Grade 'Shop Till You Drop'

How would you grade Shop Till You Drop

  • A+

    Votes: 4 11.4%
  • A

    Votes: 12 34.3%
  • A-

    Votes: 3 8.6%
  • B+

    Votes: 3 8.6%
  • B

    Votes: 4 11.4%
  • B-

    Votes: 2 5.7%
  • C+

    Votes: 2 5.7%
  • C

    Votes: 1 2.9%
  • C-

    Votes: 2 5.7%
  • D+

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • D

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • D-

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • F

    Votes: 2 5.7%

  • Total voters
    35
I wasn't saying that she had it coming to her since she stole the money. He should've fired her, but he was a horny man, he wasn't going to get rid of her. It is gross that she went along with his perverse stuff.

So, let me see if I have this right:

1. Grossman was a horny lech who wouldn't have fired her because he fully intended to sexually exploit her regardless of her answer to his proposal. In other words, you acknowledge that he fully intended to rape her.

2. But it's gross because she opted for the less physically violent rape in order to lessen the pain and trauma of the ordeal.

3. Conclusion: She is gross and undeserving of sympathy because she "allowed" herself to be a victim, even though there was no way to avoid victimization at that point. Only badly-beaten, helpless rape victims deserve sympathy.

Yeah. Wow.
 
Conclusion: She is gross and undeserving of sympathy because she "allowed" herself to be a victim, even though there was no way to avoid victimization at that point. Only badly-beaten, helpless rape victims deserve sympathy.
....Ouch!:eek:
 
Very good episode! For me this is a little bit better than 'Second Chances' but I like them both. I'm glad it wasn't billed or promoted as 150th episode because I would expect much more. Since it wasn't, I'm not disappointed at all. The story is simple yet interesting.

Good to see Danny and Jo working together. I think they are great together. It's quite funny that Danny grabbed Jo's body whatties! :lol: However, the lines Jo: Wanna go shopping? Danny: For what? Jo: Our killer... *walks out* are kind of cheesy. Something I'll expect from Horatio! :lol: But it's okay, it's Jo. :drool:

By the way, I like the opening scenes. It is engaging and pretty funny too. :lol: at Mac! I hate shopping too, except if I'm shopping for myself! :)

Overall, an A.
 
I wasn't saying that she had it coming to her since she stole the money. He should've fired her, but he was a horny man, he wasn't going to get rid of her. It is gross that she went along with his perverse stuff.

So, let me see if I have this right:

1. Grossman was a horny lech who wouldn't have fired her because he fully intended to sexually exploit her regardless of her answer to his proposal. In other words, you acknowledge that he fully intended to rape her.

2. But it's gross because she opted for the less physically violent rape in order to lessen the pain and trauma of the ordeal.

3. Conclusion: She is gross and undeserving of sympathy because she "allowed" herself to be a victim, even though there was no way to avoid victimization at that point. Only badly-beaten, helpless rape victims deserve sympathy.

Yeah. Wow.
It seems you like to question my logic more than other posters. Sure I tend to think most victims have ways out of situations they find themselves in, but I fully admit that I tend to be very uncaring about people. So I see we will never agree on these cases.
 
I question it because I find it repugnant. But thank you for admitting you're a misanthrope and possible sociopath.
 
Hence your reply.

Tell me, since you're clearly gifted with nerves of steel and the ability to see a terrifying situation from all angles, what should she have done? As you pointed out, Grossman was a horny lech who wasn't going to take no for an answer. We can agree that she never should have stolen the money, thereby giving him the leverage he used to coerce her into sex, but by that point in the story, that shipp had sailed. She was either going to be brutally raped or raped by coercion. I suppose she could've tried to fight him off as she did later in the staging area, but until she grabbed that branch, she was being strangled to death, so it's likely she would've died in the bathroom.

So, what she have done? Better to be a brutally-exploited victim we can all pity than a gross survivor who did what she had to in order to minimize the damage and trauma?
 
I think in her mind at the time, her only option was to do what he wanted. He had locked her in the bathroom with him and no one would be able to get to her to help her before he had a chance to really harm or even kill her. She was desperate at the time. She did say that she felt sick and dirty afterwards though. I can understand the choice she made. I don't think I would handle it the same way, but then again I have never been in that situation, so I can't really say for 100%. When under situations like that people might handle things very differently than they believe they would.
 
So, just to make sure I've got this right. Dying woman gets pissed that the shop is spending a ton of money on shop windows i.e. ADVERTISING rather than spending money on staff and/or bonuses, so she makes sure that the shop has even *less* money to pay staff by ripping it off to the tune of a couple of hundred thousand bucks? (and Mac's calculations were off, unless she was working 7 days a week).

you could, of course, argue that happy staff = better customer service which brings in more trade thru word of mouth than advertising anyway...

Ugh, while the storyline itself was interesting enough, the whole "OMG, she's being all Robin Hood, isn't that wonderful and big businesses are evil and deserve to be ripped off" message just left a bad taste in my mouth

i dunno, i was quite pleased to see a hollywood show espousing an almost socialist point of view! but then, property is theft, so i would say that.

once the robbery division *do* get around to looking into it and realize who got all the dosh, you think they're going to be allowed keep it?

The money would probably be long since spent by the time they got around to it. Since the woman would likely be dead by the time they got around to it. It'd be much cheaper for them to drop the case than to shell out even more money by taking it to court to get the money back from the employees.

that was the one thing that really bothered me this ep (apart from the f**king xmas bollocks) - why those employees? if you're gonna pull a robin hood (ewww, that means getting off with either kevin costner or russell crowe! ick! i retract that statement!!!) how do you decide who gets the benefit? sure she knew those employees risked financial trouble but this is a department store not a corner shop, what about the other employees getting laid off in other departments? why not them too? i don't think 'maybe she didn't know them" qualifies either because if she was a genuine altruist (which, by the way, don't exist) she'd have researched it so she could spread the money more fairly. but she didn't so she's just as bad as the big businesses.

I wasn't saying that she had it coming to her since she stole the money. He should've fired her, but he was a horny man, he wasn't going to get rid of her. It is gross that she went along with his perverse stuff.

So, let me see if I have this right:

1. Grossman was a horny lech who wouldn't have fired her because he fully intended to sexually exploit her regardless of her answer to his proposal. In other words, you acknowledge that he fully intended to rape her.

2. But it's gross because she opted for the less physically violent rape in order to lessen the pain and trauma of the ordeal.

3. Conclusion: She is gross and undeserving of sympathy because she "allowed" herself to be a victim, even though there was no way to avoid victimization at that point. Only badly-beaten, helpless rape victims deserve sympathy.

Yeah. Wow.

this i fully 100% agree with. it's on the same level as saying someone in a short skirt was asking for it. which, as any sane person knows, is utter bullcrap. NO ONE asks to be raped, ever, end of story. what needs to happen is people stop saying it's the rape victim's fault and start realising that men need to stop thinking they have the power to just take what they want, and to start keeping it in their pants (not that rape is ever really about sex, but i guess that thing is a handy little weapon:scream:)

I question it because I find it repugnant. But thank you for admitting you're a misanthrope and possible sociopath.

this, however, i think is taking it a little far. i have to admit i'm definitely a misanthrope, i think humans generally are pretty scummy. that said i'm not a sociopath as i'm too emotionally involved (hell, i'd love not to be but i can't help it with borderline personality/bipolar:lol::rolleyes:) and given that abuse (be it systematic or one off, or by a human or by a corporation or even a government) is what makes me hate people so much, i can't help but see the woman's side in all this, regardless of what else she did wrong - because there are proper procedures to deal with light fingers that don't involve rape and coercion.

suffice it to say i think calling someone a sociopath based on 2 threads on a tv show forum is a little exaggerated.


as for the ep itself, i wasn't really blown away. i quite liked that they had the least subtle thief since oliver! i liked mac's grudging behaviour over shopping (i am the same). i thought he and jo were cute too - were they holding hands as they crossed the street?! it kinda looked that way for a second but a car got in the way...

as for the case, well, as i've said i think the boss reaped what he sowed, there are better ways to deal with thieving. quite interesting that they essentially had 2 petty thieves though with 2 very different outcomes.

i found her selective donations at the end a bit annoying. but not as annoying as all the f**king xmas bollocks. why must i be subjected to this bullshit everywhere i look?! dear xmas: bugger off!!!!

so yeah, i gave it a B- - worst of the season so far i think, i quite liked some aspects of the case, and i liked the intro, but otherwise? meh.
 
IMO,I don't really care what Alena did or if she had basically made herself availble 24/7 for the guy before the incident in question.
No means no,and Grossman made it clear just before his death that he wasn't going to take that as an answer.
 
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One thing that bugged me a tiny bit is ... when the pickpocket said "its my word against yours" to Mac... why didn't Mac mention that Jo also saw him stealing the wallets? That would be two cops' word against the perp's lol.
IIRC, Jo didn't actually see the guy stealing the wallets, she just saw Mac's reaction to it.

LOL. I think you are over thinking this.
And, I don't think it came across as 'big businesses are evil', but more that the victim was. He was going to lay off the employees, and he was blackmailing Elena with sex, so he didn't really care about the company either.

Two different scumbags we're talking about. 1 was the manager who was laying off people but told Elena her job was safe. 2 was the one blackmailing Elena.
1 might have been a horrible boss but he wasn't doing anything illegal (apparently)

That's just it though, they wouldn't be keeping their jobs or getting benefits. He said HER job was safe, but that he was going to let others go and they wouldn't get notice. Most jobs that let someone go give them enough notice so they they can find another job or at least give them a little money to hold them until they can find another job

Is it different in the USA then? I thought that in a lot of places, employers were required to give notice or pay in lieu of notice when letting people go. Unless they're being fired for something, which is a different situation.
 
Hence your reply. So, what she have done? Better to be a brutally-exploited victim we can all pity than a gross survivor who did what she had to in order to minimize the damage and trauma?
I would've hit him but not enough to kill him. It can be debated if she was trying to injure or kill him. Regardless, a knee to the groin or other non-lethal measure could've been taken so she could've left the situation. Beyond that, I am tired of the accusations about my mental capacity. But as I can see you will continue to berrate my opinions, I will stop quoting or any of your comments.

that was the one thing that really bothered me this ep (apart from the f**king xmas bollocks) - why those employees? if you're gonna pull a robin hood (ewww, that means getting off with either kevin costner or russell crowe! ick! i retract that statement!!!) how do you decide who gets the benefit? sure she knew those employees risked financial trouble but this is a department store not a corner shop, what about the other employees getting laid off in other departments? why not them too? i don't think 'maybe she didn't know them" qualifies either because if she was a genuine altruist (which, by the way, don't exist) she'd have researched it so she could spread the money more fairly. but she didn't so she's just as bad as the big businesses.
That bothered me too because if her goal was to help coworkers, she would've had to help all of them to be fair. She probably couldn't have gotten money to all the ones who were getting laid off, even if she knew who all was getting axed. So really the Robin Hood scenario rarely even works.

As for the other stuff, I will refrain from comment because no one will agree with me.
 
Hence your reply. So, what she have done? Better to be a brutally-exploited victim we can all pity than a gross survivor who did what she had to in order to minimize the damage and trauma?
I would've hit him but not enough to kill him. It can be debated if she was trying to injure or kill him. Regardless, a knee to the groin or other non-lethal measure could've been taken so she could've left the situation.

although she *did* try that first, and that was when he started to strangle her, so i guess that just proves the point that she was acting in SD and her defensive strategy had to escalate as his attack did.

That bothered me too because if her goal was to help coworkers, she would've had to help all of them to be fair. She probably couldn't have gotten money to all the ones who were getting laid off, even if she knew who all was getting axed. So really the Robin Hood scenario rarely even works.

yep. she couldn't have known who would benefit most (because i think if she'd taken a sneak peek at company documents to discover exactly who was getting fired, we'd have seen it, ie they'd have shown us why it was those employees specifically in a less fuzzy way than they did - they explained tracey but none of the others), so for true fairness, she'd have had to split the cash many more ways. so i think that spoilt it a bit for me. that said i think the robin hood thing can work, it just depends what you steal.

in a marxist sense if she'd somehow taken over the store and demanded fairness and got it, that would've been (a) more noble and (b) more effective. if she'd staged a window protest with a huge sign saying "shoppers, this store is screwing its employees, don't give your money to the shop, give it directly to the workers", and it had the desired effect - which, of course, was highly likely :lol::lol: - it would've been a true espousal of marxist theory of alienation (but let's face it, not matter how many people go on about how liberal hollywood is, it's not quite marxist!:lol:) - and that wouldve resulted in a much more fair distribution for everyone. her idea was no more fair really than the capitalist profit-driven store she was trying to undermine.

haha, to quote malcolm x/fred hampton (someone in black panthers anyway*), i am... a revolutionary!:guffaw::guffaw:

* just want to make it clear i don't mean to deride/undermine this quote or the cause it stood for, i actually admire it
 
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