Episode 7x20 - Wolfe In Sheep's Clothing ***CONTAINS SPOILERS***

Orla_Dark
Now i start get angry. Scene with Cal and Eric was awful. I can understand why they was pissed of, but they should give him chance explain this. hiphugger17, i don't agree with you, they don't give him chance to explain. All quotes you wrote was too fast, he really don't say anything, just wanna show them that evidence is key to solve this crime.
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If he had time to answer other things, then it wasn't that fast ;). Instead of "I'm sorry", "I had to" or "take a look at it" he could've said "I got kidnapped", "they had Billy" or "I was tortured". It would've took him the same time to complete those sentences.

But the scene was written that way for a purpose, to show that the team is "breaking up". Like I said, I understand both sides and their reactions.
 
hiphugger17 said:
If he had time to answer other things, then it wasn't that fast ;). Instead of "I'm sorry", "I had to" or "take a look at it" he could've said "I got kidnapped", "they had Billy" or "I was tortured". It would've took him the same time to complete those sentences.

But the scene was written that way for a purpose, to show that the team is "breaking up". Like I said, I understand both sides and their reactions.
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Still don't agree, i think he should have a little bit more time to take all thoughts together and tell them, when he was ready and start explain Eric don't give him chance. I say "I'm sorry", "I had to" and "take a look at it" because he thought that he should say it. He didn't know that they don't give him chance say all story. If he can read their minds or see future, he said "I got kidnapped", "they had Billy" or "I was tortured" instead :D And i watch this right now, it was too fast! Only one time it was slow, when Eric look at evidence, then Calleigh said "so you had it whole time" Ryan starts explaining but Eric cut him of.;)
 
Orla_Dark said:
hiphugger17 said:
If he had time to answer other things, then it wasn't that fast ;). Instead of "I'm sorry", "I had to" or "take a look at it" he could've said "I got kidnapped", "they had Billy" or "I was tortured". It would've took him the same time to complete those sentences.

But the scene was written that way for a purpose, to show that the team is "breaking up". Like I said, I understand both sides and their reactions.
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Still don't agree, i think he should have a little bit more time to take all thoughts together and tell them, when he was ready and start explain Eric don't give him chance. I say "I'm sorry", "I had to" and "take a look at it" because he thought that he should say it. He didn't know that they don't give him chance say all story. If he can read their minds or see future, he said "I got kidnapped", "they had Billy" or "I was tortured" instead :D And i watch this right now, it was too fast! Only one time it was slow, when Eric look at evidence, then Calleigh said "so you had it whole time" Ryan starts explaining but Eric cut him of.;)
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We just see it differently then. Just like Ryan couldn't see the future Eric and Calleigh couldn't know Ryan's past. If he said what he said because he thought he had to then maybe he should have thought he had to explain why he had taken evidence. I think the reason as to why he had taken the evidence is more important than saying he was sorry. He could've apologized later.

Still I'm not trying to take away the severity of the situation from Ryan's side.
 
hiphugger17 said:
Orla_Dark
Now i start get angry. Scene with Cal and Eric was awful. I can understand why they was pissed of, but they should give him chance explain this. hiphugger17, i don't agree with you, they don't give him chance to explain. All quotes you wrote was too fast, he really don't say anything, just wanna show them that evidence is key to solve this crime.
Click to expand...

If he had time to answer other things, then it wasn't that fast ;). Instead of "I'm sorry", "I had to" or "take a look at it" he could've said "I got kidnapped", "they had Billy" or "I was tortured". It would've took him the same time to complete those sentences.

But the scene was written that way for a purpose, to show that the team is "breaking up". Like I said, I understand both sides and their reactions.
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I actually would have to agree with you. Let's not forget, Ryan AND Horatio left out the kidnapping. Makes me think they don't want anyone to know, at least not right away. Probably damage control? Hopefully the rest of the season will explain.

From a writer's stance, I think (or would hope) the writers wanted to leave the ending open to keep us tuned in. To be honest, if everything had played out perfect at the end of the eppy, I would have walked away from the episode not expecting much from the rest of the season. We're on episode 7.20, it's too early for a happy ending. We still have 5 more episodes to go! ;D
 
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I also think that he should have told them from the beginning, "I have to tell you guys something. The mafia kidnapped Billy and I was forced to take drastic measure to protect him." And then given them the bullet casing and adding, "but I had every intention of only slowing down things long enough to find him and then fixing everything once he was safe and I'm sorry I couldn't tell you, but they were watching me, eyes and ears everywhere. I was afraid they'd hurt Billy or either of you" and then just walked out of the room and given them time to process it all rather than standing there waiting for their reactions.

That still would have left the viewers wondering if they would forgive Ryan or not. It would still have the same effect in the end.
 
I totally agree with hiphugger17. Although I wanted Ryan to say something about what happened to him and why he held onto the evidence, to clear things up with C/E, that is not what the writers wanted. They wanted the issue to remain unresolved for the time being, to cause a rift between Ryan, Calleigh, and Eric. When Snarnoff was sent to jail, he said to Horatio that his "team was falling apart, and you don't even know it". He said something like the ball has already started (photos being taken of the team). Ryan even commented at the end of 7x20 that "they" were trying to divide them. The fact that Horatio responded with that won't happen leads me to believe that Horatio will not let the team turn against one another. Horatio will clear things up with the team. Horatio's team is like his family and he will never let his family fall apart! :)
 
^ Exactly,an explanation was needed.Ryan did something serious that can only be excused becouse he was saving Billy's life.I agree with hipgugger17 that the writers wanted to have that uncertainty at the end.But if we don't get the team solving this issue, I will not be satisfied.

And orla,IMO Calleigh had reasons to be upset.If anything,she is even more upset then Eric.Maybe Eric snaps and forget the next minute but Calleigh is the one that goes over and over.Plus ,she is Ryan friend .Like I said ,what Ryan did can only be excused becouse we know what Ryan was dealing with and both E/C are unaware of it.


GNRF,Any reason why Calleigh and Horatio don't work together?
 
GregNickRyanFan said:
I also think that he should have told them from the beginning, "I have to tell you guys something. The mafia kidnapped Billy and I was forced to take drastic measure to protect him." And then given them the bullet casing and adding, "but I had every intention of only slowing down things long enough to find him and then fixing everything once he was safe and I'm sorry I couldn't tell you, but they were watching me, eyes and ears everywhere. I was afraid they'd hurt Billy or either of you" and then just walked out of the room and given them time to process it all rather than standing there waiting for their reactions.

That still would have left the viewers wondering if they would forgive Ryan or not. It would still have the same effect in the end.
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I kind of agree .Maybe he could have just screamed out,"I was tortured",that would have gotten their attention. If he had told them ,we perhaps would just be wondering how they felt about it,instesd of thinking they are pissed,they won't trust him again.It sounds as if there will be a few more episodes dealing with the Russians,so there may be some closure. I don't expect everything to be perfect,but at least for everyone to understand where the other is coming from. There are hurt feelings and perhaps anger on both sides and it sould be addressed at some point.If the team is really to survive,they are going to need to gain each others trust. It will be interesting to see what followup takes place.
 
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I just had a thought when I was watching the episode a while ago. Right after Ryan said there were "extenuating circumstances" Eric just told him to get out. Ryan just kinda looked at them like....what?? I can see why he didn't want to tell them. It reminds me of Resurrection when they thought he killed/had a part in killing Horatio. He was probably offended that they never trusted him even though he's never really done anything to betray their trust. :( Gha....I love Eric and Calleigh but sometimes I really dislike them when this happens.
 
electra said:
GNRF,Any reason why Calleigh and Horatio don't work together?
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Character wise, I don't really know. Actor wise, there's all kinds of rumors floating around. Who knows. :lol:

I was thinking about something the other night... what if there was a camera there (like it looked like it might have been in the promo pics) and they did film their torture of Ryan? What if they later send that to the lab and Horatio asks Dave to put it on. Then the others come in and see what Ryan had to go through. Maybe that's how they'll find out?

Also, I noticed in the promo pics, Ryan's attacker was wearing a reddish-purplish shirt and when the actual episode aired, it looked like he was wearing a black sweater like shirt. :lol:
 
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I have been reading the postings here with great interest (being a big Ryan Wolfe fan), and wanted to add my two cents concerning the scene between Ryan, Eric and Calleigh if I could. I hope no one thinks I am going to bash any one of the three of them because that is not my intention. Being the viewers, we obtain knowledge and gain insight that some of the characters (in this case Calleigh and Eric) don't have. To blame them or be critical of their reaction to Ryan for belated bringing them the shell casing, in my view, is unfair. Given the information they had, their reaction was perfectly justified.

I just wonder if Ryan wasn't emotionally ready to explain.

We all know what Ryan went through. He then went home, cleaned up and had to go to work as if everything was okay because he HAD TO. He then found out for sure that Billy's life depended on him doing something he really really didn't want to do and was obviously killing him when he was doing it. I think that the gambling aside, Ryan Wolfe is decent honest guy who has faults and makes mistakes like the rest of us. I think this was the reason why he did what he did in such a way that could be corrected later. He then, after pleading with his Russian captor, has to listen to a gunshot that he briefly thought ended Billy's life, and the relief he felt when he discovered H had saved the day. That is a lot to process in a short span of time. However I think he probably shouldn't have been too surprised at Calleigh and Eric's reaction to deliverying of his belated evidence.

I also wanted to comment on Eric possibly being depicted as "the villain" in all of this. I have been watching CSI Miami pretty much from the beginning and have always liked Eric. I think Eric, like Ryan, is a decent honest guy who would be one of the first people to offer his support to Ryan if he knew the truth. It is the truth as posted earlier (I wish I could remember who it was--sorry), Eric and Ryan have a love-hate relationship which, at times, can be downright testy, a situation which neither one is 100% guilty or 100% innocent of contributing to. Hats off to the acting abilities of AR and JT!!

I hope, like of us, that they is some sort of follow-up.

Those are just my opinions and I hope I added something positive to this lively discussion.
 
I just wonder if Ryan wasn't emotionally ready to explain.
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Actually that does make a lot of sense. Ryan had just been through a traumatic experience.He is going to need some time to "come" down from the days events.Maybe he couldn't deal with it at that time .I still hope we see something of what was said or done with the characters to help the healing process.
 
MiamiWolfe said:
I have been reading the postings here with great interest (being a big Ryan Wolfe fan), and wanted to add my two cents concerning the scene between Ryan, Eric and Calleigh if I could. I hope no one thinks I am going to bash any one of the three of them because that is not my intention. Being the viewers, we obtain knowledge and gain insight that some of the characters (in this case Calleigh and Eric) don't have. To blame them or be critical of their reaction to Ryan for belated bringing them the shell casing, in my view, is unfair. Given the information they had, their reaction was perfectly justified.

I just wonder if Ryan wasn't emotionally ready to explain.

We all know what Ryan went through. He then went home, cleaned up and had to go to work as if everything was okay because he HAD TO. He then found out for sure that Billy's life depended on him doing something he really really didn't want to do and was obviously killing him when he was doing it. I think that the gambling aside, Ryan Wolfe is decent honest guy who has faults and makes mistakes like the rest of us. I think this was the reason why he did what he did in such a way that could be corrected later. He then, after pleading with his Russian captor, has to listen to a gunshot that he briefly thought ended Billy's life, and the relief he felt when he discovered H had saved the day. That is a lot to process in a short span of time. However I think he probably shouldn't have been too surprised at Calleigh and Eric's reaction to deliverying of his belated evidence.

I also wanted to comment on Eric possibly being depicted as "the villain" in all of this. I have been watching CSI Miami pretty much from the beginning and have always liked Eric. I think Eric, like Ryan, is a decent honest guy who would be one of the first people to offer his support to Ryan if he knew the truth. It is the truth as posted earlier (I wish I could remember who it was--sorry), Eric and Ryan have a love-hate relationship which, at times, can be downright testy, a situation which neither one is 100% guilty or 100% innocent of contributing to. Hats off to the acting abilities of AR and JT!!

I hope, like of us, that they is some sort of follow-up.

Those are just my opinions and I hope I added something positive to this lively discussion.
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Great post :thumbsup:
 
I do agree that Calleigh seemed more hurt (that Ryan didn't come to her when she so many times given him the opening) than she is angry. I think Calleigh understands more than she's letting on though. Eric on the otherhand, he isn't as close to Ryan and doesn't know him as well, so he wouldn't recognize all of the signs like Calleigh did. I think Cal even knows Ryan well enough to know when Ryan's lying. I think at the end she was processing everything and trying to come to some kind of conclusion.

I do however wish the writers had at least allowed Eric to (when Ryan was trying to explain) say "Not now, Ryan. I'm too angry right now. Maybe after I've had time to calm down you can explain what these circumstances were... but just not now." It would still have had the same effect on the ending. Leaving us all wondering if Ryan's actions will be understood and forgiven by his teammates. I really liked the moment where Eric told Ryan not to worry about the mistake during the interrogation. That was progress right there.

I do understand why Calleigh felt hurt and why Eric felt angry. I just wish the writers had given us a little bit more than that. :lol:
 
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At some point,either Calleigh,Eric or both may decide on their own that something really isn't right. They may question,what reason did Ryan have to hold on to that bullet?They may seek to find out some answers on their own. He didn't hang on to the bullet just to be hanging on to it.Or Horatio will just tell them eventually.
 
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