Grade 'Officer Involved'

Seems this episode does teach a real life lesson.

Sometimes you need to see if what you want to do will work and if you try it, you need to ease yourself into the job. Learn to get to know employees or employers and hope they will earn your trust. Sometimes you gotta bite the bullet and see who you can trust and sometimes you really can't trust anyone.

 

I'm going to sound like a shallow asshole with this comment, but I have no filter: for the love of God please make Carmine/Danny's transition back to the lab entail the return of his sexiness. Also: no mustache! :lol:

 

I give this episode a C. Where is the hard Mac that I used to know?? I would really hate to think that the writers don't really know how to write in Danny as a Sargeant, and a believable one at that, without the thought of losing the show's viewers. While I personally wanted Danny to continue on as a Sargeant, I am somehow glad that he's back in the lab. Yet, I do dread the thought of another tired D/L saga in the lab. I even cringed that Danny would bring his family and wife into the unpleasant conversation he had with Cooper, and now, Lindsay starts bitching to Adam about the whole "conflict of interest" whatever. Even with her babying Danny while bitching to whatshisface about something-hours as well as being the one to get Cooper to confess. Yeah, where does the whole "conflict of interest" stand from those moments?? As if the NYPD aren't reliable enough to do their jobs or to get Cooper to tell the truth.

I am all for Lindsay standing up to her man, but please, let him deal with this mess. I was appalled that Danny would lie about Cooper, who fired the gun, etc. With the preview, I somehow got the feeling that Danny would be back in the lab, even in this way. Yeah, they had to write him in as screwing up again and costing his promotion. It's reminiscent to the On The Job episode.

On On The Job, I've wanted to choke Mac for saying that they haven't found Danny's bullet, making me think Danny shot Minhaus. Mac just babbled that he did, he didn't, he did, he didn't. Really, whaatt? Until, many, many episodes and many, many seasons later, Danny finally said that he didn't in here. Or I must've missed something. I've personally wanted Mac to give Danny a lecture or some tough love throughout this episode.

And Sheldon and Jo doing the bullet trajectory in the least expected place to find a bullet was reminiscent to Aiden and Flack finding a bullet in the tree and Sheldon taking it out in the lab.

Average episode at best, and yet another one of Danny screwing up after another promotion. Even though nothing happened, I can somehow say that this episode echoes the saying, "Behind a man's success can be a woman, and behind his fall or failure can be another woman."

 

I'm not a Linsdey fan but I loved her laying into officer what's her face. You don't somebody's career on the line like that. You don't try to take bread off of someone's table to save your own behind. But this should be a lesson to Danny not to be so trusting.

 

I loathed this episode. I liked this episode. Sorta.

Last week was apathetic, this week had me back to wanting to throw things at my teevee, which hasn't happened in quite awhile for NY. It f*cking kills me to give this one a grade as high as last week.

Which is a B-.

It was a tighter episode, had better momentum, better flow, some good character moments, better balance in some respects, was cut and put together well, looked good, had better underscoring, was better paced. But I raged at the tack the story took, the potential lost, and the path to resolution pissed me off to no end. For all the ambition, NY undercut itself in not really reaching, and by falling back onto old habits.

Sry for the length of what follows just running thru it. It was hard to be apoplectically coherent :lol:

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I thought the intro was a bit ponderous, and while deliberate, it was nearly overly so. It was a gorgeously lit & staged sequence tho.

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I liked the early goings of Act 1. Looked great, half of the NYPD out there given the 'officer involved' shooting, etc. The all-hands impetus was given extra oomph in having Adam out in the field with the rest of them, in how it was cut with Jo & Flack asking the questions. While the set-up was again overly telegraphed, the last rookie's line of "you know the drill, I ain't saying another word till my rep gets here," returned a grain of grit.

Mac & Danny had a pretty decent scene, even if the mention of the nickel-plated revolver was incredibly unsubtle. Among the better parts of that exchange was Mac treating Danny as both an equal colleague and still someone he's looking out for. I liked Mac's reply to Danny's comment on the surrounding circus, with the spotlight on the rookies, "not just them, but you, Danny, you're their supervisor; the bosses want someone to answer, ...are you ready?"

(it's unfortunate the point was moot).

Mac, Flack, and Jo together are always good. They're engaging while still keeping things moving. With them, it really did seem the case was the focus. Predictably, what I liked less was the DL component. As soon as that was introduced, it dulled a lot of what had just been established. Not unexpected but disappointing in the shift in balance.

Part of that is a personal sense of over-saturation with the couple, and part of that is frustration with the producers in maintaining an insular focus that sometimes impacts larger storytelling. I felt the show took an easy out & an overly-used formula to do so. This was battled a bit, but ultimately borne out in the path to the resolution.

I didn't enjoy the boom with which Lindsay was featured in the episode. Not that she was involved, but in how she came across, and how she figured in the balance of the episode. Yes, NY was careful to reiterate over & over the conflict of interest for Lindsay. What I disliked was that other characters suffered in setting up her moments.

I didn't like how Danny was written either. He didn't speak for himself with the IAB investigator in that first street scene, Lindsay did. The rookies got to speak for themselves, complete to indicating they 'knew the drill,' as one of them said, but Messer wasn't given even that much. He's their supervisor. He's a sergeant. He's an experienced cop. He's dealt with IAB before. He gets nothing to say? Even Mac treated him better. It pissed me off that Messer being on the hot seat right in scene one became a Lindsay moment instead.

For a storyline that supposedly featured Danny, he didn't get much to do within it other than essentially be a victim, in circumstances he was held responsible for. The ultimate utility player didn't show how much he's evolved (so much as we were told) & the multi-ep arc didn't do much for him.

The Sid/Mac scene was nice. Would like to see more of Sid in general. Mac does seem to be nudging at a slightly modified disposition, at least so far . I thought Mac was surprisingly well written in this episode, and was pretty balanced and multi-dimensional in how he handled the case involving a friend and colleague. He among the roster seemed to suffer least for how NY resolved Messer's predicament.

After Messer, another character who suffered for how NY proceeded with Monroe was Adam. NY was insistent on giving her a pretty singular path thru the ep, and the next to bear the brunt of plating up Monroe moments was Mister Ross. The lab scene was a clumsy combo of exposition & screaming "lookit we're acknowledging conflict of interest!!" but doing so thru Lindsay further spouting expertise of regulations with Adam babbling made him look an oblivious idiot.

The next moment of plating: the first IAB/Danny interview. I was exasperated to note that the IAB investigator was immediately used to offer yet another Lindsay-is-awesome affirmation before starting his interview with Danny. Norris didn't suffer for it particularly, but WTF. Not only does she get to speak for herself and for Danny, the IAB investigator had to be used to comment on her as well. Sheldon would be Example 4 a bit further in. AB & NY in general do not induce me to warm to Lindsay; writing like this doesn't help.

I thought Dean Norris played the IAB Lt. Adler very well. Wasn't a cardboard cut-out just out to get someone. There was a lot in his initial summation to Messer that I couldn't disagree with - and it actually gave me a bit of hope that Danny's character was indeed getting both a highlight and opportunity to demonstrate contrast.

(As for Danny saying he wasn't drinking, part of me does have to recall that the last scene of the previous ep did have him with at least one mug of beer, if only to participate in the initial toast with the others).

I actually liked how Adler reached the moment of 'there are things you do, in the labs, that are way over my head. But being a boss is way over yours." If the episode had continued more in that timbre, with Danny able to counter & demonstrate his progress (better than last week's "you screwed up & gave me extra paperwork"), I think I might have enjoyed it more.

The street fair was fun. I think the inclusion of a 'second' case helped with the pacing and density of the episode, even if the second case was inevitably tied to the first. Mr. Doom n' Gloom shooting the paintball dude also, of course, confirmed that there was indeed a nickel plated revolver, and teased credence to elements of the rookies' stories.

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I liked Flack and Jo in Act 2. They're always fun, and I think the sequence gave Flack his best moment in the episode - one he was curiously absent in, given the friendship he and Messer used to have.

I would have liked to see him more involved, or somehow given more reflection, and something to indicate the friendship hasn't waned. I was glad that the Mac/Danny dynamic was shown to reflect on how far Danny has come, but Flack had very little to say about his friend. Sheldon and Lindsay are suddenly buddy-buddy, but Flack gets nothing at all to comment on? Disappointed.

Anyhoo. Jo/Flack: "...Get the geek?" / "I bet he told his mother he was in show business..." I actually laughed out loud there. One of the best lines in the episode .

Jo & Mac were engaging in their exposition sequence about the gun & the green fairy, and even made NY's propensity for cheezy lines ("not a full deck but a loaded gun") somehow fit and keep things rolling without taking me out of the episode.

Danny, for the first time in a long time, was warm enough to draw me in; the scene between him and Cooper on the bench talking about the shooting was good, and I thought Jeannanne Goossen was excellent. I thought the other rookies were also well played, and the scene did have me believe Cooper was torn in how she was handling things, even while essentially walking away from Messer in a larger sense at that point.

Mac & Lt. Adler had another good scene in Mac's office. I might have expected it to be more combative & bombastic, but was pleasntly surprised at the tone. I liked the discussion of political realities ('who's whispering in your ear') as well as the evidence needed in the case ('you've gotta not just find the gun but put it in Pete Miller's hand'). It was also another nice allusion to Messer's interesting career profile, and moment of looking back for NY. Norris & GS were really very good. A solid scene, and a good way to move the case and story forward.

Another good sequence in the episode was the Jo/Adam/Mac bit with fly fishing. It was humor, character, case, and CSI mandate all rolled into one. It was not an outright 'aha' moment, it was a moment of something pinging and being followed up with science, and it was also nice to see Mac getting a scene written to touch on his weapons experience, and getting him back in the labs doing tests & recreations.

I also liked the following transitions between Mac confronting Cooper to Lt. Adler then continuing, and then the outright turn/twist with her implicating Danny. The Aha moment only made things more complicated, and I thought that was a good thing for NY to attempt, even if I didn't like how it ended.

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The IAB/Messer scene starting act 3 was mixed for me. I don't know how many bars have internal surveillance, but it did make it visually interesting in how the deck was being stacked. That said, I was hugely disappointed in the tack the story took, having IAB then cast aspersions against Messer's character with the suggestion of an affair. The sequence was tight, and cut together well, but I increasingly disliked the story choices, didn't like the seeming banality, the sad predictablity, nor that the case ultimately came down not to Sgt. vs. Responsibility for Circumstances, but He Said/She Said.

The next Jo/Sheldon bit was meh, just keeping things rolling. I damn near forgot Joey McIntyre was to be in the ep at all. Mac/Flack & McIntyre were good, kept things moving, but not really memorable. Blink and you'd have missed it. But it was tight, believable, it did it's job well, in that respect.

The round table meeting with Jo/Mac/Adam/Sheldon was alright. Making sure we were all caught up yada, got Travis' ex, Krystal, into the case proper. I didn't at all miss Lindsay's involvement in a case. The most interesting part there for me was simply noting Jo's enormous mug of tea .

The short scene with Lindsay and Mac was one I thought was actually interesting to include. I liked this one more than all her lecturing and heavy handed moments earlier on, and those that would follow. Lindsay (and AB's performance) was no less strident here, but I thought Mac was written well in countering and balancing that, and that two sides of the coin made for a good exploration, while also acknowledging procedure etc..

It was the first time in the ep that AB's performance and the show's writing combined to suggest that Lindsay was not entirely keeping it together, that she was breaking a bit, that she was more than just the counter-punch to Messer's more low-key presence in the story. And again, given Mac is often written rather bombastically, I thought this was interesting for him as both supervisor, colleague,confidant, as a voice of experience - and reason, something he often is not.

Jo & Adam chatting about the burlesque club was fun, but I hafta admit I was hoping for more from this interaction, and I was perhaps hoping for some further allusion to Jo's own past in working for such a club to come to the fore, be it with Adam here, or with Mac again. That said, Jo's little snickergiggle was hilarious , and another example of how SW elevates what she's given thru her performance choices.

The inevitable sexy montage in the club was meh, but it was fun to see Mac & Flack paired up. No doubt another result of Messer being out of the loop, but a nice change all the same.

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Act 4 was a bit choppy. I thought it was interesting that Mac was able to stop Travis from taking a shot at Krsytal, but still wound up getting roughed up before he & Flack had him cornered, threatening suicide ...with no bullets left, or at least a dud.

It's the next sequence that had me irritated all over again. Yep, Lindsay and Cooper. I thought Goossen out-performed AB here. I liked Cooper's "...who are you?" I rolled my eyes at "I'm Lindsay Messer!!" as a reply. That's not to say I sympathized more with Cooper, but I didn't feel anything for Lindsay's rant here.

I liked the reiteration from Cooper that she wasn't supposed to talk to Lindsay. After Lindsay's earlier spouting of regulations & conflict of interest, her choice to approach Cooper was a self-serving departure, if also understandable.

What I enjoyed less was that it wasn't just for Danny. It was about Lindsay having another moment. It was also spouting exposition in case any viewer still hadn't caught on. All fair enough.

Less impressive: the show continuing to use Lindsay to wrap up a case or episode at the last minute due her personal magic :brickwall::vulcan:.

It was also irritating that, after the relationship earlier established between Cooper and Danny, all they'd talked of learning from mistakes etc., Cooper's conscience was not moved thru that, but battered into submission by the Mighty Montana. Way to take any glimmer of impact at all from Sgt. Messer as leader & boss. Why bother with any of this.

I thought the Danny/Mac scene was better, suggested a complexity for the story that would have been interesting for NY to run with just a bit longer had they the balls to pursue it. But I suppose looking more than four episodes ahead is tricky in their machine of production. Mac & Danny's overall interaction was far better in this episode than the last one.

I loathed the resolution. Cooper retracting her statement, IAB dropping the case against Danny, Danny being able to return to duty immediately. One knew that Danny wouldn't have the heart or stomach to want to return to his position as a sergeant after that. I found that disappointing too, even knowing it was also the vehicle to get him back in the labs. Just another example of his character not being challenged.

I also didn't enjoy the '2 weeks later' lab scene that followed. If it was about Messer returning because he wanted to be in a team of people he trusted, it mighta been nice to have him back in the team of people he trusted. It was DL again, and another hint that the arc had little to do with Messer at all.

I also didn't believe that Messer was sad about stepping down, that he found the stripes hard to give up. He sounded wistful that it hadn't been what he'd thought it would be, but not that he really liked being a sergeant, and not torn in the decision.

I didn't get anything from Messer thru this whole arc. Not that he liked or hated being a sergeant. That he only vaguely missed being a CSI. Little of Messer being determined to see things thru because he was thinking of his wife and child and the future of his family (his motivations in taking the sgt exam). Only a cursory indignation at various accusations made during the IAB interaction.

There was also little indication that the team missed having Danny as a part of it. I hope we'll at least get some brief moments devoted to commenting on his absence, as there were a few moments for Mac in his first case back.

None of it seemed to make any difference.

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Messer as a character remains ambivalently defined. After all this, he's still pretty much just half of DL, and after an ep like this, Lindsay's the more defined of the two (not that that does her many favors either).

As for NY. The case against Danny wasn't solved thru any CSI-type dogged pursuit and science. It wasn't procedure, nor the system they work within. It was a confession browbeaten out of Cooper by the Mighty Montana.

I don't begrudge the show giving Monroe a moment to break the rules and speak her piece. I do have an issue with Lindsay being used yet again in her familiar and over-done capacity of resolving a case and episode at the eleventh hour. That's precisely what it was. Cooper became just another piece of evidence & tide-turning revelation prompted by Lindsay. It was frustrating to see the arc dissolve into that, and NY fall into old habits.


So. Yes the episode was in some ways much better than last week, and in some ways it was far, far worse.

My visceral reaction was to give it a D. Acknowledging the things that kept it interesting and things that worked pushed me to grade it better than I still think it really deserves.

I'm really not enjoying this season so far. I liked the flying-by-the-seat-of-their pants exhilaration that last season's improv infused in their early episodes, I liked witnessing the evolution of new dynamics.

I don't like the sense that after S7's changes, things have now been sussed and require less effort in pushing the envelope. Last season had its stumbles, but at least there was a sense that they'd kicked themselves out of a rut and weren't coasting. This season feels a bit nonchalant, with good and ambitious ideas suffering for it.

:rommie:. Well, he wasn't was he - his gun had no more bullets... .

:lol:. True enough.

...since when have NY producers considered us smart enough to catch onto things and also remember all their carefully researched and crafted details without the aid of mallets of various kinds??

I think I was gonna say this last week to your post too and never bothered. I think there was never any doubt NY would bring both Mac and Danny back into the labs sooner rather than later. I'd be hard-pressed to think they'd spend the money on modifying credits, even if Messer was a Sgt longer, especially not with only an 18-ep initial order. (imo). Not quite the same as adding a new character.

I think this sums up a great deal of my frustration, but I still have issues; with AB's performance, with yet another lost opportunity for Danny's character, with how the show continues to use Lindsay to wrap things up at the last minute, and with using other characters to comment on or reaffirm her awesomosity.

That Danny has come out of this arc much the same as he went in, and with so little to say about any of it, is perplexing & disappointing. I wanted a hint of his old fire, and got nuthin.

 

Thanks Faylinn!

I found it a bit amusing when Lindsay called Hawkes "Sheldon." I thought of Sheldon Cooper of TBBT! :lol: When was the last time someone in the lab called him that? Or maybe I wasn't attentive enough on what the CSIs called each other.

 

firing blanks you mean?

their research clearly wasn't careful enough as they'd not actually tried the stuff in the name of research

never bothered?!!!?!! shocking:lol::lol:

 

...guess they couldn't find a way to write it off... :lol:

:alienblush::lol: ...erm. Guess I could rephrase that? .

Ahem: I felt I was being Captain Obvious in so stating, especially as we were essentially in agreement?

(...I think that's quite possibly the first time I've ever managed to "" you, ...let alone provoke a "" & " " :lol:. )

 

I agree. If I had a quick feeling that maybe my husband was about to start talking and I know he doesn't have to, I would've stepped in too. Not because I thought he didn't know squat or can't do things right, but because this is his career we are talikng about and it's better to just be extra careful.

I didn't see Lindsay as being motherly or sticking her nose in. I saw her as being concerned and frustrated and wanting to be there for her husband. Maybe Danny could've spoken more for himself, but like it's been said before, Danny always depends on others to save him so I wasn't expecting any different. I would've been plenty irritated if Lindsay would've been indifferent or struggling on how the heck to help him out. I think it speaks better for her character that she was supportive and stepped up than to have her be uncertain as to how to help Danny (which if I remember correctly happened with the Ruben situtation and there were plenty of irritated people here with her reaction).

 

The body language and tone of voice is what made it a "mommy protecting a child" vibe to me. I'm not just talking Lindsay's, but Danny's as well.

Yes, I would expect either spouse to be protective and even step in, but it is possible to do that without coming off like you're the parent instead of the spouse. The spouse can also respond like an adult instead of looking and acting like a five year old who just got busted for doing something naughty.

A lot of that has to do with Belknap's acting, and I just rarely like her choices. It also has to do with Carmine's choices and I really didn't understand that response coming from Danny. If they made those choices themselves or were told to play it that way, I have no idea, but either way it just didn't work for me at all.

Danny can act like a little brat at times, but he's never just complacent like that, even after a conk on the head. Yes, he lets Flack take control of situations for him, but he's never complacent when he does that. There's always grumbling and arguing and wanting to do it his way before that happens and even when it does happen he's never really OK with it.

Danny shouldn't have to be put in his place in order to try and make Lindsay look like a caring spouse, just like Lindsay shouldn't have to be put in her place to make Danny look like a caring spouse.

 

Obviously I haven't been here for long but I didn't realize people were irritated with Lindsay concerning Ruben. What did they think Lindsay should have done?

 

^^
It was something along the lines of Lindsay saying she "wasn't good at that stuff" referring to helping out Danny in a bad time. I think it was a scene with Mac in the morgue. Also there were a lot of complaints because she was making the situation more about herself than about Danny with a scene were she said something about how she was foolish for falling in love and she'll find a way to fall out of love. I guess the complaint was about Lindsay not helping Danny out (not even knowing how to) when he was going through a rough time and to make things worse, making it about herself.

 

It's not that she said "I'm not good at this" or whatever she said to Mac. It's that she said it and never offered support to Danny and then bitched at him for not coming to her with his problems along with not grieving according to her timetable. She did make it about herself when it had nothing to do with her.

ETA: Here's the Grading thread for 'Right Next Door.' It might help explain what people felt about Lindsay at that point: http://talk.csifiles.com/showthread.php?t=56256&highlight=Grade+%27right+door%27