Character Development/Screentime Discussion

It was not murder. Again, the definition of murder: the crime of unlawfully killing a person especially with malice aforethought

to kill (a human being) unlawfully and with premeditated malice

This is NOT what Nick did. It was not murder. Catherine has shot and killed two (Beebs brother too) that was not murder.

 

What Nick did was justifiable homicide, NOT murder. Just like Ray at the end of season 9. They killed an armed suspect who was actively aiming a weapon at them or someone else, and was not already subdued. Once Ray had subdued Haskell it became murder, because Haskell was no longer a threat.

 

But Ray didn't have Haskell subdued, he got free of his restraints, and was still threatning Ray and would have killed him, but he got him first, plus what he'd done to Gloria, justifiable is subject to interpretation, and the circumstances surrounding the event at the time, and he might have escaped again, wouldn't that have been wonderful?

 

"A homicide can only be justified if there is evidence to suggest that it was reasonable to believe that the offending party posed an imminent threat to the life or wellbeing of another."

Haskell was no longer a threat, once he was cuffed. He didn't "get free" - Ray cut him loose in order to beat him some more and kill him.

As for "he might have escaped again" - well, my next door neighbor "might" go on a killing spree next month, so does that mean I would be justified in killing him?

 

Haskell did not *get free* of his restraints, Ray cut them off!!
That is where the problem lies.

Every person who Nick killed was armed, and in a position to shoot back, both McCann brothers and Jekyll.

In my earlier post, I wasn't referring to Ray liking Nick, I know he likes everyone. I was referring to Ray actually having their backs, as in saving their lives or bailing them out of trouble. Seems like it's always been Ray who's had to be *saved*.

ETA:
Smokey, don't pop, you're too important around here! Just think of all the spam you've been removing lately. :lol:

 

Well sorry I guess I imagined that Nick killed two people, was it justifiable? of course as stated earlier he could have disabled them. If someone broke into my house would it be justifiable to kill them or should wait till they kill me? I realize Ray killed Haskell, I watched this it too, but under what circumstances? Did anyone mourn his death? So he should face what ever he deserves, depending on what his answer will be next season. Now I read [on another fan-site] that it's possible that Gloria is pregnant with Haskells child EWWW. Fans have different takes on everything and don't get upset if someone doens't see things the same way. It's the name of the game, different opinions.

 

Those two people had guns and were going to shoot others, yes it was justifiable. And how was Nick going to disable those two when the guns were pointing at them? He was just suppose to walk up to them and take the guns as they're shooting him? :wtf::wtf::wtf:

If Nick had subdued them, he wouldn't have then murdered them.

Do you not get that killing someone that is justified is NOT THE SAME as murder?

Ray murdered Haskell, plain and simple. It was not justified. Ray is not Judge and Jury and cannot decide Haskells fate.

Having another opinion is not what upsets people, it's when people don't seem to know the difference between a justifiable kill and murder.

Yes, Nick killed three people, he DID NOT MURDER THEM. Ray killed Haskell, but he MURDERED him and by murdering Haskell he destroyed everything this team built up. He put Brass in a situation he shouldn't have been in. I can understand why Ray did it, still DOESN'T make it right.

Man, I give up. Fantasy worlds.

 

This isn't a case of "different opinions," this is a case of one person not comprehending the definitions of "self defense" and "murder." Yes, both instances end up with a dead person, but they are NOT remotely the same thing. Self defense is when you have to protect yourself from being killed (i.e. a perp draws his weapon and is obviously going to kill you if you don't shoot first.) Murder is when there is no threat of further harm and you still choose to kill a person. (i.e. the perp is subdued and cuffed, but then you uncuff him and kill him anyway.) It doesn't matter if anyone cares if the dude that was killed is dead or what terrible things he did before he was subdued. You let the legal process determine guilt and punishment. No one gets to play judge, jury and executioner. Not even the most fabulous, awesomest, perfectest person in the world.

 

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I know Ray is a murderer, I saw the episode and realize he was completeley out of line and his rage and anger took him over, please give me some credit. I don't think he's perfect he's got the same gene as Haskell. I hope he gets just punishment as he should, if he cops up to his crime and the rest of them as well, and they put him away for his horrendous crime, and maybe strip them of their badges, or their positions cause they all know what happened not just Brass, or whatever is justice. I meant on mourn the "fans" who watch the show, did anyone say "Oh darn he's dead poor guy"? I as well want this to be over, and was getting sick of it too

 

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