What was Danny's biggest misstep?
- Thread starter Top41
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I voted for sending Ruben home - it was a mistake with tragic consequences, and it was the situation where Danny was most responsible (IMO) for the tragedy - unlike in 'On the Job', which I thought was more of a case of being in the wrong place at the wrong time (although it was still definitely a mistake to shoot at Minhas).
AppleJack
Police Officer
I disagree with you, Faylinn. Bad decisions or choices are not always mistakes. In this case I don't think it was a mistake but more an unfortunate decision. I'm sorry if I'm nit-picking here. 
I haven't decided yet but I'm leaning towards the second option. I'll have to rewatch some episodes first to be sure.
I haven't decided yet but I'm leaning towards the second option. I'll have to rewatch some episodes first to be sure.
Hmm, well I still see sending Ruben home as a mistake. To take a definition from dictionary.com:
"a wrong action attributable to bad judgment or ignorance or inattention"
That's how I look at it, anyway. It wasn't a conscious sort of mistake, such as defying orders from his boss or withholding information about his family's ties with the Tanglewood boys, but I view it as a mistake nonetheless.
"a wrong action attributable to bad judgment or ignorance or inattention"
That's how I look at it, anyway.
It wasn't a conscious sort of mistake, such as defying orders from his boss or withholding information about his family's ties with the Tanglewood boys, but I view it as a mistake nonetheless.
I'm not sure many people will agree with me on this, but personally, I think one of Danny's biggest mistakes/worst decisions was cheating on Lindsay and pushing her away... It seemed to me as everything was fine with them, then Boom, Rueben was killed, which yes, Danny was in some way responsible for, he let the kid go home on his own, on which way he was killed (I think that was another pretty big mess up), he then feels really guilty about letting this happen and ends up sleeping with Rikki, after which he then begins to push Lindsay away, which I think when she comes to find out about his cheating will crush her... I think his affair was a pretty big mistake...
Kimmychu
Coroner
Oh man, it was only until I was replying to this thread that I got what 'sending Ruben home on his own' was referring to. :lol: Me bad. I kept thinking it meant Danny letting Ruben ride on his own when he got the phone call, but now that I realize it's referring to Danny shouting at Ruben to ride home when the gunshot rang out ... yeah, that would be the biggest mistake Danny's ever done yet.
Personally, that bit comes off as iffy writing to me. It isn't logical that Danny would just forget about Ruben after such a tense situation. If anything, from the way he watched out for Ruben earlier in the scene, he would have been on the phone ASAP to check and see whether Ruben did reach home safely.
Now that I think about it, the angst level of the episode would probably have shot up the wazoo if Danny had checked up on Ruben and rushed the kid to the hospital only for Ruben to pass away anyway. Not only would that have made much more sense for Danny's character, the writers would still have been able to go where they did in season four. Oh well, eggs already turned into omelettes and all that.
:lol: Me bad. I kept thinking it meant Danny letting Ruben ride on his own when he got the phone call, but now that I realize it's referring to Danny shouting at Ruben to ride home when the gunshot rang out ... yeah, that would be the biggest mistake Danny's ever done yet. Personally, that bit comes off as iffy writing to me. It isn't logical that Danny would just forget about Ruben after such a tense situation. If anything, from the way he watched out for Ruben earlier in the scene, he would have been on the phone ASAP to check and see whether Ruben did reach home safely.
Now that I think about it, the angst level of the episode would probably have shot up the wazoo if Danny had checked up on Ruben and rushed the kid to the hospital only for Ruben to pass away anyway. Not only would that have made much more sense for Danny's character, the writers would still have been able to go where they did in season four. Oh well, eggs already turned into omelettes and all that.
I'll have to disagree with this. Danny was pushing Lindsay away long before episode 4x11. He was doing it since the season four premiere, if his eye rolling and him telling her off in the lab was anything to go by. What Danny didn't do was not turn to Lindsay for support like Lindsay expected him to, which is far cry from him 'pushing her away only after he slept with Rikki'. And of course, there's the continuing debate of whether Danny and Lindsay were ever in a relationship to begin with. One night of sex on a pool table does not automatically a relationship make. If sex was the sole determining factor for it, then I guess Danny and Rikki must definitely be in one since they slept with each other at least twice, right?
PerfectAnomaly
Resident Smart Ass
You can't cheat on someone if you're not exclusively dating them and there is no conclusive evidence that Danny and Lindsay were in an exclusive relationship. Because of that I don't agree that sleeping with Rikki and pushing Lindsay away can be labeled "mistakes" at this point. Actually, I don't agree that pushing Lindsay away can be labeled a "mistake" at all. Sometimes relationships - whether friendly, business, or romantic - don't work out and people distance themselves from the other person. I can agree that Danny and Rikki sleeping together can be labeled a "mistake," but it's because they were using sex to try and deal with grief and relieve guilt and not because it relates to Lindsay in any way.
In the Danny thread I said it was a toss up between the Minhaus and Ruben incidents, but since I have to pick just one I went with Ruben. There's no proof that Danny could have prevented Ruben from being shot or saved Ruben if he kept Ruben with him, but there's also no proof that keeping Ruben with him wouldn't have saved his life. He should have been overly cautious with Ruben while he was responsible for his care and he wasn't. That misstep may have contributed to the death of a 10 year old boy. Missteps can't get any bigger than that IMO.
Shytownmofo
Lab Technician
It depends on how you look at it. Are we looking at things he did consciously, like Defying Mac over going to IAB in the Minhaus incident, or split second decisions he made; like with telling Ruben to go home?
If we're going on Conscious decisons, I'd say the Minhaus incident. That had the potential to lead to some serious consequences for him. He could have lost his job, he could have gone to jail, hypothetically.
Or, there's the fact that he slept with a co-worker he works with on a regular basis. Flirting is fine, but when you cross the line and actually have a physical relationship, be it actually having an exclusive thing, or just a one time thing, it does change things, and not for the better. Perhaps Danny realized that, and didn't want that, so he held her at arms length.
Something to be considered is that he was holding her at arms length long before the events of "Childs Play." There was not one kiss, hug, romantic gesture or anything there to indicate their continuing relationship in Season 4. The closest thing was the Condom Spray Demonstration in "CYHMN." He sort of rolled his eyes and said something to the affect of "All Right. Let's get back to work."
Another thing that you have to consider is that Death is the worst consequence of them all, with bodily harm coming next Minhaus died, Ruben Died. Lindsay, she's still alive and kicking, and physically fine.
Danny and Lindsay sleeping together in "Snow Day" led to him taking her shift, getting caught in the warehouse with Adam, and getting beaten pretty badly. I'd say that's a serious consequence.
Also, there's the fallout that their "Relationship" could have had on the crimelab. The scene in "LWFM" where Lindsay left her evidence out, and Quinn explicitly let Mac know that they had some tension there that was not merely friendly. Mac could have come down very hard on Danny for that if he'd wanted to. In most workplaces, there are protocols that people working in the same departments and on the same shift can't have intimate relations; and they're there for that very reason, because it changes things between people, and oftentimes not for the better, and can tear apart a team, theoretically.
If we're going on Conscious decisons, I'd say the Minhaus incident. That had the potential to lead to some serious consequences for him. He could have lost his job, he could have gone to jail, hypothetically.
Or, there's the fact that he slept with a co-worker he works with on a regular basis. Flirting is fine, but when you cross the line and actually have a physical relationship, be it actually having an exclusive thing, or just a one time thing, it does change things, and not for the better. Perhaps Danny realized that, and didn't want that, so he held her at arms length.
Something to be considered is that he was holding her at arms length long before the events of "Childs Play." There was not one kiss, hug, romantic gesture or anything there to indicate their continuing relationship in Season 4. The closest thing was the Condom Spray Demonstration in "CYHMN." He sort of rolled his eyes and said something to the affect of "All Right. Let's get back to work."
Another thing that you have to consider is that Death is the worst consequence of them all, with bodily harm coming next Minhaus died, Ruben Died. Lindsay, she's still alive and kicking, and physically fine.
Danny and Lindsay sleeping together in "Snow Day" led to him taking her shift, getting caught in the warehouse with Adam, and getting beaten pretty badly. I'd say that's a serious consequence.
Also, there's the fallout that their "Relationship" could have had on the crimelab. The scene in "LWFM" where Lindsay left her evidence out, and Quinn explicitly let Mac know that they had some tension there that was not merely friendly. Mac could have come down very hard on Danny for that if he'd wanted to. In most workplaces, there are protocols that people working in the same departments and on the same shift can't have intimate relations; and they're there for that very reason, because it changes things between people, and oftentimes not for the better, and can tear apart a team, theoretically.
miss_blue
Lab Technician
At the moment, I can't decide to vote on any of those. Ruben's death in his care should definitely take the cake for Danny's biggest mistakes, but when he sent Ruben home, he was trying to protect the kid from getting hurt, and as a police officer sticking at the scene of a shooting. Personally I can't fully blame him for what happened to poor Ruben, in the end,it was all a combination of fate and bad decision making. I can't really place 100% the blame on him, but he did do a stupid thing when he heard the gunshot and then sent poor kid back home all by himself.
On the other hand, there is the shooting from On the Job. Although the suspect fired at him first, Danny should have known better than to shoot his weapon in a crowded subway station, people could have panicked and the consequences of his actions could have been worse. But then again, he didn't make that decision fully consciously, he acted on an impulse and according to his Academy training.
Regarding the other bad decisions in the poll, I feel that they are not half as bad as the ones from Child's Play and On The Job. Danny is always trusting the bad guy to be the good guy, but in the end he comes around and makes the good arrest.
And last, pushing the panic button in Trapped, I don't consider it to be a mistake. While he was in the panic room he put his thoughts in order, and saw the affection of the millionaire guy had for his little brother, and in a way opened his eyes to Louie, and he called his brother. In the end, that was a good thing.
(While writing this post I decided to vote for sending Ruben home)
On the other hand, there is the shooting from On the Job. Although the suspect fired at him first, Danny should have known better than to shoot his weapon in a crowded subway station, people could have panicked and the consequences of his actions could have been worse. But then again, he didn't make that decision fully consciously, he acted on an impulse and according to his Academy training.
Regarding the other bad decisions in the poll, I feel that they are not half as bad as the ones from Child's Play and On The Job. Danny is always trusting the bad guy to be the good guy, but in the end he comes around and makes the good arrest.
And last, pushing the panic button in Trapped, I don't consider it to be a mistake. While he was in the panic room he put his thoughts in order, and saw the affection of the millionaire guy had for his little brother, and in a way opened his eyes to Louie, and he called his brother. In the end, that was a good thing.
(While writing this post I decided to vote for sending Ruben home)
Kimmychu
Coroner
I just reread your post and the quoted part above is redundant because you mentioned Ruben getting killed as two separate missteps.
Either he's 'in some way responsible' or he 'messed up big'.But since you did acknowledge what happened with Ruben is a misstep, my question is this (and it's a sincere one): How is it that Danny's irresponsibility resulting in the death of an innocent child is far less a misstep than him sleeping with another woman other than Lindsay?
(Anyone else who has the same opinion that Danny 'cheating' on Lindsay is his worst misstep, feel free to answer the question too, if ya like.)
As someone said to me on this issue, Danny pushing Lindsay away/not turning to her for support was a choice, not a mistake/misstep. If it's to be considered a misstep, then it can be just as easily said Danny even choosing to flirt with Lindsay, much less have sex with her, was a mistake/misstep due to where and what it led to.
The poor guy just can't get a break, can he?
Ghawazee
CSI Level Three
I voted "Other". he didn't follow Mac's orders about not talking to the I.A guy (or was a lawyer? I can't remember!). And he didn't trust Mac either (something it was remarked by Donnie) he only complaint about him as a spoiled brat
I could handled it because i liked Danny by then.
4 years later he showed he didn't deserve at all Mac's confidence or anyone's confidence when he refused to report Rikki
It doesn't matter how guilty he had felt,still he had a responsability because many people could have been hurt or dead
So he screwed up again in All in the family
Debbs
ps: Btw I DO like Rikki!!!!
I could handled it because i liked Danny by then.
4 years later he showed he didn't deserve at all Mac's confidence or anyone's confidence when he refused to report Rikki
It doesn't matter how guilty he had felt,still he had a responsability because many people could have been hurt or dead
So he screwed up again in All in the family
Debbs
ps: Btw I DO like Rikki!!!!
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Railynn
Rookie
off of this list I'd have to say Danny sending Ruben home. Cause even though you can see how in the moment that was probably the best desicion, trying to get Ruben out of the situation, Danny should have at least checked him since Danny didn't see the bullet be fired he just heard it so he had no idea if Ruben was hurt or not.
Also it's his biggest misstep/mistake whatever because it's one of the few that he could have completely changed the outcome. Most of the others where out of his control.
Also it's his biggest misstep/mistake whatever because it's one of the few that he could have completely changed the outcome. Most of the others where out of his control.
I'll admit, I left "Sleeping with Lindsay" and "Sleeping with Rikki" off the list because I didn't want to directly get into the shipper stuff. Anyone is of course free to pick "Other" and opine one of those as the options if that's what they think Danny's biggest mistake is, though.
Interestingly, some of this discussion kind of gets at the question of what Danny would think is his biggest mistake. I think he'd go with sending Ruben home alone. It's obviously the thing he's done that he's regretted the most.
Yeah, I should have had that option on the poll, since I think most people were understanding of Danny's position up until the point he decided "no one had his back" and he was going to take matters into his own hands, despite being expressly told not to do that by Mac and Flack.
Yep, that should have been on the list, too. Danny is lucky he had Flack to watch over him in that episode or things could have gone down in a really bad way (ie, he wouldn't have found Rikki in time and she would have shot Ollie with his gun).
I voted for sending Ruben home alone. I know it was an active crime scene, but Danny had a responsibility to Ruben first and foremost. He should have kept Ruben with him or even sent him into a nearby shop--done something other than told a ten-year-old kid to ride home alone in Manhattan. He should have called for back up and then taken Ruben home. Maybe Ruben couldn't have been saved--and no doubt, if that was the case, Danny would have still felt terrible--but at least the kid wouldn't have died alone in an alley.
The Minhaus stuff is bad--really bad--but Danny was under a lot of pressure and I can understand how when someone's shooting at you, you're not exactly thinking straight. And going to IAB against orders was bad, too, but that was something that hurt Danny and not anyone else, so it's hard to think of that as his biggest mistake.
I had a difficult time deciding between options, but in the end, I went with the Minhaus incident, too (including the issue of defying Mac). As you indicated, that could've had serious ramifications for Danny's career and freedom. And even if he ended up being cleared, he had to know that letting Mac down for the third time was not going to slide by without consequence.
Danny's decision to send Ruben home certainly had the most severe and traumatic outcome, but I have a hard time blaming Danny for Ruben's death. I think his instinct was to get Ruben away from the scene and still respond to a crime in progress, and he made what he thought was the best decision at the time to balance both responsibilities. I agree that one thing he could've done differently was to have Ruben take cover on the ground or in a nearby shop until Danny returned for him. But it was a split second decision, and I think he did what seemed reasonable in that moment -- it just turned out very badly.
Another misstep that I thought was bad was the way Danny handled Rikki's theft of his gun. That situation also might've had severe consequences for Danny (and Flack) if anyone had ended up being injured or killed as a result of Danny trying to handle it alone and avoid reporting the theft. I wonder if there will be any further fallout from this one in S5 and also whether Mac knows about it.
Ceindreadh
Pathologist
I voted for sending Ruben home.
I have nephews aged 9 and 10 that I frequently look after. Something bad like that happens, no way would I be letting them out of my sight.
Danny was thinking like a cop, not a parent/guardian, clearly he wasn't that experienced with kids. But he took responsibility for Ruben and Ruben should hae been his main priority until he handed him back to Rikki.
(I'm also still appalled that he never checked on Ruben even after the scene was secured. And don't get me started on the fact that nobody informed Rikki about Ruben's death until Danny got there - did Danny tell the Detectives in charge of the case to leave it to him and then just take his sweet time going home???
Mind you, Rikki didn't impress me either. What sort of mother, who's expecting her son to be home in a few hours, doesn't start looking for him till that night? WTF? Did she not phone Danny, try to find out where her son was?)
I have nephews aged 9 and 10 that I frequently look after. Something bad like that happens, no way would I be letting them out of my sight.
Danny was thinking like a cop, not a parent/guardian, clearly he wasn't that experienced with kids. But he took responsibility for Ruben and Ruben should hae been his main priority until he handed him back to Rikki.
(I'm also still appalled that he never checked on Ruben even after the scene was secured. And don't get me started on the fact that nobody informed Rikki about Ruben's death until Danny got there - did Danny tell the Detectives in charge of the case to leave it to him and then just take his sweet time going home???
Mind you, Rikki didn't impress me either. What sort of mother, who's expecting her son to be home in a few hours, doesn't start looking for him till that night? WTF? Did she not phone Danny, try to find out where her son was?)