smacked4ever
Prime Suspect
i would like to go to new york city, california, and also go back to hawaii for a vacation again. i did that when i was younger.
places you want to see
- Thread starter Nick3167
- Start date
talkingtocactus
Coroner
what was it like? i've been to russia (i went from london to vladivostok by train - best. trip. EVER.) but it was post-communism so i'm guessing it was quite different (even though lenin is *still* everywhere). which bits did you go to? i was on a train for most of it but i stopped in st pete's (loved), moscow (it was ok), nizhny novgorod (loved), ekaterinburg (loved), irkutsk (liked), lake baikal (adored) and vladivostok (loved).
i'm reading steinbeck's russian journal at the moment, it's really good, it was published in 1948 so definitely still communist.
Ducky, that's a great thought! I always dreamt about the similar thing, because northern Asia has beautiful nature, and so many interesting/beautiful places.
You've reminded me of something I wanted to do - I wanted to walk down the trail of ex Iron Curtain. There are woods on both sides, and an old, overgrown road. I've seen pictures, and documentaries, and I just wanted to see it for myself (and I know it a loooong way to walk, but still).
You've reminded me of something I wanted to do - I wanted to walk down the trail of ex Iron Curtain. There are woods on both sides, and an old, overgrown road. I've seen pictures, and documentaries, and I just wanted to see it for myself (and I know it a loooong way to walk, but still).
Very controlled. We had a tour guide with us most of the time. The only time we didn't was on an afternoon where we 'allowed' to go to the GUM dept store. It was really a shopping mall.
People were lined up for food. I remember one sight where the line went out the door and down the stairs to the level below. This was in the GUM dept store.
People were lined up to go and see museums. We as tourists were allowed to by pass the lines.
Moscow was very dull compared to Leningrad. Leningrad had much more of a western touch to it. More lights and glitter.
We stayed at government run hotels. Not surprising really. We ate there and for the most part any souvenirs we wanted we bought there. When we got to Russia we didn't change any of our money into Rubles. When you shopped at these shops in the Hotel you used you own currency. The only down side to this was you didn't know if you were getting the correct change back as you got your change back in 'other' countries currency. So I'd pay in Canadian dollars and may have got American, British, Finnish, Swedish, you name it currency back.
One of the one things that still stands out today was the lack of gas stations. I think the whole time we were there, about 8 days, I saw 1 gas station. The tour guide was not impressed with us trying to take a picture of it. Must have been a state secret :lol:
One thing I will say is our tour guides were very proud of their Russian History and their contributions in both World Wars. I think our guide in Leningrad was honestly proud where as the one in Moscow was state proud.
talkingtocactus
Coroner
^^ I always said to my mom, I want to take train (leaving from Finland) thru Russia to China and she said once when I have my Master's degree - it's getting closer but I highly doubt I gotakes a week to get there, 9000km
a lot of people i know did the train from st petersburg to beijing, via mongolia, but for some reason mongolia & china never really interested me as much as russia so i went to vladivostok instead, which is the traditional trans-siberian route. i think people thought i was nuts going 10,500km by myself but hey. it can take more than a week - i stopped off at various places on the way so it was spread over a month. it can be done in a week with no stops but it seems a shame not to see other places on the way. it was fantastic, you should do it for sure!
GUM in moscow? the one by red square? yeah that was definitely more of a mall. the one in vladivostok was much more like a dept store, albeit a slightly odd dept store! they have TSUM now as well, which is a more commercial version (i believe GUM is still at least partially state owned), so GUM (especially the moscow one) is quite glitzy now - competition!
i think for me that was one of the most obvious differences - although i didn't get to go before the end of communism (i was too young) i've studied communist russia a LOT and it was really obvious how there were no ration cafes anymore, no queues for food, it was all commercial, lots of mcdonalds etc. on the plus side it was lovely to see so many commercial restaurants/cafes doing such traditional russian food. i have never eaten so much soup (solyanka = mmmmmm) or so many pierogi or pancakes (all with sour cream, of course) in my life, and i loved every second of it! i think if someone told me i had to eat nothing but russian food for the rest of my life, i'd be quite happy
yeah, i guess because st pete's was so french for so long before the revolution. in the 18th-19th century if you didn't speak french in st pete's you were nobody. i loooooved st pete's, it's so beautiful, and so much fun. i didn't like moscow so much (it didn't help that i was sick). i think i could live in st pete's
haha, yeah me too - although they're run commercially now. it was a surprise to see these vast buildings with marble and gold staircases being used as, well, more like hostels than hotels really.
the money thing must've been tough - although roubles are quite confusing too!
i only saw one i think, bizarre. haha maybe it was! i was reading in steinbeck's journal that one place they were banned from photographing was a tractor factory which made little sense as (a) it was progressive and (b) all the equipment was american.
yep, i thought the same. i didn't have to be with a guide all the time but i did get a compulsory 2-3 hour walking tour of each city i was in (apart from nizhny novgorod & vladivostok which i guess people don't visit enough to warrant guides, on the entire trip i didn't meet a single other person who was going to either), and the guides were all very proud - and very informed. i think they are justified in their pride at their role in the wars - particularly WWII; although i think i saw one too many museums on the great patriotic war of 1941-45 :lol:
by state proud do you mean proud because he was told to be proud? did you go quite late during communism, i'm guessing you weren't there at the time of the purges or when there was real fear of arrest? (unless you're *extremely* computer savvy for your age :lol::lol
i think towards the end even though the gulag kept going, things relaxed a bit, especially when stalin died. but i think people carried on being good soviet patriots anyway, if you're that scared it takes a long time to relax!
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by state proud do you mean proud because he was told to be proud? did you go quite late during communism, i'm guessing you weren't there at the time of the purges or when there was real fear of arrest? (unless you're *extremely* computer savvy for your age :lol::lol
I went with my high school in March 1978. So communism still ran the day.
Our Moscow guide was definitely pulling the party line. No emotion in her voice when she talked of the history. More than one student fell asleep on her :lol: More scripted if anything where as our guide in Leningrad, and yes I know today it's called St Petersburg
, I could hear the pride in her voice of the struggles that the city endured during the wars and the fact that they survived and over came the struggles. Her pride was coming from her heart not her sleeve.
Well guys, remember how in my last post I said that I wanted to see NYC? Well looks like it going to happen, my best friend and I just booked a trip to NYC for next January, we're both super excited *even if it is ages away*, she's been before, but I haven't, so it'll be totally awesome. Hehe, anyhoo, just wanted to share my excitement with the rest of you.
Hehe, anyhoo, just wanted to share my excitement with the rest of you.
talkingtocactus
Coroner
it did! at least by then they'd pretty much stopped midnight arrests followed by 25 years hard labour in kolyma for merely looking at someone funny though!
Our Moscow guide was definitely pulling the party line. No emotion in her voice when she talked of the history. More than one student fell asleep on her :lol: More scripted if anything where as our guide in Leningrad, and yes I know today it's called St Petersburg
i think that's indicative of the cities as well though - moscow is much more "russian", it's the old capital, it's got more state apparatus etc; st pete's has always been much more european minded and has a more diverse history (at least in modern times, and in terms of art, culture etc) - which i guess makes for guides being more interested in and proud of the history, rather than just reeling off state stuff.
it is called st pete's now but a lot of people still call it leningrad - apparently a lot of older people think it should never have been changed back, and would rather still be living under stalin. which seems odd in a way but i guess if your entire life has been controlled by the state, suddenly having that security blanket ripped away must be tough.
Well guys, remember how in my last post I said that I wanted to see NYC? Well looks like it going to happen, my best friend and I just booked a trip to NYC for next January, we're both super excited *even if it is ages away*, she's been before, but I haven't, so it'll be totally awesome.
yaay! that's great news
i'm in the middle of planning a trip to the US at the moment too - i'm really excited. at the moment i think the plan is to go to chicago, then get a train to either LA or SF, then drive up/down the pacific coast highway to SF or LA, then fly home. i'm veeeery excited
Nick3167
Rookie
I can tell you about Communist Russia Iwent on my way to my home country of Latvia. Communism SUCKED I can remember my family in Latvia struggling to get basics bread , milk, eggs, if they had ways off of their land to get it it was helpful BUT half of what they collected went to the Communists
Ducky if you ever go to Latvia let me know that is my Nationality and would LOVE to know what you think
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talkingtocactus
Coroner
^ i agree, it was a massively flawed system, but i think a lot of that was because of the people involved in executing it, the principles behind it are quite sound in a lot of areas.
i have a very long-standing and somewhat obsessive "thing" for communist russia, i always seem to get interested in periods/systems that are horrible, my other favourite historical area is WWI, which is another nasty one.
i have a very long-standing and somewhat obsessive "thing" for communist russia, i always seem to get interested in periods/systems that are horrible, my other favourite historical area is WWI, which is another nasty one.
Nick3167
Rookie
I am a WWII fan myself but lisasimpson ( cool name by the way my fave character) but Communist Russia was a MAJOR DRAMA I am friends through email with a few Russian girls who ( to really make you sick ) would have me send them Feminine products because for them to get them otherwise they would have to prove that they needed them (AKA a strip search) how fair is that most times they would use whatever rags they could spare and wash them out
Oh it always challenging... and I'be they were much more excited to get canadian currency. Especially if it's not just rubles you get back but pretty much anything
I always try to exchange money so I don't have to count. Estonia (well in Tallinn atleast) they are happy to take euros (and of course they do, so many Finns visiting there and buying booze.. erm and maybe something else) But they get the price and exchange right and nowdays you usually get euros back. Same in Sweden, well in Stockholm you get krones back but in north by the FInnish border, you usually get euros back and some places you can even pay with coins
I think more in Russian, I'd like to see areas that used to be Finland, I know it's not pretty and those are extremely poor areas but still... my town has one village that has been created for those who fled the soviet troops from Karelia (the area that is now part of Russia)
My mom and dad visited Vyborg few summers ago and dad just said that god there were men in the border that Russians didn't get any further.
But even with the history, Russia is very important export country for us,
Next Sep we'll be on cruise that goes to Riga. There I've been choosing between two trips, one is tour around Riga and the other to the countryside, bunkers of Ligatne and see what Latvia's countryside is like
I guess I'll stick with city, since I've never been there, even countryside is interesting since I am a farmer and I wonder if it's much different from Estonian agriculture and it's countryside (which is plain sad)
talkingtocactus
Coroner
Nick3167 said:
i'm interested in wwii as well, but wwi is more interesting imho because wwii was at least fully justifiable, it really had to happen. wwi was just a giant egotrip. well, there are other reasons too but not for here probably!
yeah i've read stories like that, it's really very sad - it's always the miserable, oppressive periods of history that interest me, or the ones where the utter idiocy of human beings is made even more obvious than it is anyway...