Grade 'Forbidden Fruit'

Discussion in 'CSI: New York' started by Top41, Dec 17, 2008.

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How would you grade Forbidden Fruit?

  1. A+

    12 vote(s)
    17.1%
  2. A

    28 vote(s)
    40.0%
  3. A-

    8 vote(s)
    11.4%
  4. B+

    7 vote(s)
    10.0%
  5. B

    7 vote(s)
    10.0%
  6. B-

    4 vote(s)
    5.7%
  7. C+

    1 vote(s)
    1.4%
  8. C

    1 vote(s)
    1.4%
  9. C-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. D+

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. D

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  12. D-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. F

    2 vote(s)
    2.9%
  1. La_Guera

    La_Guera Lab Technician

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    Oh, dear God, NY has begun to adopt Miami's cracktaculous production values. The grainy, comic-book stock quality of the herky jerky opening chase scene did not, alas, inspire thoughts of Sin City or 300, but rather reminded me of the efforts of a university Communications and Television freshman after several hits off a Red Bull and doob-smoke bong. It was annoying and unnecessary and removed me from the story before it ever began.

    The "mystery" itself was boring, and though I was clearly supposed to sympathize with the young fashion accessories magnate, I could not have cared less. The only background we receive is the fact that she used to sew purses in her dorm room. Well, boy, that sure humanizes her for me. She was just another rich victim murdered by a rich asshole for a vague, trite reason. Yippee. If only the killer hadn't been such a stock, one-note villain.

    NY math strikes again. In "The Box", Lindsay tells Danny she's pregnant and has known for "a few weeks". The following episode, "The Triangle", she tells Danny that they won't be able to determine the sex of the fetus "for a while yet", which makes sense since she shouldn't be out of the first trimester and sex is determined after the twentieth week(I think). Now, two weeks after the revelation that she's pregnant, she's suddenly sporting an enormous belly and the baby is moving?

    Uh, what the hell happened? While fetal movement is likely present beforehand, it usually isn't felt until after the first trimester, often in the fourth or fifth month. What mutant sci-fi, flesh-eating demigod is Lindsay incubating? And if there has been a time jump, it would have behooved TPTB to indicate this with a handy throwaway line. Perhaps Stella could've asked Lindsay how she's been feeling these past few weeks because she's seemed tired. But that would require effort, and we know how the writers feel about that.

    Dear Lindsay,

    A pregnancy is, as the Internet says, serious business. It is not a Get Out of Responsibility card and does not give you carte blanche to be a smug bumcankle. Mac is under no obligation to "humor you" because you're a lazy imbecile who couldn't be arsed to use protection before you buffed Danny's crankshaft with your honey duster. Mac is not to blame for your stupidity; you are.

    Would you mind too terribly if I stabbed you in the eye with this sterile swab? Humor me; I'm enraged.

    That's not to say that the episode was without intrigue. Indeed, Stella's defiance of Mac's direct order is going to come back to bite her in the ass, methinks. No doubt she thinks she has everything well in hand, but I'm afraid innocent people are going to get caught in the crossfire of her personal crusade. Stella's let her emotions override her better judgment before, but in those cases, she'd only endangered or compromised herself; a misstep here could cost Angell or the counterfeiter their lives or Mac his job. Stella is dangerously blinkered right now, downright Dannyesque in her recklessness, and I shudder to think what lies ahead.

    It was incredibly rich of Mighty Mac to be the one chiding her for her recklessness, and I didn't blame Stella at all for her expression of indignant incredulity. Isn't Mac the same Mac who disregarded departmental protocol in the Dobson case and blackmailed his superiors to quash the internal investigation of his unquestionable violations? The same Mac who channeled Rambo Norris to take down the Irish mob and blew up his lab in the process? The same Mac who told Gerrard to kiss his great divide on numerous occasions? He's ordering Stella to stand down and put the lab first?

    Pot, meet a highly decorated kettle.

    Speaking of Mac, the story arc with Ella could be wonderful. It's certainly started well. Ella is clearly extremely damaged and sees Mac not only as a surrogate father, but a potential lover, as evinced by her creepy postcard declaration of, "I will make him love me." Given that Ella was recently being romanced by her father in "Sex, Lies, and Silicone," it's not going out on a limb to posit that Ella has a severe Elektra complex and profound abandonment issues. In doing his job and the right thing and saving Ella from a suicide attempt, Mac has only encouraged her delusional behavior, and I fear that things are bound to get worse.

    If Stella's defiance of a direct order and Ella's obsession with Mac don't culminate in him temporarily losing control of the lab by next season, I'll be very surprised.

    Once again, the case was little more than a shoddy prop for the personal drama, but that was enough to sustain my interest, for the most part. The D/L drama continues to be a soggy morass of pungent bogwater, but Mac and Stella continue to carry the day, and hopefully Flack and Hawkes will soon shine as well.

    B-
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2008
  2. eyewitness

    eyewitness Rookie

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    Guys, is anyone able to read what's in the postcard just below the "I will make him love me" one?? I thougt it might be another clue to the chick's crazyness. But i'm just sayin'.
    I can read something like
    "I was born a ???
    my parents made me ????
    ???"
     
  3. eyewitness

    eyewitness Rookie

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    oh nevermind

    "i was born a hermaphrodite
    my parents made me male
    but i think they were wrong"

    ;)

    the other ones:

    left side: i'm terrified of hair
    top: chocolate is better than sex
    my boss has terrible breath
    (preg?)nancy. It's what's for dinner.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2008
  4. FlackFan01

    FlackFan01 Police Officer

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    eyewitness, I think there is one that says "I hate LA"

    I would just love to really get a good look at some more of those cards. I get the feeling we haven't seen the last of Ella. Just my suspicions!
     
  5. firehawk12

    firehawk12 Victim

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    Random speculation based on nothing - I'm expecting the assassin to take out Angell, forcing Stella to deal with the consequences of her choice to go "rogue". It might end up like the end of S2 with the detective who was killed by the rapist.
     
  6. eyewitness

    eyewitness Rookie

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    oh true. i just looking at the ones with the tiny letters.
    there one that says "free dirt" and something else unreadable below it.
    and "You are the wrong track".
     
  7. coruption

    coruption Dead on Arrival

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    Overall,I loved this ep. Normally, I more interested in the cases or the crimes before personal character problems. While the case was craptastic, i admit I was drawn to the other things happening in the ep:

    Ella stalking Mac. I know Mac has been stalked before but this is going to be interesting. I wonder what else this crazy beyotch is going to come up with to "make Mac love her"?

    Stella going directly against Mac. While I like that Stella is going rogue on this, I feel like something is missing.I have to ask: Is Stella putting so much on this case because other innocent people might be killed (like she claimed) or is it because she was attacked and was sent a dead rat? Bringing Angel into it seem odd too,especially since she couldn't even tell Mac what was going on until he found out about that guy's brother. I will enjoy seeing where it goes, but it seems like the story wasnt put together quite right.

    Flack was snarky. Adam was adorkable,as usual. Hawkes was simply yummy!


    What was up with Lindsay? Why did she feel Mac needed to humor her because she was pregnant? **rolls eyes**


    D/L wasn't TOO bad tonight though...it was short...that's all I ask for....
     
  8. Dawni

    Dawni CSI Level One

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    I have to say i agree with most people on the A, It had everything in it apart from any big explosions or car chases (Criminal minds had one and i got a lil excited) but it was gripping enough and revisted stuff making it for me more interesting.

    The whole case was strange from head to toe it almost creeped me out them eating that stuff but its how the upper classes live and its whats in fashion so let them stick to that.

    Mac and Ella is wierd, I was kind of baffled by it i understand her feeling lonely unsure of everything but confiding in Mac is ok but the stalking him part to do it is plain wierd, she has that feel about her tho that creeps me out like she can suddenly turn in an instant and the scene at the end made me think its not over yet and she has only just begun in getting her way.

    Stella and Angell are being naughty is fun to watch i love Angel in undercover she seems to have the right attitude and considering its going all season by what stuff has been said in interviews i'm happy because so far its done well in adding titbits.

    DL was cute i admit that, and wasn't to much to handle it was cute how he dragged her away knowing its in the workplace. And Lindsays 'I'm pregnant' excuse made me laugh but i think its because I've been ill recently and was at work going 'I'm ill' and making same excuse... but i see how it could wear thin easily being used in every ep. But that scene I liked her reconstructions always almost amuse me.

    Have to say tho this season i'm loving the music... few UK artists being used which is one good thing and the song at the start was really good, was for a few secs distracted by that rather than watching.
     
  9. MakeTracksCowboy

    MakeTracksCowboy CSI Level One

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    i gave this ep a C. it was ok but not spectacular.

    i'll start off by saying that i am a D/L shipper but the scene in the hallway was a little much even for me. i guess in a way it was cute but i really didn't need to see it.

    Stella and Angell at the end were pretty bad ass. i like how Angell went undercover a bit, she's always awesome.

    Lindsay's experiment scene was funny. i like how she always picks on Mac as the guinea pig for the experiments.

    the rest was ok. i'm not a fan of the Stella and Mac stories going on i don't think they'er planned out well. i'm not liking how Ella McBride is becoming obsessed with Mac and kinda stalking him. that story ended and should be done. Stella just needs a better story, i don't like the vendetta she has going on.
     
  10. Sagemint

    Sagemint Witness

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    I gave this episode a A-.

    What I generally loved about the episode;

    -Mac's new storyline. Contrary to popular belief i like where it's going. Although I guessed a little earlier what Ella's intentions were but maybe it's because I let my imagination run away with me sometimes, I spoil things for myself. Ella's character seems to be slowly losing it and I like seeing characters like that. It thoroughly entertains me really. I also though it was kind of cute when Mac came to her "rescue", after she slit her wrists.

    -That card at the ending of the episode was pretty cool, and nicely structured to end this part of the season I feel. i knew it would be Ella's but nonetheless I love how that was set up.

    -Hawkes fixing the machine was adorable!
    Tee-hee he's a genius! I also found it funny how Mac was scolding him too. It was also pretty funny when he was stumped after Sid called him down to the morgue.

    -Adam wanting to give Danny a hi-five. Then Danny ABRUPTLY walking away. I almost died laughing, it was pretty cold though but if I were in his shoes...
    Also a mention of Adam's father again, I think someone must be reading you guy's minds(posts) here. I would love to see a story form of that but not too early. Subtle hints are fine for now.

    -Was it just me or did Flack seem very I don't know angry? xD
    He made me laugh at a few parts, but I don't generally like seeing him so angry like that...-cries-


    What Aggravated me a bit;

    -Stella's storyline I don't know seems a bit off to me. I understand her being headstrong and wanting to get to the bottom of things..but it annoys me a bit. I don't why.Although Angell teaming up with her was pretty cool though I have to admit.


    -I wanted to see Flack and Angell interact a bit more. I was hoping he'd pop up at the diner or something xD
    Or when Angell was going through the alley towards Stella. Actually the way that scene was shot looked as if she was going to get jumped or something. O_O -was looking forward to added drama-

    -The hallway scene...I feel it was cute...but..I don't know. Something about it made me a bit disoriented. I'm not into much ships, although a read a few not really picking too many favorites.

    -Boohoo I though it was going to be a Christmas episode, I had it all planned out what I was probably going to see too. xD
    Like mistletoe...-ahem- never mind.

    Overall I enjoyed it but it's going to be a pretty long wait until what January? I think we have to wait that long for the CSI part 2 episode...aw man...-cries-
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2008
  11. CsiFreak-

    CsiFreak- Victim

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    Hiya. My name is Max. I just watched "Forbidden Fruit" last night. It was so AWESOME! Best NY episode yet. In my opinion anyway.
     
  12. Half

    Half CSI Level Two

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    I gave it an A-. Love Angell, so I'm always glad when she has scenes, but I couldn't give it an A. I wrote this when I was supposed to be paying attention in Human Bio, so if it sounds a little bit like an argument in someone's head, it sort of is:

    I'm trying to figure out who annoyed me more in this episode: Stella or Mac. Not that I'm not already tired of this whole Danny/Lindsay thing, but even they didn't drive me insane like our two leads did. I'll break it into two parts to prevent me from judging early.
    MAC: Oh, Mac Taylor. Please stop turning into Horatio Caine. You really don't need to personally save everyone. Ella creepily talks to him in a food store, and then hands him evidence conveniently relevant to his case, and he doesn't think something's wrong until he finds out said evidence is false. Then, he finds her with suspiciously barely-slit wrists and decides to personally drive her to the hospital. Just call an ambulance, dude. She doesn't deserve your attention, because she's apparently stalking you in some sense of the word. Do not fall for this crap.
    STELLA: Stella, I sympathize with your situation. I really do. But it's the wrong way to go about this. Not that it's not an interesting way to catch that guy, but maybe you should have considered telling Mac before you did something that would require his approval. The thing that annoys me the most is that I have the feeling that Stella didn't tell Angell that Mac demanded the idea be dropped. It just seems that Stella wouldn't be the type of person to admit defeat, and that includes telling Angell about the whole "This stops now" deal. And Stella ticks me off with this because, while even though I know this was probably partially Angell's idea, Stella knows how upset Mac is. If Angell mentions something, will Stella get mad at her (unfairly)? If Stella gets in trouble for this, how much trouble will she get into, and will Angell get in trouble as well? How much danger is Angell in, since two people are alread dead because of these coins?
    Mac wins the annoying contest, because although Stella is risking Angell's life, she's not being an idiot about someone that is pretty obviously a stalker.
    However, the most important question about the episode is: Will we EVER get follow-up on that Flack/Angell kiss?

    As you may be able to tell, I really didn't pay attention in school today... ah, well. *laughs*
     
  13. RearWindow

    RearWindow Victim

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    B+

    I loved the Danny and Adam scene in the hallway. Here's hoping Adam and Flack get to babysit.

    The D/S stuff was so sweet, but I'm glad they only had one scene. There's only so much sap I can take each week.

    I didn't care for the Ella storyline at all. Can Mac get through a season without a stalker or being put in danger, please??? The girl is batshit crazy and I can't believe he went to her place by himself. Too bad she didn't slice the other way because I don't want to see anymore of her.

    The Greek coin storyline is really interesting but I fear for Stella and Angell. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
     
  14. Ghawazee

    Ghawazee CSI Level Three

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    hey Max welcome aboard! :D

    I admit the episode was quite boring to me (I cound't resist and i watched it a few hours ago online) but that scene at Mac's office was WORTH all the way :D
    i gave this eppy a B-

    Also i would love to remark (first than anything) Angell is an ADULT woman who can make her own decitions. I didn't watch Stella dragging her out in front of the Greek Guy and i didn't watch Angell kicking and screaming neither.
    Could we assume Angell decided to help Stella because she was worried for her and she also wants to make justice?
    I wouldn't want to read here as i did in another forum "Oh we will hate Stella if something happens to Angell":angryrazz:
    Besides i really ENJOYED their scenes together. I missed Stella having a female buddy and Angell is perfect. She is not Aiden but they are building their own chemistry as a female duo:bolian: Loved that scene with the guy who had his brother in jail "I can move Christmas":lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: Please writers and producers!!!!!! we want more of these two!!!!!!!!:bolian:

    I liked:

    -i didn't watch two latest episodes so i didn't mind DL. Mainly because it was short and cute (even to me;))Actually i found it natural and nice. Mainly because of Anna. It's obvious to me she is enjoying her pregnancy so she doesn't have to pretend to be happy because she is indeed:bolian: Carmine's expression was cute too

    -Loved Sid's expression when he opened that chick's stomach was great. You gotta know he was going to call Sheldon:lol:

    -Adam adorkable as usual. Sorry but i don't feel chemistry with Danny. I wouldn't mind a scene with Mac tough;) or any scene with Stella (poor soul. She needs support nowadays) but the poo issue was hilarious as everything with him. I liked the reference to his father. Someone i would like to meet this season ;)

    -Loved Don and his "science & facts" comment:lol:
    -Danny needs his glasses NOW;)


    The Ella-psycho chick thing---> Mac won't fall for her. He is being weak as usual with those who don't deserve his pity (as Ethan /Joe). As i said inside the Smacked thread, she had a mentall illness right before her father died. A post traumatic neurosis is not enough to have her all psycho after Mac. In special after it was showed that card. She doesn't seem creepy, she already is :lol:



    as i said the best of the best came from Mac's office IMHO . Two GREAT actors portraying two fantastic characters.
    it will be fantastic to see the consequences of all this situation. Usually Stella is Mac's Voice of Reason but now Stella is a train out of control :D
    Mac had his own Nemesis in Charles Dobson back in S3 so it was Stella's turn to have her own
    But the consequences are the important issue here: Mac followed a suspect (Dobson) without telling his team where the heck he was going to. Result: he was accussed of being Dobson's murderer. He broke protocol. Now Stella defied a direct order from Mac. And he is in an impossible situation now: as he said: being her friend he would love to let her do whatever it takes to catch this guy. As her boss he can't do that. But Stella was right as well. She wasn't doing anything illegal. What she has done it's NOT worse what Mac has done before with Sinclair and Gerrard in Comes Around. Someone in the Smacked Family Thread remembered Melina's words on Mac and Stella saying he is all white-and-black meanwhile she can see shades of grey
    Stella is forcing protocol. Did she make anything illegal? No. But she used her own resources to get what she wanted. The problem here is she is not the boss and she jumped over Mac's autorithy to get what she wanted
    Is their friendship going to survive?. I think it is. But it's too early to know what kind of consequences they will face before they become friends again
    Is Stella's job going to be in danger? Unfortunately yes
    Is Stella's life going to be in danger? I think it already is

    Debbie :D

    ps: I didn't like AT ALL the demostration scene. Lindsay could have more interesting scenes if writers want to. Also i found that answer" I'm pregnant. Humor me" out of place. Mac is his boss. Not the guy she has sex with:rolleyes: Besides her explanation would have been enough to please me because it was interesting so she didn't need that comment:wtf:
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2008
  15. cSiNyFrEaK30

    cSiNyFrEaK30 Police Officer

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    I have to give this one a B. Not bad, but not the best it could have been.

    The D/L moment was actually kind of sweet. Danny wanting to know when the baby was kicking was a cute moment....although I'm not sure how a woman who is a "few weeks" pregnant or at most a month along already has a stomach that big and a baby kicking?? :confused::confused::confused: I understand they probably just figured "Hey, Lindsay's pregnant now too, so lets just forget any idea we have of time and just show Anna's baby bump," but really...if they are going to fast forward the pregnancy that fast simply to work in Anna's belly, at least give us some kind of line that mentions how it happened so fast. Minus points for that, writers.

    Lindsay using her pregnancy as an excuse not to eat the fruit was annoying also. It was whiny and pathetic, and really grated on my nerves. Furthermore, what did being pregnant have to do with it? If she can handle chemicals and other dangerous substances while pregnant, why not munch on an onion? :rolleyes: I really am not a fan of her demonstrations at all...but I did like Mac's being annoyed/irritated with them as well. At least that something.

    The cases overall were ehhh for me. Isabella's murder wasn't really intriguing for me at all--another rich girl gets murdered by a different rich girl because first said rich girl is making more money. Again, are there ANY middle class or poor people living in NYC? It isn't just the rich that kill each other, and I hate seeing it every episode...although I did like that during Isabella's body dump the guy who was doing it wasn't involved, just simply found the body at his house.

    Stella's storyline was also kind of so-so for me. Her talk with Mac made her seem much more childish than she was for the rest of the episode, and I really felt that it could have been handled better. However I love it when Stella and Angell team up....girl power!!;) The two of them work well together, and I hope we get to see that more next year.

    And doesn't Mac have enough going on right now? Do we really need to add ANOTHER stalker to the mix? Granted, I like Ella as a character--she certainly has enough issues making her crazy, and we got her attraction for paternal figures in her first episode, when she is attracted to her father (although not knowing it) online. It does make sense that she would latch on to Mac, seeing as he's the father figure of the show, but it would have been nice to see Danny or even Hawkes in the same position. Hawkes more so for me, since Danny has had his fare share of stuff to deal with these past few seasons...

    If the card at the end of the ep is a foreshadow for things to come with Ella, my guess is that we will see her going Fatal Attraction on Mac at some point...which to me doesn't really fit. Yeah, she has issues and wants him to want her and take care of her, but we didn't see this much with the ordeal with her father. There really wasnt any indication that she would have gone Fatal Attraction (for lack of a better term) on her internet boyfriend (who happens to be her father) if he didn't show the same love for her. Of course her clinginess to Mac could be just result totally from the idea of her mother killing her father and the internet relationship, but it would be interesting to see if she had some issues prior to the episode.

    There were some nice little moments in the ep too. Hawkes taking apart the DNA machine rather than doubt Mac's samples was nice, and really showed the respect and trust he has in Mac-he'd rather believe something was wrong with the machine than Mac's work. Adam was awesome as well, he looked oh so proud of himself with the elephant crap...I would have given him a high five, crap or no. :lol: Plus, his side note about his father was a nice nod to his past (yay continuity!) that I hope we get to revisit later this season....

    (and was it just me, or did anyone else get the feeling that Adam wanted to peace out when he saw Lindsay??)

    Overall, I'll stay with the B grade...not bad, but could have been so much better and so much more creatively done...
     

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