

    Number 3: Flack and Aiden- I just love these two together. They just went together so well. In "What You See is What You See", the bike part was just great- she seemed kind of turned on by Flack and the bike. The conversations were priceless between them also. "So this guy was killed by a frozen crapsicle?" "Yep."

    Fourth: Mac and Lindsay- They have great scenes toghether. They stay very on the subject a lot though, but they stay on it well. She always seems to make him smile. She knows just what to say, but syas it in a professional matter. And once again, great chemistry between the two of them. It's almost kind of like a father daughter relationship, just in a non-related manner. (not supposed to sound gross...)

    Numero Cinco: Aiden and Danny- Very brother-sister relationship, but very cute together. They had a way pf calming eachother down, but yet making each other laugh so much. The "Robo-slapper"? You know they wanted to test that out! One thing that kind of spoiled the fun was in (don't now the eppy off of the top of my head) She wsa dressed up pretty nicely and saw Danny and said "I'm way out of you're league, Messer." It kind of gave me the sense he was into her, but she wasn't diggin' him. It kind of ruined the fun for me.

    2nd to last: Flack and Lindsay- Although I don't really see them really going anywhere, it's so fun to write fan fic on these two. And they're so cute to think about with each other. Fan fic is basically what got me into these two. If it were to happen, it would be cool. I would defenetly support them.

    Last but not least: Danny and Flack- I really would never expect to see this ever on screen, but the fanfic-- holy crap so so hott. Main reason I'll support this ship- the ficcies. I wouldn't to see these two go at it (sorry guys) but the fics are good.. so there's a plus!
     
  9. kinkapoodles

    kinkapoodles Judge

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    Wow...between Fay and Radical, there's not much left to say. :lol: But I'm sure I'll think of something. :p

    I have to agree with Top that I'm not in favor of ships going canon on the show. I know NY is supposed to be character driven, but they can accomplish that without pairings. I like to explore the friendship, work relations, and background stories more than the ships.

    I am very interested in seeing this Mac/Peyton thing and how it is handled. I'm glad Mac has been seeing someone that doesn't work at the lab (well not at first I guess). I'm also interested to know just how far the Danny/Lindsay thing will go. Unless there's some new spoilers posted today that I haven't read yet, I don't see it turning into much. From the spoilers (which I know could change) it doesn't seem like there's much romantically going on after episode 4. Just my take on it.

    Now about the ships:

    Danny/Flack - I'm sure that everyone knows that this is my absolute favortie pairing. There are indeed some very hot fanfics out there about these two. They have amazing chemistry, have a deep friendship, and have a real attraction to each other. In fanfic, it's a D/F lovers dream. On the show, the writer's would just screw it up. So, I would not want to see this on the show. Although I am very intrigued at Flack's obvious staring at Danny in every scene they are in. :D That baffles me because Flack doesn't do that with anyone else. Also, Danny seems more relaxed when Flack is around.

    Flack/Aiden - I enjoyed these two together. These were the first fics I ever read from NY and I loved them. I enjoyed watching them work together and they had amazing chemistry. Too bad they hadn't gotten to work together more.

    Danny/Maka - I have never seen Danny have so much chemistry with any other female character as he had with Maka and they didn't have lots of scenes together. They just sizzled. I loved watching them work together.

    That's really the only favorites I have. Now on to the rest.

    Mac/Stella - I just don't see it. Yes, they have amazing chemistry together but I see them more as good friends and co-workers only.

    Mac/Lindsay - This I could see. They have great chemistry together and she seems genuinely happy when they work together. She seems more relaxed and happy. Although it would probably never work because he is the boss.

    Danny/Aiden - I have read a couple fanfics but I just don't see it. Yes they worked great together and had amazing chemistry but I only saw them as good friends and co-workers. I'm glad TPTB never pursuied that relationship.

    Danny/Lindsay - I just do not see this at all. I see absolutely no chemistry between these two romantically. I'm sorry if I upset anybody who does see the chemistry but I just don't. It has nothing to do with Aiden. I never thought of Aiden and Danny as a couple. I've always thought most of Danny and Lindsay's scenes were full of tension. Like they were making themselves pull of the flirting scenes instead of actually enjoying them. Now, Danny is a total flirt. He flirts with everyone but it's just not happening with these two IMO. I lay a lot of blame with TPTB. They have pushed Danny and Lindsay in our faces and gave them scenes together when there was no reason to. Maybe I'll change my mind sometime in the future but right now, it's just not happening for me.

    I'm also not too fond of Danny or Flack hooked up with any other guy except each other. I almost forgot, that's not entirely true. I have read tons of Danny/Speedle (from Miami) and I do enjoy those. I've read some Mac/Danny and Mac/Flack but I just couldn't get into them. I've read some Flack/Lindsay but couldn't get into them because they have not had enough scenes together.
     
  10. Islandgirl

    Islandgirl Police Officer

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    What I like about CSI:NY is that it's a "double-ship" show. We have the long-established, extremely subtle shippiness of the Mac/Stella relationship and the newer, more flirty shippiness of the Danny/Lindsey relationship.
    In my perfect little shipper fantasy world, BOTH these couples would be married to each other by the end of season three. In reality, I realize that's not going to happen. The unwritten rules of TV require that at least one of these ships remain in a state of unresolved sexual tension until the last episode of the series or until one of the actors who portrayed these characters leaves the show or until the Earth stops spinning.
    However, that's the deliciousness of a double ship show. ONE of these relationships may actually evolve so that it contains kissing, marriage, sex, children, etc. rather than being forever limited to nothing more than lingering glances and flirtatious romances.
    Personally, I'd rather seem Mac/Stella get married than Danny/Lindsey, but I think M/S has been established as the main ship of the show (the one that has to remain in a state of perpetual UST) , so it's more likely that Danny/Lindsey will move on to a more fulfilling relationship sometime this season.
     
  11. Faylinn

    Faylinn Adam Fangirl Super Moderator

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    Is that your not-so-subtle way of saying I dissed someone's ship? ;) I'm not trying to insult anybody who follows a ship, simply to express my personal opinions about all of the ships on the show. :)

    They play off each other well as co-workers, in my opinion. Danny and Hawkes play off each other well, Lindsay and Mac play off each other well. I just don't see how that translates to romance. You're welcome to feel that way, I'm just expressing my feelings on it. ;)

    But what's with the comparison to DnA? I was never a DnA shipper, so that had no effect on my feelings for D/L. I didn't start shipping D/F seriously until I began posting in the D/F thread at the beginning of May, so I honestly don't even think that my preference for D/F had any effect on how I viewed D/L from the beginning. Quite frankly, I dislike D/L all on it's own, unrelated to any other ship.

    I like this stuff as well, but I wouldn't call it 'cute' exactly. I think it's a testament to their deep friendship and trust for each other, but when it comes to romance I just don't think they've reached that point yet. Mac still has some personal issues to deal with before he's at a point to be ready for a serious relationship (although I'm interested to see his interaction with Peyton in S3), and Stella has her own demons to overcome. Eventually I could see it, but not at this point.

    I think I know what you mean. :lol: It's like she knows she has a lot to learn from him, and he knows he has a lot to teach. Their interaction is almost flirty, but I think the fact that they stay "on the subject," as you say, shows that one or both of them seems determined to keep it professional.

    Let's face it, Danny/Flack only exists in fanfiction. Hell, all of the ships only exist in fanfiction at this point. What's on the show influences us, but the relationships only exist in our minds. Even if Danny and Lindsay start to date on the show (and I agree with 1CSIMfan that it may not even happen), will that really satisfy D/L shippers? I doubt it. D/L on the show won't begin to compare to D/L in fanfiction. Any relationship that goes canon cannot be as developed and functional and well-thought-out as shippers make it in discussion and in fanfiction.

    Now, I see I managed to miss a few ships the first time around. :lol:

    Danny/Maka: I agree with 1CSIMfan that they had so much chemistry and they really did "sizzle" together. I could easily see that developing into something romantic. Easily. ;)

    I mentioned just about every combination earlier, but didn't do Flack/Hawkes. I've only read one fic for this pairing (which was hot, but not exactly romantic :lol:), and I can't really see it at this point. I think the relationship could be interesting in fanfic if done correctly, but right now I don't think it's viable. ;)

    I think my seemingly constant references to fanfiction say a lot about how I view ships. Shipping is fun and it's easy to become very involved in a ship, but in the end I think it really comes down to the fans to be responsible for ships. Shipping the way I do it (and I'm sure a lot of other people would agree) simply couldn't exist on the show, and I don't think I'd want it to. I'm completely satisfied with ship in fanfics, and I think I'd be distinctly unsatisfied with ships on the show.

    ETA: I was typing when Islandgirl posted. ;)

    Do you really think Mac and Stella are an established relationship? I have to say I disagree. They're established as friends but nothing more.

    I also don't like the idea of NY being a 'double ship show' as you say. I don't think a crime drama needs to concentrate on marriage, sex, kids, etc. at all, even when the show is going off the air. Anything of that nature should take place in the background, and quite frankly I don't think the writers could do that right.

    So no offense to you, Islandgirl, but I hope you're wrong about either or both of those relationships considering the way you view them. You have every right to ship the way you do and see the show the way that you do, but if either ship goes canon in such a way, I don't think it would be CSI anymore, it would be a soap opera. Seriously.
     
  12. Natasha Romanoff

    Natasha Romanoff Police Officer

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    My main ships for CSI NY would deffinatly have to be Mac/Stella i think i've probably shipped them from day one, they just seem to me like they could have something there between them and like each other more then friends. My other one has always been Danny/Aiden, but lately i started shipping Danny/Lindsay as well, and i've also recently become interested in Flack/Aiden.
     
  13. Fabian

    Fabian Pathologist

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    When I wrote it, I knew it wasn't the right word at all. Can you come up with a better word for Danny's background? Anyhow, I hope you understand what I mean.
     
  14. Springmoon

    Springmoon CSI Level Two

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    Er, Fay I really worry about you sometimes :lol: I think you have CSI:NY on the brain 24/7.

    The ship I am behind the most is definitely Danny/Maka. From the moment he said her name in the episode where we first saw them together, I swear I almost saw a spark jump between them. There was this definite chemistry between them - and I mean the explosive kind.

    Danny/Lindsay I don't really get. The chemistry that I see between them is the same kind that I have with my kid brother and my best friend growing up - who happened to be a boy. It's platonic and vanilla. It could maybe - maybe! - grow into something more many many years down the road, but right now, I don't see anything there.

    Danny/Flack I am, of course, fully in favor of :lol: but to be honest and fair, they have a very solid and almost unshakeable friendship. That's the reason why I would put them together so easily. They're not necessarily gay, but just love each other so much and so well.

    Mac/Stella know each other so well, that a ship relationship would never work. I think Stella might kill him.
     
  15. Faylinn

    Faylinn Adam Fangirl Super Moderator

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    Re: The Great Ship Debate--CSI: NY

    Oh, I had a pretty good idea what you were trying to say, but I didn't understand what you meant by 'ghetto.' :lol:

    Springmoon, don't make me spork you. :lol: I just happen to think I should put some major thought into what I say on here. ;) Go big or go home, as it were. :p

    I think the point about Danny and Flack not being 'gay' is a very important one. Slash fans generally know that as a general rule, but people who don't ship slash might not think there's a difference. The fact is that I don't see any of these characters as 'gay,' not that there's anything wrong with that, of course. It's just that the characters have been portrayed as 'straight' and that's how I think of them. When I think of Danny and Flack in a relationship, it's not about coming out or anything, it's just about falling in love with someone. Why try to label it? The world isn't divided into gay and straight, so I don't think shipping should be so cut and dry either. ;)
     

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