Grade 'Rest in Peace, Marina Garito'

Discussion in 'CSI: New York' started by Top41, Apr 7, 2010.

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How would you grade Rest in Peace, Marina Garito?

  1. A+

    9 vote(s)
    14.5%
  2. A

    10 vote(s)
    16.1%
  3. A-

    3 vote(s)
    4.8%
  4. B+

    6 vote(s)
    9.7%
  5. B

    8 vote(s)
    12.9%
  6. B-

    5 vote(s)
    8.1%
  7. C+

    4 vote(s)
    6.5%
  8. C

    2 vote(s)
    3.2%
  9. C-

    5 vote(s)
    8.1%
  10. D+

    1 vote(s)
    1.6%
  11. D

    2 vote(s)
    3.2%
  12. D-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. F

    7 vote(s)
    11.3%
  1. Lori K.

    Lori K. Pathologist

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    Why not they have magic pencils.:lol:
    Yep cant wait for that one:thumbsup: At least someone still has a keen sense of humor,should be fun when he gets sent out of the room...would this be akin to being grounded by Mac we know he doesnt like flying paper airplanes how about he sounds like Zach Gill "dont touch my stuff"?:lol:

    And a very long summer!:lol:

    Naw! But why even waste his time with it,Stella does what she does!:lol:

    Hence the fire!:lol:

    HA HA! Type away I'm on spring break!!:p
     
  2. meggzie

    meggzie Police Officer

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    That annoyed me, it was just the way she said it felt very much like she didn't believe her.

    :lol: I always love flack, the way he can switch to incredibly sarcy(?) and humorous to very serious in a second is definitely one of his best qualities


    It is frustrating when it feels like every time Stella is shining on her own someone brings her down a peg by attacking her. It just shows how sexist and chauvanistic the show is.

    And the tucking her in, i mean how old is she 10? if she was tired why didn't she just go home? Why does Mac yet again have to come and be the hero, so to speak


    This episode really feels like a love or hate it episode it is normally that way when it is focused on a character.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2010
  3. Maya316

    Maya316 Lab Technician

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    I don`t know so much if Lindsay didn`t believe her -- she was the one suggesting theories on how Marina may not have committed suicide. However, I admit there was something about the `women`s intuition`line that I didn`t much like. Going further into this...

    I think my main problem was that other characters (Mac and Danny) have had the `intuition` cases before, have even been looked at sideways and been treated skeptically -- just like Stella was here, although the team did rally around her -- for having little more than a gut feeling to go on (Greater Good comes to mind). But it`s never been labeled as just intuition. In Greater Good, Mac was getting admired all over the place for being that dedicated to his job. Even in Crime and Misdemeanor, though Danny got in trouble for it, I think we were meant to see his drive as a drive for the truth. And even if we weren`t, it wasn`t exactly labeled as ``guy`s intuition``.

    With that kind of presentation, despite how unrealistic it may have been for Stella to be right after all (I can`t help thinking that in an episode of CSI Original she wouldn`t have been), I enjoyed it. Because it would`ve been worse for her to have been wrong.
     
  4. wildcat

    wildcat Witness

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    Yes, I agree with you here. In fact, looking back at what we've been told, it seems that at first Marina called Stella and said that she had a breakthrough, but did not admit that she just went back to the house and remembered what happened. And then she wrote her with the explanation. Despite the argument that she probably could not bring herself to tell Stella that she knew this all along, it definitely would have been more decent to explain everything in person.

    Actually, I believe that both of these strange things are probably true and quite real. CSI:NY is known for reliable scientific bits. That's what makes it stand out among the three CSI series. :p
    I liked some of their sci-finds from other episodes and checked them out. Every single one of them was real! :eek: :thumbsup: :cool:
    And that goes not only for these science/tech bits they mention. All the equipment in the lab and how they operate it is real. I am a research scientist, and I was just amazed at how the actors of NY are reproducing actual laboratory manipulations - all these sample preparations, HPLC and MS runs, etc.
    If you watch CSI you could notice that their lab is EMPTY compared to NY. It is quite usual to see the CSI:LA techs to just hang out or spread clothes on an empty table in an empty lab. THAT's not close to any reality. NY is absolutely different - they have realistically looking labs with real research equipment (though some of it looks a bit outdated ;)), and their facts are usually very accurate.

    Ok, I even spent 2 minutes to check the last one. Here -
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shape_memory_alloy

    quotes: "Shape memory materials are fascinating materials, with the potential for application as "smart materials" and also as new functional materials....The characteristics, fabrication techniques and thermomechanical treatment of various shape memory alloys are described in detail, with special emphasis on Ti-Ni and Ti-Ni-X (with X being Cu, Fe etc.) alloys..."
    " The nickel-titanium alloys were first developed in 1962–1963 by the US Naval Ordnance Laboratory and commercialized under the trade name Nitinol (an acronym for Nickel Titanium Naval Ordnance Laboratories). Their remarkable properties were discovered by accident. A sample that was bent out of shape many times was presented at a laboratory management meeting. One of the associate technical directors, Dr. David S. Muzzey, decided to see what would happen if the sample was subjected to heat and held his pipe lighter underneath it. To everyone's amazement the sample stretched back to its original shape"

    - That's the same type of memory material which is mentioned in this episode. ;)

    I guess the "foam fry" is more strange, and probably it won't work with any foam, but I'm ready to bet that they have some reference that such a thing happens in some cases. :cool:

    Lori, you've made my day! :guffaw::guffaw:


    This IS Stella. Emotional, passionate, giving all 200% of herself when she is convinced in something and trying to convince others. Yes, sometimes it leads to her pushing too hard, coming on too strong, being a bit too harsh. But that's her character. She's human. :p

    I so did this! :lol:

    I also watch it for the team, but this particular guest star was very good. :thumbsup: Unlike some others we saw, she played her part really well, and her monologues were well done.


    You are absolutely right! The scenes with the two of them are always great - does not matter what's going on, whether it's a friendly banter or an angry argument or exchanging childhood memories or just a work-related discovery shared with a collegue. It's a shame there was not many such moments recently. I wish we'd get more of their interaction - it's always interesting to watch.

    She's been quite heavily promoted by TPTB. Her total screen time is hardly 5 min, but she's been present in nearly all spoilers and preview fragments.:eek:
    And I'll agree that while all the letter exchange was a bit artificial and out of character for Mac, at least it was a decent presentation of a new character, now intruding into the work place without invitation and all the grabbing was WAY too much. (I just imagined MY new flame just showing up at my work - I'd be SO mad! :lol:)

    :guffaw::guffaw:

    It would have been a perfect storm in here! ;)
    (Here is the difference between promoting the character and not. Well, Stella really does not need it, right? ;) )

    Yeah.... both the comment and the intonation with which it's been delivered were annoying and irritating. I wonder whether it was intentional.


    Because he IS the one? :p
     
  5. GregNickRyanFan

    GregNickRyanFan Holographic Moderator Moderator

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    Oh the woman's intuition line... that's something else I forgot to mention. I didn't like it. I just think the line felt out of place. It's like the writers were trying to say, "see Stella has magical woman's intuition and everyone knows it". :lol: I like Stella, but geesh do the writers have to hit us over the head with how good of instincts she has. :lol:

    As for Adam's age, not sure about the character, but I do know that the actor was born in either 78 or 79. I know that on CSI, Eric Szmanda's character is supposed to be the same age he is in real life, so it's possible its the same way for Adam/AJ.
     
  6. roximonoxide

    roximonoxide Lab Technician

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    Thanks, I am aware of memory alloys actually existing. They're typically metals and look as such. Some other materials are called "memory foams" but the term is used much more loosely there. I'm not denying the existence of these things. My problem is that what was showcased was some loosely related-in-name-only substance. Memory alloy (and foam for that matter) tends not to come in floral patterned little quilts like the piece found in the vics hand. I promise you the military has little use for anything floral patterned. They don't tend to match camo to botanical gardens. There's a difference between Sci-Fi and Sci-Fantasy and they're towing that line.

    As for the bullet punching out a fry shaped piece of foam I'm still highly skeptical. Bullets aren't just a penetrating force. They're also hot metal. If you've ever stabbed a styrofoam container with a hot fork you'll see why this 'foam fry' presents a problem. Secondly, if someone put this foam pillow between the gun and the vic, why was there no particulate on either the girls wound or the bullet? It punched out a perfect piece of foam but not any residual bits? Right. Forgive me for refusing to stretch my imagination for this one.

    As for the claim that CSI:NY is known for being reliable for their science, I don't think they have any more cred than Miami or Vegas that I'm aware of, but the fact that any of them shouldn't be taken with a grain of salt is entirely debatable. It's a huge stretch to say "every single one of them is real" (them being the outrageous sciences they showcase time and time again) because they're just not. They're often BASED on real things, like with the memory alloy which we also saw in a completely different incarnation in 'You Only Die Once' when Flack saw the car that "repaired" itself. In fact memory alloy isn't exactly as freaky and new as they made it seem. While often based on real inventions/discoveries CSI takes this science and then drives it to exaggeration for the sake of being showier than the actual science it's based on.

    I don't know any CSI:LA so I can't argue with you that they're any more or less realistic than NY, but all the shows have used at one point or another all the same basic lab equipment and they do tend to be more accurate with that stuff.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2010
  7. Ghawazee

    Ghawazee CSI Level Three

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    Probably one of the best Stella episodes if not the best of all of them. Why? why does it make it different for other like All Access or Heart of Glass or Right Next Door or Creatures of the Night?

    Knowledge and understanding are the answers

    The first time we met Stella it was showed as someone "tough". Someone you wanted to know more about because she was showed interesting enough to keep following her
    And through all these past years she was revealling herself, slowly

    She is not interesting because she is perfect but because she is so imperfectly human

    Then we learnt she was passionate and emotional and compassionate and stubborn and determined.
    Most of time those qualities led her to disaster eventually because her life was on the edge several times but, is that something essentially bad? No. She never changed, she kept being who she is now. She was revealing her sides slowly, like a rose reveals its petals

    So, was I surprised by the fact she was determined to find Marina's murderer? No. We had continuity, her true nature was respected. Her true essence as a character was kept and me thinks this writer does love her Stella:thumbsup:
    And i am not surprised by the fact she was so convinced Marina was murdered. She knew Marina, she knew someone who spent her whole life looking and waiting for her brother wouldn't end her life so easily because Marina had a reason to live. Stella knew her determination to get answers to her questions and her frustration was so obvious because she couldn't be available just in time to avoid the disaster so Marina's determination was equal to Stella's determination to not let she left this world without an answer.

    Because Stella does know how to be without a supporting voice around (not until she was found by Professor P. once more time again) so the mention to her insticts are right. She grew up as an orphan so she learnt how tu survive the concrete jungle trusting her instincs because she is alert to everything that happens around her

    I believe her biggest achivement is to be so emphatic to others, that's why she cares so much for her lab family and other people who has a meaning to her (like Marina for example).
    And the best of her she didn't blush at the time to say "I am sorry" to Sid because once the cause of her afliction was solved, she needed to take care of them once again:thumbsup:

    General comments

    Shocking into scenes. It was obvious it was a dream (the yellow balloon) but the whole sequence was worth and specially the crash. Very well done and it had the magic of all oneiric scenes. It was so different to what we had before! It was really appreciated that

    For women and by women" that's the way i see this. Having a female director, writer, a story focused on a woman and giving preponderance to females characters from the show made it.

    I liked the way Mac was always omnipresent even tough it was obvious he was always pending on her
    I love how she tried to do the right thing not pushing too hard until they found a good reason to keep investigating
    That first scene between Mac and Stella put me in tears, probably because i did feel Melina's emotion was real and not just pretending her Stella was being emotional

    I truly enjoyed the fact the whole team tried to help her. She is always pending on them and she always get the retribution she deserves because she does love them

    I didn't find so dramatic the fact Stella had a little exchange of opinions with Sid. It was obvious before my eyes she wasn't upset with him. I believe she felt frustrated and she proyecting her own feelings of guilt because she wasn't there when Marina died

    Awww Stella and Don re such amazing friends. I love when they play the "tough cops" card and i love them when they have a simple conversation as the one they had here and in the past (like that one from 5.13 and all these past years). They are REALLY like a brother and a sister. In this case tehy had 2 amazing moments, one of them was the best action scene we have ever had before (Chasing Marina's stepfather and then ending up inside the pool). How great something can be done! The best for me was the reminicense to Into the fire (Melina's movie) meanwhile she was floating inside the pool

    I am glad to know Mac was still there, always near to her and having Mac tucking her in was so sweet, such a tender moment:drool: He understood how is to be haunt by ghosts, so he understands very well how she felt

    I didn't feel strange she decided to stay there. Not only because she is so dedicated to her job but because it's the lab. It's the only place where she has a family. She feels safe there

    (darn i know i need to write more but lasagna is waiting. Later i will add more thoughts;))
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2010
  8. La_Guera

    La_Guera Lab Technician

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    I get what they were trying to achieve with "Rest in Peace, Marina Garito." I do. I even give them credit for reminding folks that the crime doesn't necessarily end when the case does for victims' families. But with a few exceptions, the execution made me want to perform the CSI:NY Dance of Apoplectic Rage, as demonstrated in this helpful instructional video.

    You cannot predicate your entire show on the premise of following the evidence, and then base an entire investigation on one character's intuition. Nor can you then have the other characters blithely accept that baseless intuition as SOP, especially not the Grand High Poobah of Bunsen Burner Buttcrack who has repeatedly drubbed subordinates over the head with his cherished mantra of evidence before instinct. Well, you can, but you'll embarrass yourselves.

    And embarrass themselves the writers did. From the opening scene, Stella behaved like a spoiled, petulant harpy. She's so accustomed to being deferred to that when the mild-mannered Hammerback had the temerity to defend his work, she threw a tantrum and flounced off like a cosseted diva.

    There's intuition, which all investigators develop, and then there are ego and denial. What the writers wanted to show viewers was Stella's vaunted grit and determination in the face of adversity, but what they actually showed was crass petulance. Stella metaphorically stuck her fingers into her ears and screamed, LALALA, I CAN'T HEAR YOU!! I'M RIGHT JUST BECAUSE." That was her story, and she stuck to it until the rest of the team uncovered evidence to support her hunch.

    If anyone else were to do this, Mac would be riding them like a John Deere and calling them reckless and irresponsible(see anytime Danny took the initiative on a case--"A Man a Mile" and the human statue case), but because it's Stella, he lets her run roughshod over the rules and protocols he's sworn to uphold. Given that he previously let her flout his direct orders during the Diakos investigation and temporarily quit her job to fly to Greece in her superhuman Suetard, I'm not surprised, but I am tired of the double standards that are so often applied to the show's leads. If Danny can be reprimanded for poking about in a mysterious death with no evidence of foul play--and Danny had some evidence of chicanery with the hinky measurements and the ill-fitting clothes--then Stella should be told to sit down, shut up, and stop showing her ass just because someone told her no.

    The Marina Garito voiceovers were grating. I'm sure they were meant to convey pathos, but all save the last were disjointed and delivered with all the verve of a sixteen-year-old drama student getting her pubescent gravitas on and made me want to perform the CSI:NY Dance of Apoplectic Rage again.

    I did like the conversation between Stella and Flack about each of them having their own Marina Garito. It was a lovely note of actual depth amid the patently manufactured bathos of the episode.

    Alas, it wasn't enough to make it interesting. D.

    "Burger and fries. Not much of a last meal."

    "Are you kidding? Those are from the Shake Shack."

    I love you, Flack. So, so much. Now if we can just get you back into a suit.
     
  9. Andromeda

    Andromeda Police Officer

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    I grade it with an A, not only because it was a Stella-centric episode and she´s my fave, but because of the story; I thought it was one of the more extraordinary cases of the show. But I understand that this one was very much a "love it or hate it" affair, and I even understand some of the criticism about Stella´s behaviour during some scenes, she wasn´t always likeable there and even I wanted to shout at her sometimes "C´mon, Stella, take it easy, no reason to be unfair." I think in real life a person like her would drive me crazy and make me want to slap her occasionally :D, but on the other hand I love her for being exactly the person she is. She´s not a Babe, she´s got a lot of rough edges and once her gut feeling gets started, there´s nothing that can stop her from listening to it and following it. That´s one part of her versatile character, another one is her great compassion that sometimes causes her emotions to overwhelm her. And this all was represented in this episode and I expected nothing less. Also I loved the scenes with Flack, they complemented each other very well- on one side the sensible, maybe even slightly disillusioned Don who tried to point out to Stella that she can´t save every person on this planet and on the other side the determined and slightly stubborn Stella who does not want to accept this.
    I loved Sid and pitied him a bit, but I think Stella´s apology at the end was neat.

    Some here complained at, what they call, too many coincidences that helped solving the case; now I´m not a criminologist, but I think a lot of real detectives would confirm that many cases only get solved finally with the help of coincidences and luck rather than with science and super state-of-the art technology.

    And finally: Some here would have loved Stella´s gut feeling to be proved wrong :D. Now tell you what: I wouldn´t mind if there´d be an episode where exactly this would happen, because she´s only human after all and therefore not immune against failure ;).
     
  10. Lori K.

    Lori K. Pathologist

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRSfpxSKbYs
    Forgot to add link!:p
     
  11. PianoWizzy

    PianoWizzy Prime Suspect

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    I just read over the other reviews here.

    One word: ouch.

    Critical much?? Relax... the writers are human too... and Pam Veasey [I think?] isn't your normal writer, is she?

    Cool down your flames.
    - Stella's control does slip at times and sometimes she lets all out on her emotions and flings things around until she's got her point across. In this case, when she's got her case closed. I'm hardly a fan of Stella or Melina. This is purely character observation.
    - Adam is not dumbing down, he's being childish. And for entertainment purposes. If he was serious and intelligent as he really is all the time, would you enjoy watching him as much?
    - I'm a SMack fan but I simply don't see it happening. The last scene was fangirl squeal-and-die worthy for sure. But I'm not in any way opposed to Mac/Aubrey. How many of you other hard-core SMack fans seeing Mac spending the rest of his life with Aubrey? Just cool it, it's not that likely. They'll be friends for sure, they have so much in common, but a romantic endeavor with Mac Taylor is hard to believe.
    - Writers: I'm not opposed to Danny/Lindsay. Don't make me. Even Gil and Sara don't rub it in this much. Granted, Gil's not there, but consider it.
    - Leaps of logic. It happens. Get over it, it's not a reality TV show.
    - About the french fry. Okay, fine, call Mythbusters. I'd love to see it happen again. But it's not like something like that is going to ruin the whole show?
    - Don't freak over two minutes of SMacked scenes if you don't like them! Gosh.

    So, how about we cool it down and just laugh at the stupid parts and enjoy the good stuff?

    By the way, don't kill me.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2010
  12. GregNickRyanFan

    GregNickRyanFan Holographic Moderator Moderator

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    I think by the dumbing down thing, they meant the thing about the french fry foam. He didn't understand how that proved murder or something. NY is not the only CSI show to do this either. They tend to dumb down a character so they can explain to the audience how something works. I don't see how him not understanding the fry this is childish though? I don't think anyone was complaining about him flirting with Aubrey. Everyone pretty much agreed that that was a cute scene. I unfortunately missed that scene because I was in the kitchen at the time. :lol:
     
  13. talkingtocactus

    talkingtocactus Coroner

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    i don't often agree with you on mac-related stuff, i think we just share a difference of opinion there generally, but in this case i totally agree - there's no way he'd have been (or indeed has been in the past) that forgiving for anyone else :)

    and with this actually :)

    that was definitely a highlight - i'm so glad we have flack's snarky comments to rescue dire situations :)
     
  14. Ghawazee

    Ghawazee CSI Level Three

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    Amen!. His main asset is how lovely he is, all nervous in front of Mac or childish as you say in front of others (i prefer to use the word "naïve"). But if suddenly he became into someone serious (because we already know he is brillant) he would loose his charm

    I have this hyphotesis, he is so ansious because the situation he had to live with his father. That's why i am hoping so much a good development on his background story
     
  15. Top41

    Top41 Administrator Administrator Moderator Premium Member

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    Let's not tell other people how to post, and what they can think. Just because they don't agree with you about an episode doesn't mean that they're wrong, or that they don't have a right to feel the way they do. As for flames, if there are any, hit the "notify mod" button (the little triangle at the bottom of each post) and let the moderators deal with it. That's what we're here for. But please don't come in and tell other people how to think about the episode--that's just going to invite a lot of frustration.
     

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