I voted no,because how can you cheat on someone when your not in a relationship . It was obvious that they were not on the same level when it came to a relationship plus the writers themselved said they had cooled down. There was never any connection between them what so ever after snow day. Nice list,except for the fact that 4 of the 5 points don`t apply to Danny/Lindsay sense they were not in a serious relationship at the time. Point 2: there was never shown any romantic interest after snowday from either of them. Point 3 : Danny didn`t avoid her gaze,he was more shocked but avoiding her gaze nope. Point 4 : if Lindsay would be that agressieve or annoyed I would be sensitive aswell,especially when i`m grieving about someone I lost Point 5: When the hell were they open to each other? cause I have never seen that from both sides. Their lack of communication is what was the most obvious thing.
I don't understand how anyone can say she is selfish or critical. I believe that Danny did cheat. (TBTB never gave us true confirmation of them as a couple) We just had little insights into their relationship. In someway it was up to the viewer to decide if they were a couple or not. When Danny saw Rueben lying in the morgue Lindsay did try to comfort him but he shrugged her away. It seemed everything went downhill from there. I think that TPTB were trying to get Danny and Lindsay both to realize their feelings for one another. Lindsay is not selfish. She is guarded. Danny is just self destruction and he doesn't know how to handle tragedies in his life. When Lindsay phoned him and asked him if he wanted to have lunch you could hear the defensiveness in his voice. A SIGN OF CHEATING!!! Then again when he showed up for work HE COULDN'T EVEN LK at Lindsay. THE GUILT WAS KILLING HIM!!! I know this is just a TV show but I have experienced being cheated on and Carmine is a good actor because I truely beleive he cheated; but due to the circumstances I can see why Lindsay went back to him. I don't think he would have cheated under differenent circumstances.
If the relationsship never was confirmed, then how can Danny then cheat? Officially he was not in a relationsship and it is really hard to cheat on people then. Everyone has different ways of dealing with death, Danny has his way and if that is to be alone - the people has to let him be alone. No matter what relations they had to Danny. When my granddad died my brother sat in the other end of the room, while people from the morgue were there, reading a newspaper!. That was his way of dealing with his grief... And nice add about Pam Veasey's comment before Season 4, when it was stated by the writers that DL was not an item when Rikki was in the show. Perhaps Danny was just showing Lindsay what it was like being treated like crap. She is really good at treating him like that... If just 1 person in a relationsship (that consist of 2 people) sees them as a couple, then they are NOT a couple! D did not see them as a couple, L did. Danny did not cheat. And why is it that "frisky" chemistry between man and woman means there is something sexually between them? I have great male friends that I get along with really well and have seriously fun with (heck, once one male friend was asked if he and I were dating), but I am not in a relationsship with either of them.
Officially? Where was that said? No one said they were not together. And didn't PL say their 'relationship' had cooled at the point Danny hooked up with Rikki? So? Of course that's okay. It doesn't mean he has to go and sleep with Rikki though. People always blamed Lindsay for pushing Danny away, but did she go and sleep with some guy? No. And the two weren't even together at that point. Oh, he did that because he wanted to show her how it is to be treated bad? That would be totally childish. And- Lindsay is good at treating someone like crap? Okay....... I never saw it like that. She shouldn't have stood him up, she should had called him. Maybe she should also have said 'good-bye' before she left. But that's treating someone like crap? Nah, I don't think so. She had problems with dealing with her past. I never had a problem with Danny pulling away. I could understand his reaction. Like I could understand Lindsay's. But there was no need to sleep with Rikki. When did he say that? When did he say 'sorry Linds, we are not a couple?'. Maybe I missed that.
When did he say they were? Never either. Relationsship does not automatically mean boyfriend/girlfriend; Friendship is a relationship, and then there are different degrees of "friends" as in "close friends", "just friends" and "acquaintances"). Being "sworn enemies" would also be a relationship of sorts. There is also blood relationship, describing how one person is related to another in terms of origin (the mother of a child, somebody's grandfather). There are business relationships (mr Smith does business with mr Doe. They both claim to have a good business relationship). Which means that DL is just as little a relationsship and DM, DF, DS, DA.
You seem pretty sure there. How can you be so certain? I said, it may not have been serious, but then again, it depends how you define serious. And cheating is cheating. Are there like different levels of cheating or something? Cooled. Means looses intensity. Doesnt mean over. Gone cold, means over. He said they were going through a down period in their relationship when the whole Rueben thing happened. You forgot to mention that part though. Like I said, a couple like D and L, you would have seen a breakup if they broke up. Its like not seeing Mer and Der breakup, or Sara and Grissom, thats what D/L is like for NY. They are THE couple of the show. Well what we saw sort of contradicts that..If D didn't see em as a couple, why did he want Lindsay back. D said. He pushed her away. L said, she didnt know how much longer she could feel alone. What do you think she meant by that. That sort of suggests she was waiting for him on some level doesnt it? Seriously. Apart from the time she stood him up in LRC, can you tell me when else she treated him like crap? In LRC she was also honest with him. Her telling him she couldn't be with him IMO showed she did care. She didn't want to get into something she couldn't put her all in, because that wouldn't have been fair on Danny. And she left him a note when she went to Montana, IMO a note is way more personal that a quick goodbye. And what does that say about Danny, if he is treating her like crap, because apparently she treated him like crap. Makes him just as bad as her then doesnt it? Really. Hmm interesting. Explain PV's "Danny and Lindsay are together and their relationship is happy and interesting" then. I am certain that she meant together as in a romantic relationship together. Cant see what other sort of together she could mean. Really. Can you show me that comment. I would like to see it. PL said "The relationship had cooled when Danny hooked up with Rikki, BUT like any relationship it had its up and downs, and it was in that down period when Danny and Rikki connected" Where in that statement does it say they had broken up. It doesnt. Seriously I dont think PL thought the question warranted an answer. It was made pretty clear on the show they were together, if they were not, why did Danny feel the need to explain himself about missing her birthday. If they were not together, why should he care? If they were not together, why have Lindsay call him in RND and ask him for lunch and offer to pay. If they were not together why did Danny get defensive when L asks him was their something wrong. Why would Flack say that Danny should piss of Lindsay more often, which means as far as F knew they were still together but D had done something to upset her. I am sure if they had broken up before that F would have known, he is Dannys best friend afterall. Why did Lindsay have the picture of Danny on her phone. If they had broken up before the whole Ruben arc, why still have that couply picture on her phone. The thing about TV is they cant show us every moment. Read my previous post up a way or two. They showed enough. This argument goes both ways. You say they never showed em as a couple, but TPTB stated they were . So if they were not together like you say, where was the breakup scene? I didnt see it. Wouldnt you think a couple that has evolved on the show like D/L would be shown breaking up? Also Carmine himself said they were either going to get really serious or end it, AFTER the Rikki thing. He didn't just say serious, he said REALLY serious. If they were not together, how could they break up or become really SERIOUS. Makes no sense at all does it? I think it was more evident in the scene before that, when Danny arrives at work when L, M, and H are standing in the hallway. Twice Lindsay catches his gaze, and twice he looks away. Also in the talk scene. Danny, when Lindsay says "obviously you decided to do this all on your own" Shifts in his seat and turn his head and looks down. That is a sign of guilt and shame. Look up Body Language on the net and have a look under body language for somone thats feeling guilt and or shame. Carmine played it perfectly IMO ITA with you..I dont think he would have either. Danny has always been shown to be a loyal character, there is no way if he was in his right mind he would have done the crap he did. ETA. Kristine. We have to go off what we see. If PL did indeed state that to you, how are we supposed to know that? We can only read the answers you type up in your interview. On the season 4 dvd Anna makes the comment "At the beginning of Season 4, Lindsay is happy again. She got together with Danny at the end of Season 3 which is what shes wanted all along, so shes kind of re-invigorated and kinda peppy again. And then Danny has this terrible thing happen." See that suggests to me that things were relitively ok up until the Rueben thing. PL also said "Dannys guilt ultimately put a wedge between the Danny and Lindsay storyline" See that also suggest to me that things were ok between them, maybe not perfect, but like PL said, all relationships have their ups and downs. The reason the relationship cooled IMO was because of Danny pushing Lindsay away after Rueben died. And the connection I assume PL mentions between D and R is Ruebens death. Relationships have ups and downs all the time, that doesnt give you the right to sleep with someone else though, no matter what the circumstances. If you watch the Rikki/Danny scene, Danny tries to justify what they are doing, by saying "Reubens dead" Thats how he is making it ok in his mind. What does that tell you about his state of mind at the time? Rikki over heard the phonecall, there is no way in heck she didn't, the door was open, plus she seemed nervous and on edge. The fact she over heard was the catalyst to her speech. Desperately trying to make Danny understand, that under normal circumstances what was happening wouldn't have been happening. She knew he was going to s***w everything up, she could see him self destructing and I think in a way, she kinda felt partly responsible. And thats why I have never been able to dislike Rikki, she didn't want to be part of Danny F*****g up his life. She was trying to make him see, he was going to regret it later on. Even though she was going through the worst thing imaginable and her life was in tatters, she didnt want the same thing to happen to Danny.
You know it is rude to use capslock on a fanboard. He wasn`t defensive,he was annoyed,because miss sunshine couldn`t accept no for an answer. If it`s up to the viewer to have their own view,then people are allowed to say that they weren`t in a relationship and that he didn`t cheat. So,it is what it is and it means that at that point they didn`t have anything going on either. So,he didn`t cheat.
One sentence: I totally agree with everything you said, melanie! I don't think I have anything else to add.
Despite the fact that one of the executive producers said he didn't? Okay. Geez. Could any of those things perhaps have to do with the fact that Danny felt responsible for the death of a child? Of course Danny felt guilty--about Ruben's death. Continuous suffering is what he's in for with Lindsay, the emotional abuser. Both times she told him she loved him, the connotation was negative. The first time, it was about how she had "to get over that." The second time, it was in the context of him being "hard to love." Interesting that she's said it twice and he hasn't once said it back to her, no? And yet, only one of them said it. Twice. Again...when did Rikki say she knew about Lindsay? Oh that's right--she didn't. I think you might want to take your own suggestion and "go back and watch again." Another thought--it is possible that part of the reason they cooled was because Lindsay made no effort to be there for the person she supposedly loved? You're making assumptions that aren't based on anything that was on screen. I'm not one of those people who thinks "Snow Day" was a one night stand by any means, but I do think what we saw on screen suggests Danny and Lindsay were in a somewhat undefined relationship, one that wasn't totally serious yet. And Peter Lenkov said they had cooled by the time Danny hooked up with Rikki. Both EPs comments reflect what we saw on screen--though we didn't really see much of Danny and Lindsay together other than a joke here and there. I think ultimately, looking at what TPTB wanted and not shipper stuff (either for or against D/L) it's obvious it started out casual, hit a bump in the road that cooled the relationship--Lindsay couldn't be there for Danny because of her own hang ups, Danny withdrew from people and turned to Rikki--then Lindsay dropped the L-word on Danny and he apologized to her and their relationship picked back up and got serious. Independent of any shipper/character bias, that's what TPTB intended. They're the ones writing the thing--if they had wanted the storyline to be about Danny cheating, it would have been about Danny cheating. The fact that it wasn't shows that's not what it's about for TPTB. I must have missed you being involved in that interview. :lol: Is it that you think PL didn't think the question warranted an answer, or that you don't like the answer he gave?
I just have to say that I agree with everything Top Said, and I'd just like to add a couple things in... Note that Peter Lenkov and Pam Veasey said that they were not in a relationship and Danny did not cheat. Also, Carmine Giovanazzo and Anna Belknap THEMSELVES said that they had no idea wheter Danny and Lindsay were in a relationship. The very actors who are portraying the characters. That says all there needs to be said about that. That clearly states that they were not in a relationship. As far as the hooking up with Rikki, both Danny and Rikki said that this wasn't good in the longrun, and wasn't healthy, but they were taking whatever comfort they could from it. Then, when Rikki moved away, it was clear to me that both she and Danny were desperately trying to keep from crying. Lindsay, I haven't seen that. There was the phone call and monologue in RND, then the phone call in Personal Foul. In PF, it seems clear now that Lindsay got what she wanted from Danny, and then came running to his house. It also came across as really mean, IMO. I mean, Danny had been caught up in his own grief for a long time, then Lindsay tells him he's hard to love....that's just a bit of an insult in my opinion. Regardless of how difficult someone is being, if you care, you make the effort and don't tell them they're hard to love. And notice that Danny never told Lindsay he loved her back. He said he missed her, wanted to talk with her, and was sorry, but never that he loved her. That says it all right there.
Wait - are you saying that you have just now seen the entire arc? Despite having commented about it before? How much of it had you seen when you were so sure he was cheating before?
I suspect the reason tptb have been noncommital about the whole cheating thing is because they really want to drop the ball on this one. I say noncommital because I don't recall seeing anything from them that completely refutes the 'cheating', more it seems to me that they just don't want to be clear about it, or they want us to think everything in the garden is now rosy and nothing that happened before really matters. It's kind of irrelevant now anyway because tptb will take the storyline and the relationships within it wherever they want it to go. Besides, Danny's not a 'cheater'. As other's have said, he was grieving and his actions were driven by guilt more than anything. As some people have argued time and time again, it really doesn't matter what tptb say if it isn't played out on screen because everyone will bring their own interpretation/preferences to the debate. In actual fact that's why we've got old threads popping up because there really cannot be a conclusion unless it plays out on screen, unless there's a conversation where Danny admits to 'cheating' or where Danny or Lindsay refer to their 'break up' or lack of togetherness during S4. If PL had said that D/L had broken up, or even if they were on an infamous 'break' ala Friends then I'd accept it. But, he said they'd 'cooled'. Any relationship where one is pushing the other away while the other is inadequate in terms of supporting them through their grief will be somewhat chilly. It seems to me that those who like Lindsay and sympathise with her think that Danny cheated, those who like Danny and think Lindsay is a whiny bitch think that he didn't and those who sympathise with both just don't have a clue. It's no different to RL when couples go through problems, the guys friends will support him, the girls friends will support her and those who are friends with both get torn between the two.
^Fair enough, though I think if Lenkov or any of the writers had meant for Danny to be unfaithful, the answer would have been something more along the lines of "he strayed during a difficult time." I do think the whole thing is a bit of a mess, which now the writers have to patch up much faster than they would have--and perhaps in a way they didn't intend--due to real life circumstances. I'm by no means convinced D/L was supposed to end after fourth season, but I'm not really convinced they were supposed to continue either, especially after seeing zero interaction between the two in the first few episodes. It still seems to be more of a miscommunication than actual infidelity since it seems clear that Lindsay thought they were more serious than they actually were. And I think it's fair to say her behavior didn't indicate how serious she was about Danny--how many girlfriends just throw up their hands and say, "I'm not good at dealing with this kind of thing" and leave their boyfriend alone after he suffers a major loss. At the very least, I think Danny's confusion was warranted.
In all honesty, I put 'I don't know', but I'm leaning heavily to the no side of things. It's all about how you view things. If you looked at Danny and Lindsay's remarks and saw love, then yeah, he cheated. If you saw a romantic relationship, then yeah. Off the top of my head and in my fatigue and headache, I can't recall most of the arc, hence the I don't know. I reserve the right to change that, though, when I'm more awake. However, the parts of the arc I do recall revolve around 416 and Child's Play. While I do recall Lindsay's worry in whichever episode Danny failed to show up for work, I didn't read that as a girlfriend worried for her boyfriend. I read that as a friend and colleague concerned about another friend and colleague as the wrath of the boss would've come down upon the first colleague if he or she was caught. Flack shared the same concern... does that mean he was sleeping with Danny too? (Although, he could be, but that's neither here nor there) The point is, I don't think he cheated, but I'm not going to definitively way in either way until I've had at least 10 hours of sleep and something to make my headache go away so I can think straight.